261 réponses à ce sujet

[TwistedComplex]

And BTW Jade Empire is still their lowest scoring game with an 81

[Foolsfolly]

Warheadz wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

TileToad wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

Mass Effect 2 is far and away better than Mass Effect.

Only in your dreams.

Not just mine, sir. Look at the OP. ME2's their best rated game. And it should be. I'm a long time BioWare fan and that game was great. Can't wait for Arrival and ME3.

If I may express my own opinion, Mass Effect 2 improved on the gameplay aspects but removed a bit of the... originality Mass Effect had. I thought both of them were good games, but if I had to choose between the two of them I would choose the first game. It had a better feeling and atmosphere than Mass Effect 2 (but in all honesty, the best thing so far in ME series is ME 2's strong, strong finish).

I don't think I could play ME1 again if I had to. The vast barren landscapes, the exact same maps over and over again (which were worse than DA2's reuse), and the generally sterile nature of the universe. ME2 exploded the universe by adding more grim and showing us varied planets and locations. Every planet in ME1 looked a like (except for Plot Planets).

I will say ME1 felt more original, but being the original and not a squel that makes sense, no? Unless you meant the feeling and story, in which case you're not a fan of Babalyon 5, Alien, Starship Troopers, the works of H.P. Lovecraft, and all the other blanant sources for their stories.

Loved the game. Have over 20 different Shepards saved on my Xbox. But after ME2 came out going back to it is like....going back to Tostino's Microwavable Pizza after having a really great pizza.

A lot of that may be burn out from playing ME1 so many times....but I still play KOTOR so...

[TileToad]

Foolsfolly wrote...
Not just mine, sir. Look at the OP. ME2's their best rated game. And it should be. I'm a long time BioWare fan and that game was great. Can't wait for Arrival and ME3.

I'm not saying ME2 was extremely bad, but, I guess, it was to me what DA2 is for a lot of DA:O conservatists.
What's probably even more twisted, however, is, that in many ways, I like DA2 better than DA:O.

[Dr. Impossible]

Arian Dynas wrote...

I'm calling bull**** here. It's being panned on METACRITIC, a site FOR the people BY the people, which is to say, stuffed with trolls wanting to make trouble and with people whining and crying "RUINED FOREVER WAAAAHHH!!!"

Yes, the almost universally negative reception must be the work of trolls. There couldn't be any other explanation.

Also, for the record, since lying about critical scores is considered a No-no in the free market, the PROFESSIONAL critics, who do this for a living and are (mostly) impartial are giving it two thumbs up.

Publishers and journalists have a symbiotic relationship where journalists get exclusive previews and screenshots, early review copies and other perks, and the publishers get advertising and good scores. But since AAA games usually are at least decent, there isn't a great difference between professional and user scores. DA2, however, is not decent. Hence the vast difference between the scores.

Modifié par Dr. Impossible, 21 mars 2011 - 08:48 .

[Solmyr2000]

rokeeb wrote...
Over here, an 82 is an A

Modern "professional" review scores:
95-100 - Great
90-95 - Good
80-90 - Average
70-80 - Bad
Lower - Trash

To actual reviewers who are in touch with reality

There are none.

Modifié par Solmyr2000, 21 mars 2011 - 08:50 .

[ahpuch]

Solmyr2000 wrote...

rokeeb wrote...
Over here, an 82 is an A

Modern "professional" review scores:
95-100 - Great
90-95 - Good
80-90 - Average
70-80 - Bad
Lower - Trash

To actual reviewers who are in touch with reality

There are none.

agreed. pro reviewers are hired by companies who get money from the gaming companies, so their scores are higher than they should be.

[TwistedComplex]

ahpuch wrote...

Solmyr2000 wrote...

rokeeb wrote...
Over here, an 82 is an A

Modern "professional" review scores:
95-100 - Great
90-95 - Good
80-90 - Average
70-80 - Bad
Lower - Trash

To actual reviewers who are in touch with reality

There are none.

agreed. pro reviewers are hired by companies who get money from the gaming companies, so their scores are higher than they should be.

Is that why G4 gave it a 3/5?

Do me a favor. Go to meta critic, click on a professional reviewer, and you'll be able to compare there overall scores with user scores

It's almost perfectly even. In fact most of the time professional reviews are LOWER than user reviews 

Modifié par TwistedComplex, 21 mars 2011 - 08:56 .

[Foolsfolly]

TileToad wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...
Not just mine, sir. Look at the OP. ME2's their best rated game. And it should be. I'm a long time BioWare fan and that game was great. Can't wait for Arrival and ME3.

I'm not saying ME2 was extremely bad, but, I guess, it was to me what DA2 is for a lot of DA:O conservatists.
What's probably even more twisted, however, is, that in many ways, I like DA2 better than DA:O.

DA2 took good steps at gameplay and the characters are more nuanced than the last game. However, it's completely lacking in purpose and antagonist.

I'm getting the feeling that BioWare tired of doing antagonists. ME2 lacked a strong antagonist and DA2 does as well. ME2 got away with it, probably because the focus of the game was to prepair for the Suicide Mission and build your team. It was kind of like a caper movie where you make your plan, get experts, and then spend the act doing the heist.

DA2 however isn't about gathering anything, since you can get your whole companion roaster in about 30-40 minutes. It isn't really about anything. The big Mage/Templar conflict happens in about 2-3 missions at the end, there's mage/templar side quests but they're not telling an over-arching story they're examining the situation.

I can only speak for myself, but to me, the entire reason why the game's disappointing is because the main plot just isn't gripping. It's barely there and then when the game's over nothing's been resolved. There's not even a decent ending of you being able to guess or speculate what happens to your companions and other NPCs. It just ends and may as well have had a "To Keep Playing Insert 7 Dollars for DLC" and a ten second countdown for the lulz.

[TileToad]

Foolsfolly wrote...

DA2 took good steps at gameplay and the characters are more nuanced than the last game. However, it's completely lacking in purpose and antagonist.

I'm getting the feeling that BioWare tired of doing antagonists. ME2 lacked a strong antagonist and DA2 does as well. ME2 got away with it, probably because the focus of the game was to prepair for the Suicide Mission and build your team. It was kind of like a caper movie where you make your plan, get experts, and then spend the act doing the heist.

DA2 however isn't about gathering anything, since you can get your whole companion roaster in about 30-40 minutes. It isn't really about anything. The big Mage/Templar conflict happens in about 2-3 missions at the end, there's mage/templar side quests but they're not telling an over-arching story they're examining the situation.

I can only speak for myself, but to me, the entire reason why the game's disappointing is because the main plot just isn't gripping. It's barely there and then when the game's over nothing's been resolved. There's not even a decent ending of you being able to guess or speculate what happens to your companions and other NPCs. It just ends and may as well have had a "To Keep Playing Insert 7 Dollars for DLC" and a ten second countdown for the lulz.

I guess the biggest problem I had with DA:O and ME2 was the combat. Both games, in my experience, had a combat system that was weak and frustrating and since it's a large part of these games, it has a big impact on my opinion about them, and why I would rate the others higher.

Character- and storywise both (if not all Bioware) games did very well. I'm certainly not one to complain about that. In fact, it's probably what makes me enjoy Bioware games the most.

Modifié par TileToad, 21 mars 2011 - 09:21 .

[Alex Kershaw]

Gavinthelocust wrote...

Sonic The Dark Brotherhood scored lower.
Your post is invalid, if you wish to complain there are a good many topics to do it in.
Good day sir.

I already mentioned that in the OP, and it doesn't change anything. If you prefer, Dragon Age II is the worst serious Bioware game, or the worst Bioware non-handheld, or the worst Bioware RPG, or the worst Bioware PC game, or just the 2nd worst.

[Alex Kershaw]

Il Divo wrote...

88mphSlayer wrote...

CRISIS1717 wrote...

I wonder how Mike Laidlaw is going to explain this to EA along with supposedly lower sales figure as well.

700k before the end of March is a lot... i doubt they will top DAO in the long run given how DA2 seems to have shorter legs than the first game but given how much shorter the dev time and cheaper DA2 is than DAO i doubt EA will be too harsh on sales, the low metacritic will raise some ire internally at Bioware tho

regardless of sales tho, i think everybody - including those that loved the game - would like for the sequel to receive more attention and time and polish and thought, i don't see the point in playing "follow the leader" when it's just following the other Bioware single player franchise and not surpassing what you're following...

This.

Also, has anyone put out the score for Awakening and Tales of the Sword Coast? 

I didn't include expansion packs. I personally think Awakenings was a little better than Dragon Age II - I'd give DA2 about a 75 and Awakenings an 80, taking into account that Awakenings was only an expansion and not a full release title.

Awakenings actually received an 82 on Metacritic. Tales of the Sword Coast doesn't have any reviews on there :|

[Alex Kershaw]

Gavinthelocust wrote...

InHarmsWay wrote...

An 82?

That's like chastising a child for getting a B+ instead of an A.

It's better than most games get, games I'm sure many here enjoy. Unless they walk the way they talk and everything has to be 96-100 to be enjoyable, in which case they're exempt from humanity on counts of being anal.
Anyway I love your post.

But it ISN'T better than most games that Bioware make, as proven by this post! If your favourite sports player plays badly, do you make the argument that he's still better than 99% of all the amateurs in the world? No - it's irrelevant. You have to base them on their previous performance, their reputation and their potential.

Modifié par Alex Kershaw, 21 mars 2011 - 11:32 .

[Alex Kershaw]

DTKT wrote...

Isnt it 80?

At the time of writing there were two 80 scores and one 82 across the 3 consoles.

[Lulia]

People should stop making such comparisons...

I'm as disappointed with DA2 as anyone ***compared to DA1***.

82% is still a pretty good score - better than i'd give it personally, but still reflects that it is one of thebetter games out there compared to the rest of the market.

It isn't the end of the world and i'm sure Bioware aren't feeling worried at all.

[Alex Kershaw]

Vicious wrote...

Really, Bioware took 7 years to put out Dragon Age: Origins. Do you think EA [or hell their stockholders] would let them take another 7 years for DA2?

They shot themselves in the foot.

But that isn't really accurate because Mass Effect 2 was made in a not-much-longer timescale and got a 96. They already had the world, the characters, the lore, etc, and so a massive chunk of that time wasn't needed.

[AkiKishi]

Altered Idol wrote...
I understand their views and frustrations come from the fact they love Biowaire's other titles. But some of the criticism has gone a bit over the top at times. And as with Alpha Protocol, there comes a point where a publisher/developer could just decide to cut their losses.

And that would be a shame for everyone.

Alpha Protocol was flawed but at least they tried. Some of the design in DA2 like the reuse of scenery it just outright cynical. If that is the new "standard" I could not care less if I see another Dragon Age game anyway.

Before Bioware it was SSI, somenoe will occupy any void they leave. There are too many "classic" RPG fans.

Modifié par BobSmith101, 21 mars 2011 - 11:38 .

[S Atomeha]

JE is possibly the worst BW game  for me at least. haven't touched it once since i beat it.

Modifié par S Atomeha, 21 mars 2011 - 11:38 .

[Alex Kershaw]

TileToad wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

Mass Effect 2 is far and away better than Mass Effect.

Only in your dreams.

I personally prefer ME2, having played through ME1 about 5+ times and ME2 3 times to get all the achievements on both. ME1's combat is more of a chore, especially on Insanity. The enemies run around shouting crazy things for like 10 minutes; it isn't hard, it just takes bloody ages as they keep using that ability that makes their HP white so you can't hit them... And I don't think the inventory/skills really worked on ME like it did on DAO, because the combat was action-based. I think that levelling up and RPG elements work well on games where you do the Behind The Scenes like DAO, then the combat is somewhat automated other than the timing of abilities etc. Mass Effect focuses on action-based shooting and the skill is in the combat itself so I found the streamlined version of ME2 quite an improvement. That and ME2 didn't reuse the same assets constantly...

[Alex Kershaw]

TwistedComplex wrote...

Alex Kershaw wrote...

tenshi_no_hone wrote...

because as we know, 82 is a terrible score...

It may be the lowest rated of Bioware's games (bar SC:DB) but that doesn't make it a bad game! Even if it wasn't my favourite, I still loved it.

Accusing it of being a truly terrible game is not supported by this score, just that it doesn't quite meet the greatness of Mass Effect or DA:O. It's being damned by slightly less glowing praise rather than outright hatred by its scores!

82 is actually pretty bad. You can't use 82/100 in the same way you'd rate other things - in games, 85 is about average for a game that's good enough to be worth buying.

No, to USER SCORES an 8/10 is average

To actual reviewers who are in touch with reality, a 5/10 is average

The game has an 82 professional score

You find me a game on Metacritic with a metascore of 50 that is worth buying.

[Alex Kershaw]

TwistedComplex wrote...

And BTW Jade Empire is still their lowest scoring game with an 81

The version that got 81 was a re-release a number of years later... The original got 89

[Alex Kershaw]

Foolsfolly wrote...

TileToad wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...
Not just mine, sir. Look at the OP. ME2's their best rated game. And it should be. I'm a long time BioWare fan and that game was great. Can't wait for Arrival and ME3.

I'm not saying ME2 was extremely bad, but, I guess, it was to me what DA2 is for a lot of DA:O conservatists.
What's probably even more twisted, however, is, that in many ways, I like DA2 better than DA:O.

DA2 took good steps at gameplay and the characters are more nuanced than the last game. However, it's completely lacking in purpose and antagonist.

I'm getting the feeling that BioWare tired of doing antagonists. ME2 lacked a strong antagonist and DA2 does as well. ME2 got away with it, probably because the focus of the game was to prepair for the Suicide Mission and build your team. It was kind of like a caper movie where you make your plan, get experts, and then spend the act doing the heist.

DA2 however isn't about gathering anything, since you can get your whole companion roaster in about 30-40 minutes. It isn't really about anything. The big Mage/Templar conflict happens in about 2-3 missions at the end, there's mage/templar side quests but they're not telling an over-arching story they're examining the situation.

I can only speak for myself, but to me, the entire reason why the game's disappointing is because the main plot just isn't gripping. It's barely there and then when the game's over nothing's been resolved. There's not even a decent ending of you being able to guess or speculate what happens to your companions and other NPCs. It just ends and may as well have had a "To Keep Playing Insert 7 Dollars for DLC" and a ten second countdown for the lulz.

I agree with this - where did the Quanari have any relevance to the templar/mage thing? It's like they had 2 different plots and decided to throw both in there because they couldn't decide. There was no big plot, just lots of random mini-plots...

[CRISIS1717]

Who was it that said 8/10  can't be average?

Most review sites ratings are messed up, they rate as high as 7 or 8 for average games and for junk games they usually rate them somewhere around 4 or 5.

Regardless of the scale, Dragon Age is supposed to be a AAA title so being scored in the 80s basically makes this game a joke.

Modifié par CRISIS1717, 21 mars 2011 - 11:46 .

[Alex Kershaw]

simfamSP wrote...

Alex Kershaw wrote...

'Tis true. Here's the list of Bioware games with their metacritic score:

(I didn't include that Sonic DS game because it's a handheld nor Shattered Steel from 1996 as no reviews are available)

(multi-platform games were given their highest score)

Mass Effect 2 (2010) - 96 95
Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn (2000) - 95 96
Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic (2003 )- 93
Baldur's Gate (1998) - 91
Neverwinter Nights (2002) - 91
Mass Effect (2007) - 91
Dragon Age: Origins (2009) - 91
Jade Empire (2005) - 89
MDK2 (2000) - 83
Dragon Age II (2011) - 82

Why fix what isn't broken, Bioware?   

Thats still a good game in my eyes... btw I'm going to fix something.

Why did you change those scores?

[Brenus]

Sonic Chronicles really seems to be a LOT better than DA2.