260 réponses à ce sujet

[maegi46]

He was a great character in Awakenings. Funny, spirited. Loved WOMEN. Not crazy or any terrorist tendencies. He wanted freedom yes and he got that by joining the Grey Wardens. At least in my game he did. He was a trusted friend and someone you could depend on with your life. He was not joined with Justice. Justice possessed a dead grey warden...

Then in DA2 his voice is changed, the writer is changed and his character is a direct 180 from what he used to be. Now he's pyschotic , possessed and gay. A terrorist incident waiting to happen. Not amused and not happy with the changes at all. Thoughts?

Modifié par maegi46, 22 mars 2011 - 04:47 .

[MJRick]

Come back after you complete the game next time...

[Icinix]

Agreed. I loved Anders.

Now, he will never be seen in any future Dragon Age games I play...just like how Leliana died in DAO, and how Anders died in DAA...and they weren't seen in future DA games...

..wait...

[Shadowknight12]

maegi46 wrote...

[...] and gay. 

Correction: Bisexual.

That's all.

[maegi46]

MJRick wrote...

Come back after you complete the game next time...

I did finish the game and that is part of the reason I am not happy with Anders. Blowing up the one neutral faction that might have helped find a peaceful solution and causing the right of Annulment to be called immediately was not a smart or good move to make "on the mages behalf" He appointed himself as some kind of saviour for all mages without thinking to ask them first or care about the consequences of his terrorist act. He brought only more hatred from an already close minded society towards mages by that one destructive act.

Ignoring that, and yeah that's hard to do, his character is NOTHING like the one we met and got to know in Awakenings.

So, come back when you learn to read a post and can comment and actually add to a discussion. Thanks.

Modifié par maegi46, 22 mars 2011 - 04:46 .

[MyKingdomCold]

if he did a direct 360 he would have been the same as before

[maegi46]

True , bad choice of words, ok he is the opposite of what he used to be.

[Casuist]

... a sociopath who spend the bulk of his time healing the impoverished, right.

Anders is a compassionate man who is driven by desperation and a spirit he can't control.

...and there's nothing about his bisexuality that's particularly inconsistent with his previously established character.

[EDarkness]

This was my issue with Anders. He was cool as hell in Awakening. I hated his guts in DA2. Such a drastic character change and not for the better, in my opinion.

[Foolsfolly]

I didn't like Anders in Awakening and I don't much care for him in DA2. He felt like a Mage Alistair and now he's definitely not that. But he's still not my cup of tea.

However, I'll say this, it's cool he's a companion with his own agendas.

[Casuist]

the right of annulment was in discussion well before Anders' action. He viewed any compromise through the Chantry as a delaying tactic, not a solution, and I have a hard time disagreeing with that opinion (not to say I agree with his solution).

[maegi46]

Shadowknight12 wrote...

maegi46 wrote...

[...] and gay. 

Correction: Bisexual.

That's all.

Bisexual means he likes men and women. My Hawke was a man and he made advances and flirted with me. Never saw him express any affection or desire to a woman. Therefore in my game he certainly exhibited gay tendencies. I don't care or discriminate against gay people. My point was that he was very much "straight" in Awakenings. People don't suddenly turn gay or bisexual. They either were to begin with or they were hetero. That's only one aspect of how he changed. Way to focus on that.

[MyKingdomCold]

maegi46 wrote...

Shadowknight12 wrote...

maegi46 wrote...

[...] and gay. 

Correction: Bisexual.

That's all.

Bisexual means he likes men and women. My Hawke was a man and he made advances and flirted with me. Never saw him express any affection or desire to a woman. Therefore in my game he certainly exhibited gay tendencies. I don't care or discriminate against gay people. My point was that he was very much "straight" in Awakenings. People don't suddenly turn gay or bisexual. They either were to begin with or they were hetero. That's only one aspect of how he changed. Way to focus on that.

if you play as a female, he's straight.

Plus, unless I'm mistaken you couldn't romance him or anyone in Awakening. He may have said he likes women in Awakening, but that doesn't mean he isn't bisexual. Or maybe Justice made him bisexual.

[EDarkness]

Anders was definitely straight in the first game. He even mentions settling down with a good woman and he flirted with other women all the time. He never once flirted with the male Warden that I remember. Though he was flirting with other women, including the templar who was tracking him down.

[maegi46]

Casuist wrote...

the right of annulment was in discussion well before Anders' action. He viewed any compromise through the Chantry as a delaying tactic, not a solution, and I have a hard time disagreeing with that opinion (not to say I agree with his solution).

Agreed it was being discussed. However,the Grand cleric was a neutral player and was looking for a peaceful solution where there probably wasn't going to be one.  Blowing up the entire chantry and killing a lot of innocent people was not the way to win favor for the mages cause. It's the action of a sociopath. Don't blame it on Justice either. This was all Anders. When confronted he readily admits knowing what he did and that you would probably kill him for it.

He also states that his own hatred turned a benign spirit of justice in a spirit of Vengeance that could not feel pity or remorse. So let's not use the Justice excuse.

Modifié par maegi46, 22 mars 2011 - 04:59 .

[Casuist]

He also states that his own hatred turned a benign spirit of justice in a spirit of Vengeance that could not feel pity or remorse. So let's not use the Justice excuse.

Your second statement does not follow from the first. Justice's persona may be derived from aspects of Anders' character but that does not make the severity of Justice's outlook any less an influence on Anders' future actions. i.e. would Anders' have acted the same if Vengeance were not present?

Blowing up the entire chantry and killing a lot of innocent people was not the way to win favor for the mages cause.

I agree, and as you'll note above I already said so.

It's the action of a sociopath

Borrowing from inigo montoya, "you keep using that word - I don't think it means what you think it means."

[David Gaider]

MyKingdomCold wrote...
Plus, unless I'm mistaken you couldn't romance him or anyone in Awakening. He may have said he likes women in Awakening, but that doesn't mean he isn't bisexual. Or maybe Justice made him bisexual.

As stated, nobody could romance him in Awakening. He expressed an interest in women, yes, but as far as I know that doesn't preclude someone being bisexual-- though in neither game does he express a preference. Whatever someone chooses to perceive him as is up to them.

As for the other changes, we certainly did change his voice actor. The fact that he is no longer the same character, however, is because people change-- and he, in particular, has been through a lot since joining with Justice. He always had that streak of hatred towards the Circle. He just felt powerless to do anything about it.

If someone doesn't like the direction we take a character, however-- oh well. Wouldn't be the first time.

[M_arc]

Yeah they totally killed Anders in DA2

The fusion with Justice was lame as hell, Anders was a very funny cat-loving person in Awakening with witty comments. He was like a light version of Alistair and the only real kickass companion from Awakening anyway, at least the only one I remember from all unique DLC companions.
Changing this good-hearted guy to a mad mass murder doesn't do the story well.

C'mon BioWare you don't need to give a character all these huge changes and emotional traumas, to make a character interesting, you'll only make them less believable this way.

But yeah it seems like every guy in DAII is a mass murder, sociopath, blood mage, serial killer or a total nutjob.

[Taleroth]

I don't think you understand the meanings of either the words psychotic or sociopath. He displays empathy quite well. And he is very very concerned with the rights of others.

[Akron1983]

You say butcher I say character development. But you know how it is with diffrent opionions, they're like DA2. Theres only one outcome and no one wins.

Modifié par Akron1983, 22 mars 2011 - 05:17 .

[Sabariel]

Oh look, it's this thread again... for the 50th time...

[EDarkness]

As stated, nobody could romance him in Awakening. He expressed an interest in women, yes, but as far as I know that doesn't preclude someone being bisexual-- though in neither game does he express a preference. Whatever someone chooses to perceive him as is up to them.

He actually hits on my male Hawke. Not sure how else to take it other than he's at least bisexual. No hint of that in Awakening, not even in the slightest.

[Shadowknight12]

maegi46 wrote...

Shadowknight12 wrote...

maegi46 wrote...

[...] and gay. 

Correction: Bisexual.

That's all.

Bisexual means he likes men and women. My Hawke was a man and he made advances and flirted with me. Never saw him express any affection or desire to a woman. Therefore in my game he certainly exhibited gay tendencies. I don't care or discriminate against gay people. My point was that he was very much "straight" in Awakenings. People don't suddenly turn gay or bisexual. They either were to begin with or they were hetero. That's only one aspect of how he changed. Way to focus on that.

From Awakening:

Nathaniel: "You don't always wear robes, do you?"
Anders: "Not when I'm naked, I don't."

The tone of voice is crucial here, so I'm adding a youtube link:  around minute 1:11. Also, "Ser Pounce-a-lot" and his plethora of 'who's a little kitty?' moments. For the other half of bisexuality, I believe you've provided enough examples. In DA2, even if you play as a male, there is a party banter with Isabela in which it is implied that they slept together once. Mandatory link:  first banter, right from the start.

And yes, I'm focusing on this because everything else has been oversaid already. Yes, they changed him completely from Awakening. The official explanation is because he was possessed by Justice (who also changed into Vengeance). There's really nothing to discuss. Yes, his character was remade almost from scratch. There is an in-game reason for that. Whether that is satisfactory or not will vary from person to person.

[Jackel159357]

Anders was fine in DA2, right up until the point he tried to hit on me when i was male hawke. Anders was very straight in DAOA but then somehow became a very in your face bisexual. Killed the character for me.

[Akron1983]

Piece of advice, dont press quote button when you want to edit

Modifié par Akron1983, 22 mars 2011 - 05:17 .