81 réponses à ce sujet

[White_Buffalo94]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...
And Varric is supposed to be one of the smartest, cleverest, most worldly-wise characters in the game! This isn't some campy horror movie, where the stars don't know about demons and crap, one of your party members is freaking POSSESSED BY THE LIVING EMBODIMENT OF JUSTICE. And yet no one says anything here. There's not a word of "hey, let's be careful" or even a "Maybe we should wait a second". No, it's just "Ooooooooooh shiny thing!"

Hahaha. This post is good. Anyway, on topic, I think that "Hey, let's be careful" was kind of a given rule of thumb in that cesspit

[The Angry One]

It's called the Idiot Ball. Every character will usually find themselves carrying the Idiot Ball at some point to move the plot along, usually so the baddies can score a victory.
In this case, Hawke and Varric carry the Idiot Ball so that Bartrand can catch them in a trap a mole person could see coming a mile away.

[Gentleman Moogle]

The Angry One wrote...

It's called the Idiot Ball. Every character will usually find themselves carrying the Idiot Ball at some point to move the plot along, usually so the baddies can score a victory.
In this case, Hawke and Varric carry the Idiot Ball so that Bartrand can catch them in a trap a mole person could see coming a mile away.

I like you. You're devious. 

[Wolfva2]

Deylar wrote...

Silveryne wrote...

The characters exist in the world and are incapable of having the infinite foresight that we do. We have the frame of reference from watching a dozen movies where we claw our eyes out and go "DON'T DO IT." They don't.

Oh come on.

That's such a cop out.

In real life, if I saw a creepy idol I'd probably not even touch the idol. I'd leave it alone. 

And that is why, if you were the protaganist, the game would have ended with ya'll backing slowly out of the room, sealing it shut, and then selling off the rest of the items you plundered thus making you a wealthy merchant who never becomes the Champion because you always play it safe.

Of course, you also end up dying in your sleep at an advanced old age surrounded by hordes of loved ones, unlike the Champion who'll probably end up aten by a kraken or something.

[Gentleman Moogle]

Wolfva2 wrote...

Deylar wrote...

Silveryne wrote...

The characters exist in the world and are incapable of having the infinite foresight that we do. We have the frame of reference from watching a dozen movies where we claw our eyes out and go "DON'T DO IT." They don't.

Oh come on.

That's such a cop out.

In real life, if I saw a creepy idol I'd probably not even touch the idol. I'd leave it alone. 

And that is why, if you were the protaganist, the game would have ended with ya'll backing slowly out of the room, sealing it shut, and then selling off the rest of the items you plundered thus making you a wealthy merchant who never becomes the Champion because you always play it safe.

Of course, you also end up dying in your sleep at an advanced old age surrounded by hordes of loved ones, unlike the Champion who'll probably end up aten by a kraken or something.

Is it weird that I would have prefered that ending?

Also, the Idol wasn't what led to you becoming the Champion (At least, not if I remember correctly). That happened because of the conflict between the Arbishok and the Viscount, neither of whom were connected with Meredith's actions. 

Again, if I remember correctly. 

[Alexein]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

It's called the Idiot Ball. Every character will usually find themselves carrying the Idiot Ball at some point to move the plot along, usually so the baddies can score a victory.
In this case, Hawke and Varric carry the Idiot Ball so that Bartrand can catch them in a trap a mole person could see coming a mile away.

I like you. You're devious. 

 http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IdiotBall

Start there, and waste a good 10 hours of your life following the tropes, its a lot of fun actually.

Modifié par Alexein, 23 mars 2011 - 05:08 .

[The Angry One]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

Wolfva2 wrote...

Deylar wrote...

Silveryne wrote...

The characters exist in the world and are incapable of having the infinite foresight that we do. We have the frame of reference from watching a dozen movies where we claw our eyes out and go "DON'T DO IT." They don't.

Oh come on.

That's such a cop out.

In real life, if I saw a creepy idol I'd probably not even touch the idol. I'd leave it alone. 

And that is why, if you were the protaganist, the game would have ended with ya'll backing slowly out of the room, sealing it shut, and then selling off the rest of the items you plundered thus making you a wealthy merchant who never becomes the Champion because you always play it safe.

Of course, you also end up dying in your sleep at an advanced old age surrounded by hordes of loved ones, unlike the Champion who'll probably end up aten by a kraken or something.

Is it weird that I would have prefered that ending?

Also, the Idol wasn't what led to you becoming the Champion (At least, not if I remember correctly). That happened because of the conflict between the Arbishok and the Viscount, neither of whom were connected with Meredith's actions. 

Again, if I remember correctly. 

Yep. With no idol, Act 2 remains the same. Act 3 may have been about 50% less crazy.

[Gentleman Moogle]

Did... Did you just link me to TVtropes? On an internet forum!? Don't you know how dangerous that is, man!!? You're practically inviting me to suck my life out through my eyeballs!

Oh. Oh great. Now I clicked on it.

I hope you're happy.

[Halo Quea]

The lyrium idol was a pure and shameless rip off of the Ring in LOTR. When seeing Betrand's behavior from being separated from the idol in "Family Matters", I thought "Golem!"

[Alexein]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

Did... Did you just link me to TVtropes? On an internet forum!? Don't you know how dangerous that is, man!!? You're practically inviting me to suck my life out through my eyeballs!

Oh. Oh great. Now I clicked on it.

I hope you're happy.

Yes that was EXACTLY my intention, My well-thought out response before was ignored, so i feel i must repay the blatant insult by sucking the life through your eyes and leave you a horrible smoking husk of your former self....

.... Like Meredith

Speak of which.... she's dead, but what exactly is she now? more red Lyrium? or is it just a radioactive mummy?

If its red lyrium that means the idol is REALLY dangerous... it turns people to red lyrium. What if she's contagious?

*shudder*

[Gentleman Moogle]

Alexein wrote...

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

Did... Did you just link me to TVtropes? On an internet forum!? Don't you know how dangerous that is, man!!? You're practically inviting me to suck my life out through my eyeballs!

Oh. Oh great. Now I clicked on it.

I hope you're happy.

Yes that was EXACTLY my intention, My well-thought out response before was ignored, so i feel i must repay the blatant insult by sucking the life through your eyes and leave you a horrible smoking husk of your former self....

.... Like Meredith

Speak of which.... she's dead, but what exactly is she now? more red Lyrium? or is it just a radioactive mummy?

If its red lyrium that means the idol is REALLY dangerous... it turns people to red lyrium. What if she's contagious?

*shudder*

Heh, your well reasoned response was ignored because I was having fun with my witty rant, and your cold unfeeling logic was severely harshing my mellow. 

And no idea on Meredith. I haven't beaten the game yet. I encountered Merrill's quest-tangle bug in Act 3, and I just couldn't continue. Rips me right out of the game every time I try to muscle past it. 

[Maria Caliban]

Looks safe to me.

[Pinely]

Yeah, definitely classic idiot ball.

But, if I were in that same situation, I would have picked up the idol as well. The fact that it is sitting on an altar just screams "Pick me up!". Then, I would think to myself "That was stupid, better hand this to someone else before I explode or something". Varric does the same and suddenly Bartrand gets the idol. I probably shouldn't be an archeologist.

[LightningOkami]

I'd be curious and wanna touch the Idol or any ancient artifact xD
I guess when they ventured into the Deep Roads, the room didn't give them the warning signs, instead "Treasure, Treasure, Treasure" must've been going through their minds, so as soon as they saw it they just picked it up without thinking
The whole idea that Varric threw it to his brother who was stood near the door is what bothers me the most, someone who acts like he did when you wanted to join the expedition, i wouldn't trust them so quickly with something 'special' i had just found...

Modifié par LightningOkami, 23 mars 2011 - 06:06 .

[TheBlackBaron]

Pinely wrote...

Yeah, definitely classic idiot ball.

But, if I were in that same situation, I would have picked up the idol as well. The fact that it is sitting on an altar just screams "Pick me up!". Then, I would think to myself "That was stupid, better hand this to someone else before I explode or something". Varric does the same and suddenly Bartrand gets the idol. I probably shouldn't be an archeologist.

Realistically speaking, I doubt anybody here wouldn't have picked it up, even knowing it would probably end horribly. Who doesn't want their own Indiana Jones moment? 

[AlexXIV]

Ever played Lara Croft? She is doing that all day long.

If Hawke had known how much the idol ruins the story later in Act3, he/she probably would have smashed it right there. But hey they were going to be rich, and if by that they wake up some ancient mummy who then is going to destroy the whole world then so what -

Modifié par AlexXIV, 23 mars 2011 - 06:15 .

[LobselVith8]

Odd that the Idol never seems to corrupt Hawke in the same way it seems to corrupt Bartrand and Varric. You'd think a lyrium idol would have a bigger impact on an apostate Hawke than two dwarves, after all.

[The Angry One]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Odd that the Idol never seems to corrupt Hawke in the same way it seems to corrupt Bartrand and Varric. You'd think a lyrium idol would have a bigger impact on an apostate Hawke than two dwarves, after all.

Hawke: *lifts idol away from Varric* My precioooousssssss! *runs away laughing*

Coming soon: Crazy Crazy Hawke DLC.

[AlexXIV]

I think the idol does not corrupt instantly. It didn't corrupt Bartrand instantly either. He was just an ass. By nature, so to speak. They only meet him again after many years when he is batsh*t crazy, and Meredith also holds it for years before the final act.

[The Angry One]

AlexXIV wrote...

I think the idol does not corrupt instantly. It didn't corrupt Bartrand instantly either. He was just an ass. By nature, so to speak. They only meet him again after many years when he is batsh*t crazy, and Meredith also holds it for years before the final act.

There's being an ass then there's leaving your own brother to die in a hole in the ground.
Not to mention Bartrand instantly takes on a maniacal look as soon as he takes the idol.

[Alexein]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Odd that the Idol never seems to corrupt Hawke in the same way it seems to corrupt Bartrand and Varric. You'd think a lyrium idol would have a bigger impact on an apostate Hawke than two dwarves, after all.

Yeah, this violates estabalished canon in DA:O mage origin where just touching pure lyrium causes a mage to quickly and mentally enter the fade (harrowing).

Its even written in the codex that raw lyrium is fatal to mages (i'm assuming in larger doses rather than just a quick touch)

So either this is a plot hole big enough to lose leliana's death into. or the idol is not lyrium as we know it, but something else, maybe a processed form or lyrium compound. like salt is a safe compound of deadly chlorine and dangerously reactive sodium.

Ofcourse Hawke wouldn't have known this.

SO WHY DID MAGE HAWKE TOUCH IT?

its like superman seeing something that looks like kryptonite and going "This will probably kill me... let me fondle it!"


oh well, the only out is if mage-hawk already has extensive knowledge of lyrium types and recognized the idol as a some sort of processed lyrium that was safe.... although he didn't know about the later corruption.

Bottom line: Lucky Basterd.

Modifié par Alexein, 23 mars 2011 - 06:43 .

[AlexXIV]

The Angry One wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

I think the idol does not corrupt instantly. It didn't corrupt Bartrand instantly either. He was just an ass. By nature, so to speak. They only meet him again after many years when he is batsh*t crazy, and Meredith also holds it for years before the final act.

There's being an ass then there's leaving your own brother to die in a hole in the ground.
Not to mention Bartrand instantly takes on a maniacal look as soon as he takes the idol.

He's a stereotype greedy dwarf. And he says himself that he thinks the location of the thaig is worth much more than the idol.

[harzamir]

I just think the reason for noone thinking rationally is because the only reason they even went there was to find treasure and get rich. The thought of getting rich makes many people blind to all else.
And as to why Varric gave it his brother, well there wasn't any reason why he shouldn't trust his own brother at that point.

[AlexXIV]

harzamir wrote...

I just think the reason for noone thinking rationally is because the only reason they even went there was to find treasure and get rich. The thought of getting rich makes many people blind to all else.
And as to why Varric gave it his brother, well there wasn't any reason why he shouldn't trust his own brother at that point.

I don't know, I'd know a very good reason. Thing is they are really all very stupid at this point. But the plot demanded it.

[Talladarr]

ROFFLMGDFAO!!!!!!!!!!! I agree with you 100%, I mean, I love them, Varic is one of my favorite characters, but that was a ****ing STUPID thign to do