143 réponses à ce sujet

[Delduwath Mordion]

Franzius wrote...

But also take a look at sales data... ME2 sold less than ME1 (on xbox360 at least)...

Check NPD for US data.
If you want, you can more easily check VGChartz for a very rough estimation.

Just checked VGChartz (Since US is only one market and the NPD also neglects certain stores) and if they are correct ME2 has sold just as well on 360 as ME1. If you also take into account that ME1 has been out for two more years I would say it's sold quite ok. And as usual neither NPD nor VGChartz has any info on the PC -market which despite the popular claims is NOT a dead market. All of my friends play Bioware-games on PC because that's what we're used to and prefer. And as you said digital sales are also not included and while ME1 might be available on XBOX ME2 is available on PS3.

All in all I'd say that the sales of ME2 seem to be higher than ME1's

[Torhagen]

Franzius wrote...

jamskinner wrote...

Franzius wrote...

The "loud minority" is a false mith. And it will not help BiowEA!
There is a HUGE SILENT Group of people that disliked (at many levels) ME2.
You should know it, it is accademy, only a really small % of not satisfied customers shown openly their feelings.
Please, just look outside this forum, in the comments section of other sites, in other forum, everywhere around the web!!! ME2 is a sequel that make a huge % of customers regret (again, at many different levels) the original.. And if you think about it, this is just a huge failure per se!

But also take a look at sales data... ME2 sold less than ME1 (on xbox360 at least)...
And if you consider the sales data based upon the different user-base during each release date, consider also the huge praise of the game "journalists", the fake GOTY etc... Well ME2 doesn't encounter an EPIC success among the gamers after all!!!
We just want also to talk about the PS3 fiasco?!?!

I am more that sure that if they have conduct a survey after ME1 & after ME2 the data would have shown how the Franchise has incredibly lost its magical-status among widespread fans.

The point is that after ME2 (well and also DA on consoles and DA2) many old time fans are now on a "wait & see" status, and many (like me) will only take the game after 1-2 year (super discounted!). There is also a important portions of customers that bought the game (shooter fans / hype victims mainly) that will not come back on ME3.

So yes BiowEA is under a lot of pressure... But due to the evidences the pressure will crash them.

The reason it did not sell as much might have to do with it not being an xbox exclusive at release like the first game was.  The second game released on PC as well as xbox at the same time so it is not strange to see it not sell as well.  You would have to look at the total sales to see what the picture actually is.

Ok.
But do you realize how different was the user base at the time of ME1?
Do you realize how HUGE was the marketing effort that was behind ME2 (gdc, teaser, pre-e3, e3, many trailers etc...) respect to ME1?
Do you realize that ME2 could enjoy an alredy established franchise (not a new IP!) with a very strong and established userbase of fans ready to everything for their beloved sci-fi serie?
Do you realize that they even create a demo?
Do you realize that the "game journalis" praised it as a definitive MASTERPIECE the Avatar of Games (EA money?)?
Do you realize how many GOTY and Prize (EA money?) it wins?
Do you realize how very poorly performed on PS3 ?

People it is redicolus to keep on being BiowEA "Yesmen" !!!

I totally agree with Franzius the main reason i bought ME2 was that loved ME1 to death and i am not the only one
who thinks that ME2 was a huge letdown .

I may buy ME3 but ONLY after i have seen the finished product

Modifié par Torhagen, 24 mars 2011 - 02:47 .

[cedgedc]

Torhaqen wrote...

Ok.
But do you realize how different was the user base at the time of ME1?
Do you realize how HUGE was the marketing effort that was behind ME2 (gdc, teaser, pre-e3, e3, many trailers etc...) respect to ME1?
Do you realize that ME2 could enjoy an alredy established franchise (not a new IP!) with a very strong and established userbase of fans ready to everything for their beloved sci-fi serie?
Do you realize that they even create a demo?
Do you realize that the "game journalis" praised it as a definitive MASTERPIECE the Avatar of Games (EA money?)?
Do you realize how many GOTY and Prize (EA money?) it wins?
Do you realize how very poorly performed on PS3 ?

People it is redicolus to keep on being BiowEA "Yesmen" !!!

You can't look at just the figures you want to consider and make a judgement based on that. There is a tremendous number RPG fanatics (myself included) who don't touch consoles with a 10 ft pole. The title being released for both xbox and pc at the same time woudl definitely have an impact on xbox sales.

Furthermore you'd have to also look at xbox sales for that year if you really want to get down to it. What other titles for xbox were releasing at the sametime? Even the state of the economy during the two releases would have a big impact on something like video game sales. And the game is still generating solid sales on pc.

And as for being BiowEA fans- I judge a company on the quality of it's products. I don't defend a company unless their track record provides good reason. I am not even a sci-fi fan at all. I Wasn't the slightest bit interested in ME until I was horribly bored one evening, waiting for rift and DA2 to come out and saw it on sale on steam. Now I'm completely hooked, and yet I still don't care for other sci-fi series that i've seen/tried.

The fact of the matter is that looking elsewhere on the internet still won't tell you much because people always complain louder than they praise. The people who loved the game are still playing it right now for a 5th or 6th time. They're reading the books, and they're frantically awaiting the next installment.

It's a good game, and looking at a fraction of the sales numbers and drawing conclusions from them won't change that.

Modifié par cedgedc, 24 mars 2011 - 02:53 .

[Fat Headed Wolf]

Ok.
But do you realize how different was the user base at the time of ME1?
Do you realize how HUGE was the marketing effort that was behind ME2 (gdc, teaser, pre-e3, e3, many trailers etc...) respect to ME1?
Do you realize that ME2 could enjoy an alredy established franchise (not a new IP!) with a very strong and established userbase of fans ready to everything for their beloved sci-fi serie?
Do you realize that they even create a demo?
Do you realize that the "game journalis" praised it as a definitive MASTERPIECE the Avatar of Games (EA money?)?
Do you realize how many GOTY and Prize (EA money?) it wins?
Do you realize how very poorly performed on PS3 ?

People it is redicolus to keep on being BiowEA "Yesmen" !!!

O.K. I can understand not liking ME2, I really can. I mean, while I thought ME2 was better than ME1, I also thought certain things about it were not as good (mainly the story, atmosphere, and characters). 

But, to imply that the reason ME2 won its rewards and what-not because of "EA Money" is a bit far-fetched. I'm only gonna say this once--

There is no evidence--concrete or no-- that has pointed to EA bribing for reviews and/or awards of ME2. None, zip, zilch, nada, nothing, zero. numero none-o, asolutely positively nothing.

To try to win a debate by bringing up a point that has no proof is just silly. What if presidential canidates did that during their debates? "You're poll numbers are only up because your paying people to raise them! And although I have no proof, I'm going to base a pole of my beliefs upon this one questionable ideal! And, you know what else? The fact you haven't proven I am wrong only further shows that I am not!"

Come on folks, were smarter than this..... 

Modifié par Fat Headed Wolf, 24 mars 2011 - 02:54 .

[cedgedc]

Fat Headed Wolf wrote...

To try to win a debate by bringing up a point that has no proof is just silly. What if presidential canidates did that during their debates? "You're poll numbers are only up because your paying people to raise them! And although I have no proof, I'm going to base a pole of my beliefs upon this one questionable ideal! And, you know what else? The fact you haven't proven I am wrong only further shows that I am not!"

lol Dude, our presidential candidates do -exactly- that. 'His name is Obama, he musn't be an American citizen!'

[Whatever42]

Bioware and EA know their sales numbers perfectly well. They seem perfectly pleased with it.

I suspect they're curious to why their sales don't break through to the next level on any of their games, which is what I wager they are more concerned about.

[Fat Headed Wolf]

cedgedc wrote...

Fat Headed Wolf wrote...

To try to win a debate by bringing up a point that has no proof is just silly. What if presidential canidates did that during their debates? "You're poll numbers are only up because your paying people to raise them! And although I have no proof, I'm going to base a pole of my beliefs upon this one questionable ideal! And, you know what else? The fact you haven't proven I am wrong only further shows that I am not!"

lol Dude, our presidential candidates do -exactly- that. 'His name is Obama, he musn't be an American citizen!'

Well, I'd say that's moreso the way-far-right and not the candidates, but, still, I award an internet point to you! Get 100 and I'll give you an internet cookie! 

[cedgedc]

Fat Headed Wolf wrote...

cedgedc wrote...

Fat Headed Wolf wrote...

To try to win a debate by bringing up a point that has no proof is just silly. What if presidential canidates did that during their debates? "You're poll numbers are only up because your paying people to raise them! And although I have no proof, I'm going to base a pole of my beliefs upon this one questionable ideal! And, you know what else? The fact you haven't proven I am wrong only further shows that I am not!"

lol Dude, our presidential candidates do -exactly- that. 'His name is Obama, he musn't be an American citizen!'

Well, I'd say that's moreso the way-far-right and not the candidates, but, still, I award an internet point to you! Get 100 and I'll give you an internet cookie! 

Some might argue that was worth... two internet points??

[Fat Headed Wolf]

cedgedc wrote...

Fat Headed Wolf wrote...

cedgedc wrote...

Fat Headed Wolf wrote...

To try to win a debate by bringing up a point that has no proof is just silly. What if presidential canidates did that during their debates? "You're poll numbers are only up because your paying people to raise them! And although I have no proof, I'm going to base a pole of my beliefs upon this one questionable ideal! And, you know what else? The fact you haven't proven I am wrong only further shows that I am not!"

lol Dude, our presidential candidates do -exactly- that. 'His name is Obama, he musn't be an American citizen!'

Well, I'd say that's moreso the way-far-right and not the candidates, but, still, I award an internet point to you! Get 100 and I'll give you an internet cookie! 

Some might argue that was worth... two internet points??

What do you think I am? Some internet points ****? Uh-Uh! You gotta work for yours shuga!!! 

[RyuGuitarFreak]

Bioware is on pressure to get huge sales. Yes. ME1 sales and DAO getting over 4 million units isn't being enough for EA. If you follow video gaming on news around, they're on an obsession to make a Call of Duty level blockbuster. They want sales, sales, sales and it doesn't matter how. ME2 won over 100 GOTY awards but the sales were "not so good" if the post report of someone from Bioware in Giant Bomb that ME2 struggled to get over 2 million units (I doubt this a little) in comparison to Bethesda (Fallout 3 3.5kk, Oblivion 4kk) and Rockstar (RDR 4.5kk) is putting them on the edge www.giantbomb.com/dragon-age-ii/61-30995/bioware-senior-developer-da2-was-a-one-year-production/35-487429/. EA wants multi million sellers. Period. For good or bad.

I don't wanna think about what will happen if SW: TOR and ME3 don't go over sales expectations. We had Dragon Age 2 huge controversy already.

[cedgedc]

RyuGuitarFreak wrote...

Bioware is on pressure to get huge sales. Yes. ME1 sales and DAO getting over 4 million units isn't being enough for EA. If you follow video gaming on news around, they're on an obsession to make a Call of Duty level blockbuster. They want sales, sales, sales and it doesn't matter how. ME2 won over 100 GOTY awards but the sales were "not so good" if the post report of someone from Bioware in Giant Bomb that ME2 struggled to get over 2 million units (I doubt this a little) in comparison to Bethesda (Fallout 3 3.5kk, Oblivion 4kk) and Rockstar (RDR 4.5kk) is putting them on the edge www.giantbomb.com/dragon-age-ii/61-30995/bioware-senior-developer-da2-was-a-one-year-production/35-487429/. EA wants multi million sellers. Period. For good or bad.

I don't wanna think about what will happen if SW: TOR and ME3 don't go over sales expectations. We had Dragon Age 2 huge controversy already.

Personally I think it's safe to say DA2 sales were hurt most by Rift. I was -so- excited for DA2 until I saw when rift was coming out. Lots of people I know get into the single player rpg's to take a break from WoW or what have you cause they're tired of the grind. Rift filled that void and stole lots of potential customers from the release, myself included.

[Naltair]

Armchair speculation and half-cocked arguments and conspiracy theories is all I see here.

[Dominus]

Armchair speculation and half-cocked arguments and conspiracy theories is all I see here.

Certainly makes for an amusing read, though.

[MajesticJazz]

Shadow of Sparta wrote...

Okay,this is kind of related to all the recent criticism of Dragon Age 2 so bear with me.Bioware has encountered quite a bit of negaivity (some of which they were not expecting) for the changes made to the game and now i feel as though the pressure is on for ME3.First of all, i know they're different games but from what comments i've seen particularly on this forum, Bioware's reputation is at stake with some of the fans.Maybe i'm reading too much into it but that's the vibe i'm getting.I know ME fans are really looking forward to the next installment but there wasn't any real pressure on the ME team.The second was arguably better than the first so we all expect them to continue working with fan feedback to make an excellent finale to the trilogy.Right?However,i do get the feeling that there are now more scrutinous eyes on the next thing Bioware release to see if they can appease or cater to the hurt fans (though you can't please everyone) and try and save their deteriorating reputation in the eyes of those fans.So in closing,do you think there is now added pressure on Bioware?Is the pressure fair?Are the expectations now ridiculously high?Am i being silly?Let me hear your views.

I would say that the pressure is more on Bioware's Star Wars: The Old Republic than Mass Effect 3.

[DarthSliver]

Sorry to say but i see point here. Not many people truly know how the system works because they mostly play the games for fun. They dont sit here on the forums talking about every aspect of Bioware games "so to speak".
Even though I know the concerns on DA2, I do worry if it will effect ME3. And to be honest why wouldnt I worry about that detail. DA2 may not be as bad as the most negative review it has, but X-Plays review of DA2 by far speaks some truth of what the problems with the game is. I dont think we have much to worry about with ME3 as long as they dont rush it. If they run into a snag, i trust Bioware will push back ME3's release date.
With SW:TOR coming out soon, I think thats their focus point right now. Ive been calling that game the WoW killer since its been announced. I justify my point with WoW's recent expansion, why change the game so dramatically if they arent worried about TOR.

[Vena_86]

BioWares reputation has decreased since the EA takover and since it has become obvious that it does change their approach for making games. The love for creating art which people will remember appears to be gone or atleast it has taken a back seat. BioWare has been industrialized. Now rules for attracting the biggest audience in the most cost effective way are most important. DA2 will damage them on the long run. Even if a rushed DA2 is cost effective thanks to pre-orders and release-day sales based on marketing and previous reputation, the next game wont have the benefit of the doubt anymore to that extend.
With dwindling reputation ME3 will sell not as good as it could and unless that game will convince people through it's quality, depth, love and attention to detail again, the next game will have a similar problem.
What is more fullfilling, creating games that will be remembered, respected and referenced for decades or making the quick buck?

[SalsaDMA]

TwistedComplex wrote...



That said. DA2 wasn't rushed

They just spent too much time on the wrong things

Interesting.

So you're saying that the composer that delivered music to DA2 is wrong when he said in an interview it was rushed because EA wanted to capitalize on DA:O's success?

[Naltair]

I would love a link to said interview.

[Naltair]

Vena_86 wrote...

BioWares reputation has decreased since the EA takover and since it has become obvious that it does change their approach for making games. The love for creating art which people will remember appears to be gone or atleast it has taken a back seat. BioWare has been industrialized. Now rules for attracting the biggest audience in the most cost effective way are most important. DA2 will damage them on the long run. Even if a rushed DA2 is cost effective thanks to pre-orders and release-day sales based on marketing and previous reputation, the next game wont have the benefit of the doubt anymore to that extend.
With dwindling reputation ME3 will sell not as good as it could and unless that game will convince people through it's quality, depth, love and attention to detail again, the next game will have a similar problem.
What is more fullfilling, creating games that will be remembered, respected and referenced for decades or making the quick buck?

Mass Effect series will be remembered regardless.  Mass Effect 2 was one of the most critically acclaimed games of 2010, it will not be forgotten.

[Tazzmission]

Gongon11 wrote...

i dont get why people keep automatically thinking just cause dragon age 2 wasnt as good as it should be doesnt mean me3 will be as bad, they are two different teams, and the me has been working on me3 few months before me2 was released i believe, pretty much 2 years in development

whats really is laughable we here all these people complain when in fact theyll still buy the game. theres times where im like wtf is up with fans

[piemanz]

Naltair wrote...

I would love a link to said interview.

http://uk.music.ign..../1154594p1.html

I'm nt going to lie, it is concerning.However ME3 will have had 2 years of development by the time it's released which isn't really rushed when you consider theres a 2 year gap between ME1 and ME2, and they had to revamp the whole game in that time.

Modifié par piemanz, 24 mars 2011 - 06:32 .

[Tazzmission]

Vena_86 wrote...

BioWares reputation has decreased since the EA takover and since it has become obvious that it does change their approach for making games. The love for creating art which people will remember appears to be gone or atleast it has taken a back seat. BioWare has been industrialized. Now rules for attracting the biggest audience in the most cost effective way are most important. DA2 will damage them on the long run. Even if a rushed DA2 is cost effective thanks to pre-orders and release-day sales based on marketing and previous reputation, the next game wont have the benefit of the doubt anymore to that extend.
With dwindling reputation ME3 will sell not as good as it could and unless that game will convince people through it's quality, depth, love and attention to detail again, the next game will have a similar problem.
What is more fullfilling, creating games that will be remembered, respected and referenced for decades or making the quick buck?

how is it ea's fault? lets be realistic if bioware didnt say hey we'll listen to the fans i dont think half of this board would be complaining because lets face it FANS dont know what the hell they want. first people hated the mako so they ditched it and now fans are saying the hammerheads worse when in fact it was FREE DLC.  also the mac walters bashing isnt cool because lets face it anytime theres a new game or movie for that matter you have to write something new and thats what mac waltes  did and these so called fans are nothing more than some whiney little kids who dont wanna take responsibility and admit they dont know what they want.

[Chewin]

I wouldn't say DA II was rushed. It's actually a very good game. But when it comes to being a sequel, it's the worst game EVA!!!

[Tazzmission]

Chewin3 wrote...

I wouldn't say DA II was rushed. It's actually a very good game. But when it comes to being a sequel, it's the worst game EVA!!!

i never cared for dragon age honestly. im not a fan on the whole medevil theme at all. and the truth is the people who still complain will buy me3 because than it gives them another excuse to rant about in the long run.

[Naltair]

piemanz wrote...

Naltair wrote...

I would love a link to said interview.

http://uk.music.ign..../1154594p1.html

I'm nt going to lie, it is concerning.However ME3 will have had 2 years of development by the time it's released which isn't really rushed when you consider theres a 2 year gap between ME1 and ME2, and they had to revamp the whole game in that time.

IGN: After the game is finished, do you go back through a play it again with all of the music in place? 

Zur: Sure thing. I'm actually really anxious for the game right now, so I can pop it in and start playing. I'm really looking forward to see it. I know there are a few bugs that still need to be fixed. Unlike other titles from Bioware, this [score] was kind of a rush job. EA really wanted to capitalize on the success of Origins, so the game was really being pushed hard to be released now. So I'd like to know if there are bugs, or if there's anything we could patch or fix. [Editor's note: Zur is speaking about bugs in the score only; he had no involvement with the rest of the game's development.] 

I think people are reading way too much into this.

Modifié par Naltair, 24 mars 2011 - 06:37 .