147 réponses à ce sujet

[nicodeemus327]

I don't know if I'd say masterpiece. However, its a damn great game. One of my favorites.

Modifié par nicodeemus327, 24 mars 2011 - 06:36 .

[NinjaRogue]

or has their own opinions *gasps*

[scpulley]

Sazzle wrote...

Dragon Age 2 is an understated masterpiece.  In the vein of Empire Strikes Back, it leaves you feeling gloriously unsatisfied and begging for more.  I've read complaints about its lack of epicness, about the end of the game being uncontrollable and inevitable, and about the romances being lacklustre, but I refute them all.  The beauty of it is its understated nature and the realism invoked by the gritty ending which, intertwined with intimate friendships and subtle, realistically private relationships, make it a gloriously involved experience. 

Loved it.

Except....Empire Strikes Back had characters that actually showed some sort of reaction and investment to what was going on. I thought it was the best of the Star Wars movies to be honest. That being said, DA 2 would have been good and the 'big decision' would have mattered if there was actually enough story to give it any sort of emotional depth. I had zero feeling about which side to choose at the end, you killed everyone anyway. The only sane people really were the chantry and they were blown up lol. In the end you just were sort of there, some stuff happened you were supposed to care about, but Act 3 was horrible. Open endings are great, but you still actually have to care enough about the story or at least feel like the main character cares otherwise you just wasted 30 hours of gameplay for nothing.

[Nyaore]

I wouldn't call it a masterpiece, or even the best Bioware game I've ever played, but I definitely don't believe it deserves all the flack it's getting. It's a solid game for the amount of time it took to develop, and based upon it's own merits. Honestly I believe that many of the people who are railing against it would have had no problem with the game if it wasn't a Dragon Age title.
With all that said, I hope the amount of nerd rage on these forums doesn't force Bioware to completely scrap some of the ideas they used for this game. I enjoyed the faster paced combat, the friendship/rivalry system, and even the idea that not all fantasy stories should be about facing down some 'big bad' and saving the day; and would like to see all of them make a return either in the next game or another title.
(Note, people who are expressing legitimate concerns in a constructive manner do not exhibit nerd rage, it's the people who bash the game relentlessly for failing to live up to their expectations and completely ignore the good things about it that apply to what I'm saying.)

[Invalidcode]

DA2, underrated? Yes. Over-hated? Also yes.
Masterpiece? Sorry no, far from it.
Is it enjoyable & fun? Yeah!

[TheBlackBaron]

As far as second outings go, it reminds me more of Attack of the Clones than Empire Strikes Back.

That said, of course, it's not a bad game by any stretch. Hell, compared to most of what comes out of gaming industry, it's still above average. It's just that BioWare has a track record of producing "great" rather than "good".

[Buckarama]

I believe that the criticisms shouldn't be hard on the game but there are valid arguments through out. The repeated levels - the characters ARE shallow, but it is a video game and not a movie, I think combat has good and bad points - rogues look and act more like a ginzu knife commercial and not rogues, Mages ARE weak in comparison to the other classes, fighters are okay but not great.
The whole game reminds me of a Looney Toons where the little chicken "hawke" (coincidence? I don't think so) had to go around the farm to get string, fish, bone and some other things so he could get the chicken in hte end (Foghorn Leghorn) Hunt and fetch over the top.
Is it fun? Yeah I'm still playing it, but the same levels are really getting old. I'm finding it harder to play all three classes through to the end.

[Everwarden]

Sazzle wrote...
 In the vein of Empire Strikes Back, it leaves you feeling gloriously unsatisfied and begging for more.  I've read complaints about its lack of epicness, about the end of the game being uncontrollable and inevitable, and about the romances being lacklustre, but I refute them all.  The beauty of it is its understated nature and the realism invoked by the gritty ending which, intertwined with intimate friendships and subtle, realistically private relationships, make it a gloriously involved experience. 
Loved it.

But you didn't refute any of it. There actually is no way to change the ending -at all-, there are no significant choices in the game, you are railroaded into making choices you might not want to make ("Sure, Meredith, I'll hunt down apostates for you. Being one myself, and all. One who hates you. Sure.") and the romances are half-baked and buggy. 

[Sazzle]

Autolycus wrote...

It's by far the best bioware game to date

Really? You're either very young, easily pleased or have a short memory lol...

*shakes head*

You know, I think it might be one of their best games to date.  Certainly in recent years it's by far the most alternative.  It seems to be getting a similar reception to KOTOR 2, which was all about understatement, though the point was missed by many.
I love how much debate this game is throwing up anyhow! 

[Fault Girl]

LOVED IT.

DA:O was the first bioware game I ever played and I don't think any game could ever surpass it but then I played ME/ME2, blown away even more.

DA2 had the same effect, I wish it was a tad longer and more areas to go to but It's my top 5.

Still getting through Jade Empire, not one Bioware game has disappointed me. Know a few other people who are loving DA2.

I know its not like origins but before I played it, I took note that it wouldnt be and so I enjoyed it for what it was.

Made me cry and laugh!


PS.

it's nice to see a positive thread for once, the bashing was getting a tad extreme.

Hissy fits galore it was.

Modifié par ZombieGeisha, 24 mars 2011 - 06:15 .

[Fault Girl]

DOUBLE POST

Modifié par ZombieGeisha, 24 mars 2011 - 06:14 .

[Tamahome560]

Everwarden wrote...

Sazzle wrote...
 In the vein of Empire Strikes Back, it leaves you feeling gloriously unsatisfied and begging for more.  I've read complaints about its lack of epicness, about the end of the game being uncontrollable and inevitable, and about the romances being lacklustre, but I refute them all.  The beauty of it is its understated nature and the realism invoked by the gritty ending which, intertwined with intimate friendships and subtle, realistically private relationships, make it a gloriously involved experience. 
Loved it.

But you didn't refute any of it. There actually is no way to change the ending -at all-, there are no significant choices in the game, you are railroaded into making choices you might not want to make ("Sure, Meredith, I'll hunt down apostates for you. Being one myself, and all. One who hates you. Sure.") and the romances are half-baked and buggy. 

Yeah because we were not told multiple times that the story is not about How Hawke choices changed the world but what kind of a person was Hawke what has really happened around him that has lead to the world falling apart...

Also you have to help Meredith because you are under her rule. She is the ruler of the City and you are the servant of the City. You are meant to protect it and this is what she sees as your duty to Kirkwall and if you don't obey what she perceives as your duty she might as well treat you like any other apostate since you do not work for the good of Kirkwall anymore which was the only reason you are allowed to be a Free Mage.

[Lithuasil]

Autolycus wrote...

It's by far the best bioware game to date

Really? You're either very young, easily pleased or have a short memory lol...

*shakes head*

Or maybe I don't have my pretty face stuck in a bucket of nostalgia - there's room for improvement sure, but what I can say is that the game addresses every single issue I've ever had with bioware games, and moves in the right direction. Babysteps at times, but movement none-the less.

[KenKenpachi]

Lithuasil wrote...

Autolycus wrote...

It's by far the best bioware game to date

Really? You're either very young, easily pleased or have a short memory lol...

*shakes head*

Or maybe I don't have my pretty face stuck in a bucket of nostalgia - there's room for improvement sure, but what I can say is that the game addresses every single issue I've ever had with bioware games, and moves in the right direction. Babysteps at times, but movement none-the less.

Hmm its not often I find myself in agreement with you, but this is such a case. 90% of the people who hate this game is due to nostalgia by and large. When I went into DA:2 I went in to see it as DA:2, not as DA:O 2. I do that with many games even if they are connected. Its why I like ME1 and ME2, I like both for various reassons and hardly any of which match up.

That being said I LOVED Saints Row 2, and absolutely HATED the first. I am soooooo happy they are getting away from that "Gangsta" crap, and guess what the people who whine about it changing are the same who like SR1, and hate 2. Nostalgia, is the main problem with various fans.

Modifié par KenKenpachi, 24 mars 2011 - 06:26 .

[Sazzle]

Everwarden wrote...

Sazzle wrote...
 In the vein of Empire Strikes Back, it leaves you feeling gloriously unsatisfied and begging for more.  I've read complaints about its lack of epicness, about the end of the game being uncontrollable and inevitable, and about the romances being lacklustre, but I refute them all.  The beauty of it is its understated nature and the realism invoked by the gritty ending which, intertwined with intimate friendships and subtle, realistically private relationships, make it a gloriously involved experience. 
Loved it.

But you didn't refute any of it. There actually is no way to change the ending -at all-, there are no significant choices in the game, you are railroaded into making choices you might not want to make ("Sure, Meredith, I'll hunt down apostates for you. Being one myself, and all. One who hates you. Sure.") and the romances are half-baked and buggy. 

I agree on the Meredith section, that was a little funny.  With regards to refutes perhaps I wans't clear enough, sorry.  What i meant was that in some ways it was charming in its imperfection, its gritty nature if you like.  I like the fact the game wasn't about creating a perfect world from an imperfect one, it was about the catharsis at the end when you realise that you're fighting a losing battle.  Quite controversial I know, but I like the game for that exact reason!  Life would be boring if we all had the same opinions, though, eh?

[Everwarden]

Tamahome560 wrote...
Yeah because we were not told multiple times that the story is not about How Hawke choices changed the world but what kind of a person was Hawke what has really happened around him that has lead to the world falling apart...

We don't get to decide 'what kind of person' Hawke was, either. The extent to how you can make Hawke 'unique' is limited to which of the three tones you pick. That's it. Though I find your "..well they didn't promise us the chance to make any choices!" excuse to be ridiculous. Yeah, they did. This is such common knowledge that I don't think that digging up a reference is even necessary.

Also you have to help Meredith because you are under her rule. She is the ruler of the City and you are the servant of the City. You are meant to protect it and this is what she sees as your duty to Kirkwall and if you don't obey what she perceives as your duty she might as well treat you like any other apostate since you do not work for the good of Kirkwall anymore which was the only reason you are allowed to be a Free Mage.

Fail logic is still fail. An unapologetic apostate (who has a 2/3 chance of being a blood mage) would not do fetch quests for the templars. Or at least 'my' Hawke wouldn't have, and yet I'm given no choice in the matter. I'm forced to have 'my' Hawke hunt down apostates. Loghain was in charge in Origins, that doesn't mean that it would have been reasonable for the Warden to run fetch missions for him. 

[Everwarden]

KenKenpachi wrote...

Hmm its not often I find myself in agreement with you, but this is such a case. 90% of the people who hate this game is due to nostalgia by and large.

90%? Really? You did a study on it?

No. I don't hate DA2 for reasons of nostalgia (I'm still playing DAO, can't be nostalgic for it). I hate DA2 because the game is a heap of bad ideas and cut corners. The entire game reeks of 'half finished'. 

[Lithuasil]

Everwarden wrote...
Fail logic is still fail. An unapologetic apostate (who has a 2/3 chance of being a blood mage) would not do fetch quests for the templars. Or at least 'my' Hawke wouldn't have, and yet I'm given no choice in the matter. I'm forced to have 'my' Hawke hunt down apostates. Loghain was in charge in Origins, that doesn't mean that it would have been reasonable for the Warden to run fetch missions for him. 

If Loghain knew where the warden lived, and told the warden outright "I don't like you, and if I wanted, I could seriously ruin your ****, so do as I say" then doing fetch quests for him sound perfectly reasonable. For a person with a house, friends, lovers family all in that city, anyway.

[Lirea Dragonage]

It has it's flaws but what game doesn't? At least they're trying different things, pushing the boundaries. I doubt there's another game out there with such involved companions and so much interaction along with the ability to customize your own character so thoroughly to the point of picking a personality. I can't wait to see how they improve the things they've trialed here in DA3.

[Sazzle]

Everwarden wrote...

KenKenpachi wrote...

Hmm its not often I find myself in agreement with you, but this is such a case. 90% of the people who hate this game is due to nostalgia by and large.

90%? Really? You did a study on it?

No. I don't hate DA2 for reasons of nostalgia (I'm still playing DAO, can't be nostalgic for it). I hate DA2 because the game is a heap of bad ideas and cut corners. The entire game reeks of 'half finished'. 

Hmn, I do think you have a point about the half finished thing.  It certainly could have been more polished and a more flexible in dialogue choices.  I suppose that's the nature of a successful gaming company though, alas!  Perhaps my use of masterpiece was untoward.  I suppose what I meant was that I think the premise is certainly close to masterpiece, though I agree, its execution is far less than so!  Having said that, I still thoroughly enjoyed it!

[Everwarden]

Lithuasil wrote...
If Loghain knew where the warden lived, and told the warden outright "I don't like you, and if I wanted, I could seriously ruin your ****, so do as I say" then doing fetch quests for him sound perfectly reasonable. For a person with a house, friends, lovers family all in that city, anyway.

No. It still wouldn't be reasonable. 

[Lithuasil]

Everwarden wrote...

Lithuasil wrote...
If Loghain knew where the warden lived, and told the warden outright "I don't like you, and if I wanted, I could seriously ruin your ****, so do as I say" then doing fetch quests for him sound perfectly reasonable. For a person with a house, friends, lovers family all in that city, anyway.

No. It still wouldn't be reasonable. 

So essentially, what you're saying is that responding "No mum, I dun wanna eat my spinach" to meredith outright telling you "do as I say, or I'll have you clapped in iron, right here, right now", is a perfectly reasonable choice?

Yeah.
Riiiiiiiiight.

[Merced652]

lucas would roll over in his grave if he were dead.

[Tamahome560]

Everwarden wrote...

Tamahome560 wrote...
Yeah because we were not told multiple times that the story is not about How Hawke choices changed the world but what kind of a person was Hawke what has really happened around him that has lead to the world falling apart...

We don't get to decide 'what kind of person' Hawke was, either. The extent to how you can make Hawke 'unique' is limited to which of the three tones you pick. That's it. Though I find your "..well they didn't promise us the chance to make any choices!" excuse to be ridiculous. Yeah, they did. This is such common knowledge that I don't think that digging up a reference is even necessary.

Also you have to help Meredith because you are under her rule. She is the ruler of the City and you are the servant of the City. You are meant to protect it and this is what she sees as your duty to Kirkwall and if you don't obey what she perceives as your duty she might as well treat you like any other apostate since you do not work for the good of Kirkwall anymore which was the only reason you are allowed to be a Free Mage.

Fail logic is still fail. An unapologetic apostate (who has a 2/3 chance of being a blood mage) would not do fetch quests for the templars. Or at least 'my' Hawke wouldn't have, and yet I'm given no choice in the matter. I'm forced to have 'my' Hawke hunt down apostates. Loghain was in charge in Origins, that doesn't mean that it would have been reasonable for the Warden to run fetch missions for him. 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. So I will not argue further because there is no point in forcing my opinion and view on you when you clearly have a strong stance and with this matter being such a trivial thing it is not worth trying convincing you to change it