2875 réponses à ce sujet

[moilami]

JohnEpler wrote...

Let me jump in now and give a general warning that, given the tone of the last few threads discussing this issue, this one is going to be monitored very, very carefully. Homophobia and throwing slurs against those who are of a different sexual orientation than you is not acceptable.

At the same time, let's try to avoid the insults from the other side of the fence. If someone is espousing an opinion you find particularly offensive, let a moderator know. Every PM I get, I'm notified via my e-mail inbox and I will see it almost right away.

Let's try to keep this civil and constructive. If it starts to get out of hand, it will be locked, and warnings/bans will be handed out.

I have noticed it is acceptable in BW forums to attack heteros by calling them with names like "homophobic", which supposedly is something very insulting.

Heterosexualism is sexual orientation too.

[City6]

tanerb123 wrote...

the only reason i am not happy with gay romance is that space could be used for extra straight romance. because i am not happy with isabella and merril

This is the text book example of privilege that the designer is talking about.

"There are 2 gay option?!? The there should be 4 straight ones!"

There are as many straight options as there always were. But because now there are equal gay options, you deserve more stright options?

[Inquisitor Recon]

Merci357 wrote...
I guess not, since we already have people in this thread arguing with the bible. But we live in 2011, "thank god".

Saying "we live in 2011" doesn't justify anything ma'am.

[The Angry One]

Ryzaki wrote...

And to a femHawke! She insulted my femininity! I had to watch her to make sure she wouldn't try to molest me and she still ran up in my house! I never touched a heart icon! What? The golden heart? Well yeah I clicked that but it doesn't matter! The heart meant nothing at all! 

I clicked the heart and the next thing I knew she was in my house forcing herself on me!
I clicked the heart again to make her go away and we ended up in bed! Scandalous!

[v_ware]

ReconTeam wrote...

v_ware wrote...
Again: Majority isn't usable as a argument about morality.
Unless you're three years old.

I would hate to imply your reading comprehension may be on the level of a three-year old, but I was talking about sales and money, not morality there.

I knew you were talking about that, but my point still stands. And it even stands stronger.

Money is even less an argument when you're talking about morality.

[Ryzaki]

The Angry One wrote...

Deadmac wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Indeed. In fact, Isabela's same-sex flirts are near constant. Invitations to her bed, innuendo, and so on.
Even with a male character, aren't there those who feel such loose innuendo is inappropriate and sin? They're being discriminated against!

What about hetrosexual females who think the act of lesbian relations are immoral? Its not all one-sided.

What about them? You cannot write characters so that they will not offend anyone.
Bethany's a mage. She will offend those who think magic is evil.
Aveline is a soldier. She will offend misogynists.
Fenris is anti-slavery. He will offend ancient Romans.
And so on..

Don't forget Anders he does something...spectcular. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 24 mars 2011 - 10:44 .

[Captain Jazz]

Ryzaki wrote...

I think the majority cares more about the repeating maps, and the change of focus from DAO than about who exactly is Bi. 

I'm pretty sure that's pretty low on the list of concerns. IF it's even on it. 

I might get lynched for this... but I was actually more annoyed by the limiting of my weapon options for warriors and reducing specializations than the repeating maps - the maps give a large number of areas to adventure in without a 20gb install size. That might only be a big deal for me however - I play on a laptop with a wimpy little hard drive.

[AkiKishi]

iakus wrote...

Sharn01 wrote...
Yes, in my opinion it actually does.  When yo ask for this toggle you are saying that homosexuality is so bad that you want to erase it completely from the game, that the game makers agree with you that homosexuality is a terrible thing and give you the option to erase it from the game.  You are saying that rewriting chracters that are bisexual or gay and have those as character traits is less important then you being offended for 5 seconds during the course of a 30 hour game.

The idea is just as rediculous as having a toggle to turn everyone in the game gay with no interest in members of their own sex.

Hmm, I hit the toggle to remove persistant gore from the game.  Don't like having conversations while drenched in blood.  Does that make me...hemophobic? 

But seriously, the only problem I have with making the LIs available to everyone, regardless of gender is that, to me, it removes a part of what makes each character unique.  If they're all attracted to you, regardless of who or what you are, as long as you hit that  icon, seems to be making the reality of Thedas a bit...mutable.  Like reality bends around your character rather than people having clearly defined charactaristics.  I had enough of that with Shepard's mioond-control powers, thankyouverymuch


But for this particular game, the only truly annoying part was  I didn't like racking up rivalry ponts for turning down a character I wanted to befriend, just not be that kind of friend  

Well played sir/madame

[Monsteroids]

ReconTeam wrote...

How is it an inaccurate generalization? Most gamers are straight, as such they wouldn't get anything out of said content.

False, quite a few straight girls find Yaoi romance extremely arousing and most normal young men tend to like girl-on-girl skinship.

Anders and Fenris both make perfect Ukes (girl's insert guy) to the Seme (manly guy and girl's power fantasy) Hawke. One Emo and one Dangerous. The asthetic is much more likely or at least just likely to attract teen girls than men.

Also, Isabella is a legs-open lady that can do your Hawke and there's no danger of them not liking dudes, perfect fratboy ****** material. Merrill is the pure one and makes up a more social recluse nerdy girl/girl fantasy of pure-ish girls. Most insecure guys like pure girls. A wise old frog once made an essay about how pathetic these kinds of guys were, but they most definitely are a lucrative market.

The way these relationships are set-up are highly multi-purpose, but still keep the character's motivations, social behavior, and hidstories intact.

Modifié par Monsteroids, 24 mars 2011 - 10:46 .

[v_ware]

ReconTeam wrote...

Merci357 wrote...
I guess not, since we already have people in this thread arguing with the bible. But we live in 2011, "thank god".

Saying "we live in 2011" doesn't justify anything ma'am.

Saying the majority of gamers is straight doesn't justify anything dude.
Saying...........
.....
And so on. Nothing you said justifies your stance on homosexuality. It's wrong.

Modifié par v_ware, 24 mars 2011 - 10:45 .

[Galad22]

moilami wrote...

I have noticed it is acceptable in BW forums to attack heteros by calling them with names like "homophobic", which supposedly is something very insulting.

Heterosexualism is sexual orientation too.

If you noticed Epler didn't actually call any particular person homophobic. And those sort of people do exist.

Modifié par Galad22, 24 mars 2011 - 10:46 .

[Ryzaki]

Captain Jazz wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

I think the majority cares more about the repeating maps, and the change of focus from DAO than about who exactly is Bi. 

I'm pretty sure that's pretty low on the list of concerns. IF it's even on it. 

I might get lynched for this... but I was actually more annoyed by the limiting of my weapon options for warriors and reducing specializations than the repeating maps - the maps give a large number of areas to adventure in without a 20gb install size. That might only be a big deal for me however - I play on a laptop with a wimpy little hard drive.

Ah yeah I forgot about that. 

My DWW is nonexistant. <_< Apparently Anders forgot how to dual wield in Kirkwall.  

Though 20GB isn'ttoo big of a deal to me. That said decent HD and was planning on getting a TB. 

Still average players do not care about the romances. They're just there for favoring. They don't make or break the game. (If they did Awakening wouldn't have been so well received). 

[Blastback]

moilami wrote...

JohnEpler wrote...

Let me jump in now and give a general warning that, given the tone of the last few threads discussing this issue, this one is going to be monitored very, very carefully. Homophobia and throwing slurs against those who are of a different sexual orientation than you is not acceptable.

At the same time, let's try to avoid the insults from the other side of the fence. If someone is espousing an opinion you find particularly offensive, let a moderator know. Every PM I get, I'm notified via my e-mail inbox and I will see it almost right away.

Let's try to keep this civil and constructive. If it starts to get out of hand, it will be locked, and warnings/bans will be handed out.

I have noticed it is acceptable in BW forums to attack heteros by calling them with names like "homophobic", which supposedly is something very insulting.

Heterosexualism is sexual orientation too.

Being called homophobic is not an attack on your sexual orientation.  It is a critisism of someone being intolerant of other sexual orientations <_<

[Galad22]

ReconTeam wrote...

Saying "we live in 2011" doesn't justify anything ma'am.

And you saying majority of the gamers all the time? Does that justify something then?

[Merci357]

ReconTeam wrote...

Merci357 wrote...
I guess not, since we already have people in this thread arguing with the bible. But we live in 2011, "thank god".

Saying "we live in 2011" doesn't justify anything ma'am.

Of course not, but we have people here, who argue homosexuality is immoral, or a sin. Isn't murder, stealing, *insert your sin included in the game* as well? And were are the complains about that one? I just get upset when people hide behind their bible when it comes to sexuality, while they forget the very same book conveniently regarding tons of other aspects of games.

[Mad-Max90]

This is when it should be locked, every time somebody brings in a good argument on both sides the extremes from the others don't care what they read it's all "your with me or against me" I agree they're shouldn't be a toggle but I also agree not every damn person who follows Hawke should be gay for him/her and I only put her in there because if I didn't then that would offend somebody too, America has become too politically corrected, but that's beside the point. They did a decent job with origins a system they should have made better not just axe it and throw every bi person in thedas at you, it really is kind of lazy in the romance department

[v_ware]

moilami wrote...

I have noticed it is acceptable in BW forums to attack heteros by calling them with names like "homophobic", which supposedly is something very insulting.

Heterosexualism is sexual orientation too.

So is homosexuality. We aren't offended by heterosexuality. We are offended by some of you thinking homosexuality is less, and you should be able to turn it off.

Modifié par v_ware, 24 mars 2011 - 10:50 .

[John Epler]

Galad22 wrote...

moilami wrote...

I have noticed it is acceptable in BW forums to attack heteros by calling them with names like "homophobic", which supposedly is something very insulting.

Heterosexualism is sexual orientation too.

If you noticed Epler didn't actually call any particular person homophobic. And those sort of people do exist.

In fact, my policy has always been 'be civil above all else'. If people are offended or upset by what someone else has posted, they are more than welcome to message a moderator and let them know, at which point the situation will be dealt with.

Certainly I have my biases, but I try to put them aside when I moderate. I'll give my two cents where I can, but I don't believe I've been any more or less forgiving of one side or the other. When people start throwing out insults, regardless of the motivation, they are warned and/or banned for 24 hours.

However, I am not omniscient, and the forums move at a brisk pace. So unless I'm told about a problem, I can't do anything about it.

[Deadmac]

ReconTeam wrote...

Merci357 wrote...
I guess not, since we already have people in this thread arguing with the bible. But we live in 2011, "thank god".

Saying "we live in 2011" doesn't justify anything ma'am.

I agree with ReconTeam.

Even though we live in a new millennium, we didn't suddenly leave religious practices back in the 19th century.

[AkiKishi]

Monsteroids wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...

How is it an inaccurate generalization? Most gamers are straight, as such they wouldn't get anything out of said content.

False, quite a few straight girls find Yaoi romance extremely arousing and most normal young men tend to like girl-on-girl skinship.

Anders and Fenris both make perfect Ukes (girl's insert guy) to the Seme (manly guy and girl's power fantasy) Hawke. One Emo and one Dangerous. The asthetic is much more likely or at least just likely to attract teen girls than men.

Also, Isabella is a legs-open lady that can do your Hawke and there's no danger of them not liking dudes, perfect fratboy ****** material. Merrill is the pure one and makes up a more social recluse nerdy girl/girl fantasy of pure-ish girls. Most insecure guys like pure girls. A wise old frog once made an essay about how pathetic these kinds of guys were, but they most definitely are a lucrative market.

The way these relationships are set-up are highly multi-purpose, but still keep the character's motivations, social behavior, and hidstories intact.

The more I read this thread the more I think Bioware should just make eroge.

[Ryzaki]

The Angry One wrote...

I clicked the heart and the next thing I knew she was in my house forcing herself on me!
I clicked the heart again to make her go away and we ended up in bed! Scandalous!

You always know how to brighten my day. <3 

[John Epler]

Let me add, of course - this thread is coming dangerously close to being locked. Tone down the rhetoric on both sides and make an attempt to discuss this civilly, or it will be locked.

[Russalka]

Deadmac wrote...

I agree with ReconTeam.

Even though we live in a new millennium, we didn't suddenly leave religious practices back in the 19th century.

If that is where your beliefs are from, then honey, you should consider getting in touch with the modern times.

[The Angry One]

Deadmac wrote...

I agree with ReconTeam.

Even though we live in a new millennium, we didn't suddenly leave religious practices back in the 19th century.

So what, we should carry obsolete dogma into our videogames?

[moilami]

Galad22 wrote...

moilami wrote...

I have noticed it is acceptable in BW forums to attack heteros by calling them with names like "homophobic", which supposedly is something very insulting.

Heterosexualism is sexual orientation too.

If you noticed Epler didn't actually call any particular person homophobic. And those sort of people do exist.

It was a sarcastical reply to hypocrism below:

"throwing slurs against those who are of a different sexual orientation than you is not acceptable"