2875 réponses à ce sujet

[Sabariel]

EccentricSage wrote...

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

JohnnyDollar wrote...

I would appreciate it if someone that has gone through the dialog wheels would answer a few questions.

Concerning romantic dialog, who has revealed to the protagonist what their sexual preference is, by either coming out and saying "I am bisexual" for example, or having told the protagonist something about their personal history that would indicate what their preference is?

Who has not revealed any of the aforementioned info, but instead just engaged in romantic dialog, so that from Hawke's perspective (non-meta), Hawke can only assume that the LI is either heterosexual or homosexual, with no other information to conclude that the LI is bisexual?

Anders will say he had a male lover, but ONLY only if the PC is male. Females never get it.

Zevran in DA:O will candidly talk about his 'adventures' with male and female partners regardless of the PC's gender, though he phrases it slightly differently for each. He will also admit his preference is for women, but he 'knows what he is' and would happily be with a man if he wished it. He can also imply Taliesen was his lover later in the game, again to both genders of PC.

Leliana in DA:O isn't as open about the topic, but regardless of gender admits she was in love with her mentor Marjolaine.

If it was DA2, I get the feeling only female PCs would hear Leliana's confession, and Zevran would tell whichever gender the PC is that he prefers theirs--and only males would hear about Taliesen.

Exactly.  This is what I find unfortunate about the new romance system.  In origins, a character's sexuality was a part of who they are, and made them more real, and your Warden could not change that, just react to it.  With DA:2, I think you loose some of the deapth and realism because the characters revolve around suiting hawk.

I do applaud Gaider for doing what he can to make the game inclusive, though.  He's kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place when it comes to game mechanics.  He ether makes the characters revolve around Hawk so that people can bang, or romance, any romancable character they want, which takes away from the deapty of the character; or he has to choose who will be streight, who will be bi, and who will be gay if they even let him have that many characters be romancable.  I don't blame him for trying this variable concept out.

I also love him for always being on forums, defending his characters, and defending minorities.    Much love for David Gaider.

I hope that in the next game, they can have more than four romance options, and instead of variables, create the characters to be a group of characters with their own complete identities, with representation available for both the majority and minorities.  I would love to see more than four romancable characters in the future.  Never understood why the game would decide for us that it's not even an option with some of them.  I'd totally romance Varric, for example.

Zevran and Leliana's sexuality changes based on the Warden's gender. Both swing more toward the "female side" of the bisexual arc if your Warden is female; both admitting to preferring women more. If your Warden is  male they remain in the "middle" of the bisexual arc; neither saying anything about a gender preference. Were they weaker characters for it? Uh, no.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Untrue. When asked, Zevran states his preference for 'a soft and shapely woman' regardless of the PC's gender.

[EccentricSage]

DontStickItThere wrote...

I find it hilarious how many people have this mistaken notion that sexuality is so defining of a character's personality.

I find it retarded that you think it isn't.

To the point that most people could be gay, straight or bi and you wouldn't know until they told you.

Uhmmm... That's not true. You can always spot a fairy. ALWAYS. They may try to hide it or think they look normal, but everybody can tell. I'm assuming your gay which is why you don't know this.

Most writers do not think about a character's sexuality unless it matters to their story.

MOST writers don't even think about it because it's just pretty much understood that the characters are straight unless it's a story about some really ****ed up perverted kids.

Fenris as the gay lover has a different storyline to Fenris as the straight lover - doesn't make his character any less of a person than if he had been only one sexuality.

Yes, it absolutely does. It makes him gay.

Troll harder.

[EccentricSage]

Sabariel wrote...

EccentricSage wrote...

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

JohnnyDollar wrote...

I would appreciate it if someone that has gone through the dialog wheels would answer a few questions.

Concerning romantic dialog, who has revealed to the protagonist what their sexual preference is, by either coming out and saying "I am bisexual" for example, or having told the protagonist something about their personal history that would indicate what their preference is?

Who has not revealed any of the aforementioned info, but instead just engaged in romantic dialog, so that from Hawke's perspective (non-meta), Hawke can only assume that the LI is either heterosexual or homosexual, with no other information to conclude that the LI is bisexual?

Anders will say he had a male lover, but ONLY only if the PC is male. Females never get it.

Zevran in DA:O will candidly talk about his 'adventures' with male and female partners regardless of the PC's gender, though he phrases it slightly differently for each. He will also admit his preference is for women, but he 'knows what he is' and would happily be with a man if he wished it. He can also imply Taliesen was his lover later in the game, again to both genders of PC.

Leliana in DA:O isn't as open about the topic, but regardless of gender admits she was in love with her mentor Marjolaine.

If it was DA2, I get the feeling only female PCs would hear Leliana's confession, and Zevran would tell whichever gender the PC is that he prefers theirs--and only males would hear about Taliesen.

Exactly.  This is what I find unfortunate about the new romance system.  In origins, a character's sexuality was a part of who they are, and made them more real, and your Warden could not change that, just react to it.  With DA:2, I think you loose some of the deapth and realism because the characters revolve around suiting hawk.

I do applaud Gaider for doing what he can to make the game inclusive, though.  He's kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place when it comes to game mechanics.  He ether makes the characters revolve around Hawk so that people can bang, or romance, any romancable character they want, which takes away from the deapty of the character; or he has to choose who will be streight, who will be bi, and who will be gay if they even let him have that many characters be romancable.  I don't blame him for trying this variable concept out.

I also love him for always being on forums, defending his characters, and defending minorities.    Much love for David Gaider.

I hope that in the next game, they can have more than four romance options, and instead of variables, create the characters to be a group of characters with their own complete identities, with representation available for both the majority and minorities.  I would love to see more than four romancable characters in the future.  Never understood why the game would decide for us that it's not even an option with some of them.  I'd totally romance Varric, for example.

Zevran and Leliana's sexuality changes based on the Warden's gender. Both swing more toward the "female side" of the bisexual arc if your Warden is female; both admitting to preferring women more. If your Warden is  male they remain in the "middle" of the bisexual arc; neither saying anything about a gender preference. Were they weaker characters for it? Uh, no.

You are wrong.  The only thing that changes in Zevran's case based on the Warden's gender, is how he words it, but the point of what he is saying remains the same.  Basically with a fem warden he talks about how he has a lot of sex for work, not just for fun, with a male warden, he acts more like sex is a conquest.  It's actually very realistic... IRL, a tactful man will usually handle such a conversation a little differently for women than men, because many women unfortunatelt would be made uncomfortable or figure he's just sleezy.

I have no clue about Lel, though, as I don't like her and have not managed a romance with her as of yet.

[Red Clover]

Balthamoss wrote...

Geez, so many threads and so much whining about one small OPTIONAL part of the game. So many people complained that they couldn't romance the character they wanted in Origins. Now, they go ahead and make all characters available for everyone and people still complain about options they DON'T have to choose, that's right it's optional - if you don't want it, then don't do it and let those who do.
If I were lead-writer at Bioware I'd just go ahead and say 'screw you, you don't get any romances at all for the next game.'

Lol, I bet that's how God feels sometimes. But I better shut up before I get flamed for that. ^^ Continue on, funny thread.

[axl99]

Hang on. How many straight white male gamers actually played a female hawke just so they get it on with another girl? [/sarcasm]

Rather than just go and be all on the fence about a character's sexuality in a game, isn't the emotional connection between yourself and a character you'd like to romance more important anyway? Doesn't anyone believe in love conquers all anymore?

Most of the LIs were written in a way that they will test your loyalty to them, and if things don't work out at all, you could just move on with the next person down the list or stay single for the rest of the game if you like.

People complained when some LIs in Mass Effect 2 weren't available for the other sex. Once DA2 reveals that all the LIs - barring Sebastian - can be romanced with either gender, people complain.

There's just no winning is there?

Perhaps it might better if Bioware didn't announce who the LIs are in their games. Let people figure things out on their own at their own pace.

[Steven83]

Anders was really unfair to me. I was half expecting it. But when it came, I wasn't even prepared for it. It's like Bioware just didn't care. They just wanted to give me an emotional slap and call it a 'deep experience'.

Reloading and change decision didn't help. Anders still do it. Fake choice leading to predetermined consequences. Depressing.

[Lord Sullivan]

After reading the OP's linked article, I got to say... MAN, Gayder is sooooo Heterophobic!!

[ReiSilver]

I support the 4 LIs being available to everyone.
It's the best solution so that everyone gets a choice.
In DA:O if you were playing a hetrosexual warden you had three options: chose between two characters or none
If you were playing a homosexual character you either had to go for the one character available to you or stay forever alone.

DA2 solves this so that everyone has the same amount of options. I understand that it would be nice to have characters with very set sexual identities, and maybe that would work if you had 6 or more LIs but the decision was made to stick with 4 LIs and keep the most amount of choice possible. I just don't believe sections of the audience should be left hanging like in the Mass Effect series.
While I am critical of DA2 in a lot of areas this is one thing I believe was done right (even though my Lady Hawke will be forever alone pinning for Aveline, that's OK, my Hawke had the same amount of options as any other Hawke)

[The Brigand]

axl99 wrote...
People complained when some LIs in Mass Effect 2 weren't available for the other sex.

I was always under the implication that the reason for this was people finding cut content suggesting that said LIs were intended to be bisexual.

But then I haven't paid attention to anything ME2 related for months now, so I might be wrong.

[OrlesianWardenCommander]

Theses are the kind of forums that completely confuse me... But alsomakes sence too me tons of people ask for gay and lesbian relation ships, most of you wanted more in origins but now that practically every charater is bi alot of you bash that? Just like you bash the game in general? This is why bioware takes opinions on theses forums with a small grain of salt.....you fuking people don't know what you want.. I think what they did makes sence this is the 21st century being gay/bi is generally accepted theses days, and too bash people that like the romance options is wrong.....Might as well join that anti gay protest against Lance Cpl. Matthew Snyder a gay marine that died in Iraq. Ignorant douches...

[moilami]

1Nosphorus1 wrote...

I think all of this could've been avoided, if the option was that Anders didn't gain rival points if you shot him down.

I'm fine with them being in the game, I don't use them myself but I must say that when Anders came on to me, I had the option of Flirt/Flirt/NO(+15 Rivalry).

If there were no Rivalry gain, I'd of been fine with this, it just narcked me a bit having to suffer for my orientation.

We have a saying for that kind of behaviour. It is "antaa ymmärtää, mutta ei ymmärrä antaa". A little bit hard to translate. 

You maybe chickened and pissed Anders off? Could be understandable reaction by Anders anyway.


Edit: Oh yeah, and be carefull with the romances in DAs. People has turned ****** while doing them.

Modifié par moilami, 25 mars 2011 - 06:49 .

[moilami]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Galad22 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

Merril has low self esteem. I'd find it creepy romancing her as a man.

Uh, what is your point here? I missed it.

Merrils lack of a defined sexuality makes sense in view of her low self esteem.
I feel like I'm taking advantage of her.

That better?

Very well said. Add to that her situation of leaving her tribe and I could say she is even more vulnerable to be exploited.

[koshiee]

The characters are hawkesexual. I like the idea that each romanceable character can be straight, gay, bi depending on the input the user gives. That wasn't exactly the case in DA2 but it was close. More user choice that doesn't negatively impact the quality of the story is always a plus in my book.

[moilami]

koshiee wrote...

The characters are hawkesexual. I like the idea that each romanceable character can be straight, gay, bi depending on the input the user gives. That wasn't exactly the case in DA2 but it was close. More user choice that doesn't negatively impact the quality of the story is always a plus in my book.

I like more of characters who does not change from playthrough to playthrough in that way.

For example I wanted Aveline would had been pure ******.

[moilami]

Monsteroids wrote...

How about a Rose?
Or a bloody beating heart!? >

A rainbow?

[koshiee]

moilami wrote...

koshiee wrote...

The characters are hawkesexual. I like the idea that each romanceable character can be straight, gay, bi depending on the input the user gives. That wasn't exactly the case in DA2 but it was close. More user choice that doesn't negatively impact the quality of the story is always a plus in my book.

I like more of characters who does not change from playthrough to playthrough in that way.

For example I wanted Aveline would had been pure ******.

 for inconsequential things like sexaulity I don't mind. But I think that in some characters where there sexuality has a big impact on their lives I could understand it not being different from playthrough to playthrough. But in DA2 the romanceable characters have a relationship with the protagonist, Hawke. It doesn't really change the story or the characters if Hawke is a man or a woman. 

[moilami]

Blastback wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Okay, well, that's your issue, because it's a point that the devs have addressed several times. And you still didn't answer the point.

Cold comfort when they could come up with some equally absurd scenario for everybody being bisexual in future games, just to pander to a very outspoken minority who now is offended when they don't see such content.

I've never said I'd be offended by the lack of such content in the future. Don't treat me as though I've said everything that everyone's said.

Has it ever occurred to you that it's not pandering? That, maybe, the writers and other developers actually think that it's important to include s/s content?

Or just fits the characters.  Isabella is obviously rather sexually liberated.  Merrill is insecure and falls for the first person besides the keeper to show that they really care for her.  Fenris can fall for the first person he's had a reall connection with since he escaped.  Anders being bi worked fine with his personality.  As in, it felt totally organic and not forced or tacked on.

Also, I just came to find some Turnips I swear!

That is debatable. One could as well say Isabella is overdoing or compensating for her low self esteem. Desperately trying to be accepted.

In sexuality there is no right or wrong as opposite to your suggestion. Being a gay or bi does not make you better or worse person.

In my opinion people tout about sexuality here like teenagers who get sex for the first time and soon begin to hallucinate they invented sex in the first place and are only ones who know anything about it.

[MOB_RULES_]

I'm just at a loss for words here.
 
Why isn't the title of this thread:

"Homosexual DA2 Lead writer blasts Homophobic Fan."

if you're allowing lables, why not be fair?

[moilami]

koshiee wrote...

moilami wrote...

koshiee wrote...

The characters are hawkesexual. I like the idea that each romanceable character can be straight, gay, bi depending on the input the user gives. That wasn't exactly the case in DA2 but it was close. More user choice that doesn't negatively impact the quality of the story is always a plus in my book.

I like more of characters who does not change from playthrough to playthrough in that way.

For example I wanted Aveline would had been pure ******.

 for inconsequential things like sexaulity I don't mind. But I think that in some characters where there sexuality has a big impact on their lives I could understand it not being different from playthrough to playthrough. But in DA2 the romanceable characters have a relationship with the protagonist, Hawke. It doesn't really change the story or the characters if Hawke is a man or a woman. 

For me there would be a "huge" difference in game if say, Isabella was a ****** and could only be romanced by homos.

[koshiee]

MOB_RULES wrote...

I'm just at a loss for words here.
 
Why isn't the title of this thread:

"Homosexual DA2 Lead writer blasts Homophobic Fan."

if you're allowing lables, why not be fair?

ummm cuz it's not a fact that the DA2 lead writer is homosexual while the fan being homophobic is. 
ohh and way to be rude and homophobic. brava 

Modifié par koshiee, 25 mars 2011 - 07:41 .

[koshiee]

moilami wrote...

koshiee wrote...

moilami wrote...

koshiee wrote...

The characters are hawkesexual. I like the idea that each romanceable character can be straight, gay, bi depending on the input the user gives. That wasn't exactly the case in DA2 but it was close. More user choice that doesn't negatively impact the quality of the story is always a plus in my book.

I like more of characters who does not change from playthrough to playthrough in that way.

For example I wanted Aveline would had been pure ******.

 for inconsequential things like sexaulity I don't mind. But I think that in some characters where there sexuality has a big impact on their lives I could understand it not being different from playthrough to playthrough. But in DA2 the romanceable characters have a relationship with the protagonist, Hawke. It doesn't really change the story or the characters if Hawke is a man or a woman. 

For me there would be a "huge" difference in game if say, Isabella was a ****** and could only be romanced by homos.

well I think Isabella would fall into the "sexuality has a huge impact on the character" category. But having said that I'm kind of tired of the bisexual=sexually wild trope. You're right that with Isabella it would really change her if she only romanced one gender but for the others i don't think it really makes a difference. 

[apantoliani]

I'd just like to say, that David Gaider is now one of my heros in the industry. That is all.

[Kidd]

koshiee wrote...

But having said that I'm kind of tired of the bisexual=sexually wild trope.

Slightly off topic here, but I just wanna say I agree =) In a way, I liked that about Leliana, that she didn't follow that trope at all. That's not to say I feel offended by Isabela in any way, in fact I kinda look up to her (as weird as that probably sounds to most people). She lives the good life and isn't afraid of trying to get what she wants, overall very confident and strong. Definitely a strong woman to look up to, to me =)