2875 réponses à ce sujet

[Bathead]

Just as a quick aside involving LOTR and gays ...
I don't know how many of you may remember when it was announced that Ian McKellan (sp?), an openly gay man, would be playing Gandalf the wizard in Peter Jackson's movie trilogy, some fans actually raised a stink proclaiming "Gandalf isn't gay! How dare they hire a gay man to play Gandalf!"
Some people just can't seem to separate real life and fictional characers.

[moilami]

Wincer wrote...

moilami wrote...

Wincer wrote...

As a member of the theatre community (which is populated by all sexualities) I am happy to see Bioware taking steps toward acceptance and tolerance.
And while I agree with some of the comments about how not everyone you run into in real life is bisexual, I have read complaints for DA:O where people weren't satisfied having Zevran has the only male-male romancable option, while straight males had more to pick from.
This is a sticky subject, but I think it is fair to all players if they are able to shape their characters world with the romance they desire.

Fairness really have nothing to do with it. Is LotR unfair book because there were no gays?

In an RPG there is a story. The story can be like "I killed stuff and became a champion without ever founding a gay lover." 

Please, try to be logical, especially if you are from creative arts. Oh lol, guess that is too much asked though.

LOTR isn't unfair because there are no homosexual characters. I never suggested that.
I'm saying in an interactive game, where the players can shape their world and make their own decision, it is stupid to disregard the option of a same-sex relationship, because not everyone is attracted to the opposite-sex.

Tolkein never said Gandalf was homosexual, and I would stupid to throw up my arms and complain about that because that was the writer's choice. I have no problem with straight characters.

You don't have to attack my field of interest because you disagree with me. That is an attack on me and not my point of view.

Now, that's better. No more absurd "its not fair" whining.

[Lord Sullivan]

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gays seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Modifié par Lord Sullivan, 27 mars 2011 - 06:01 .

[AngelicMachinery]

Wincer wrote...
site-sex.

Tolkein never said Gandalf was homosexual, and I would stupid to throw up my arms and complain about that because that was the writer's choice. I have no problem with straight characters.

I'm pretty sure Ian McKellan was playing Gandalf as a homosexual in the movies though.

[Seifz]

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

[moilami]

Bathead wrote...

Just as a quick aside involving LOTR and gays ...
I don't know how many of you may remember when it was announced that Ian McKellan (sp?), an openly gay man, would be playing Gandalf the wizard in Peter Jackson's movie trilogy, some fans actually raised a stink proclaiming "Gandalf isn't gay! How dare they hire a gay man to play Gandalf!"
Some people just can't seem to separate real life and fictional characers.

I think it was some kind of political movement (if it happened). Sounds so very stupid. 

[Wincer]

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Wincer wrote...
site-sex.

Tolkein never said Gandalf was homosexual, and I would stupid to throw up my arms and complain about that because that was the writer's choice. I have no problem with straight characters.

I'm pretty sure Ian McKellan was playing Gandalf as a homosexual in the movies though.

That is his choice as an actor
As an actor I have chosen different traits for my characters to relate more to them.
I don't mind what he chose to play Gandalf because it was an excellent performance

I'm an avid supporter of gay rights, but I acknowledge that all characters are not written as homosexuals. What the actor decides to do is up to him and the director

Modifié par Wincer, 27 mars 2011 - 06:11 .

[Arik7]

I was dissappointed by the DA2's linear storyline, reused areas, short companion dialogue, and virtually non-existant love scenes. If you are complaining about 4 lines of Anders's dialogue, clearly you have issues. Kudos to BioWare for providing choice in romance, if nowhere else.

Modifié par Arik7, 27 mars 2011 - 06:05 .

[Stinkface27]

Wait, am I the only person who doesn't play my protagonist as an extension of myself? You realize that just because you are a straight male gamer doesn't mean you have to be a straight male Hawke, right?

I'm pretty sure nobody's ever had sex with an alien but that didn't stop people from romancing Liara, Garrus or Tali.

Live a little!

Modifié par Stinkface27, 27 mars 2011 - 06:10 .

[Lord Sullivan]

Seifz wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

[moilami]

Wincer wrote...

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Wincer wrote...
site-sex.

Tolkein never said Gandalf was homosexual, and I would stupid to throw up my arms and complain about that because that was the writer's choice. I have no problem with straight characters.

I'm pretty sure Ian McKellan was playing Gandalf as a homosexual in the movies though.

That is his choice as an actor
As an actor I have chosen different traits for me characters to relate more to them.
I don't mind what he chose to play Gandalf because it was an excellent performance

I'm an avid supporter of gay rights, but I acknowledge that all characters are not written as homosexuals. What the actor decides to do is up to him and the director

Just wondering how you can act gay if you are gay?

LOLOLLOOLOLOOOOOL.




Edit: For those who don't get it: you can't.

Modifié par moilami, 27 mars 2011 - 06:14 .

[Wincer]

Lord Sullivan wrote...

Seifz wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

I'm not a homosexual and yet I accept it. You don't have to "compute" something to acknowledge that is there and real.
You don't have to be a homosexual or bisexual to accept homosexuality. Homosexuality is attraction for the same sex. One does not decide to get aroused, they simply do.

[Arik7]

Lord Sullivan wrote...

Seifz wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

Your argument would make sense if gay romance was mandatory in the game, which it isn't. 

[Lord Sullivan]

Stinkface27 wrote...

Wait, am I the only person who doesn't play my protagonist as an extension of myself? You realize that just because you are a straight male gamer doesn't mean you have to be a straight male Hawke, right?

I'm pretty sure nobody's ever had sex with an alien but that didn't stop people from romancing Liara, Garrus or Tali.

Live a little!

I may not play an extension of myself, but there are things that remain the same yes... like for instance, I don't play female characters.

[Riv2.0]

Stinkface27 wrote...

Wait, am I the only person who doesn't play my protagonist as an extension of myself? You realize that just because you are a straight male gamer doesn't mean you have to be a straight male Hawke, right?

I'm pretty sure nobody's ever had sex with an alien but that didn't stop people from romancing Liara, Garrus or Tali.

Live a little!

Thank you!

Personaly, I like to "write" the character's story. If a gay relatonship adds to his/her story, I go for it. It's all about the story for me and how I can shape it.

[Wincer]

moilami wrote...

Wincer wrote...

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Wincer wrote...
site-sex.

Tolkein never said Gandalf was homosexual, and I would stupid to throw up my arms and complain about that because that was the writer's choice. I have no problem with straight characters.

I'm pretty sure Ian McKellan was playing Gandalf as a homosexual in the movies though.

That is his choice as an actor
As an actor I have chosen different traits for me characters to relate more to them.
I don't mind what he chose to play Gandalf because it was an excellent performance

I'm an avid supporter of gay rights, but I acknowledge that all characters are not written as homosexuals. What the actor decides to do is up to him and the director

Just wondering how you can act gay if you are gay?

LOLOLLOOLOLOOOOOL.

How does one act straight if they are straight.
Acting is decision making.
If I am playing a straight character I activly pursue my male romantic interest. By purseuing him I am communicating to the audience that I am interested in a heterosexual relationship.
If I am playing a homosexual character I pursue a relationship with my female romantic interest.
There are no sweeping characteristics of homosexuals. Not every gay man is a drag queen or feminine.
You simply play the actions.

[Cadaveth]

Seifz wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

Well, let's just some straight guys can be rather open to homosexuality. And there's the Gay-For-Pay -stuff in adult industry. There are surprisingly many straight guys in gay porn scene.

[Lord Sullivan]

Arik7 wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

Seifz wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

Your argument would make sense if gay romance was mandatory in the game, which it isn't. 

Well that is another argument as to how it has been handled in the game, I'm arguying the rampant negative labeling of heterosexuals who dare have an opposit oppinion.

[Deathwurm]

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Wincer wrote...
site-sex.

Tolkein never said Gandalf was homosexual, and I would stupid to throw up my arms and complain about that because that was the writer's choice. I have no problem with straight characters.

I'm pretty sure Ian McKellan was playing Gandalf as a homosexual in the movies though.

I never really noticed...it certainly didn't show in any explicit way in the Performance (which was spectacular..."You shall NOT pass" made me shiver to hear it delivered so well)
I must say it has been quite a few years since I read LotR and I was a Tolkien nut at one time...but if I remember correctly aren't Wizards Asexual in Tolkien's Middle Earth? I know they have Male secondary sexual characteristics, but I was always pretty sure they didn't mate.

[Centauri2002]

Lord Sullivan wrote...

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

Could you generalise any more than that? What one or a group of gay people might say does not count for the whole. And it still sounds like you're saying homosexuals want to make heterosexuals gay or bi in order to broker some understanding. Personally, I think there's no harm in asking for some understanding or empathy. 

[Seifz]

Lord Sullivan wrote...

Seifz wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

I don't understand your claim.

First of all, homosexuality computes just fine for this heterosexual.  Some men are attracted to other men, some women are attracted to other women, and some people are attracted to both sexes.  What doesn't compute?

Personally, I am attracted to females.  My sister is attracted to females as well as males, and I've got a good friend who is male and attracted to other males.  So what?  We're all just people.  Why shouldn't all three of these people be equal?

By asking for a "no gay" toggle as many here have, you are effectively saying that these people are not equal.  Such a toggle is no different than a toggle that says "no hispanics" to turn off the Isabela romance trees.  Do you see how silly that is?

[Arik7]

Lord Sullivan wrote...

Arik7 wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

Seifz wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

Your argument would make sense if gay romance was mandatory in the game, which it isn't. 

Well that is another argument as to how it has been handled in the game, I'm arguying the rampant negative labeling of heterosexuals who dare have an opposit oppinion.

Negative labeling?   Do you need a hug or something? 

[moilami]

Stinkface27 wrote...

Wait, am I the only person who doesn't play my protagonist as an extension of myself? You realize that just because you are a straight male gamer doesn't mean you have to be a straight male Hawke, right?

I'm pretty sure nobody's ever had sex with an alien but that didn't stop people from romancing Liara, Garrus or Tali.

Live a little!

I romanced Ashley and got a great Christian woman and spouse (Christian women are the best women) with whom we lived happily, went to Church on Sunday, and raised many kids.

[Seifz]

Lord Sullivan wrote...

Arik7 wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

Seifz wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

It's quite ironic that while time as move forward and that heterosexuals have generaly changed their stance(leaving exeptions aside) towards homosexuality and showing basic human mutual respect to gays, now gays want more then just respect, they want heterosexuals to open up to homosuaexuality? or else you're negative towards gays?

Delusional much? or admiting that homosexuality is a choice since gay seem to believe heterosexuals can open up to homosexuality?

Are you trying to suggest that homosexuals are trying to recruit heterosexuals to join them or something?

That's... I don't even... Holy ****.

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

Your argument would make sense if gay romance was mandatory in the game, which it isn't. 

Well that is another argument as to how it has been handled in the game, I'm arguying the rampant negative labeling of heterosexuals who dare have an opposit oppinion.

Only those who wish to discriminate against homosexuals get the label.

[Lord Sullivan]

centauri2002 wrote...

Lord Sullivan wrote...

No, what I'm saying is that homosexuals do not seem to get the fact the homosexuality does not compute for heterosexuals but yet, they try to sell the idea that it should. The only way for it to compute, is to be homosexual OR Bi-sexual, other wise it will never and that is what gays are unwiling to understand/accept.

Could you generalise any more than that? What one or a group of gay people might say does not count for the whole. And it still sounds like you're saying homosexuals want to make heterosexuals gay or bi in order to broker some understanding. Personally, I think there's no harm in asking for some understanding or empathy. 

Well, if gays are asking to be respected as the humans that they are, to not be dismissed for in the social arena or business arena that is all good and well, but for gays to not accept heterosexuals to take offence by a gay approach is asking the impossible therefore buccking heads with heterosexuals.