160 réponses à ce sujet

[Joy Divison]

Silent movies went out of style in the 1920s.

In a world where everyone speaks, emotes, and has a name, if I don't then that is REALLY conspicuous and IMHO out of place and dumb.

I do agree that some of the paraphrasing does not quite match up as I thought, but this issue is very much overstated; it's not nearly as bad as people make it out to be and I'll take an occasional surprise line to the nonspeaking and emotionless robot I was in Origins

[TJSolo]

It is really depends on what I want to get out of certain games. I am never Gordon Freeman but I never want to hear him talk. I also think that is Shepard was not voiced we would not have such great banter as;"Wrex." "Shepard."

I would not call either choice for a character dumb as that would absurd but I generally prefer that if a game lacks a canon character and allows the player a certain degree of customization(races, sex) that there be multiple voices or no canon voice at all.

[srieser]

I like the spoken character and dialogue wheel. I end up approaching the character different. my approach is like a director working with an actor. This is the Hawke for my story, not me pretending to be Hawke.

For my first Hawke I decided quickly what would make him angry, when he felt comfortable joking and when to be a diplomat. For instance don't threaten my Hawke's family (including most party members). Not even as a joke. However, if he deems you no threat at all he'll shrug you off with quip or two.

He will trade one-liners with Varric and Isabela. He's sincere about helping people but leary around templars.

[BlameBot]

I didn't feel disconnected when I finally realized my character had a voice. Then again, I was sort of expecting to, I played ME1 and 2 a lot more than I played Origins. I think the idea was to give your character a sense of permanency, which isn't something that was really done in Origins. Your character sort of wandered off at the end, and wasn't heard from again.

[TJSolo]

BlameBot wrote...

I didn't feel disconnected when I finally realized my character had a voice. Then again, I was sort of expecting to, I played ME1 and 2 a lot more than I played Origins. I think the idea was to give your character a sense of permanency, which isn't something that was really done in Origins. Your character sort of wandered off at the end, and wasn't heard from again.

The word you are looking for is canon. It works great for some jRPG characters and canon characters which are disconnected from the player.
When Origins ended my Warden popped in Awakenings and Witch Hunt, not hearing from Warden again is a problem with you selections.

[Ahglock]

I prefer when virtually everything is unvoiced. I prefer to read things. It isn't bad IMO in games like mass effect or dragon age. The design is more linear and is set up for a specific protagonist. In elder scroll games though I'm happy with the silence and prefer less than more because the open ended world implies a generic protagonist. Since I generally prefer open world rpgs, the silent morrowind style is what I prefer. Still the mass effect style has its purpose and I do love the games.

[Meltemph]

I liked the talking Hawk more then the Warden, because due to him being the only one not voiced. NPC's always had to talk threw your choices because of it and the interaction in scenes where you were dealing with major events took a knock. If they dealt with VO's a bit differently, I wouldn't care which way they go, so long as it supports the interactions well.

[Bostur]

Sacred_Fantasy wrote:

That's why we have different preferences. It's a matter of how we
perceive and role-play the character. Some people like to play as
themselves ( me for example ) because they don't like to be forced to
become someone else ( I can't stand all fixed main characters. If the
game doesn't have character creation or even, has slightest impression
that he has his own personality, I automatically reject that character
thus the world. All the RPG I've completed must allow me to become the
hero and not Skywalker or Shepard or Hawke or Ezio ). Normally this type
of people wants a lot of customization and at same time flexibility to
shape the character's personality. 

I'm not saying other people
who want to play the hero as someone else, is wrong. We're both within
context of role-playing. I can play Abigail Hawke or Marlene Hawke or
even default Marian Hawke at the cost of my emotional bonding. It isn't
mandatory to become oneself to role-play a game. I completely understand
that.

There's must be some way where we could have the best
option for our preferences. Voice actor does interrupt on how I choose
to shape my character personality. I'm willing to tolerate that. I have
tried to be comfortable with Paraphrase words in Mass Effect 2 and now
Dragon Age 2. But I can't. I don't know exact intent of the dialogue.
The camera show the character face when he talks totally kill me to play
as myself. This is one area I can't tolerate. And this one of the
biggest problem with both ME 2 and DA 2 for me.

I see too many
third person "modern RPG" are imposing their character to be the hero
except for Bethesda's TES and Fallout who continue to use first person
view. Heck, Even FPS can make me feel I'm the hero with the feel of
inside the world and react to bullets and staggering pain.  It's sad
things most "modern RPG" can't understand the important of it.

If this matter continues, I have to find other fantasy RPG that can make the hero out of me.

We may have a slightly different approach to how we conceive the PC, but I very much agree with your description of the limitations. Even if I prefer to play someone else, I can still feel limited if the PC has too much character. The actor may not deliver the lines the way I imagined the character would. I still like to add something of my own.
It's probably easier for me to adapt though, its similar to the difference between a movie and a book in my case. Reading a book I have more options for adding my own interpretation, but that doesn't mean a movie completely ruins the experience.
I can certainly understand that it's a much bigger issue for people who prefer to play themselves.


Having a very neutral PC is the traditional way to do it. Any first person shooter does it, all we see are hands and weapons. In old RPGs it didn't matter at all since the characters were so simple anyway.
Giving an option to cut out the voice would be easy, its probably harder to make it natural in a cinematic context. I can imagine clever camera work could have 2 versions, one with angles that have the PC's face hidden at all times and one that shows it as traditional acting.

The warden felt weird because we saw his face all the time, but he never actually said anything. If we didn't see his face most people probably wouldn't even notice that he didn't say anything.

[planed scaped]

Immersion is by far one of the most importiant things for me in a game.

Yet I like voiced protagonists, I am a monster. Giving the main character a voice is one of the few changes I actually like.

[AlanC9]

So we'd create faces but never see them? I don't think that would go over so great either.

[Steven83]

I just want an option where Hawke can simply walk out on a conversation. Because often times, that's what I really wanted to do when dealing with unreasonable NPCs.

Or the option to let them 'EVIL' do whatever they want. Because maybe I want Hawke to not care.

[TJSolo]

planed scaped wrote...

Immersion is by far one of the most importiant things for me in a game.

Yet I like voiced protagonists, I am a monster. Giving the main character a voice is one of the few changes I actually like.

You are not a monster but clearly missed the topic of the thread; immersion, ie the feeling of being the character not just liking how they sound. If you don't immerse yourself to the point of pretending to be the character then the points raised by the OP are moot.

[DarthBakura]

bill4747bill wrote...

Being mute in DAO damaged immerssion for me. It just looks and sounds wrong to me when everyone talks except the warden.

So I prefer a voiced protagonist.

I have to agree with this.

The point of you "role-playing" a character is to make choices suited to your personality or to a type of personality you want to exude. The mute factor works for JRPGs, but in a game like Dragon Age, it hinders some of the immersion. The voice-overs for Hawke in DA:2 are not about giving him/her a voice so much as it is about giving you, the player, a voice. What you decide to say is where the role-playing comes into effect.

I love my female Hawke and her sexy voice.

Modifié par DarthBakura, 25 mars 2011 - 06:37 .

[TJSolo]

DarthBakura wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

Being mute in DAO damaged immerssion for me. It just looks and sounds wrong to me when everyone talks except the warden.

So I prefer a voiced protagonist.

I have to agree with this.

The point of you "role-playing" a character is to make choices suited to your personality or to a type of personality you want to exude. The mute factor works for JRPGs, but in a game like Dragon Age, it hinders some of the immersion. The voice-overs for Hawke in DA:2 are not about giving him/her a voice so much as it is about giving you, the player, a voice. What you decide to say is where the role-playing comes into effect.

I love my female Hawke and her sexy voice.

I am not sure what was the last jRPG you are using as reference but current jRPGs use voices for canon characters.

Deciding what to say means you know what you can say. Paraphrasing is not knowing anything other than possible tone, not a real good way to RP a character.

[DarthBakura]

TJSolo wrote...

DarthBakura wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

Being mute in DAO damaged immerssion for me. It just looks and sounds wrong to me when everyone talks except the warden.

So I prefer a voiced protagonist.

I have to agree with this.

The point of you "role-playing" a character is to make choices suited to your personality or to a type of personality you want to exude. The mute factor works for JRPGs, but in a game like Dragon Age, it hinders some of the immersion. The voice-overs for Hawke in DA:2 are not about giving him/her a voice so much as it is about giving you, the player, a voice. What you decide to say is where the role-playing comes into effect.

I love my female Hawke and her sexy voice.

I am not sure what was the last jRPG you are using as reference but current jRPGs use voices for canon characters.

Deciding what to say means you know what you can say. Paraphrasing is not knowing anything other than possible tone, not a real good way to RP a character.

There are still JRPGs that don't use voice-over work for every line of dialogue. It's not as common as it used to be but I just bought one not too long ago and it brought back such fond memories, lol.

[planed scaped]

DarthBakura wrote...
There are still JRPGs that don't use voice-over work for every line of dialogue

Lost Odyssey and Resonance of fate had dialog that wasn't voiced over. Ahhhh both of those games were spectacular.

[DarthBakura]

planed scaped wrote...

DarthBakura wrote...
There are still JRPGs that don't use voice-over work for every line of dialogue

Lost Odyssey and Resonance of fate had dialog that wasn't voiced over. Ahhhh both of those games were spectacular.

Haven't played RoF yet. Lost Odyssey was great though.

Anyway, I think the game I picked up was Magna Carta 2... or was it Star Ocean: The Last Hope International? I can't remember. One of them was not entirely dubbed though, I'm 100% certain about that.

Modifié par DarthBakura, 25 mars 2011 - 07:20 .

[steve1945]

I actually enjoy non spoken main characters. I like to imagine the tone and the words I use myself and such. But I understand why people enjoy spoken characters. After playing my friends copy of DA2 I can say I enjoyed the sarcastic responses and such. But I have to say the non spoken characters are my favorite. I ask. Why not just add an option if you as the dev are deadset on voiced main characters, that will disable the main characters spoken lines. Its just that simple. A completely optional thing that would literally take maybe 15 minutes to implement.

"EDIT"

Just wanted to add a few other things regarding dialog. The wheel. Good god the wheel. I hated it in ME and I hate it in DA2. They have "tone" icons which are somewhat effective but litterally everything thats on the wheel is NOT what you actually say. Yesterday while playing I was romancing that lady pirate we all know so well. The village bicycle. But I was doing a good hawke so I say after she just claims its sex and to not bring feelings in it and I choose "why not?" Hawke then goes on to deliver the cheesiest derpy line of WHAT ABOUT LOVE!!!!!

I also felt very disconnected in the sense I didn't feel like I was playing MY character. I was playing Champion Hawke. Not my character. Same with ME. Im playing Commander Shepard. Not my character. But it works with ME because its always been an action heavy rpg with a heavily frammed story.

Modifié par steve1945, 25 mars 2011 - 07:34 .

[lady constance]

Aburai wrote...

Does a spoken character that you created ruin the illusion that you're that character?

Yes. It doesn't help that sometimes the way my Lady Hawke delivered her lines made me cringe.

[petipas1414]

lady constance wrote...

Aburai wrote...

Does a spoken character that you created ruin the illusion that you're that character?

Yes. It doesn't help that sometimes the way my Lady Hawke delivered her lines made me cringe.

I thought dude Hawke was laughable. I really like the female actor though... and her default look is cooler than it's male counterpart as well.

As for the topic being discussed... if I wanted to play as Commander Shepard, I'll go play Mass Effect.

DA and ME are different franchises... homogenizing the two really doesn't help

[Kidd]

Am I the only one who don't really see the difference in how much the character is "mine" if my character is called Hawke or not? I mean, I was playing "the Warden" in DAO, I don't see how that's any more or less my character just because I can't be a dwarf. I mean, it's not like I could be a Desire Spirit or even someone from Tevinter in DAO either.

[AlanC9]

You're not the only one. It's way overblown.

[steve1945]

Or it could just be some peoples honest opinion.

Naw, that would be crazy man.

[MorrigansLove]

I am ALL for a voiced protogonist, but no paraphrasing. It was awful.

[Bourne Endeavor]

KiddDaBeauty wrote...

shumworld wrote...

One of these day I intend to play DA2 with a character who I see as "me". Though it's gonna be tough since I don't see myself speaking in an English accent.

Interesting issue. I mean, I don't even speak English in my ordinary, day-to-day life since I don't live in an English-speaking country. But even so, the Hawke you see on my avatar is my "me" Hawke. Perhaps it's more difficult for you if you speak English to begin with?

Then again, when I do speak English, I do go for some standard Queen Elizabeth kind of English, which I suppose fits LadyHawke just fine =)

....every time I write LadyHawke I almost write LadyGagaHawke. Weird compulsions... I need to make a LadyGagaHawke.

I believe his issue is because of how widely different then English language may sound in North America due to our respective accents. Thus, I can understand where he is coming from. I am in disagreement myself however that is primarily due to my penchant for many European accents, in particular ones similar to FemHawke's.

For the topic at hand. My preference is voice acted characters. I have a fleeting interest at best to live vicariously through the life of Hawke. I have files wherein my choices are regulated to what they be were I in such a scenario but I retain the belief I am playing an interactive movie or novel and watching the story unfold. I suppose I have a tilted bias derived from my JRPG preference. Regardless, I fancy witnessing the reactions of my PC and not a far away look.