49 réponses à ce sujet

[Camenae]

I wish we could have found out more about Malcolm, Hawke's dad. Other than that companion quest for Carver, I haven't seen any information about him in-game. When did he even die?

[TheBlackBaron]

Sesshomaru47 wrote...

That is cheap. And doesn't count when you consider they marketed it as Hawke's story (your game) spanning 10 years. Not the Dwarf's re-tel.

As for family if you make the sibling a Warden you see them a few times, at lot more than the Circle bound mage (dunno about Tenplar) or indeed the dead one.....Does Bethany treat you better than Carver when you see her again in the Wardens?

Beth isn't real happy about being a Warden, and is pretty cold for the Act II and Finding Nathaniel appearances (something about her having to freeze herself emotionally in order to get through it all or whatever). 

She gets better at the end, though. And as a bonus, isn't caught up in the Doomy Circle of Doom and hunted by Templars in the postgame. 

[5ubzer0]

MPSai wrote...

Yeah the family is a little pointless, it would be better to just have race selection and be with a bunch of people you happened to escape Lothering with.

This. Being forced to stay with your family throughout the game ruins immersion for me. Either give me an option to be an orphan or the chance to abandon them in the prologue. Not everyone likes to play a nicey nice character.

After killing hundreds of mobs, I don't want to come home to a mama Hawke telling me it's time I find a suitable husband. I ended up pretending she is an elderly and confused servant.

[TillyBomas]

I think I would have liked it more.. if there was more.. openness. Like, I actually thought the Elf **** at the Blooming Rose that you talk to about that guys wife was the killer. I should have had the option of killing him, be it right there, or later, when more murders occured. Sure I would have been wrong... and that could have had consiquences, but should have been an option. Or avoiding the Fate altogether, saving mother. Yet far as I know, nothing can be done.

I lost Bethany to the Darkspawn in the deep roads. I didn't even know that there was a grey warden option... I never got any... least not that I remember. Also, short of end game (Mostly) there is no way to get rid of party memebers. I mean, my Hawke believed in Mage Rights, but hated Blood Magic. He worked for the Templars, but would try his best to save mages being persicuted, but would kill blood mages... yet I had to have Merril join in, dispite knowing she was a blood mage. Why could I not leave her, or kill her?

As for the Family thing, I did have a feeling for them, well, except Carver. But then, thats because I get into a character. I could read the emotions and such. I felt bad that Bethany died. Anyhow, as it goes, they could have done more with it, added more normal interactions, and possibly focus more on the compainon/family/politics of Kirkwall then the 'run and do this for some schmuck' or 'run and find this guy for the Templar'. Also, the ending was rather dull. I mean, what happened to the Mine I owned? Why is it I could not put money into it for protection? Why is it in three years or so I see NO profit from the damn thing?

[Alexein]

I look forward to coming home from work and having dinner with my family.

We're angry, we're semi-dysfunctional, and we get into fights a lot. But i love them and they make my life happier and whenever crud hits the fan i know they'll always be there.

This goes for about 90% of all families in existence, they strengthen your love of life, not diminish it.

I thought bioware would transfer this very obvious aspect of family into Hawke's family. Give hawke a steady rock no matter how screwed up hawke's life became. Alternatively i thought they would give hawke a reason to keep going. I push myself as hard as i do in real life because of my family. Perhaps hawke was going to need a deeper reason other than "save the world" like the warden.

Instead they're used to punish hawke emotionally.

Now sure, i've lost family and it hurt me bad. But it made me clutch ever stronger to my remaining family, and even brought me closer to the younger members of my extended family.

Instead hawke seems to be ever more and more disconnected from the world. First the loss of one sibling, then another, then finally hawke's mother. What does hawke have left? a sibling that comes back for all of 15 minutes?

If the loss of the family was supposed to forge hawke into an epic badass that was going to make the warden look like a scared little school girl, then the game ended WAY TOO SOON to show that.

So the family felt like it was just a means to rend emotions, rather than rock to keep hawke stable, a goal to keep hawke motivated, or a forge to make hawke into something epic.

[MelfinaofOutlawStar]

It's kinda like how the family element was described in the Fable series when really you get married, pop out of few kids and as long as you're dropping some gold into their pockets from afar you don't need to be involved with them at all. That's why they try to tempt you back with gifts.

[Shadowrun1177]

I really think the family dynamic was wasted in DA 2. From the start of the game as they were fleeing Lothering I felt like Hawke's motivation was his/her family protecting them and keeping them together. I could understand losing one sibling based on class during the prologue, but then they started ripping the rest away at then end of Act 1. With the remaining sibling dead or a Warden or Templar/Circle and gone for most of the rest of the game minus some cheap cameos and then Leandra killed in Act2. I really didn't feel like Hawke was hero or champion, the whole Hero of Kirkwall title seemed pointless cause Hawke couldn't do anything to protect those most important to him/her.

By the start of Act 3 I really felt no motivation to get involved in the whole templar vs mages thing. As a mage and Carver as a Templar I was like them destroy the Circle if Meredith came after me then I would worry about it. As a rogue or warrior and Bethany in the Circle I would of gotten involved only to protect her I really didn't care about the rest of the mages in Kirkwall. If Carver/Bethany were made Grey Wardens or died in the Deep Roads I felt why is Hawke still in Kirkwall this cursed city that completely destroyed his/her family. I would of felt like a hero or champion if Hawke had been able to protect from beginning to end his/her family.

[TillyBomas]

Shadowrun1177 wrote...

I really think the family dynamic was wasted in DA 2. From the start of the game as they were fleeing Lothering I felt like Hawke's motivation was his/her family protecting them and keeping them together. I could understand losing one sibling based on class during the prologue, but then they started ripping the rest away at then end of Act 1. With the remaining sibling dead or a Warden or Templar/Circle and gone for most of the rest of the game minus some cheap cameos and then Leandra killed in Act2. I really didn't feel like Hawke was hero or champion, the whole Hero of Kirkwall title seemed pointless cause Hawke couldn't do anything to protect those most important to him/her.

By the start of Act 3 I really felt no motivation to get involved in the whole templar vs mages thing. As a mage and Carver as a Templar I was like them destroy the Circle if Meredith came after me then I would worry about it. As a rogue or warrior and Bethany in the Circle I would of gotten involved only to protect her I really didn't care about the rest of the mages in Kirkwall. If Carver/Bethany were made Grey Wardens or died in the Deep Roads I felt why is Hawke still in Kirkwall this cursed city that completely destroyed his/her family. I would of felt like a hero or champion if Hawke had been able to protect from beginning to end his/her family.

I like that idea.  Wish that it could come true.  I was sad that Bethany was slain, and did lose motivation for family after that.  My mother wanted to court sutors, so go ahead.  That got her killed..  I said in another post, that I felt that there was no real choices.  I thought that the Elf prostitute you talk to about the missing wife was the killer, and would have liked to have killed him.

[Big I]

Hawke's family was Fridged

[Bearbarossa]

This is one more reason I hate playing "Bioware's character" versus my own. They throw a couple family members at me and expect to give a fig what happens to them when I can only have a small handful of interactions with them.

What drove me nuts in Act 1 was that my sibling's TWIN died, and they never mention a word about it. Seriously? That just makes my companion sibling an even bigger douche nozzle. Could they at least have tried to make them a little more likeable

[flakmeister_mcg]

This game really needed some sort of an ab ovo beginning where you are slowly introduced to each member of the family, get to know their personality and really just sow the seeds of a relationship. Then the hammer drops, Dad gets killed and you have to flee everything you hold dear. Weird thing is, that if you watch the extended Destiny trailer for the game you see a short glimpse of a flashback of a flaming house, which in all likelihood is the Hawke residence. Unfortunately we never experience what living in Lothering was like nor that seminal moment in Hawke's life.

Instead we're treated to an in medias res opening with the Dad already dead and one sibling following suit shortly after, having spouted three lines of dialogue. Sure ain't getting misty eyed about this.

And don't even get me started on Leandra. The horrible schlock that is that character and the laughable way by which she is gratuitously killed off has become a pet peeve of mine.

[Foolsfolly]

This game really needed some sort of an ab ovo beginning where you are slowly introduced to each member of the family, get to know their personality and really just sow the seeds of a relationship.

Eh. Eh. Eh.

....that's not necessary. The siblings and mother just needed the same level of love and development as the other characters. When Bethany and Carver didn't have their own special skill tree, didn't you kinda think they were disposable? Especially after one of them died?

Little things like that tip you off and rob from the emotion of their death.

I think if they were just deeper. And if they were with you longer. It's so absurd that you're done with your siblings at the end of Act 1 and your mother's gone near the end/middle of Act 2.

[Ealos]

I kinda felt this with all the companions - I had Merrill as a LI, lived together for 3 years, only time we really had a chat was her asking me to go see the demon. After killing Marethari she has one moment of grief, then... all back to normal, next time we speak is going into battle in the Gallows. 7 years to get to know characters, and the tiny number of conversations made me feel far less involved than Origin characters I had for one year. Sad, cos they were all great characters (and banter between companions was so awesome). Family was just one step more unremarkable.

[Foolsfolly]

Ealos wrote...

I kinda felt this with all the companions - I had Merrill as a LI, lived together for 3 years, only time we really had a chat was her asking me to go see the demon. After killing Marethari she has one moment of grief, then... all back to normal, next time we speak is going into battle in the Gallows. 7 years to get to know characters, and the tiny number of conversations made me feel far less involved than Origin characters I had for one year. Sad, cos they were all great characters (and banter between companions was so awesome). Family was just one step more unremarkable.

That is an absolute problem with the game.

It's actually worse for Isabela. She never moves in, at least Merrill moved in (I think Anders moves in and Fenris doesn't but I haven't romanced them). Isabela never really mentions anything about the relationship until Act 3. She gets a ship but never mentions it.

It's weird how you'd set a game over such a long period of time and yet have so few conversations with your people. It sometimes feels like they haven't spoken in the 3 and 4 years since the time jump, which is jarring.

Merrill also only saying that Sandel's watching her when she moves into your house is weird. There's really nothing about her or the relationship worth commenting on? We have to say Sandel's watching her?

[Chuvvy]

MelfinaofOutlawStar wrote...

It's kinda like how the family element was described in the Fable series when really you get married, pop out of few kids and as long as you're dropping some gold into their pockets from afar you don't need to be involved with them at all. That's why they try to tempt you back with gifts.

Yeah, except I always end up killing my wife. Everytime. I'm sure that's a great sign.

[Wulfram]

What annoys me is the lack of interaction with your sibling if they're in the tower. Even simply being able to ask Cullen how Carver is doing would be nice.

[Ascendra]

I liked the family concept and got really attached to them.
Do you know that you have a cousin as well? In act III? She gets a very little screen time but I thought she was great. After the loss of your mother and sibling you actually gain a new member in third act. And Carver came back to me from Grey Wardens in the end, and delivered such a grown up heart-wrenching speech that I wanted to hug him. I loved it.

Btw, what happens to Carver if he is Templar and you join with mages?does he stay with Templars or leaves with you?

[flakmeister_mcg]

Foolsfolly wrote...

This game really needed some sort of an ab ovo beginning where you are slowly introduced to each member of the family, get to know their personality and really just sow the seeds of a relationship.

Eh. Eh. Eh.

....that's not necessary. The siblings and mother just needed the same level of love and development as the other characters. When Bethany and Carver didn't have their own special skill tree, didn't you kinda think they were disposable? Especially after one of them died?

Little things like that tip you off and rob from the emotion of their death.

I think if they were just deeper. And if they were with you longer. It's so absurd that you're done with your siblings at the end of Act 1 and your mother's gone near the end/middle of Act 2.

Everything about this game needs to be deeper and better. My contention is that no hook is ever presented to the player early on in regards to caring about the family. They're just flung at you and you're supposed to care about them regardless of the fact that they, with the possible exeption to Carver and that guy needs a good stabbin' anyway, are flat and uninteresting.

Throughout my playthrough I kept having this feeling of disjointed concepts and ideas that never metastasized into one whole experience. This game could have been great. It really could.

[Addai]

I thought what was there was done well, but there wasn't enough of it, especially in Act 1. Probably the idea was to drop you quickly into the action but I think for all that, the sense of history and therefore connectedness suffered. I would have liked to see the family home in Lothering, even in cutscene flashback.

[AlexXIV]

There is no family dynamic at all. Just one of many promises Bioware made that DA2 never kept.

[Addai]

AlexXIV wrote...

There is no family dynamic at all. Just one of many promises Bioware made that DA2 never kept.

And just another useless whine.  Be constructive or save yourself the carpal tunnel and the devs the aggro.

[Dark Specie]

The whole idea if giving Hawke a family was an intriguing idea. Pity that they decided to just kill all off though.

[Volourn]

"There is no family dynamic at all."

This isn't true at all. the family dynamic is awesome.

Not only can one of your siblings the entire game, that sibling can change over the course of the game.

The family dynamic with Hawke and Bethany or Carver is fabulous. And, momma is well a momma with her perosnality.

Let's also not forget dear 'ol unc who has depth to his character that is hidden (but shown a bit) earlier on. let's not forget sweet 'ol cous.

Family dynamic is awesome.

[Drew_Weidner]

I liked Hawkes family. I sat there stunned for a few minutes after the Templar took Bethany. I didn't really like Carver that much, but I loved his dialogue when he comes back from the Wardens to help you fight the Templars, and his little talk before the final boss. The problem with it is your sibling just needs to have more to say... Hell all of the companions need to talk more. Seems like the Origins companions had more to say.

Glad to see I'm not the only one who got a little emotional about what happened to Leandra though.

[nicodeemus327]

Alexein wrote...

Instead they're used to punish hawke emotionally.

Your steady rock is boring. I'd rather have emotional punishment (ie drama). Bethany and my mother were taken from me! It was gut retching (sp?).