78 réponses à ce sujet

[Gentleman Moogle]

 No no, this isn't a bash thread (and my apologies if this has been posted/discussed to death. If it has, feel free to ignore me), but after playing a bit more of DA2, I suddenly got to thinking about Mass Effect 3 and how many fans want to see at least SOME kind of loot/inventory system brought back to the game. Not the one from ME1 of course, God no. But some kind. 

But then, that got me thinking... What kind of loot would it be? How would it be dropped? Why would we want random loot from a dead mercenary? Shepard is a fully-armed-and-armored space marine with -- as of the end of ME2 -- Some of the most powerful weapons and armor known to humankind. In a fantasy RPG like DA, it makes a kind of sense to get loot because there's always a chance that that hedge knight you just offed will have a sword with better enchantments on it, and if nothing else you can sell it to a blacksmith for some quick cash. 

But in ME3, you're practically your own autonomous city-state. The Normandy is worth billions by itself, and has the ability to research and manufacture anything you might need all on its own. So... What kind of loot would make sense in a ME universe? Schematics? Just plain credits? Weapon upgrades maybe? 

The more I think about it, the more ME just doesn't seem conducive to the 'enemies drop loot, we take loot'  trope we've come to expect from RPGs. 

Any thoughts?

[Admoniter]

Well yes you are correct a loot system like the one traditionally used doesn't really work with the ME universe. I mean once you have scanned an items schematics there is no need to pick its ilk up.

So IMO they should something like Assassins Creed with Trade items, i.e. items whose only purpose is to be sold. So an in-universe explanation for this could be that while an omni tool is capable of using ceramics, plastics and light alloys for manufacturing, but perhaps heavier alloys are only useful for selling as raw materials. Or perhaps you sell the more complicated components from the armor/weapons/omni-tool and scrap the rest. I.e. the minifacturing suite in the omni-tool, the kinetic barrier emitters in the hardsuits, and the computers used by the weapons.

Modifié par Admoniter, 25 mars 2011 - 08:30 .

[CroGamer002]

I never though of that in that way.

Nice thread OP.

[AlanC9]

Yeah, I agree. I've never seen why loot should be in ME in the first place.

Easy for me to since I've never liked RPG loot in the first place.

[hawat333]

Schematics, upgrades, modifications, ammunition types (assuming the ammo abilities will be elminated). That would be my guess.

[Rurik_Niall]

Admoniter wrote...

Well yes you are correct a loot system like the one traditionally used doesn't really work with the ME universe. I mean once you have scanned an items schematics there is no need to pick its ilk up.

So IMO they should something like Assassins Creed with Trade items, i.e. items whose only purpose is to be sold. So an in-universe explanation for this could be that while an omni tool is capable of using ceramics, plastics and light alloys for manufacturing, but perhaps heavier alloys are only useful for selling as raw materials. Or perhaps you sell the more complicated components from the armor/weapons/omni-tool and scrap the rest. I.e. the minifacturing suite in the omni-tool, the kinetic barrier emitters in the hardsuits, and the computers used by the weapons.

Or we could just streamline things and receive credits, clips, medi-gel, and resources. I mean, really if you're just going to sell the stuff anyway why not cut out the middleman and just give the player credits, the end result is the same and this way you don't have to run back to Omega or the hub of your choice to cash it in.

[ThePatriot101]

Yeah, plus ME's always been more based on modern RL schemes. Heck, in the books the only loot marines took off their dead enemies were medigel, grenades, anything that would help but ultimately they could still carry. And it makes sense since they don't have hidden inventory stockpiles on their person to grab anything and everything they had.

[Dominus]

You have obtained the golden krogan testicle.

Estimated Sell Value, 9500 credits. 1000 Experience gained.

[Whatever42]

I do think the locker system, where you scanned new technologies and developed upgrades is a great fit for the ME universe. I think where it fell down was the lack of options, which created a lack of personalization.

Now, as far as looting credits... I know that is just a sop to traditional RPG mechanics - they didn't want to pull out all minigames - but when Shepard really run around cracking wall-safes? There had to be something else they could have done there.

[Taleroth]

They shouldn't. I like how ME2 did it and feel they should improve that. The armor system is good. Weapons need more variety and tradeoffs.

Just none of this countless weapon drops all of them crap business.  It's absurd.  If there's to be loot, it should be meaningful.  Not embryonic cash as junk.

Modifié par Taleroth, 25 mars 2011 - 02:13 .

[casedawgz]

On the one hand it would be nice to see a more renewable source of funds, as they were pretty tight in ME2 if you wanted to buy all the upgrades. On the other hand, I remember how annoying having an inventory was in ME1.

[coolair74]

I like the current loot system in ME2, I would like to see something implemented for the squad. Give them a few outfits and have add some health or stats or somthing.

[naledgeborn]

Speaking of loot..... I'll probably get flamed for this but I was a fan of the only 'techs (rogues) can decrypt/hack/bypass doors and safes' mechanic. It was an 'RPG' element I enjoyed from the first game. Sure it's a restriction (and nobody likes those) but It would certainly add to replayabilty and would make squad selection that much more interesting IMO. Soldier Shep should be a warrior. I say leave the 'lockpicking' to Kasmui/Tali/Legion.

[coolair74]

naledgeborn wrote...

Speaking of loot..... I'll probably get flamed for this but I was a fan of the only 'techs (rogues) can decrypt/hack/bypass doors and safes' mechanic. It was an 'RPG' element I enjoyed from the first game. Sure it's a restriction (and nobody likes those) but It would certainly add to replayabilty and would make squad selection that much more interesting IMO. Soldier Shep should be a warrior. I say leave the 'lockpicking' to Kasmui/Tali/Legion.

That means you would constantly have to have one of those guys with you at all times to get through a door that leads to a plot point.   Shepard got training in basic hacks at the Academy of OWN.

[Servo to the bitter end]

I'm sure a happy medium exists. The inventory and armor/weapon system in ME1 was awful. At the end of the game it was just Colossus/Spectre X/Frictionless materials on everything, and all guns felt exactly the same (so much for customization). Towards the end of the game, you'd typically maxed your money, and the 150 item limit meant you'd need to spend 15 minutes just gelling the crap you didn't need. It made subsequent playthroughs a real chore. ME2 stripped all that away, which wasn't necessarily the solution, but I'm glad that I didn't have to deal with it.

I think that as far as NPC customization goes, give them an outfit or two of their own that fits their personality and role, but allow for a few variables, and give the player the same freedom of color customization that is available to Shepard's own armor. This would ensure that their outfits still look cool and appropriate (I always thought that Liara, just to give one example, looked kind of silly in the combat armor) while still allowing for much deeper customization than currently exists in either ME1 or ME2.

[Someone With Mass]

Earning credits to buy weapons in actual stores instead of tripping over them in varied locations would be nice.

[Lvl20DM]

Instead of a classic inventory system, I'd like them to take what they had in ME2 and expand it. Having weapon and armor mods return in some capacity would do it, and they could implement it without having us loots merc squads. Once we find a schematic, then the Normandy could replicate as many mods as we need.

[Taleroth]

TommyServo wrote...

 and give the player the same freedom of color customization that is available to Shepard's own armor.

This I could easily support.  It would have been nifty to have a group color scheme for a professional look.

[Whatever42]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Earning credits to buy weapons in actual stores instead of tripping over them in varied locations would be nice.

Other than the locust, we never actually bought or picked up any weapons period. We scanned technology and that technology was researched aboard the Normandy and they manufactured new weapons for us.

People think we keep running across better guns and armor but that's not the way it works at all. We simply scan new technology and integrate it. Those mercs don't have better weapons; those weapons simply have some technology that can be used to improve our own weapons.

[Walker White]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

 No no, this isn't a bash thread (and my apologies if this has been posted/discussed to death. If it has, feel free to ignore me), but after playing a bit more of DA2, I suddenly got to thinking about Mass Effect 3 and how many fans want to see at least SOME kind of loot/inventory system brought back to the game. Not the one from ME1 of course, God no. But some kind. 

Actually no, I don't.  I have played DA2 and has reminded me how much I hate mindless loot.  Hours spending figuring out which ring/belt/amulet is best for me and my party.  As my wife says, I end up spending more time in "spreadsheet mode" than playing the game.  And the differences are so minor as to be tactically insignificant.

ME2 does it right.  Few pick-ups, but make what you pick-up to be very significant.  It is true, that the core-game weapons do not have many interesting trade-offs (though Insanity Adept players will tell you that there are many reasons to use the original pistol late game rather than the Carnifex).  But there is a lot of late game variability if you add the DLC weapons.  If you have that type of variability in the core game of ME3, we are golden.

If anything ME2 is closer to the original spirit of RPGs.  Look at any Gygax module from the 70s and you will see that the loot is almost always money (or money equivalents) and very, very few magic items.  What items you did get were significant.  That is the way RPGs started, and that is the way I like it.

Furthermore, mindless loot variation makes no sense from a lore perspective.  If I can instantly fabricate anything I want, then the only thing that matters is blueprints of complex devices.  Minor variations are just a dial setting on my 3D fabrication printer.

[johnbonhamatron]

Nyoka wrote...

Please don't remove ammo powers. It's more real than ammo looting.

Yes, soldiers are trained to use different types of ammo, but I like to think about ammo powers as if Shepard had a favorite type of ammo, or liked it most. If you are a hunter or have a gun for whatever reason, you know you like some types of cartridges better than others. I thought it made Shepard more human, more approachable, because the type of ammo she used was part of her persona. Sort of like what happens with Zaeed and Jessie.

Ammo looting felt impersonal. It was just... useful. I didn't care about it.

Y'know, I'd not even thought about that part before, but come to think of it, I think I prefer the ammo powers from ME2, to the upgrades in ME1. With me, though, it's from a tactical perspective; in ME2 (say you played as a soldier), you could switch ammo types with one button press. Really useful if you go from fighting organics to fighting synthetics, and need to switch on the fly, without having to pause, open the inventory, swap out mods, and continue.

Come to think of it, s'probably why I stuck with incediary ammo on everyone's guns in ME1, but mixed it up to suit the enemy, in ME2.

So, tactical reason and better for the characters? Yup, I want ME2-style ammo powers, too!

[Franzius]

hawat333 wrote...

Schematics, upgrades, modifications, ammunition types (assuming the ammo abilities will be elminated). That would be my guess.

-) QUESTs OBJECTS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-) New in-game Wepons & Armours (i HATE wepons& armour DLC!!!!)
-) Upgrades & Modifications
-) Galaxy Maps/coordinates , info, schematics
-) QUESTs OBJECTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-) Credits (let's hope this time BiowEA will make money really usefull!!!)
-) Some kind of recurring item to find around the game just for pure looting (like the guardians in ME1 or collectible like the one in Fable 2/3 with a decent plot reason)
-) Peculiar Ammunitions
-) QUESTs OBJECTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[aimlessgun]

Walker White wrote...

As my wife says, I end up spending more time in "spreadsheet mode" than playing the game. 

Spreadsheet mode is actually very very fun for a lot of people

The loot system in 2 is fine. Just needs more customization. Bring back weapon and armor mods and have upgrade chains for those. Make the armor of your squaddies similar to Shep's customizable N7 armor. Bam, loot solved.

There are tons of options for weapon mods. There are the standard ones: Silencers, extended mags (er rather extended heat sinks), grenade launcher attachments, scopes. Then of course you could have damage amplifiers, recoil reducers, range increasers, ROF increasers, fire selection modifications, the works.

Modifié par aimlessgun, 25 mars 2011 - 03:59 .

[Locutus_of_BORG]

DominusVita wrote...

You have obtained the golden krogan testicle.

Estimated Sell Value, 9500 credits. 1000 Experience gained.

You've massively under-appreciated the cash value that object, man. Add another 0 to the back and you'll be talking.


But back to the OP, yes, this would be a very interesting question... atm I can only really think of 'looting' novelty items to hang in Shep's cabin...

Or maybe if a salvage system was implemented in ME3 for repairs to the Ship/Weapons/Equipment that would require certain materials to be gathered from battles/locations... That might eliminate planet scanning / open some use for an inventory system / space combat?

Modifié par Locutus_of_BORG, 25 mars 2011 - 04:02 .