I think "loot" is the wrong term for ME at this point. Scans, minerals, new weapons, every now and again like ME2 but throw in DLC weapons as found / awarded IN game.
More customization would be what I would like to see, weapon styles, meaning more like seeing something added to weapons as you upgrade them through research ie. not as dramatic but like upgrading Bioshock weapons or Fallout:NV weapons, like the AP upgrade for pistols or shotgun shield penatration upgrade SHOW something changed (not saying every damage upgrade but the important ones).
Armor color for teammates and / or god forbid I say this but ....... special armor upgrades for companions in DA2 style, 4 or so found / awarded upgrades that add to the characters specialization ie. Mordin gets tech cooldown or damage bonus, Kasumi shorter cooldown on shadow strike, but make it something visibly changed on armor or a new armor. If going new whole look maybe keep it to 2 or 3 sets focusing on different paths their specialization can take if going with add-ons maybe 4-5.
How COULD they do loot?
Débuté par
Gentleman Moogle
, mars 25 2011 08:06
Retour en haut
#52
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 07:03
Rurik_Niall
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I didn't mind hacking, it was decryption that I couldn't stand, the only issue I had with the hacking game was it was unintuitive. Looking at it I expected it to function by clicking on the text you wanted to select, especially since the annoying decryption game I had already played at that point used the mouse, took me a while to figure out the WSAD keys and spacebar controlled the game. Though after getting both the hacking and decryption upgrades neither one was that bad.
#53
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 07:05
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I wouldn't want to mess with the weapons too from ME2 too much because they were excellent but then when playing Borderlands I feel (or am tricked into feeling) that all 4000+ guns are unique and special. I guess just having the stats available for viewing would help?
#54
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 07:25
ReiSilver
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I'd love to see loot come back, call me old fashioned but selling 25 guns and junk I picked off my enemies for a ton of credits feels GOOD. I can look at my inventory and see all the stuff I got, reminds me that I've been on a long mission and accomplished a lot.
They replaced inventory with scanning in ME2 and that just was NOT as fun. Just, *ping* here's some cash, wooo I got what now? Who cares I can't see it after it pops up on screen, I can't go to stores and sell my extra stuff.
Was anyone else really frustrated that they couldn't at least sell the extra metals after planet scanning? Once you get all the upgrades you want I always end up with 2453 paladium just sitting there. Why can't I sell that to someone so I can buy that new piece of armor?
I hope loot and inventory comes back
They replaced inventory with scanning in ME2 and that just was NOT as fun. Just, *ping* here's some cash, wooo I got what now? Who cares I can't see it after it pops up on screen, I can't go to stores and sell my extra stuff.
Was anyone else really frustrated that they couldn't at least sell the extra metals after planet scanning? Once you get all the upgrades you want I always end up with 2453 paladium just sitting there. Why can't I sell that to someone so I can buy that new piece of armor?
I hope loot and inventory comes back
#55
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 07:35
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ReiSilver wrote...
I'd love to see loot come back, call me old fashioned but selling 25 guns and junk I picked off my enemies for a ton of credits feels GOOD. I can look at my inventory and see all the stuff I got, reminds me that I've been on a long mission and accomplished a lot.
They replaced inventory with scanning in ME2 and that just was NOT as fun. Just, *ping* here's some cash, wooo I got what now? Who cares I can't see it after it pops up on screen, I can't go to stores and sell my extra stuff.
Was anyone else really frustrated that they couldn't at least sell the extra metals after planet scanning? Once you get all the upgrades you want I always end up with 2453 paladium just sitting there. Why can't I sell that to someone so I can buy that new piece of armor?
I hope loot and inventory comes back
Virtual junk does feel good.
Planet scanning sucked rocks for me because it was four items, over and over again with no variables.
You couldn't even read the planet codex while scanning (for shame). Yeah, not being able to sell it (or see it) was also quite annoying.
#56
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 07:55
Terror_K
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My main issue with the lack of loot in ME2 wasn't so much the lack of loot but the fact that without it the game became so linear. As annoying as dealing with the junk in ME1 could become, at least there was a sense of discovery and surprise with the items and with the random pops sometimes there'd be something really nice that came into your hands. ME2 suffers without this by having every single playthrough exactly the same every time item-wise. Every weapon is always in the same place, every upgrade is always in the same place, every piece of armour is always in the same place, every pointless captain's quarters knick-knack is always in the same place, etc. And on top of that beyond the complete lack of surprise, you can easily just get everything and max out everything with next to no issues. Nothing is a discovery, it's just a linear inevitable as long as you go to the place. If they'd just changed things up by randomising the items a little it would have helped, but they didn't. And yes, I understand that in many cases the better items actually have an explanation as to why you get them where they are, but still... the items overall in ME2 are extremely unsatisfactory when obtaining and using them is exactly the same in every playthrough.
#57
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 08:03
Rurik_Niall
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I don't know, I felt much more satisfied when I earned my Geth Pulse Rifle and Widow than I ever felt about any of the weapons in ME1 seeing as the only weapons worth using were always in the possession of the C-Sec officer and the requisitions officer.
#58
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 08:09
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Terror_K wrote...
As annoying as dealing with the junk in ME1 could become, at least there was a sense of discovery and surprise with the items and with the random pops sometimes there'd be something really nice that came into your hands.
Something... nice??
../../../uploads_user/1489000/1488972/104445.jpg
Battlemaster armor .... mmmmm.
#60
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 11:14
The Spamming Troll
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i think ME3 needs an expanded inventory just as much as it needs a story. adding MORE armor options, armor mods, and weapon mods is the very first think bioware should be looking at reintroducing in ME3. it seems to obvious.
#61
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 12:39
Vyse_Fina
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Thinking about loot and the inventory as an isolated feature doesn't really make that much sense. What you can find would have to depend on many other mechanics and even what kinds of enemies we face. Would some enemies make stunning them a viable strategy? Then some electronic trap/grenade-like item would have been interesting for example. Charging Krogans or Husk mobs maybe, or even a new species like the Yahg.
In addition there is the problem that Shepard is fighting with his skills instead of gimmicks like macGyver so he only needs practical items like armors, weapons, ammo and upgrades
That however brings up the question of how much sense there is in having an inventory for these.
Would it have made more sense to keep the different armor parts from ME2 in an inventory? Or was it better to say "You won't carry all of that around on a mission and therefor you can only change armor on the ship"
Would it have made more sense to have hacking devices bought in shops in an inventory or was "just having them" without having an inventory that shows they are here, allright as well?
You see, Mass Effect 2 actually had loot. Armor parts, Minerals, ammo, new weapons and upgrades. There was just no point in having an inventory for them. Of course that is also because the system has been designed that way, but there is pretty much no instance in which having a permanent option to change things would have been beneficial except for mods instead of weapon and armor powers.
Now you could argue that there could have been items that aren't combat related or that improve stats to which I'd answear: There were.
You found the ship models, Shepard's helmet, fish, the locket, the DNA thing for the Salarian and Star maps on Illium, upgrades etc. They were just not represented in an inventory.
What do you prefer? Going through an inventory to pick an enhancer before every second fight like in KotoR with the risk of running out of enhancers or just have a permanent effect after you found one item?
Personally, I think the real problem with inventories and the loot that is stored in them is not really a problem from a gameplay perspective and more of a problem in terms of their tradition in RPGs. Many people who play Mass Effect grew up playing RPGs and those always featured an inventory and some degree of Micromanagement. Removing it is like taking that part of their past and the warm memories they have from playing these games away from them while they play ME2 which results in the feeling that something is missing/lacking.
It's a tricky situation because the changes Bioware made were all rational however,rationality has almost nothing to do with the reactions they received from their old fans. Instead we're dealing with peoples memories and the emotions they had while they played various games and RPGs in the past.
I'm not sure if that can be fixed so easily though. Going back to an improved version of the system in ME1 would be a step backwards I think. Leaving things the way they are would leave people unsattisfied though.
To please the fans that like the new system AND the fans that like the changes there'd have to be some added micromanagement at some point, but not in combat. Maybe the mining minigame or uncharted worlds could involve some sort of management where you could regulate certain things... Yeah, I know that's vague... It's a thin line between pleasing both groups and pleasing neither of them, which can result in a reception like the one ME2 got or the one DA2 got. It's a risky thing to deal with for Bioware. Maybe it doesn't even need to be micromanagement as much as added exploration and the sense of finding new things... Not sure
Anyway, those are my two (more like twenty) cents.
Rock on guys.
In addition there is the problem that Shepard is fighting with his skills instead of gimmicks like macGyver so he only needs practical items like armors, weapons, ammo and upgrades
That however brings up the question of how much sense there is in having an inventory for these.
Would it have made more sense to keep the different armor parts from ME2 in an inventory? Or was it better to say "You won't carry all of that around on a mission and therefor you can only change armor on the ship"
Would it have made more sense to have hacking devices bought in shops in an inventory or was "just having them" without having an inventory that shows they are here, allright as well?
You see, Mass Effect 2 actually had loot. Armor parts, Minerals, ammo, new weapons and upgrades. There was just no point in having an inventory for them. Of course that is also because the system has been designed that way, but there is pretty much no instance in which having a permanent option to change things would have been beneficial except for mods instead of weapon and armor powers.
Now you could argue that there could have been items that aren't combat related or that improve stats to which I'd answear: There were.
You found the ship models, Shepard's helmet, fish, the locket, the DNA thing for the Salarian and Star maps on Illium, upgrades etc. They were just not represented in an inventory.
What do you prefer? Going through an inventory to pick an enhancer before every second fight like in KotoR with the risk of running out of enhancers or just have a permanent effect after you found one item?
Personally, I think the real problem with inventories and the loot that is stored in them is not really a problem from a gameplay perspective and more of a problem in terms of their tradition in RPGs. Many people who play Mass Effect grew up playing RPGs and those always featured an inventory and some degree of Micromanagement. Removing it is like taking that part of their past and the warm memories they have from playing these games away from them while they play ME2 which results in the feeling that something is missing/lacking.
It's a tricky situation because the changes Bioware made were all rational however,rationality has almost nothing to do with the reactions they received from their old fans. Instead we're dealing with peoples memories and the emotions they had while they played various games and RPGs in the past.
I'm not sure if that can be fixed so easily though. Going back to an improved version of the system in ME1 would be a step backwards I think. Leaving things the way they are would leave people unsattisfied though.
To please the fans that like the new system AND the fans that like the changes there'd have to be some added micromanagement at some point, but not in combat. Maybe the mining minigame or uncharted worlds could involve some sort of management where you could regulate certain things... Yeah, I know that's vague... It's a thin line between pleasing both groups and pleasing neither of them, which can result in a reception like the one ME2 got or the one DA2 got. It's a risky thing to deal with for Bioware. Maybe it doesn't even need to be micromanagement as much as added exploration and the sense of finding new things... Not sure
Anyway, those are my two (more like twenty) cents.
Rock on guys.
Modifié par Vyse_Fina, 26 mars 2011 - 12:55 .
#62
Guest_Nyoka_*
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 12:57
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Me too.Rurik_Niall wrote...
I don't know, I felt much more satisfied when I earned my Geth Pulse Rifle and Widow than I ever felt about any of the weapons in ME1 seeing as the only weapons worth using were always in the possession of the C-Sec officer and the requisitions officer.
It's good that ME2 weapons are different, not indisputably better. They have different characteristics, not just different stats, for example I prefer the Vindicator rather than the Ravenant, while other people prefer otherwise (When I found the Ravenant for the first time I was like 'cool, a new gun, things are going to be easier from here' only to find I couldn't kill anything with that thing! The bullets went anywhere!). In ME1, the HMWA X doesn't leave room to preference.
It's not about raw power either. The Cain is without a doubt the most powerful weapon in the game, but I prefer the Arc Projector, it gets along better with how I play. This way it's a lot more real. Not because a weapon is available early in the game means it must be replaced later.
Modifié par Nyoka, 26 mars 2011 - 01:10 .
#63
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 01:07
Vyse_Fina
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Speaking of those... Whatever happened to Spectre Master Gear? It's not like a weapon manufacturer for Spectres would go out of buisness and they made the best gear available so where did they go?Nyoka wrote...
In ME1, the HMWA X doesn't leave room to preference. It's the best, period.
...
#64
Guest_Nyoka_*
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 01:28
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They are probably in the warehouse where they hid all the thermal clips in ME1.
#65
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 02:05
Vyse_Fina
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Nyoka wrote...
They are probably in the warehouse where they hid all the thermal clips in ME1.
That'd probably be on the planet where Jacob's father stranded 10 years ago. They had thermal clips when the players arrived there. I think we're getting closer to solving this mystery
(Let's not derail the topic though)
#66
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 02:06
ThePatriot101
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Vyse_Fina wrote...
Thinking about loot and the inventory as an isolated feature doesn't really make that much sense. What you can find would have to depend on many other mechanics and even what kinds of enemies we face. Would some enemies make stunning them a viable strategy? Then some electronic trap/grenade-like item would have been interesting for example. Charging Krogans or Husk mobs maybe, or even a new species like the Yahg.
In addition there is the problem that Shepard is fighting with his skills instead of gimmicks like macGyver so he only needs practical items like armors, weapons, ammo and upgrades
That however brings up the question of how much sense there is in having an inventory for these.
Would it have made more sense to keep the different armor parts from ME2 in an inventory? Or was it better to say "You won't carry all of that around on a mission and therefor you can only change armor on the ship"
Would it have made more sense to have hacking devices bought in shops in an inventory or was "just having them" without having an inventory that shows they are here, allright as well?
You see, Mass Effect 2 actually had loot. Armor parts, Minerals, ammo, new weapons and upgrades. There was just no point in having an inventory for them. Of course that is also because the system has been designed that way, but there is pretty much no instance in which having a permanent option to change things would have been beneficial except for mods instead of weapon and armor powers.
Now you could argue that there could have been items that aren't combat related or that improve stats to which I'd answear: There were.
You found the ship models, Shepard's helmet, fish, the locket, the DNA thing for the Salarian and Star maps on Illium, upgrades etc. They were just not represented in an inventory.
What do you prefer? Going through an inventory to pick an enhancer before every second fight like in KotoR with the risk of running out of enhancers or just have a permanent effect after you found one item?
Personally, I think the real problem with inventories and the loot that is stored in them is not really a problem from a gameplay perspective and more of a problem in terms of their tradition in RPGs. Many people who play Mass Effect grew up playing RPGs and those always featured an inventory and some degree of Micromanagement. Removing it is like taking that part of their past and the warm memories they have from playing these games away from them while they play ME2 which results in the feeling that something is missing/lacking.
It's a tricky situation because the changes Bioware made were all rational however,rationality has almost nothing to do with the reactions they received from their old fans. Instead we're dealing with peoples memories and the emotions they had while they played various games and RPGs in the past.
I'm not sure if that can be fixed so easily though. Going back to an improved version of the system in ME1 would be a step backwards I think. Leaving things the way they are would leave people unsattisfied though.
To please the fans that like the new system AND the fans that like the changes there'd have to be some added micromanagement at some point, but not in combat. Maybe the mining minigame or uncharted worlds could involve some sort of management where you could regulate certain things... Yeah, I know that's vague... It's a thin line between pleasing both groups and pleasing neither of them, which can result in a reception like the one ME2 got or the one DA2 got. It's a risky thing to deal with for Bioware. Maybe it doesn't even need to be micromanagement as much as added exploration and the sense of finding new things... Not sure
Anyway, those are my two (more like twenty) cents.
Rock on guys.
Spot on.
Honestly I hate when the term "looting" is used with reference to something like Mass Effect.
The series holds more ties with the real world (emphasis on REAL) than most any other game I've seen in Bioware's portfolio. Loot doesn't have a RL place unless you counted thieves and crooks. You think real life soldiers in real life war zones spend all their non-combat time looting their enemies' gear and trying to sift through it all? No. Hell no.
Plus there are tons of games (RPGs included) that employ these "loot" systems. Why must this series (let alone ME3) employ a traditional "loot" system? Sure it appeases those who grew up with those traditional RPGs, but it degrades the immersion when the game's based off of RL norms and schemes.
#68
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 05:00
AlanC9
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Rurik_Niall wrote...
I didn't mind hacking, it was decryption that I couldn't stand, the only issue I had with the hacking game was it was unintuitive. Looking at it I expected it to function by clicking on the text you wanted to select, especially since the annoying decryption game I had already played at that point used the mouse, took me a while to figure out the WSAD keys and spacebar controlled the game. Though after getting both the hacking and decryption upgrades neither one was that bad.
The manual is your friend.
Actually, the same thing happened to me the first time I tried it.
#69
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 05:44
egervari
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I enjoy loot systems, but if it means implementing a bad loot system (ME1) or basically none at all (ME2), I would go with none at all.
There were many problems with ME1's loot system.
1. The items were all generic. None of them offered special abilities, and they basically just got better. Sure, there were some trade-offs here and there, but for the most part, you just kept checking to see if one was better. A lot of the time, the stuff you got was pure junk.
2. You need good menus to navigate through it. In ME1, you couldn't even sort armors, weapons, mods, etc. - it was all in one stupid list. If you sold an item at the bottom of the list, the game actually scrolled it up to the top. Basically, if you want to implement a loot system, make it convenient and not a pain in the ass - or don't do it at all.
3. Don't be like DA2 where it forces you to click every corpse on the ground. I know this has been around since the infinity engine games, but I'd rather get a huge list of all the loot you can pick up when the battle is finished. If they must make you click corpses, at least make it so it puts all of the loot for all the corpses in the same area in single screen so you don't have to click 10 different bodies. This really just slows the pacing of the game down - for no really good reason other than to pad the length of the game.
Besides, sometimes you can't even see the corpse on the ground and you miss it, which is kind of stupid if it had an important item on it. Some people have vision problems too. Just do the right thing - the thing every player will want - and pick up all the loot.
Don't be like ME1 though and do it behind the scenes. This was stupid.
4. Don't put a max inventory limit. Frankly, I don't care about realism. There has never been a case where you want to swap in and out heavy inventory, and I doubt that will be case in ME3. So there is no reason to penalize the player if they forget to sell items.
I was playing ME1 today, and I was deep in Noveria's mission and maxed out just before I used the tram. Do you realize how far it is to sell your crap? You gotta use the Mako and backtrack the entire trail, then walk through so many areas just to get to the Hanar shop. If you actually want to go back to the Citadel to get more credits by selling them to the Clinic chic, then you basically have to spend an ENTIRE HOUR just walking through useless areas. The citadel alone takes forever because of where the ship drops you off at... and the stupid elevators.
Seriously, if you want a loot system, just give the player an infinitely large inventory. Screw realism. A max inventory system is just annoying. And don't give me this crap about "trade offs" and omni-gel. If you seriously melt everything *new* down, not only are you destroying the best gear (because the newest gear is always the highest level gear in ME1), you are easily losing about 500,000+ credits, which could be put towards a Spectre gear weapon rather than just throwing it away.
There is just no good reason to have a max inventory size. None. I don't know why they keep insisting on it. It does not offer balance or add anything to game other than punishing players who don't sell their stuff before missions. If the areas and walking speed are anything at all like ME1, the time punishment is just too much and it is super annoying while adding no challenge at all to the game.
5. Use flavour text on the items. It adds to the immersion. Give each item a story - we appreciate it!
6. Make sure there's some trade-offs to using one weapon over another. Don't just make them "upgrades" with a linear upgrade path.
7. Don't make accuracy one of the things that improves with weapon quality - it really needs to be based on where your cross-hair was. As a sniper rifle user, all the accuracies are too damn low, which basically make it pointless to use sniper rifles until you get master-level gear (85% accuracy). This was clearly a mistake. It was still bad for pistols, but at least the rate of fire was so fast that a miss wasn't the end of the world. With a sniper rifle, the punishment for "missing" is several seconds doing no damage and waiting for the rifle to reposition itself to a steady resting place (which is just freaking awful in the middle of a battle).
I wouldn't fix the accuracy problem for just sniper rifles though - I would make it solely rely on the crosshair for accuracy. It just seems dumb to aim the weapon perfectly - like incredibly well - and still not hit it because of some dumb dice roll behind the scenes. While that works in other games, that doesn't work for a shooter.
That's all I can think of for right now.
There were many problems with ME1's loot system.
1. The items were all generic. None of them offered special abilities, and they basically just got better. Sure, there were some trade-offs here and there, but for the most part, you just kept checking to see if one was better. A lot of the time, the stuff you got was pure junk.
2. You need good menus to navigate through it. In ME1, you couldn't even sort armors, weapons, mods, etc. - it was all in one stupid list. If you sold an item at the bottom of the list, the game actually scrolled it up to the top. Basically, if you want to implement a loot system, make it convenient and not a pain in the ass - or don't do it at all.
3. Don't be like DA2 where it forces you to click every corpse on the ground. I know this has been around since the infinity engine games, but I'd rather get a huge list of all the loot you can pick up when the battle is finished. If they must make you click corpses, at least make it so it puts all of the loot for all the corpses in the same area in single screen so you don't have to click 10 different bodies. This really just slows the pacing of the game down - for no really good reason other than to pad the length of the game.
Besides, sometimes you can't even see the corpse on the ground and you miss it, which is kind of stupid if it had an important item on it. Some people have vision problems too. Just do the right thing - the thing every player will want - and pick up all the loot.
Don't be like ME1 though and do it behind the scenes. This was stupid.
4. Don't put a max inventory limit. Frankly, I don't care about realism. There has never been a case where you want to swap in and out heavy inventory, and I doubt that will be case in ME3. So there is no reason to penalize the player if they forget to sell items.
I was playing ME1 today, and I was deep in Noveria's mission and maxed out just before I used the tram. Do you realize how far it is to sell your crap? You gotta use the Mako and backtrack the entire trail, then walk through so many areas just to get to the Hanar shop. If you actually want to go back to the Citadel to get more credits by selling them to the Clinic chic, then you basically have to spend an ENTIRE HOUR just walking through useless areas. The citadel alone takes forever because of where the ship drops you off at... and the stupid elevators.
Seriously, if you want a loot system, just give the player an infinitely large inventory. Screw realism. A max inventory system is just annoying. And don't give me this crap about "trade offs" and omni-gel. If you seriously melt everything *new* down, not only are you destroying the best gear (because the newest gear is always the highest level gear in ME1), you are easily losing about 500,000+ credits, which could be put towards a Spectre gear weapon rather than just throwing it away.
There is just no good reason to have a max inventory size. None. I don't know why they keep insisting on it. It does not offer balance or add anything to game other than punishing players who don't sell their stuff before missions. If the areas and walking speed are anything at all like ME1, the time punishment is just too much and it is super annoying while adding no challenge at all to the game.
5. Use flavour text on the items. It adds to the immersion. Give each item a story - we appreciate it!
6. Make sure there's some trade-offs to using one weapon over another. Don't just make them "upgrades" with a linear upgrade path.
7. Don't make accuracy one of the things that improves with weapon quality - it really needs to be based on where your cross-hair was. As a sniper rifle user, all the accuracies are too damn low, which basically make it pointless to use sniper rifles until you get master-level gear (85% accuracy). This was clearly a mistake. It was still bad for pistols, but at least the rate of fire was so fast that a miss wasn't the end of the world. With a sniper rifle, the punishment for "missing" is several seconds doing no damage and waiting for the rifle to reposition itself to a steady resting place (which is just freaking awful in the middle of a battle).
I wouldn't fix the accuracy problem for just sniper rifles though - I would make it solely rely on the crosshair for accuracy. It just seems dumb to aim the weapon perfectly - like incredibly well - and still not hit it because of some dumb dice roll behind the scenes. While that works in other games, that doesn't work for a shooter.
That's all I can think of for right now.
Modifié par egervari, 26 mars 2011 - 07:11 .
#70
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 07:19
weazelwogger
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egervari wrote...
I was playing ME1 today, and I was deep in Noveria's mission and maxed out just before I used the tram. Do you realize how far it is to sell your crap? You gotta use the Mako and backtrack the entire trail, then walk through so many areas just to get to the Hanar shop.
Or you could just sell it to the elcor merchant about three rooms past the tram. I'm just sayin'...
Modifié par weazelwogger, 26 mars 2011 - 07:20 .
#71
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 08:37
egervari
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I said before the tram - in my case, it was just before talking to the VI.
Anyway, it's not worth sacrificing 10 or 20 items. I've played the game 2x before before trying my 3rd playthrough a few years later... but even I couldn't remember if I could sell my stuff deeper in here. So I didn't chance it - I headed back once I got to 148 items. How is a new player supposed to know? There's still a lot of loot between the VI and the elcor merchant.
It's just stupid either way. It's not the player's fault. Yes, you can say a person plays bad and blame them - tons of people say that. But the mechanic is just stupid. It serves absolute no purpose other than to annoy/punish the player. That's it. It's not like inventory management is strategical or you have to make "hard choices". The only 'choice' is to either walk back for 1 hour or suck up the lost of massive credits, which isn't really a choice at all - you pretty much have to walk back or be punished for 500,000 credits or some such number. The punishment of walking is less painful. Either way though, you are punished. It's just stupid.
All they have to do is make it infinite and the flow/enjoyment of the game is improved immensely. It's not like holding off the selling of items is broken. You don't get more gold for them if you sell them later or anything like that.
Anyway, it's not worth sacrificing 10 or 20 items. I've played the game 2x before before trying my 3rd playthrough a few years later... but even I couldn't remember if I could sell my stuff deeper in here. So I didn't chance it - I headed back once I got to 148 items. How is a new player supposed to know? There's still a lot of loot between the VI and the elcor merchant.
It's just stupid either way. It's not the player's fault. Yes, you can say a person plays bad and blame them - tons of people say that. But the mechanic is just stupid. It serves absolute no purpose other than to annoy/punish the player. That's it. It's not like inventory management is strategical or you have to make "hard choices". The only 'choice' is to either walk back for 1 hour or suck up the lost of massive credits, which isn't really a choice at all - you pretty much have to walk back or be punished for 500,000 credits or some such number. The punishment of walking is less painful. Either way though, you are punished. It's just stupid.
All they have to do is make it infinite and the flow/enjoyment of the game is improved immensely. It's not like holding off the selling of items is broken. You don't get more gold for them if you sell them later or anything like that.
Modifié par egervari, 26 mars 2011 - 08:42 .
#72
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 08:39
Rurik_Niall
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AlanC9 wrote...
The manual is your friend.
Actually, the same thing happened to me the first time I tried it.
Pft, everyone knows men never read instructions.
#73
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 10:39
1upD
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I don't think Mass Effect should go back to Dragon Age with its looting system. I liked how Mass Effect 1 automatically picked up all your loot for you. It didn't make any sense, but it made gameplay a lot smoother. Picking up loot almost got annoying in DAII.
"Hurry! We need to get to X!"
"No, wait! I still have to loot all these mercenaries for their coin!"
Instead of revamping the inventory system, I really think ME2's system would work perfectly if only they had more weapon and armor variety.
"Hurry! We need to get to X!"
"No, wait! I still have to loot all these mercenaries for their coin!"
Instead of revamping the inventory system, I really think ME2's system would work perfectly if only they had more weapon and armor variety.
#74
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 10:50
LTD
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Loot system is essentially defined by item managment and inventory. Can't have a good or fun loot system with poorly done, too minimalistic or plain unrewarding item managment. Have a ****ty enough inventory and looting stuff is bothersome more than anything else.
In ME2, they had all the necessary coding, features and resources in place for a very memorable, nearly revolutionary take on item management and inventory. All the coding and feats required are in game, up and running and semi-implemented. They just didn't quite pull it through. I find this frustrating!
This is how it could/should have been:
Normandy is your inventory. Loot a weapon and it shows up in armory. Have a weapons officer (or team member) stationed nearby. Each weapon, ammo type etc you have ever looted is a hot spot here. Click on em and the officer (or Shepard)comments the weapon briefly, offering a juicy mix of military jargon and interesting anecdotes.
This Gives your gear more character and makes obtaining new loot exiting. Do this well enough and some of the weapons will turn into characters in game, almost:p If that didn't make any sense at all, think of how James Cameron (Back when he still made real movies such as Terminator or Aliens) treated weapons in his movies. They get screentime. Characters speak of them. Characters maintain them. Characters caress them. Mmmmm! Even typing about this makes me drool. Wish you could romance your weapons.
Most loot types could follow the trend. Capture some sort of a plot related geth data CD thing. It could show up as a new hot spot computer screen in Science section of Normandy. Click it an a scientist nearby comments it briefly.
As mentioned, this is **almost** up and running. Combine way Bioware did dialogue with DLC team members and way new hot spots pop in Shepard's cabin. There ya go, one hell of a fun inventory right there. Atmospheric and moody. Much more..realistic and rational approach to loot than the thought of this world saving elite soldier stopping to pick up twenty crappy AK-47 space age equivalents after every single battle and hauling them all around in his..space..man.bag.
Slightly off topic,
What the hell happened between Baldur's gate 2 and KOTOR I? From perfectly fine, old fashioned grid to terrifying item list from 7th hell. WHY?! How could this happen? And why on earth this was kept alive for so long..even ME1 is plagued by it. Surely grid is less terrifying option even if you using a pad.
In ME2, they had all the necessary coding, features and resources in place for a very memorable, nearly revolutionary take on item management and inventory. All the coding and feats required are in game, up and running and semi-implemented. They just didn't quite pull it through. I find this frustrating!
This is how it could/should have been:
Normandy is your inventory. Loot a weapon and it shows up in armory. Have a weapons officer (or team member) stationed nearby. Each weapon, ammo type etc you have ever looted is a hot spot here. Click on em and the officer (or Shepard)comments the weapon briefly, offering a juicy mix of military jargon and interesting anecdotes.
This Gives your gear more character and makes obtaining new loot exiting. Do this well enough and some of the weapons will turn into characters in game, almost:p If that didn't make any sense at all, think of how James Cameron (Back when he still made real movies such as Terminator or Aliens) treated weapons in his movies. They get screentime. Characters speak of them. Characters maintain them. Characters caress them. Mmmmm! Even typing about this makes me drool. Wish you could romance your weapons.
Most loot types could follow the trend. Capture some sort of a plot related geth data CD thing. It could show up as a new hot spot computer screen in Science section of Normandy. Click it an a scientist nearby comments it briefly.
As mentioned, this is **almost** up and running. Combine way Bioware did dialogue with DLC team members and way new hot spots pop in Shepard's cabin. There ya go, one hell of a fun inventory right there. Atmospheric and moody. Much more..realistic and rational approach to loot than the thought of this world saving elite soldier stopping to pick up twenty crappy AK-47 space age equivalents after every single battle and hauling them all around in his..space..man.bag.
Slightly off topic,
What the hell happened between Baldur's gate 2 and KOTOR I? From perfectly fine, old fashioned grid to terrifying item list from 7th hell. WHY?! How could this happen? And why on earth this was kept alive for so long..even ME1 is plagued by it. Surely grid is less terrifying option even if you using a pad.
Modifié par LTD, 26 mars 2011 - 11:05 .
#75
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 10:52
Gentleman Moogle
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1upD wrote...
I don't think Mass Effect should go back to Dragon Age with its looting system. I liked how Mass Effect 1 automatically picked up all your loot for you. It didn't make any sense, but it made gameplay a lot smoother. Picking up loot almost got annoying in DAII.
"Hurry! We need to get to X!"
"No, wait! I still have to loot all these mercenaries for their coin!"
Instead of revamping the inventory system, I really think ME2's system would work perfectly if only they had more weapon and armor variety.
I tend to agree. Although I would add the caveat that I'd also like the ability to customize my weapons, even if its just putting different skins on them. Deck my Widow out in snow-camo or something like that.
I'd also like the ability to customize the weapon's abilities beyond just ammo types. Maybe add an ACOG scope to a battle rifle, or increase ammo capacities, or something like that.
Just a bit more customization would be nice.
