374 réponses à ce sujet

[sanadawarrior]

People keep comparing the sales of DA:O to DA2 without taking into account that one came out at the beginning of the the holiday season and the other in the middle of March...

[Sabiancym]

Persephone wrote...

Sabiancym wrote...

Persephone wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

planed scaped wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

Sure is fun to play for such a failure. To each his own I guess...

The game is fun, I admit that. At least for your first playthrough.

Though afterwards all I felt was empyness and dissappointment. At the time of playing it though I did have fun. Hence why I'd rate the game a 6/10 instead of a 5 or a 4.

It is remarkable how many people feel they must glorify or trash the game. It's like they can't handle the fact other 's disagree if the game is good or bad.

So what if some people hate it and some people like it? Isn't that normal?

It is. DAO has been out long enough for most of its critics to have moved on to other games. (Oh the nerd rage ala "This piece of dumbed down trash calls itself the "spiritual successor" of the Baldur's Gate series? SACRILEGE! I hope Bioware loses all its fans and they better apologize to ME personally!"....Sound familiar?) I expect the same will happen with DA2.

So where's the 4.5 rating on metacritic and universal negative user reviews on all the game sites for Origins?  It's not there.

You can claim it's just a few angry people being vocal, but that'd be ignoring the real truth that this game is bad in the eyes of many.  Maybe even the majority.

I don't give a damn about skewed, extremist ratings at Metacritic. And the user reviews aren't universally negative. And yes, those who hate something are always more vocal, especially after a release. It's normal. Many like it. Many dislike it. Many gave good reasons for both. 

My god...do I really have to lay it out?

You said people criticized Origins just like they're criticizing DA2.

If that were true, similar negative reviews should be around for Origins, but they're not.

Therefore, your claim of the same amount of criticism for Origins is false.


It's really not that hard.

[tmp7704]

BeljoraDien wrote...

Awakening was short and kind of shallow with little game-alter choice, but I thought it was good period on the end of the DA:O sentence... and it has some of the best looking environments I've seen in a game:

(snip)

Edit: Just try to imagine something like that in DA2.....

Funny thing about Awakening in DA2 -- the "throne room" of the Vigil's Keep is essentially a prototype for 90% of DA2 Kirkwall environments. The colour palette, wall textures etc.

[Galad22]

Persephone wrote...

Thank you, Galad22. I know we couldn't disagree more on DA2, but I appreciate your support there. I don't think I've said anything that could justify such an attack.

You are at least always civil with your opinions. So no you, nor any other really deserves such attacks in forums.

[v_ware]

Pacifien wrote...

Grim Fandango didn't sell very well either, which is how I know that it was an awful game. It shames me to this day that I enjoyed it so very much when its lack of sales is a constant reminder that I am wrong to do so.

Grim Fandango wasn't mediocre and didn't have a HUMONGOUS add campaign.

[Persephone]

Galad22 wrote...

Persephone wrote...

So "my validity is void to you". And I should care because?

I know enough people who love this game, here and in real life. That's enough for me. Time will tell how DA will continue. If DA3 pleases me, I'll be happy. If not, I'll play another game & not waste more than five minutes on voicing my disappointment. Games I dislike are unworthy of my time. I hate Gothic IV. I reviewed it (Negatively) and haven't touched it since.

Would you dislike if DA would went back to the way of origins however?

That is sort of game I wished DA2 would be.

It just bother me that DA2 is mass effect like railshooter in a fantasy world, just with swords.

No, I wouldn't dislike it if they re-implemented some of DAO's features. Depending on HOW and WHAT those would be. Lemme give you an example: I'd like a combination of the rivalry/friendship paths (&Romances) with the DAO mechanic of chatting with my companions whenever I like ala DAO (With topics added as the story progresses) . Or a combination of unique armors/outfits for companions BUT several of them unlocking over time and me being able to equip them as I like ala DAO. I hope that makes sense.

[Persephone]

Sabiancym wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Sabiancym wrote...

Persephone wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

planed scaped wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

Sure is fun to play for such a failure. To each his own I guess...

The game is fun, I admit that. At least for your first playthrough.

Though afterwards all I felt was empyness and dissappointment. At the time of playing it though I did have fun. Hence why I'd rate the game a 6/10 instead of a 5 or a 4.

It is remarkable how many people feel they must glorify or trash the game. It's like they can't handle the fact other 's disagree if the game is good or bad.

So what if some people hate it and some people like it? Isn't that normal?

It is. DAO has been out long enough for most of its critics to have moved on to other games. (Oh the nerd rage ala "This piece of dumbed down trash calls itself the "spiritual successor" of the Baldur's Gate series? SACRILEGE! I hope Bioware loses all its fans and they better apologize to ME personally!"....Sound familiar?) I expect the same will happen with DA2.

So where's the 4.5 rating on metacritic and universal negative user reviews on all the game sites for Origins?  It's not there.

You can claim it's just a few angry people being vocal, but that'd be ignoring the real truth that this game is bad in the eyes of many.  Maybe even the majority.

I don't give a damn about skewed, extremist ratings at Metacritic. And the user reviews aren't universally negative. And yes, those who hate something are always more vocal, especially after a release. It's normal. Many like it. Many dislike it. Many gave good reasons for both. 

My god...do I really have to lay it out?

You said people criticized Origins just like they're criticizing DA2.

If that were true, similar negative reviews should be around for Origins, but they're not.

Therefore, your claim of the same amount of criticism for Origins is false.


It's really not that hard.

Were you on the old Bioware Forum when it was released? Or on the other RPG forums? I still remember the venom quite well.

[planed scaped]

There is no way a minority could lower DA2's score as much as it has been lowered if they truly were the minority. I saw a couple 6/10 reviews for Origins stuffed in amongst dozens of 8's 9's and 10's. While with DA2 I have only seen 1 or 2 8 9 or 10 reviews that weren't unbiased or just plain false.

I don't think I have ever seen a game with as bad of a reception as DA2.

[DirtyFinger]

Pacifien wrote...

Grim Fandango didn't sell very well either, which is how I know that it was an awful game. It shames me to this day that I enjoyed it so very much when its lack of sales is a constant reminder that I am wrong to do so.

Grim Fandango didn't have a best selling precedessor to help boost it's sales. Nor did it have an advertisment budget twice the size of the development budget.

[Persephone]

Galad22 wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Thank you, Galad22. I know we couldn't disagree more on DA2, but I appreciate your support there. I don't think I've said anything that could justify such an attack.

You are at least always civil with your opinions. So no you, nor any other really deserves such attacks in forums.

I try to be, but my temper sometimes slips away from me. I do my best though. Thanks.

[Galad22]

Persephone wrote...

No, I wouldn't dislike it if they re-implemented some of DAO's features. Depending on HOW and WHAT those would be. Lemme give you an example: I'd like a combination of the rivalry/friendship paths (&Romances) with the DAO mechanic of chatting with my companions whenever I like ala DAO (With topics added as the story progresses) . Or a combination of unique armors/outfits for companions BUT several of them unlocking over time and me being able to equip them as I like ala DAO. I hope that makes sense.

I am glad to hear it.

And believe it or not there are some things that I do think are better in DA2 than in DAO. That rivalry/friendship for instance.

[Persephone]

planed scaped wrote...

There is no way a minority could lower DA2's score as much as it has been lowered if they truly were the minority. I saw a couple 6/10 reviews for Origins stuffed in amongst dozens of 8's 9's and 10's. While with DA2 I have only seen 1 or 2 8 9 or 10 reviews that weren't unbiased or just plain false.

I've seen several 8-10 out of 10 reviews. Unbiased or plain false according to YOU, you mean.

[bill4747bill]

BobSmith101 wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...
I am simply questioning that the sales are 'poor'

I would also question that it has 'Horrible word of mouth'

Remember that you and I are making different assumptions about the game:
I consider it a fun rpg, you appear to consider it a bad game.

So each of us is saying what must seem absurd to the other

No offense intended, by the way.

Sales are relative. But a AAA is expected to break a million week 1 minium across 3 platforms.

Well do you see any good word of mouth? When DA was released, one individual would buy it and then it would be posted over various forums. it was like a mexican wave. Hardcore RPGers saw it like the second coming (rightly or not).

DA2 is not new. Old news compared to when DAO was promising to awe us all. Dragon Age was in the works for what? five years. Highly anticipated.
Why would there be the same degree of word of mouth? assuming there was any for DAO.

Fundementally we are really disagreeing about how good or bad DA2 is, and neither of us is likely to change their mind. 
  

Most of the people that buy rpgs don't go to message boards anyway. 

[Persephone]

Galad22 wrote...

Persephone wrote...

No, I wouldn't dislike it if they re-implemented some of DAO's features. Depending on HOW and WHAT those would be. Lemme give you an example: I'd like a combination of the rivalry/friendship paths (&Romances) with the DAO mechanic of chatting with my companions whenever I like ala DAO (With topics added as the story progresses) . Or a combination of unique armors/outfits for companions BUT several of them unlocking over time and me being able to equip them as I like ala DAO. I hope that makes sense.

I am glad to hear it.

And believe it or not there are some things that I do think are better in DA2 than in DAO. That rivalry/friendship for instance.

I love rivalmancing the DA2 LIs. So muuuuuuuuuuch drama. And still getting personal quests without catering for approval is nice too.

[planed scaped]

The only ones I have seen don't even address the issues or they just completely dismiss them.

Show me one that doesn't. preferably a 9 or 10.

Modifié par planed scaped, 25 mars 2011 - 08:12 .

[randName]

Pacifien wrote...

Grim Fandango didn't sell very well either, which is how I know that it was an awful game. It shames me to this day that I enjoyed it so very much when its lack of sales is a constant reminder that I am wrong to do so.

I think the glee comes from that BW have made DA2 more open, less "rpgcore" or such, as in less narrow and more for everyone, casual, all while sacrificing production qualities to ride on the wave of DA:O and ME1,2 ~ all to sell more, and here DA2 doesn't sell well and that makes those people that are unhappy with the current direction glad since the heading of BW/DA2 is proving troublesome; and while I want BW to prosper, and I don't have qualms with the people working at any developer in general, I'm also glad when cash-cows and "sellouts" fail. I don't really want to label DA2 as a sellout, but rather a rushed game that tried to lower its threshold to get more people aboard at the sacrifice of some, a lower common denominator game than DA:O.

But when ever these directions fail I'm happy that it failed, and sad that the studio/devs failed; I'm divided.

& Grim Fandango is a sad example, since it pushed a deep qualitative product as to breath life in a struggling genre, and wasn't a rushed shallow game trying to cash in like DA2 in a genre that is doing rather well.

Modifié par randName, 25 mars 2011 - 08:13 .

[Kill3rN1nja]

the issue with the game isnt mechanics to me, its everything else, i could even possible say Da2 had more chance of being MORE popular then the first if they worked on it for another year....maybe 2. but once again cutting corners so far has cut there profits......but as has been said only time will tell......i bet bioware is doing something to try to change this trend....and by that i dont mean saying the naysayers are children like mike said or w/e.

[v_ware]

Let's do the math: 2 weeks in.

XBOX 360: 521,405
PC: 181,832
PS3: 224,620
TOTAL: 927,857
Thats not even a million. Hmm. Bad.

[planed scaped]

randName wrote...


I'm also glad when cash-cows and "sellouts" fail

It's called schadenfreude. I think many people are experiencing that with DA2. That's where most of the unreasonable bashing comes from.

[Sabiancym]

Persephone wrote...

Sabiancym wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Sabiancym wrote...

Persephone wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

planed scaped wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

Sure is fun to play for such a failure. To each his own I guess...

The game is fun, I admit that. At least for your first playthrough.

Though afterwards all I felt was empyness and dissappointment. At the time of playing it though I did have fun. Hence why I'd rate the game a 6/10 instead of a 5 or a 4.

It is remarkable how many people feel they must glorify or trash the game. It's like they can't handle the fact other 's disagree if the game is good or bad.

So what if some people hate it and some people like it? Isn't that normal?

It is. DAO has been out long enough for most of its critics to have moved on to other games. (Oh the nerd rage ala "This piece of dumbed down trash calls itself the "spiritual successor" of the Baldur's Gate series? SACRILEGE! I hope Bioware loses all its fans and they better apologize to ME personally!"....Sound familiar?) I expect the same will happen with DA2.

So where's the 4.5 rating on metacritic and universal negative user reviews on all the game sites for Origins?  It's not there.

You can claim it's just a few angry people being vocal, but that'd be ignoring the real truth that this game is bad in the eyes of many.  Maybe even the majority.

I don't give a damn about skewed, extremist ratings at Metacritic. And the user reviews aren't universally negative. And yes, those who hate something are always more vocal, especially after a release. It's normal. Many like it. Many dislike it. Many gave good reasons for both. 

My god...do I really have to lay it out?

You said people criticized Origins just like they're criticizing DA2.

If that were true, similar negative reviews should be around for Origins, but they're not.

Therefore, your claim of the same amount of criticism for Origins is false.


It's really not that hard.

Were you on the old Bioware Forum when it was released? Or on the other RPG forums? I still remember the venom quite well.

The proof is in the pudding no matter how much you deny it.

There are way more negative reviews of DA2 than there are of DA.  Way more.  So to say the hate is similar to the Origins hate is just flat out wrong.

[Persephone]

Kill3rN1nja wrote...

the issue with the game isnt mechanics to me, its everything else, i could even possible say Da2 had more chance of being MORE popular then the first if they worked on it for another year....maybe 2. but once again cutting corners so far has cut there profits......but as has been said only time will tell......i bet bioware is doing something to try to change this trend....and by that i dont mean saying the naysayers are children like mike said or w/e.

I would definitely agree that another year of development would have done DA2 a world of good. I'm on the lookout for patches, DLCs & Mods. And I wonder what ME3 will be like. And I have high hopes for DA3.

[Sabiancym]

planed scaped wrote...

randName wrote...


I'm also glad when cash-cows and "sellouts" fail

It's called schadenfreude. I think many people are experiencing that with DA2. That's where most of the unreasonable bashing comes from.

Why is it unreasobale?  We want this game to fail so future games are not developed like this.  

It's the exact opposite of unreasonable.

[Persephone]

Sabiancym wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Sabiancym wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Sabiancym wrote...

Persephone wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

planed scaped wrote...

bill4747bill wrote...

Sure is fun to play for such a failure. To each his own I guess...

The game is fun, I admit that. At least for your first playthrough.

Though afterwards all I felt was empyness and dissappointment. At the time of playing it though I did have fun. Hence why I'd rate the game a 6/10 instead of a 5 or a 4.

It is remarkable how many people feel they must glorify or trash the game. It's like they can't handle the fact other 's disagree if the game is good or bad.

So what if some people hate it and some people like it? Isn't that normal?

It is. DAO has been out long enough for most of its critics to have moved on to other games. (Oh the nerd rage ala "This piece of dumbed down trash calls itself the "spiritual successor" of the Baldur's Gate series? SACRILEGE! I hope Bioware loses all its fans and they better apologize to ME personally!"....Sound familiar?) I expect the same will happen with DA2.

So where's the 4.5 rating on metacritic and universal negative user reviews on all the game sites for Origins?  It's not there.

You can claim it's just a few angry people being vocal, but that'd be ignoring the real truth that this game is bad in the eyes of many.  Maybe even the majority.

I don't give a damn about skewed, extremist ratings at Metacritic. And the user reviews aren't universally negative. And yes, those who hate something are always more vocal, especially after a release. It's normal. Many like it. Many dislike it. Many gave good reasons for both. 

My god...do I really have to lay it out?

You said people criticized Origins just like they're criticizing DA2.

If that were true, similar negative reviews should be around for Origins, but they're not.

Therefore, your claim of the same amount of criticism for Origins is false.


It's really not that hard.

Were you on the old Bioware Forum when it was released? Or on the other RPG forums? I still remember the venom quite well.

The proof is in the pudding no matter how much you deny it.

There are way more negative reviews of DA2 than there are of DA.  Way more.  So to say the hate is similar to the Origins hate is just flat out wrong.

Again, give it some time for tempers to cool down and things will even out. They always have. in the past.

[planed scaped]

I just hope Bioware can actually read the legitimate criticisms of DA2 and not make the same mistakes with DA3, or fix some through DLC.

It can be very difficult reading critical and unfavorable things about something you have made. I sympathize with them for that.

[DrGulag]

Obviously I hope this game is a massive failure as far as sales are considered and at the same I hope sale figures will force Bioware to consider how they approach the next expansion.

It doesn't look too rosy at the moment if we go by that website but we dont really have all the relevant info concerning  pre-orders etc.

I think Bioware/EA managed to sell a lot of copies with the whole "get the Signature Edition. For just the normal retail you get all the release date DLC's". So maybe that trickery worked out well...who knows.

Modifié par DrGulag, 25 mars 2011 - 08:19 .