220 réponses à ce sujet

[FeralEwok]

just my opinion no need for anyone to possibly chase me with torches and pitchforks

I wouldnt be surprised if you started out with two or three squadmates at the begining, whether they have been chosen by you or just something automatically programed like how kaiden and ash/ miranda and jacob were your first squadmates. Everyone else from the suicide mission could be sent out by Shepard to rally forces. You going to whatever location ex. Tali and the migrant fleet would work as a Recruitment/loyalty mission where once you gain their support you could have the option to have the squadmember return or lead them. There may even be benefits to having them accompany you or their people. It would give people a chance to play with all the characters at least partially through the game while giving you some of the more popular or more "important to the story" squadmembers as permanent party. Those who died in the SM might allow you to pick up a new squadmember same example instead of picking up Tali if you gain the support of the Quarians you get Kal Reager.

Bottom line is that I think there will be more likely that the game will let you choose who you have with you

[Lvl20DM]

Shep is going to have a tough time of it no matter what. Christina Norman was giving a canny answer that says nothing.
Even if we get a mostly new squad, I doubt the game will be organized with recruitment and loyalty missions. It would look more like ME1.

[Uszi]

Almostfaceman wrote...

Phaedon wrote...

To be honest, I think that at best, we'll have Wrex as a temporary squadmate, his role is important.

Agreed, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if they incorporate the "temporary squadmate" feature (as in LotSB) more often in ME3.

I agree.  This makes the most sense to me, and probably the most sense when one talks about the ME2 squadmates as well.  <_<

[Iakus]

Phaedon wrote...

But, why? The squadmates so far have been very memorable, and with everything that is going in ME3, I'd much rather we didn't have any recruitment missions, even if they are like ME1's.

And anyone who's missing can be replaced by Biff the Understudy! 

But seriously, while i find it liekly that all surviving squadmates will return in some capacity, they have never said or even really implied that ME 2 squadmates will return as ME 3 squadmates. I mean, in ME 2, the VS "returned".  Wrexs "returns".  So does Liara, Anderson, Shiala, Parassini, Fist, Helena Blake, even Refund Guy! 

Now, I am confident that all the squaddies will have an important role to play, but it should be kept in mind there are many levels of "returning"

[Wittand25]

Almostfaceman wrote...

Applying your logic, keeping characters from ME1 and ME2 and not making them squaddies, plus adding new ME3 squaddies - just further complicates the story and doesn't simplify it at all.  Now they have to track not only people who didn't die in ME1 & 2 but track new characters.  I think it simplifies the plot by keeping the number of characters to a minimum.

*drops 2 cents*

A cameo or temporary spot in the squad  is restricted to small area and a duration of time that both is fully controlled by Bioware. Therefore it is easy to write for it and it does not need many resources to implement it.

A full squad-mate is much more complicated. For a new character Bioware has full freedom when creating them, while the ME2 crew already has views (and told them to Shepard) and already has back-stories and issues (usually resolved by Shepard) So it is several times harder to come up with enough new content for the ME2 crew without breaking them. All of them and any combination of them can be dead so they can either all have zero involvement in the plot or all have the same lines comment and suggestions both would make a horrible experience.

And having eight new companions and giving the Me2 crew the Wrex treatment does reduce the number of fully developed characters .
Having the ME2 crew come back would mean that you need to track who is alive, (for the whole game and not just at a single instance as you would for a cameo). are they loyal, are they romanced. what has Shepard done during their specific mission.... All that is manageable for a cameo but next to impossible for even one single squad-mate not to talk about twelve of them.

Modifié par Wittand25, 25 mars 2011 - 08:39 .

[Razagon]

Phaedon wrote...

But, 2 squaddies are enough for most games, gameplay-wise.
And it's not just that.
What about VS and Liara who have plot armour?

Well Liara and VS are the "returning" squadmates also. Hmm gameplay wise is enough if they don't go back to jobs that only a certain class can do which I doubt they will. But what about new players? 2 default survivors?

[Almostfaceman]

Wittand25 wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

Applying your logic, keeping characters from ME1 and ME2 and not making them squaddies, plus adding new ME3 squaddies - just further complicates the story and doesn't simplify it at all.  Now they have to track not only people who didn't die in ME1 & 2 but track new characters.  I think it simplifies the plot by keeping the number of characters to a minimum.

*drops 2 cents*

A cameo or temporary spot in the squad  is restricted to small area and a duration of time that both is fully controlled by Bioware. Therefore it is easy to write for it and it does not need many resources to implement it.

A ful squad-mate is much more complicated. For a new character Bioware has full freedom when creating them, while the ME2 crew already has views (and told them to Shepard) and already has back-stories and issues (usually resolved by Shepard) So it is several times harder to come up with enough new content for the ME2 crew without breaking them. All of them and any combination of them can be dead so they can either all have zero involvement in the plot or all have the same lines comment and suggestions both would make a horrible experience.

And having eight new companions and giving the Me2 crew the Wrex treatment does reduce the number of fully developed characters .
Having the ME2 crew come back would mean that you need to track who is alive, (for the whole game and not just at a single instance as you would for a cameo). are they loyal, are they romanced. what has Shepard done during their specific mission.... All that is manageable for a cameo but next to impossible for even one single squad-mate not to talk about twelve of them.

Yeah but this is the Last Act. We're invested in characters.  Cameo's aren't gonna cut it for a fan's X favorite squaddie.  

And it can't be forgotten we're telling a story.  Muddying up the story with a bunch of cameo's from old characters plus adding a bunch of new characters = mess. 

[Phaedon]

iakus wrote...

And anyone who's missing can be replaced by Biff the Understudy! 

But seriously, while i find it liekly that all surviving squadmates will return in some capacity, they have never said or even really implied that ME 2 squadmates will return as ME 3 squadmates. I mean, in ME 2, the VS "returned".  Wrexs "returns".  So does Liara, Anderson, Shiala, Parassini, Fist, Helena Blake, even Refund Guy! 

Now, I am confident that all the squaddies will have an important role to play, but it should be kept in mind there are many levels of "returning"

But it doesn't make sense to have them return in the third game if they are not even mentioned in the second.

[Uszi]

Phaedon wrote...

Uszi wrote...
-great analysis-

Why hasn't Bioware hired you as gameplay designer, yet? 

Cause game making involves more than bull****ting, I'm afraid.

[CroGamer002]

Uszi wrote...


Who doesn't make sense to come back in ME3
-Legion

Why?
Legion, given the opportunity, will go on and on and on about how important it is for the Geth to remain conected with each other, about not prizing his individuality, etc.  If he continues to follow Shepard, he continues to place himself in an extremely Alien environment, and to isolate himself from the rest fo the Geth.  Also, he seems to have accomplished his original mission by the end of ME2.  So why would he stay?  Just because we like him doesn't mean he will come back.  Especially because liking him had so much to do with the novelty of getting to know the Geth.

Wait, what?

He's goal wasn't to destroy Heretic virus from start, but to investigate what happen to Shepard and anything he/she might have find out to defend against Reapers and better investigation on organics.
He find out about that virus on Derelict Reaper. Did you missed that one?

And about he getting individuality? I don't think he realized that one. Why would he even thing that's a BAD thing?

And why would he stay? To help Shepard to stop Reapers! And there's no other platform like Legion that can alone be as nearly effective and he can also communicate with Shepard and other organics. I'm sure he'll play large role between Quarian and Geth conflict.

[Phaedon]

^ Actually, I did want to mention that as well.
Legion was programmed to stalk Shepard, not much for him to do now that to continue following him.

Modifié par Phaedon, 25 mars 2011 - 08:42 .

[Rurik_Niall]

Not to mention Legion is the galaxy's biggest fanbot. Ample opportunities to repair that big gaping hole and Legion would still rather wear pieces of Shepard's old N7 armour. Between Legion and Tali you've got the makings of a Shepard fanclub right there.

[Almostfaceman]

Razagon wrote...

Phaedon wrote...

But, 2 squaddies are enough for most games, gameplay-wise.
And it's not just that.
What about VS and Liara who have plot armour?

Well Liara and VS are the "returning" squadmates also. Hmm gameplay wise is enough if they don't go back to jobs that only a certain class can do which I doubt they will. But what about new players? 2 default survivors?

I can see new players, but I also consider bringing in already introduced characters, like Kal'Reeger or Seryna, a possibility.

Modifié par Almostfaceman, 25 mars 2011 - 08:45 .

[Razagon]

Well it makes a job a lot easier if they do return than writing half a dozen or more new characters. When will someone from Bioware miss a turn and drop a "they will return" sentence somwhere. Maybe if we create a lot of threads.

[Uszi]

Wittand25 wrote...

So there is no new information and especially no confirmation here. So it is in your best interest to lower your expectations unless you want to be severely disappointed and unable to enjoy the game once ME3 comes out.

IMO, the new information is this:  That the secret hope of, "We'll get all squaddies back," is dashed a bit becuase even Bioware is talking about how that is semi-impossible.  Those theories were kind of riding on Bioware just figuring out how to make it work, and this doesn't encourage me that they are going to figure that out.

Otherwsie, I agree with you.

[Fiery Phoenix]

iakus wrote...

And anyone who's missing can be replaced by Biff the Understudy! 

But seriously, while i find it liekly that all surviving squadmates will return in some capacity, they have never said or even really implied that ME 2 squadmates will return as ME 3 squadmates. I mean, in ME 2, the VS "returned".  Wrexs "returns".  So does Liara, Anderson, Shiala, Parassini, Fist, Helena Blake, even Refund Guy! 

Now, I am confident that all the squaddies will have an important role to play, but it should be kept in mind there are many levels of "returning"

While true, I can assure you, Iakus, that no one on this forum would like to see another two-minute cameo of their favorite character and in the final chapter of the trilogy.

[Phaedon]

Uszi wrote...
IMO, the new information is this:  That the secret hope of, "We'll get all squaddies back," is dashed a bit becuase even Bioware is talking about how that is semi-impossible.  Those theories were kind of riding on Bioware just figuring out how to make it work, and this doesn't encourage me that they are going to figure that out.

Otherwsie, I agree with you.

Which part are you talking about?
I don't see any which implies that it was a serious problem.

Plus, we both know how true/false flags work.

Modifié par Phaedon, 25 mars 2011 - 08:52 .

[Razagon]

What about Turian councilor as a new squadmate for ME3?

"Shepard! *pumps his shotgun" Let's go dismiss some Reapers!"

[Phaedon]

Razagon wrote...

What about Turian councilor as a new squadmate for ME3?

"Shepard! *pumps his shotgun" Let's go dismiss some Reapers!"

He doesn't need a shotgun at all.

[marshalleck]

Uszi wrote...

Wittand25 wrote...

So there is no new information and especially no confirmation here. So it is in your best interest to lower your expectations unless you want to be severely disappointed and unable to enjoy the game once ME3 comes out.

IMO, the new information is this:  That the secret hope of, "We'll get all squaddies back," is dashed a bit becuase even Bioware is talking about how that is semi-impossible.  Those theories were kind of riding on Bioware just figuring out how to make it work, and this doesn't encourage me that they are going to figure that out.

Otherwsie, I agree with you.

I don't see what's so hard to figure out. Each character's story in ME2 was encapsulated and independent from not only the other character missions but also the main plot. Well, most of them anyway. All Bioware would have to do is write a whole bunch more of the same. ME2 was the best game ever, right? And don't the fanboys always say don't fix what isn't broken? So there you have it. A whole bunch of self-contained character studies in ME3 for any surviving ME2 squad members. If they died in your game, you simply don't have those conversations with them. Done and done. 

Modifié par marshalleck, 25 mars 2011 - 08:56 .

[CroGamer002]

What I think that will happen with squadmates:

Those who will stay.

Jacob, Miranda, Garrus, Legion and Mordin.

Well for first 3 is obvious, for Legion I already said but why Mordin?
Mordin still has 1 decade to live( 50 years are in human years) so he won't die and he is far more useful to stay with Shepard to research stuff against Reapers. Might not be squadmate but he'll be there from start to finish, if didn't died.


Those who might leave but VERY unlikely:

Tali, Grunt and Jack.

Tali has weak explanation to leave if you do her LM "correctly" and since she can be exiled it makes no sense to leave.
Also her huge fanbase would rage.

Grunt also is a question if you do his LM if you don't then why would he leave?

Jack makes no sense to leave if she is loyal and even then she could stay. It's her survival at stake if Reapers win so she'll likely hang out with Shepard at least until Reapers are gone.


Those who will leave:

Samara, Kasumi, Zaeed.


Samara says to she will leave but help you if were Paragon or kill you if you are Renegade.

Kasumi went to hide while Zaeed might get side quest to take over Blue Suns if he was loyal.
If you left Zaeed behind in LM he will try to kill you at some point of the game( I hope).


Special case:

Thane.


I think he will be squadmate but will either die in middle of the ME3 or at the beginning he'll live for the treatment on Hanar homeworld. He won't go if he wasn't loyal in ME2 while optional if he is.

Modifié par Mesina2, 25 mars 2011 - 08:56 .

[Razagon]

I expect nothing less from Bioware than to blow my mind with this. In a good way ofc.

[marshalleck]

I think Tali will stay, however I think she may be one of the last reveals, if not left officially unrevealed until launch as was Garrus with ME2. I could totally see Bioware teasing the Talimancers this time around. 

Modifié par marshalleck, 25 mars 2011 - 08:59 .

[Uszi]

Mesina2 wrote...
Wait, what?

He's goal wasn't to destroy Heretic virus from start, but to investigate what happen to Shepard and anything he/she might have find out to defend against Reapers and better investigation on organics.
He find out about that virus on Derelict Reaper. Did you missed that one?

As far as his mission:
1.  Find Shepard, accomplished.
2.  Find out what Shepard knows about the reapers, accomplished.
3.  Investigate and make contact with Organics, accomplished.

What is there left for him to do?  What would be worth him isolating himself from the rest of the Geth?

And about he getting individuality? I don't think he realized that one. Why would he even thing that's a BAD thing?

As far as individuality:
"There is only we.  We were created to share data among ourselves."
"If that is the individuality that you so value, we question your judgement."
http://www.youtube.c...XX2_hg#t=07m00s

The geth aren't individuals.  Legion isn't an individual.  Legion also would cease to be if he re-uploaded himself to the network, since presumably his 1000 programs could go on to inhabit any other platform, and any other 1000 programs could come to inhabit his own.  Which is something Shepard struggles to understand, "How do  you stay you?"

Staying "you" isn't even a thing for the geth.

To think that Legion doesn't desire to return to the rest of the Geth and reintegrate himself would be to totally misunderstand him, imo.

And why would he stay? To help Shepard to stop Reapers! And there's no other platform like Legion that can alone be as nearly effective and he can also communicate with Shepard and other organics. I'm sure he'll play large role between Quarian and Geth conflict.

Oh sure, I agree there.  But he can do more good by returning to the Geth, sharing his experiences, and potentially brokering the truce between the Geth and the Quarians.

That doesn't require him staying with Shepard in any capacity.

Modifié par Uszi, 25 mars 2011 - 09:01 .

[Whatever42]

Not to mention: Bioware aren't redoing the graphics. They aren't chaning the core mechanics. They will likely expland the skill trees but I doubt they are completley redoiong them.

So what the heck are the going to spend all their time on if not design and character development? They have plenty and time and resources to develop continuing characters.