154 réponses à ce sujet

[AkiKishi]

Kudos to Amazon.

Anyone who bought it somewhere else who wants a refund should use this as leverage. Suggesting that if they can't match Amazons customer service you will take future business to Amazon.

[DrGulag]

I will spell things out. "Theft is theft, people. I don't care if it's legal - it's wrong". I can just as easily say marketing this game as a finished product, and selling it for $60 is theft. Therefore, returning the product, and repurchasing it when it actually works as advertised seems very reasonable.

All that being said, I don't consider them selling the game or others returning it as theft. I was just pointing out your specious arguement.

Correct. It's amazing how content people can be even if they are getting ripped off.

If it was some other business a refund for a faulty product wouldn't even be satisfactory. But game companies can operate outside the norm, because "customers have to understand that bugs will always exist but we will do our best to remove them after receiving your money". Even more so when the dev-team only has a small time frame to create a major release.

ps. Gamestop gave me a pretty good deal for my Signature Edition but the price will come crashing down soon enough though.

Modifié par DrGulag, 26 mars 2011 - 10:22 .

[UKillMeLongTime]

as someone else mentioned this game is nowhere near as buggy as vegas
It's nothing but game ending glitches.

I've played it 150 hrs i don't think I deserve a refund and i got it at amazon and the SE edition and I only paid 40 for it as i had a credit from another game return.

the bugs should be fixed but I too am over the time it's taken so far.

But to me why should amazon pay for biowares F up ? They didn't produce or code the game.

[AkiKishi]

UKillMeLongTime wrote...
But to me why should amazon pay for biowares F up ? They didn't produce or code the game.

It's very good publicity for them. Plus they will just send them back to EA anyway.

[Shadesofsiknas]

I wish I could return my PC copy. Might give it a bash and see how I get on.

Fair play to Amazon. They are pretty good to deal with, I buy all my new games from there.

[Dragoonlordz]

Bann Duncan wrote...

It's hardly comparable to Fallout: New Vegas' tendancy to crash at random or Mass Effect 2's interaction glitch. The game works fine, is very well-optimized and has been played many a time by thousands of people who have yet to experience the supposed crippling problems you speak of.

I'm calling it as it is. You've registered the game so you still have access to it post-return and are getting your money back while retaining the ability to play. That is theft. 

Sorry but it is exactly comparable to Fallout situation, it does crash and freeze the whole console on PS3 exactly like Fallout did in the past. Incase you don't understand the fact she/he bought a PS3 version which is not EADM or DL, it's a physical product not a download. Once returned you do not have the product to even play like your claiming would.

@UKillMeLongTime

Don't see how you can take moral high ground when you just said.

"I only paid 40 for it as i had a credit from another game return."

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 26 mars 2011 - 11:03 .

[CRISIS1717]

ffs I wish I had ordered from Amazon...

[MDarwin]

Bann Duncan wrote...

Mavkiel wrote...

Bann Duncan wrote...

Mavkiel wrote...

Bann Duncan wrote...

So, basically, you're going to redownload the game from EADM and get your money back. Wow.

This is theft, people. I don't care if it's legal - it's wrong.

Interesting, you realize that exact arguement could be made againsts the sale of da2 for $60?  Last I checked, I wasnt in the loaning(of cash) business, which is pretty much what I have done with da2. Can't really use it until the next patch. Or I could if I wanted to jump through hoops to avoid friendship bugs and makers sigh messing up my character.

I honestly don't understand what you're saying. If your native tongue is other than English, feel free to use it; I'm multilingual and I will hopefully be able to understand.

I will spell things out. "Theft is theft, people. I don't care if it's legal - it's wrong". I can just as easily say marketing this game as a finished product, and selling it for $60 is theft. Therefore, returning the product, and repurchasing it when it actually works as advertised seems very reasonable.

All that being said, I don't consider them selling the game or others returning it as theft. I was just pointing out your specious arguement.

I don't know if you know this, but the dollar has dropped in value. The real cost of the game has likely remained the same - in fact, it may even be lower. 

The game is as much a finished product as any game is. It has bugs, but none of them are game-breaking. It's hardly comparable to Fallout: New Vegas' tendancy to crash at random or Mass Effect 2's interaction glitch. The game works fine, is very well-optimized and has been played many a time by thousands of people who have yet to experience the supposed crippling problems you speak of.

I'm calling it as it is. You've registered the game so you still have access to it post-return and are getting your money back while retaining the ability to play. That is theft. 

Ok! Where is my Auto attack? :innocent: Was to be in the Game.

[UKillMeLongTime]

Drag i returned using their trade in option. they take books/movies/games based on depreciation
I did not RETURN a game because or any issue.
They have a business of trading games now and they pay very well for most titles that are not too old

I beat a game and just sold it to amazon and they give a amazon gift cert which can only be spent there but on anything they sell. I usually apply any credit to a game as i mostly buy games there.

Modifié par UKillMeLongTime, 26 mars 2011 - 11:18 .

[TongueDar]

yuncas wrote...

Punctuation. A lost art.

LOL!  

++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++

I'm buying my Bioware games from Amazon for now on.  I paid way too much for this game, whch is my own fault. I have no real desired to complete this game -- outside of the fact it cost me $60 -- so I'd rather just get my money back and not waste any more time on it.

[Bathead]

Yeah, even though I personally am enjoying the game on my PS3, and haven't run into any game breaking bugs (yet), I feel it is perfectly within one's rights to ask for a refund if you find a game unplayable due to said bugs. (but not just because you feel it's a bad game like some have said).
If/when any really bad bugs happen to me, I will just wait for a patch, I won't be returning it. But that's just my preference.

[nightlordv]

Amazon already has this marked down to $30 bucks? Damn...that has to say something

[zyxe]

Bann Duncan wrote...

I don't know if you know this, but the dollar has dropped in value. The real cost of the game has likely remained the same - in fact, it may even be lower. 

The game is as much a finished product as any game is. It has bugs, but none of them are game-breaking. It's hardly comparable to Fallout: New Vegas' tendancy to crash at random or Mass Effect 2's interaction glitch. The game works fine, is very well-optimized and has been played many a time by thousands of people who have yet to experience the supposed crippling problems you speak of.

I'm calling it as it is. You've registered the game so you still have access to it post-return and are getting your money back while retaining the ability to play. That is theft. 

the economics of the dollar has little to do with this. taking a quick check on gamestop, i find that RPGs for the PS3 are at most $59.99 (discluding collector's edition or "with bonus!" games), making this a high-end game and worthy of scrutiny regarding serious bugs. a game with game-breaking glitches should be able to be refunded. and if the seller is willing to offer a refund, and is not in any way coersed, there is no theft, they are well aware that the game can be repurchased at any point in time from any retailer. if one cannot play the game as-is and there is no word about when it will be fixed (or even if it will), the user has a right to ask for a refund, and repurchase should these issues ever be addressed and make it worth the money. if the price drops between now and then, so be it. if the fixes were to be announced, the game would likely not be returned, so i see no theft there.

Modifié par zyxe, 26 mars 2011 - 11:33 .

[DrGulag]

Yeah, even though I personally am enjoying the game on my PS3, and haven't run into any game breaking bugs (yet), I feel it is perfectly within one's rights to ask for a refund if you find a game unplayable due to said bugs. (but not just because you feel it's a bad game like some have said).
If/when any really bad bugs happen to me, I will just wait for a patch, I won't be returning it. But that's just my preference.

Agreed and Amazon provides a good service so they should receive credit for that.

Though I also think people should have the right to demand compensation in certain cases even if the product isn't faulty per se (game breaking bugs etc). For example when a company gives empty promises and eventually releases a subpar product that someone has pre-ordered.

Obviously this is a pretty loose description...

("Hey they promised to sell me a good game but this sux! Can I haz my money back plz?)

....but it should apply to releases that specifically promise to deliver certain things but eventually fail to do so. The auto-attack in Dragon Age 2 is one example. Had I known that it wouldn't exist in the console version, I would've opted for the PC-version instead.
 
Anyway, this whole thing from Amazon just shows how to do business properly. Even if the copy itself goes back to the publisher and the store loses its own share from the sale, atleast the person in question will probably come back for another game.

Modifié par DrGulag, 26 mars 2011 - 11:43 .

[UKillMeLongTime]

Amazon sent me a 40 lb microwave for 4 dollars next day. I mean the really are the best deal for anything you can want.
Games are just better deals with their 20 dollar coupons and a trade service where you print the ups label and throw it in a drop box. You pay nada but whatever a piece of paper and ink costs.

[Ariella]

DrGulag wrote...

Yeah, even though I personally am enjoying the game on my PS3, and haven't run into any game breaking bugs (yet), I feel it is perfectly within one's rights to ask for a refund if you find a game unplayable due to said bugs. (but not just because you feel it's a bad game like some have said).
If/when any really bad bugs happen to me, I will just wait for a patch, I won't be returning it. But that's just my preference.

Agreed and Amazon provides a good service so they should receive credit for that.

Though I also think people should have the right to demand compensation in certain cases even if the product isn't faulty per se (game breaking bugs etc). For example when a company gives empty promises and eventually releases a subpar product that someone has pre-ordered.

Obviously this is a pretty loose description...

("Hey they promised to sell me a good game but this sux! Can I haz my money back plz?)

....but it should apply to releases that specifically promise to deliver certain things but eventually fail to do so. The auto-attack in Dragon Age 2 is one example. Had I known that it wouldn't exist in the console version, I would've opted for the PC-version instead.
 
Anyway, this whole thing from Amazon just shows how to do business properly. Even if the copy itself goes back to the publisher and the store loses its own share from the sale, atleast the person in question will probably come back for another game.

Those who have the returned their game through Amazon, if that's where they bought it, should delete their registration then and leave these forums. Why should they have the same privilages as game owners if they don't own the game anymore. It'd be the honest thing to do.

As for the auto-attack, I'm willing to bet money it'll be in the first title update for the consoles, as it was a MISTAKE that was deleted from the master when it went gold. I specifically rememeber there being auto attack in the demo for the 360, so it wasn't a lie or a failed to deliever promise, there was a mistake made when the disk was replicated.

[AFCommando]

too bad i have the pc version, game is totally unfinished and pathetic.

[DrGulag]

Those who have the returned their game through Amazon, if that's where they bought it, should delete their registration then and leave these forums. Why should they have the same privilages as game owners if they don't own the game anymore. It'd be the honest thing to do.

As for the auto-attack, I'm willing to bet money it'll be in the first title update for the consoles, as it was a MISTAKE that was deleted from the master when it went gold. I specifically rememeber there being auto attack in the demo for the 360, so it wasn't a lie or a failed to deliever promise, there was a mistake made when the disk was replicated.

So what are you suggesting here, that no one was there to QA the product before it hit the shelves? And if it wasn't bad enough, it's been over two weeks already. Making a mistake is no excuse when people are paying for the game.

ps. The DLC and other registration codes can only be used once so that's really a non-issue. They are going to be part of my account regardless of what happens to the physical copy (but I see your point though).

Modifié par DrGulag, 27 mars 2011 - 12:11 .

[Well]

eno detah wrote...

Serpieri Nei wrote...

Can you post the link?

I can't even give away DA2. Thank You Amazon.

Go to the Help section via this link after logging in:
https://www.amazon.c...-questions.html

Click the "Choose a Different Order" button if your most recent purchase wasn't DA2 (I purchased mine back in Oct so had to go back 6 months to find it).

I chose the "Problem with an order", then "Defective" option for the reason.

Should be self explanatory from there.

edit: PM me this weekend if you have issues; won't be checking much after that.

Thank you.I'll keep mine even though it is just ok with me.Really disappointing.Still glad Amazon is helping out those that have buggy games.One of the reason I go thru them for games and such.Amazon has always been good to me.

[DrGulag]

Amazon sent me a 40 lb microwave for 4 dollars next day. I mean the really are the best deal for anything you can want.
Games are just better deals with their 20 dollar coupons and a trade service where you print the ups label and throw it in a drop box. You pay nada but whatever a piece of paper and ink costs.

I think the only negative is that local communities with traditional stores are struggling to compete in a market like that. Hopefully mom-and-pop store owners will learn to sell their own stuff through Amazon so they wont go out of business.

[Ariella]

DrGulag wrote...

Those who have the returned their game through Amazon, if that's where they bought it, should delete their registration then and leave these forums. Why should they have the same privilages as game owners if they don't own the game anymore. It'd be the honest thing to do.

As for the auto-attack, I'm willing to bet money it'll be in the first title update for the consoles, as it was a MISTAKE that was deleted from the master when it went gold. I specifically rememeber there being auto attack in the demo for the 360, so it wasn't a lie or a failed to deliever promise, there was a mistake made when the disk was replicated.

So what are you suggesting here, that no one was there to QA the product before it hit the shelves? And if it wasn't bad enough, it's been over two weeks already. Making a mistake is no excuse when people are paying for the game.

As I understand the QA process, it happens before the master disk goes for replication and packaging, which is handled elsewhere. So the error occurred at the factory after the QA process was complete, and Bioware was unaware of the problem till the game was in play, as it were. As for the lack of title update so far, considering the cost that both Microsoft and Sony charge for certification on DLC and Title Updates, it makes sense to get as many fixes in to one update as possible. If you want to see how this works check the archives over the Return to Ostagar debatical, where MS released it prior to Bioware being ready and there was a huge error. There was a lot of talk at the time about cost of re-certification etc... I think it was said $10K per each certification for Xbox, not sure what the rate is for Sony. So that's might partially be why no title update yet. I also expect they're going through all the feedback, trying to replicate the bugs, hunt them down in the code and make sure the fixes don't break anything else.

ps. The DLC and other registration codes can only be used once so that's really a non-issue. They are going to be part of my account regardless of what happens to the physical copy (but I see your point though).

Its a matter of integrity, if someone returns the game, gets a refund, they shouldn't be using the forums for registered game users. That just bothers me, nothing to do with the DLC or anything.

[UKillMeLongTime]

DrGulag wrote...

Amazon sent me a 40 lb microwave for 4 dollars next day. I mean the really are the best deal for anything you can want.
Games are just better deals with their 20 dollar coupons and a trade service where you print the ups label and throw it in a drop box. You pay nada but whatever a piece of paper and ink costs.

I think the only negative is that local communities with traditional stores are struggling to compete in a market like that. Hopefully mom-and-pop store owners will learn to sell their own stuff through Amazon so they wont go out of business.

So true
I called local and they were almost 100 bucks more for the few they had in stock. Add taxes too.
Amazon has no taxes for me on any order which is a huge plus

but yeah some stores are taking to closing their doors because of the internet and big malls and superstores........or walmart!

[eno detah]

Ariella wrote...

Its a matter of integrity, if someone returns the game, gets a refund, they shouldn't be using the forums for registered game users. That just bothers me, nothing to do with the DLC or anything.

Well, FWIW, I will promise you that I will stop contributing to this forum if it bothers you, once I've received my refund. Amazon says it takes <=4 weeks from the date you drop it at UPS, which I intend to do on Tuesday (traveling on Monday).

I won't delete my account (as you mentioned those returning the game should do in another post) as the account is meta to this particular title.

This isn't about taking advantage of Bioware/EA, my account status, etc. Heck, it's really not even about the money. Rather, it's the only means I have, symbolic or otherwise, of hoping to get Bioware/EA to understand that not all of its customers are willing to "take it"; that some of us will vote with our feet & wallets. (I'd do an OpEd piece for TechCrunch et al if I thought I could do so without potentially causing professional complications for myself or my employer.)

[DrGulag]

As I understand the QA process, it happens before the master disk goes for replication and packaging, which is handled elsewhere. So the error occurred at the factory after the QA process was complete, and Bioware was unaware of the problem till the game was in play, as it were.

They are responsible for the product regardless of what happened. I don't care if it was the neighbours dog or Joe the Plumber burning the data into all those Blu-Ray discs. I'm not having any of that nor should the consumer care how annoying EA finds it to produce updates via Playstation Network.

You screw up and you give back the cash and perhaps an added bonus. That's how it works in many other businesses, no questions asked.

ps. I do see your point regarding the use of these forums though. When you essentially pay for a service it can be a tad annoying if someone else has the same access.

I think it's reasonable to let people voice their frustration after having to deal with all this nonsense in any case. They might be gone soon enough, not necessarily a good thing for Bioware unless they make up for it with new customers. 

Modifié par DrGulag, 27 mars 2011 - 12:50 .

[elearon1]

planed scaped wrote...
That's...interesting.
Must just be for console versions since PC disks become coasters after registering.
Just like my worthless Half Life 2 disk Coaster next to my PC. I keep it there to remind me how much I hate steam.

This is why I use Direct 2 Drive, the game remains on your account indeffinitely (so far as I've seen so far) and you never have to worry about useless or damaged CDs; not to mention they often have deals out for 10-20% off for preorders.  D2D has saved me so many headaches the last few years I don't shop anywhere else.