145 réponses à ce sujet

[MCPOWill]

I believe Anders is one of the deepest most complex characters Bioware has ever made. His dissent into insanity due to the injustice done to mages and his union with Justice/Vengence (which is rather poetic) makes him truly a tragic figure in which, like Hamlet, the debate whether the final deed was his or Vengence or just a product of his insanity make a deep, thoughtful, and a more dynamic character than he was in Awakening.

[MelfinaofOutlawStar]

mrsph wrote...

Anders isn't badly written.

Badly written character don't inspire this much rage.

Bella Swan says "Hi".

[Zjarcal]

Elton John is dead wrote...
This is the same guy who was asking for a girl and the right to cast lightning at fools.

Well it's not the same guy really. Gobbling up a spirit of Justice for breakfast changes your mood from what I hear... 

[Lenimph]

MelfinaofOutlawStar wrote...

mrsph wrote...

Anders isn't badly written.

Badly written character don't inspire this much rage.

Bella Swan says "Hi".

:lol:QFT

Modifié par Lenimph, 27 mars 2011 - 10:24 .

[Dr. Nexas]

No, I killed Anders. With a knife.

[PinkShoes]

I dont think its bad writing, i think its his damn voice. Why change the voice actors? i get it hes been through a lot so yeah i understand your personality changes but your voice doesnt.

[The Cannibal Factory]

PinkShoes wrote...

I dont think its bad writing, i think its his damn voice. Why change the voice actors? i get it hes been through a lot so yeah i understand your personality changes but your voice doesnt.

THIS. 100%.

[Kawamura]

PinkShoes wrote...

I dont think its bad writing, i think its his damn voice. Why change the voice actors? i get it hes been through a lot so yeah i understand your personality changes but your voice doesnt.

I imagine they did it because Cullen played a bigger role.

I wish they had changed Cullen's VA instead, though. Ah, well. It can't be helped now.

[Sjofn]

I'm glad they kept him as Cullen, personally, because for me, every time Anders opened his mouth in Awakenings I was all "Arghghghgh, that's Cullen!"

Of course, the first time New Anders spoke, I was all "HAY."

Never happy, that's me!


EDIT: Of course, I really like the New Anders voice now that I'm used to it. :innocent:

Modifié par Sjofn, 28 mars 2011 - 12:07 .

[ThatDancingTurian]

MelfinaofOutlawStar wrote...

mrsph wrote...

Anders isn't badly written.

Badly written character don't inspire this much rage.

Bella Swan says "Hi".

Already done once, but QFT.

I don't agree with the argument 'well people hate him and he's supposed to be controversial, so that means he was a smashing success!'... I don't really care what he did. More importantly, I wasn't surprised at what he did. And since it seemed like it was supposed to be a surprise, I'd call that a fail. By the time the Chantry blew up I was just like, "Well that figures."

The reason I dislike Anders 2.0 is because I felt he was written, executed and voiced so poorly that it was impossible for me to connect with him enough to care what happened to him at the end, even when I romanced him. It was hardly a 'biting your fingernails' kind of choice. He spent the entire game telling me (and everyone else with ears) how oppressed he was that he didn't give me a moment to actually empathize with his situation. His dialogue was cheesy and had such a wooden delivery. He had no character development whatsoever except that which happened off-screen, which seemed like a total cop-out. And I especially disliked them taking a character that was actually interesting to rewrite into this character (A complete personality/identity/appearance overhaul is not 'character development').

He could have not been in the game at all and someone like Alain could have shown up and blown up the Chantry and it would have made no difference at all. He wasn't a character, he was a plot device.

He was worse than bad, he was mediocre. At least with a well-written anti-hero or villain, even if you hate them, they're entertaining to have around. Anders 2.0 was not.

[mysamuraiFIGHT]

Vhalkyrie wrote...

LookingGlass93 wrote...

I'm playing through Awakening at the moment, and what he did in DA2 is retroactively making me dislike him and Justice there.

It does make for very interesting retrospect.  Especially the conversation where Justice asks Anders if he feels the mages are wronged, what is he doing about it.

Really?  I just found him very Monty Pythonesq.  "HELP, HELP...I'M BEING REPRESSED"!!!

[Kattack]

DoNotIngest wrote...

It always annoys me how he went from just wanting a nice gal to being in a relationship with Karl. I mean, look, I have no problems with anybody's sexuality, but whereas he seemed heterosexual in Awakening, he seems decidedly homosexual in this one. Like if Leliana had mentioned only liking women in Origins, then only liked men in DA2. It's nothing to do with prejudice, it's just that as a part of their character, it shouldn't be manipulated so much.

I somewhat agree with this.
But I think I'm only irritated because my male!Hawke got more romantic dialogue than my fem!Hawke! RAWR. Seriously. When you put the two romances side by side, Anders seems to prefer men over women when in Awakenings he has dialogues that point to preferring women.
If I hadn't ever played Awakenings it wouldn't have bothered me, heck I even like his comment that bodies are just superfical things and it's the personality that matters.
Seriously, I just don't see how he goes from wanting a pretty girl to coming on to my male!Hawke while my fem!Hawke had to chase him for three years. I would have preferred it if he'd at least come on to BOTH of them. <_<

Ahhh, and that turned into a rant. Sorry. >.>

[Adynata]

mysamuraiFIGHT wrote...

Really?  I just found him very Monty Pythonesq.  "HELP, HELP...I'M BEING REPRESSED"!!!

LOL! I think THAT is the problem. What he considered repression was not all that bad. I brought him with me when we had to fetch the group of apostates in the cave for Thrask, some of whom were blood mages. Anders just keeps saying things like "See what mages have to resort to when templars make it life or death." I just don't get the impression that it's all that bad. From what I can see, most of those mages ARE blood mages, and others, like his boyfriend Karl, are being turned tranquil because they try to escape (maybe not the best answer, but look who we're dealing with). Bethany never gets turned tranquil when she goes to the Circle, AND she doesn't seem to be having such a bad time b/c she follows the rules and gets to learn something new about her craft.

I find Anders an interesting, but frustrating character. I am mostly just dissappointed that, no matter what I do, I can't help him or change his mind. Like Merrill, his idea is just crazy stupid, but I am forced to watch everything literally go down in flames instead of being able to do the sensible thing: talk him out of it.

[Kattack]

PinkShoes wrote...

I dont think its bad writing, i think its his damn voice. Why change the voice actors? i get it hes been through a lot so yeah i understand your personality changes but your voice doesnt.

It's what the merging with Justice did. It corrupted his voice.

But seriously, it took me all of Act 1 to get used to that. The first time he spoke I was thinking, "Hey wait! What is this now?!"
It should have been the first warning...

[erynnar]

@Aris Ravenstar you said it so well. It was wooden and whiny. I mean my character hates what they do to mages, and I despise Meredith with a passion. And I want to kick the Grand Cleric for not doing her job and being the boss, instead she is all.."Oh if the Maker wills it..." Stupid Maker's fish wife. I am not really sorry she gets blown up. Well maybe 5% she did rock my world when Mother Patrice bit it by being a Qunari pin cushion and she just walked away. I think you cleared up part of why I don't like this Anders 2.0. He is a plot device, not a real person. I don't even get his slide into insanity as much because you can't talk to him like in DAO or help him to see there are other paths. He just starts spouting crazy **** or being a douche bag to other party members. Not really deepening my...oh Anders is going nuts.  Now if they had done in DA2 what they did in DAO where you had a chance to turn Anders from his path or help him..etc. It would have been sooo much better. Then you would have made an impact...start a revolution or stave one off, or some other possibility. But you can't .

And someone else saw a lot of repressed anger in Awakenings, well bugger me, I missed that. I mean some anger to be sure, but not such a boiling seething rage. Quite frankly, I would have preferred they made a totally new mage from the Kirkwall Circle who went renegade. That would have made more sense. Someone who had been under Meredith's thumb, someone who could be romanced and friended or rivaled and who would have tied me in closer to the mages and their plight there. As it was, Anders was a cardboard throw away plot device.

Modifié par erynnar, 28 mars 2011 - 03:10 .

[LobselVith8]

What's interesting is that Leandra and Bethany compare Anders to Malcolm Hawke. Apparently, the former Grey Warden reminds them of the late Hawke Senior.

[erynnar]

Hmm I never got that convo. darn.

[ThatDancingTurian]

LobselVith8 wrote...

What's interesting is that Leandra and Bethany compare Anders to Malcolm Hawke. Apparently, the former Grey Warden reminds them of the late Hawke Senior.

It's probably a superficial connection. I doubt the Hawkes hung out with many apostates since it would only draw more attention to their family. Malcolm was probably at least a little anti-Circle given that he ran away. And Anders I would imagine is at least a few years older than the Hawke kids (since he calls Hawke 'little girl' or 'boy' when you antagonize him in his intro scene). I doubt it has a lot to do with personality.

[lazuli]

PinkShoes wrote...

I dont think its bad writing, i think its his damn voice. Why change the voice actors? i get it hes been through a lot so yeah i understand your personality changes but your voice doesnt.

No, it's the face.  I'm using a mod that changes his face and I don't find him anywhere near as repugnant.

[ThatDancingTurian]

lazuli wrote...

PinkShoes wrote...

I dont think its bad writing, i think its his damn voice. Why change the voice actors? i get it hes been through a lot so yeah i understand your personality changes but your voice doesnt.

No, it's the face.  I'm using a mod that changes his face and I don't find him anywhere near as repugnant.

All of the above?

/OT: I've seen you around the forums and every time I see your avatar and signature I am reminded of how much I love mesmers. That is all.

[PlagueDoctor]

Honestly, I never played Awakening although I plan on it. I love Anders and his character. I didn't know him before and came into it loving it. He's just stressed out. I don't know, some people believe Heath Ledger did a good joker too. To each is own I guess.

[lazuli]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

lazuli wrote...

PinkShoes wrote...

I dont think its bad writing, i think its his damn voice. Why change the voice actors? i get it hes been through a lot so yeah i understand your personality changes but your voice doesnt.

No, it's the face.  I'm using a mod that changes his face and I don't find him anywhere near as repugnant.

All of the above?

/OT: I've seen you around the forums and every time I see your avatar and signature I am reminded of how much I love mesmers. That is all.

Yes.  All of the above.  He has the odds stacked against him.

I just love Mesmers so much.

[RomanDark]

His writing was fantastically done, no other character in DA2 had an effect on the players as much as he did.

As for me, I like Anders, I hate what vengeance did to him, but what I hate more is you are powerless to stop it from happening.

[RomanDark]

PinkShoes wrote...

I dont think its bad writing, i think its his damn voice. Why change the voice actors? i get it hes been through a lot so yeah i understand your personality changes but your voice doesnt.

They changed his voice because the same voice actor did Cullen and now they are both major characters in the same game.