128 réponses à ce sujet

[Camenae]

Statulos wrote...

You basically draw on your personal experience to consider an accent fake. I draw on mine to tell you the opposite.

Who wins the generalization challenge? None.

Mm, no, that's not what I said.  I said if you DON'T have an accent when you speak a foreign language such as English, it's actually hard to fake that accent.  Certainly not impossible, but hard.  You seem to be saying that you do have an accent when you speak English, however faint.  Well if you do naturally have an accent, then of course it's not hard to fake the accent.   

Plus I never said anything about the Antivan accents, ever.  But if you think the Orlesian (French) accents in this game are good, then...

Modifié par Camenae, 29 mars 2011 - 03:45 .

[Statulos]

They are not; I agree on that. However, French is a language with a broad variety of accents, so a rotund fake consideration should be taken with a grain of salt. When I was in Auvergne and Bourgogne the spoken language over there felt completely different than the one I listened in Marseille or Lyon.

Considering that, I guess Leliana´s accent could be possible in the real world and not faking it.

On a personal level, perhaps I am good at imitating accents from Spain when speaking English, I don´t know. My Galician-English sounds pretty good and I´m not from there.

Modifié par Statulos, 29 mars 2011 - 03:54 .

[Camenae]

Most of this nitpicking about accents stems from my hatred for the Comtesse de Launcet character. Hawke kills just about everyone else in the game, why not her?

[Statulos]

Because that would prevent Varric from saying "but the Hangman is fiiiiilthy" mocking her and that is one of the BEST lines in the whole game.

Modifié par Statulos, 29 mars 2011 - 04:00 .

[dgcatanisiri]

mrsph wrote...

PsychoWARD23 wrote...

Wait, people are actually getting pissed at Sebastian ranting? It fit perfectly and helped swayed my views. His family was murdered and then the one place he found peace was blown up killing Elthina in the process.

Anything that goes against the PC's wishes will make that character the worst one. You can actually tell which character will be the most unpopular by how often they disagree with the player.

I've said some disparaging comments about Sebastian, but I don't hate him. I just feel sorry for him because despite his devotion, he learned nothing of what Elthina was trying to teach him. Sebastian's causes depend on the direction of the wind. He will abandon all of what he's sworn himself to if someone wrongs him. Sebastian's outrage isn't really about the Chantry and the innocents killed. It's about Elthina. His character arc is that he falls back into the same pattern - he is wronged and he will have vengeance. Oh, he can say he wants justice, but he wants vengeance, because HE'S been wronged.

His comments about his family are all about how he's lost his family, how he's the last of the line. Not a word given of how he wants to help the people of Starkhaven - as far as he's concerned, the peasants don't really care about their ruler. Whether it's true or not, he not once talks about what he would do as the ruler of Starkhaven. What exactly makes him a better choice than who is there now ('simple' doesn't mean bad - Many would probably call Alistair 'simple' and Ferelden does pretty well under him)? What are his qualifications beyond circumstance of birth?

Choir Boy wants vengeance for his family, it brings him no peace. He sees Hawke's reaction to the death of his mother and the killing of the man who did it, and it brought him no peace. Elthina constantly tells him that he bends with the wind, and that he must pick a path and stick to it, rather than try to jump across several. But he just keeps at it. He learns nothing, and that's the whole shtick when it comes to him.

Okay, actually, maybe I do sort of hate him, but it's hate of his very human fault, which, when all is said and done, is probably part of the intention. Up until that moment, I don't mind him. I roll my eyes at his uber-religiousness, particularly when my mage Hawkes have rejected the Andrastan religion and my warrior/rogue Hawkes are skeptics like Aveline, but since he doesn't start preaching at me or trying to convert me, I put up with it. It's just that moment, when he shows that over the last six years he hasn't changed or grown that I don't like him.

[Alarieliia]

dgcatanisiri wrote...

I've said some disparaging comments about Sebastian, but I don't hate him. I just feel sorry for him because despite his devotion, he learned nothing of what Elthina was trying to teach him. Sebastian's causes depend on the direction of the wind. He will abandon all of what he's sworn himself to if someone wrongs him. Sebastian's outrage isn't really about the Chantry and the innocents killed. It's about Elthina. His character arc is that he falls back into the same pattern - he is wronged and he will have vengeance. Oh, he can say he wants justice, but he wants vengeance, because HE'S been wronged.

His comments about his family are all about how he's lost his family, how he's the last of the line. Not a word given of how he wants to help the people of Starkhaven - as far as he's concerned, the peasants don't really care about their ruler. Whether it's true or not, he not once talks about what he would do as the ruler of Starkhaven. What exactly makes him a better choice than who is there now ('simple' doesn't mean bad - Many would probably call Alistair 'simple' and Ferelden does pretty well under him)? What are his qualifications beyond circumstance of birth?

Choir Boy wants vengeance for his family, it brings him no peace. He sees Hawke's reaction to the death of his mother and the killing of the man who did it, and it brought him no peace. Elthina constantly tells him that he bends with the wind, and that he must pick a path and stick to it, rather than try to jump across several. But he just keeps at it. He learns nothing, and that's the whole shtick when it comes to him.

Okay, actually, maybe I do sort of hate him, but it's hate of his very human fault, which, when all is said and done, is probably part of the intention. Up until that moment, I don't mind him. I roll my eyes at his uber-religiousness, particularly when my mage Hawkes have rejected the Andrastan religion and my warrior/rogue Hawkes are skeptics like Aveline, but since he doesn't start preaching at me or trying to convert me, I put up with it. It's just that moment, when he shows that over the last six years he hasn't changed or grown that I don't like him.

Well said. It's those faults that make his character seem more human no? Sebby is selfish, then again so are we all when it comes to some things. He doesnt think about the consequences of killing Anders or the lesson that Elthina was trying to all but beat into his head.

I dont hate him. He is annoying to me somethimes and other times I genuinely feel for the guy. He may not be as 'fleshed out'  as other characters but what is seen is, in my opinion, good character writing. You see his struggle with his beliefs. Weither you find his beliefs stupid or not is not the point. The fact is he has flaws and is indecisive  on how he should approach his current situation. He's a complex character.

If every character agreed with you or if you liked every character it wouldnt be as interesting. Why do you like the characters you like? Do you overlook their flaws and irritating behaviors just because you like them on their good days? The same applies to Sebastian.
 
*sigh* I guess Sebby is the one you love to hate yet hate to love.

[Camilladilla]

Camenae wrote...

Most of this nitpicking about accents stems from my hatred for the Comtesse de Launcet character. Hawke kills just about everyone else in the game, why not her?

I had bigger issues with Ninette's husband. At least with the comtesse I can excuse the horrible accent for them playing it over the top for laughs. 

[Eollodwyn]

mrsph wrote...

PsychoWARD23 wrote...

Wait, people are actually getting pissed at Sebastian ranting? It fit perfectly and helped swayed my views. His family was murdered and then the one place he found peace was blown up killing Elthina in the process.

Anything that goes against the PC's wishes will make that character the worst one. You can actually tell which character will be the most unpopular by how often they disagree with the player.

His rant at the end actually had nothing to do with my disliking him.  Oh sure, it made me mad, but at the point most things he did annoyed me.  What got me was the way he behaved and spoke as if he were holier than all of us, but he was always so quick to jump to revenge.  He talked a lot about his faith, but the second his vows were tested he dumped them and sought revenge.  Even Elthina called him out on it, and she was right.  If his faith wasn't strong enough to weather what happened, then all his talk of it, all the banter between him and the other companions was just empty words.  Granted, I understand why he behaved that way, but understanding it doesn't mean I don't dislike it.  I have no respect for people who abandon their beliefs when it's easy, and then run back to them and still think they are better for them.

The last straw for me was the banter when Sebastian tried to convince Fenris to turn in Merrill and Anders to the Templars.  It made my blood boil.  At this point neither Anders nor Merrill had hurt a soul (beyond the countless people Hawke kills on a regular basis, that is), and I even took Anders along to help him on his personal quest.  It bothered me deeply that he was willing to turn in people he knew, knowing the Templars would execute them, because his religion said so.  He was all to willing to defy the Chantry for revenge, but he couldn't do it out of loyalty to his companions?  And to add to it, he didn't even really have the guts to do it.  The coward tried to get Fenris to do it.

Again, I can understand why he does what he does, but it doesn't make it any better.

Modifié par Eollodwyn, 29 mars 2011 - 07:58 .

[MadMoskus]

Religious freak or not, he is still the most awesome companion in DA2

[Eollodwyn]

Double post.  Hit Quote instead of Edit.

Modifié par Eollodwyn, 29 mars 2011 - 07:57 .

[Teddie Sage]

Is it safe to say that he only caters religious fans of DAs?

[dantares83]

Eollodwyn wrote...

mrsph wrote...

PsychoWARD23 wrote...

Wait, people are actually getting pissed at Sebastian ranting? It fit perfectly and helped swayed my views. His family was murdered and then the one place he found peace was blown up killing Elthina in the process.

Anything that goes against the PC's wishes will make that character the worst one. You can actually tell which character will be the most unpopular by how often they disagree with the player.

His rant at the end actually had nothing to do with my disliking him.  Oh sure, it made me mad, but at the point most things he did annoyed me.  What got me was the way he behaved and spoke as if he were holier than all of us, but he was always so quick to jump to revenge.  He talked a lot about his faith, but the second his vows were tested he dumped them and sought revenge.  Even Elthina called him out on it, and she was right.  If his faith wasn't strong enough to weather what happened, then all his talk of it, all the banter between him and the other companions was just empty words.  Granted, I understand why he behaved that way, but understanding it doesn't mean I don't dislike it.  I have no respect for people who abandon their beliefs when it's easy, and then run back to them and still think they are better for them.

The last straw for me was the banter when Sebastian tried to convince Fenris to turn in Merrill and Anders to the Templars.  It made my blood boil.  At this point neither Anders nor Merrill had hurt a soul (beyond the countless people Hawke kills on a regular basis, that is), and I even took Anders along to help him on his personal quest.  It bothered me deeply that he was willing to turn in people he knew, knowing the Templars would execute them, because his religion said so.  He was all to willing to defy the Chantry for revenge, but he couldn't do it out of loyalty to his companions?  And to add to it, he didn't even really have the guts to do it.  The coward tried to get Fenris to do it.

Again, I can understand why he does what he does, but it doesn't make it any better.

yeah, preciously why I hate him so much. He did not do a single thing by himself! If someone has killed my whole family, vengence would me on my mind (like him) and I would personally make it the only thing I will ever do. Yet, he choose to ask someone else to do it for him! What if no one is willing to do so, does that mean he can forgo revenge (like what the Grand Cleric had told him so)? So it's either you follow the Grand Cleric (Maker) or yourself? And when you decided vengence is what you need to cleanse your soul, you don't put it up on a chantry board.

And then, there's Anders. He was just sitting there and not defending himself. Anyone there could have kill him and he would'nt resist it. But he insists I kill Anders for him. Did he not realize Anders was my lover? I may not agree with what Anders did and how he betrayed me but still, it takes alot to kill someone you loved. I would have just walk away when he is about to kill Anders, because I know I'm in no position to save him as he did killed a 'family member' of his. Just like how I lost my mother a few years ago.

I never got that Fenris banter but if it is true, he is just a waste of space. Shale was 1000000000x more interesting and funny!

Modifié par dantares83, 29 mars 2011 - 08:13 .

[CRISIS1717]

Can you imagine how pissed people would be if a character just decided to kill Anders without any input from the player.

I don't think the developers should change Sebastian's personality just on a whim either, it's obvious he considers Anders a murderer that needs to face justice and you made your choice. So now Sebastian doesn't like you, which is your fault.

[dantares83]

CRISIS1717 wrote...

Can you imagine how pissed people would be if a character just decided to kill Anders without any input from the player.

I don't think the developers should change Sebastian's personality just on a whim either, it's obvious he considers Anders a murderer that needs to face justice and you made your choice. So now Sebastian doesn't like you, which is your fault.

you can choose to save Anders by killing Sebastian  (as he is about to kill Anders).. outcome is still the same, you only get to keep one. it will at least made him more human...

[Sabriana]

I know nothing about Sebastian, because he's not in my game, and wont be in the foreseeable future. But just in general, there need not be a "no choice for the PC".

All through the game my Hawke can empower her companions to act on their whim and will. All I have to do is click on the companion choice in that little silly wheel. Varric gets to hoodwink Karras and the slaver, Fenris gets to 'encourage' Gascard and kill the magister's son, Aveline gets to threaten the merchant and go ballistic on her rogue guardsman, etc.

[The Angry One]

CRISIS1717 wrote...

Can you imagine how pissed people would be if a character just decided to kill Anders without any input from the player.

Who says there has to be no input?
There are several "Let Fenris kill X" options after all.

[FellowerOfOdin]

If you let Anders live, you willingly support a terrorist and thus terrorist acts that kill innocent people.

Sebastien has QUITE A FEW reasons to be pissed off.

[Gabey5]

he is afraid of anders clearly, as he is a beast

[Gabey5]

FellowerOfOdin wrote...

If you let Anders live, you willingly support a terrorist and thus terrorist acts that kill innocent people.

Sebastien has QUITE A FEW reasons to be pissed off.

he saved my ass countless times over the years , that means something to some people. Hawke no matter how you play him has been responsible for the deaths of hundreds over the years so you aren't a saint yourself

Modifié par Gabey5, 29 mars 2011 - 11:09 .

[The Angry One]

Gabey5 wrote...

FellowerOfOdin wrote...

If you let Anders live, you willingly support a terrorist and thus terrorist acts that kill innocent people.

Sebastien has QUITE A FEW reasons to be pissed off.

he saved my ass countless times over the years , that means something to some people. Hawke no matter how you play him has been responsible for the deaths of hundreds over the years so you aren't a saint yourself

Yeah remind me again when Hawke plants a doomsday bomb below a bunch of clerics, orphans and volunteers?

[Gabey5]

The Angry One wrote...

Gabey5 wrote...

FellowerOfOdin wrote...

If you let Anders live, you willingly support a terrorist and thus terrorist acts that kill innocent people.

Sebastien has QUITE A FEW reasons to be pissed off.

he saved my ass countless times over the years , that means something to some people. Hawke no matter how you play him has been responsible for the deaths of hundreds over the years so you aren't a saint yourself

Yeah remind me again when Hawke plants a doomsday bomb below a bunch of clerics, orphans and volunteers?

 
innocents die in war. Killing the one responsible won't bring them back.... There should have at least been an option to turn him over after meridith's death. Also it would be benificial to have a connection to one of potential leaders of the mages, with Anders you get thatif you let him live. I personally saw no reason to kill him, he has had my characters back since they met,saved the life of my sibling and helped me get rich.

Modifié par Gabey5, 29 mars 2011 - 11:24 .

[elearon1]

TheOrtReport wrote...I honestly don't mind Sebastian that much, he is kind of bland in some areas, but he's okay in my book.

This is my take as well.  He is not as clever, strong willed or funny as your other party members, but he does bring a fresh new perspective into the group - the faithful Andrastite.  My only problem with the character - aside from his poor combat AI - was his very vanilla ice cream personality; and while vanilla ice cream can be fine, it is rarely the flavor you want to eat all the time ... especially when you've got Neopolitan, Rocky Road, Chunky Monkey, Googoo Cluster, Chocolate and Orange Sherbert as alternatives. 

[The Angry One]

Gabey5 wrote...
 
innocents die in war. Killing the one responsible won't bring them back....

There was no war.  He started it.

There should have at least been an option to turn him over after meridith's death.

Would've been nice.

Also it would be benificial to have a connection to one of potential leaders of the mages, with Anders you get thatif you let him live.

An abomination lead mages?
Not even the Tevinters stoop that low.

I personally saw no reason to kill him, he has had my characters back since they met,saved the life of my sibling and helped me get rich.

You do realise that the Anders who helped you with all that is essentially dead, now fully taken over by Vengeance?

Modifié par The Angry One, 29 mars 2011 - 11:37 .

[ZerbanDaGreat1]

Is Seb justified it having a hissy fit? Probably not. Would it be retarded for him not to object? HELL YES. The man has just seen his home and family for the past decade or two go up in a ball of flame. Not to mention how accusing he acts if you mention that you unknowingly helped Anders. The way I see it, he wants you to do it to prove to him that you don't condone what Anders did. Really it's the same as the Alistair/Loghain dilemma from Origins.

Does it ****** off players from a metagame standpoint? Yes.
Does it make complete storyline sense? Yes.

If there's one thing I hate about the Anders dilemma is that there's no option to make the bastard Tranquil and make him Seb's personal armour polisher.

Modifié par ZerbanDaGreat1, 29 mars 2011 - 11:53 .

[The Angry One]

ZerbanDaGreat1 wrote...

If there's one thing I hate about the Anders dilemma is that there's no option to make the bastard Tranquil and make him Seb's personal armour polisher.

I don't think you can tranquil an abomination.