839 réponses à ce sujet

[thetawaves90]

Dusty Boy T wrote...

earthbornFemShep wrote...

Slow, careful indoctrination produces a capable subject that can be quite convincing.  If you read the book Retribution and paid special attention in ME1 (especially to Vigil), you know that results vary depending on the type of indoctrination used and the speed of the indoctrination.  Vigil states that the reapers used indoctrinated Protheans to find and join Prothean 'hold-out' camps... only to betray the hold-outs to the reapers.   These subjects are capable of deceit.  Some, like Grayson, believe they can control the influence and that they are not at the complete mercy of the reapers until it is too late. 

My theory on Dr. Kenson's behavior is this:  she was being slowly and subtly indoctrinated.  She did not believe that Object Rho would harm her because she felt that she was taking the appropriate steps.  Her motivations were being subtly twisted by the reapers.  She wanted to get back to the object and she wanted to bring Shepard with her--I am not sure if she even knew her motivations about Shepard until she returned to the base.  Once she returned to the base, I think she knew she was going to try to expose Shepard to the device, capture/indoctrinate him, and hand him to the reapers.  She mentioned that she could hear the 'whispers'... and was dismayed when she could not hear them--that's when she became frantic and irrational. 

To most fans, bringing Shepard back to the base seems like an illogical risk for the Reapers? (after all, don't the reapers know that Shep is THE main character and we can't have ME3 without her/him?)  However, the reapers are known for consistently underestimating Shepard when trying to destroy or capture her/him.  The odds were in their favor this time:  Shepard was alone and severly outnumbered, in foreign territory, and on a mission to save the very tool they were using (Kenson).  If I were a reaper, I would have liked those odds.  

Very well-put. Nice work.

Big +1, puts into a different perspective the main complaints I had over those aspects of the DLC. Though with the point of indoctrination with the Doctor, it still doesn't answer why she was so heavilly influenced to the point of lamenting the loss of contact with the reaper (considering her intentions were to stem the Reaper invasion to start off with). Whereas Saren (a pro-reaper, reaper-modified, geth-esque cyborg...thing) showed genuine remorse to his choices and actions. 

Modifié par thetawaves90, 29 mars 2011 - 09:39 .

[AlphaJarmel]

LGTX wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...
 i mean if you were in the military and had to make a choice on wether to sacrifice millions of people or ditch em how would you react to the pressure?

That's a choice Arrival could have given us but didn't. It matters because choices and the whole RPG element is, you know, kind of a central theme for the game. And especially since the DLCs are meant to experiment differing mechanics for later use in ME3.

And this DLC is about Shepard? Which isn't? 

I'm glad they didn't as it would just be a waste of resources.  If you didn't blow up the relay then the Reapers come and everybody dies.  SImple as that.

[LGTX]

thetawaves90 wrote...

Dusty Boy T wrote...

earthbornFemShep wrote...

Slow, careful indoctrination produces a capable subject that can be quite convincing.  If you read the book Retribution and paid special attention in ME1 (especially to Vigil), you know that results vary depending on the type of indoctrination used and the speed of the indoctrination.  Vigil states that the reapers used indoctrinated Protheans to find and join Prothean 'hold-out' camps... only to betray the hold-outs to the reapers.   These subjects are capable of deceit.  Some, like Grayson, believe they can control the influence and that they are not at the complete mercy of the reapers until it is too late. 

My theory on Dr. Kenson's behavior is this:  she was being slowly and subtly indoctrinated.  She did not believe that Object Rho would harm her because she felt that she was taking the appropriate steps.  Her motivations were being subtly twisted by the reapers.  She wanted to get back to the object and she wanted to bring Shepard with her--I am not sure if she even knew her motivations about Shepard until she returned to the base.  Once she returned to the base, I think she knew she was going to try to expose Shepard to the device, capture/indoctrinate him, and hand him to the reapers.  She mentioned that she could hear the 'whispers'... and was dismayed when she could not hear them--that's when she became frantic and irrational. 

To most fans, bringing Shepard back to the base seems like an illogical risk for the Reapers? (after all, don't the reapers know that Shep is THE main character and we can't have ME3 without her/him?)  However, the reapers are known for consistently underestimating Shepard when trying to destroy or capture her/him.  The odds were in their favor this time:  Shepard was alone and severly outnumbered, in foreign territory, and on a mission to save the very tool they were using (Kenson).  If I were a reaper, I would have liked those odds.  

Very well-put. Nice work.

Big +1, puts into a different perspective the main complaints I had over those aspects of the DLC. Though with the point of indoctrination with the Doctor, it still doesn't answer why she was so heavilly influenced to the point of lamenting the loss of contact with the reaper (considering her intentions were to stem the Reaper invasion to start off with). Whereas Saren (a pro-reaper, reaper-modified, geth-esque cyborg...thing) showed genuine remorse to his choices and actions. 

Saren accepted the Reapers for what they were, which was his primary reason for succumbing to them, whereas Kenson thought they wouldn't actually wipe us out (remember those audio logs?), and could have had any number of reasons to think their Arrival would yield a "positive" outcome. And then there's the indoctrination mixing stuff up in people's brains.

[LGTX]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

LGTX wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...
 i mean if you were in the military and had to make a choice on wether to sacrifice millions of people or ditch em how would you react to the pressure?

That's a choice Arrival could have given us but didn't. It matters because choices and the whole RPG element is, you know, kind of a central theme for the game. And especially since the DLCs are meant to experiment differing mechanics for later use in ME3.

And this DLC is about Shepard? Which isn't? 

I'm glad they didn't as it would just be a waste of resources.  If you didn't blow up the relay then the Reapers come and everybody dies.  SImple as that.

I was referring to a choice of reaction, not the actual choice on activating the Project. 

[AlphaJarmel]

thetawaves90 wrote...

Dusty Boy T wrote...

earthbornFemShep wrote...

Slow, careful indoctrination produces a capable subject that can be quite convincing.  If you read the book Retribution and paid special attention in ME1 (especially to Vigil), you know that results vary depending on the type of indoctrination used and the speed of the indoctrination.  Vigil states that the reapers used indoctrinated Protheans to find and join Prothean 'hold-out' camps... only to betray the hold-outs to the reapers.   These subjects are capable of deceit.  Some, like Grayson, believe they can control the influence and that they are not at the complete mercy of the reapers until it is too late. 

My theory on Dr. Kenson's behavior is this:  she was being slowly and subtly indoctrinated.  She did not believe that Object Rho would harm her because she felt that she was taking the appropriate steps.  Her motivations were being subtly twisted by the reapers.  She wanted to get back to the object and she wanted to bring Shepard with her--I am not sure if she even knew her motivations about Shepard until she returned to the base.  Once she returned to the base, I think she knew she was going to try to expose Shepard to the device, capture/indoctrinate him, and hand him to the reapers.  She mentioned that she could hear the 'whispers'... and was dismayed when she could not hear them--that's when she became frantic and irrational. 

To most fans, bringing Shepard back to the base seems like an illogical risk for the Reapers? (after all, don't the reapers know that Shep is THE main character and we can't have ME3 without her/him?)  However, the reapers are known for consistently underestimating Shepard when trying to destroy or capture her/him.  The odds were in their favor this time:  Shepard was alone and severly outnumbered, in foreign territory, and on a mission to save the very tool they were using (Kenson).  If I were a reaper, I would have liked those odds.  

Very well-put. Nice work.

Big +1, puts into a different perspective the main complaints I had over those aspects of the DLC. Though with the point of indoctrination with the Doctor, it still doesn't answer why she was so heavilly influenced to the point of lamenting the loss of contact with the reaper (considering her intentions were to stem the Reaper invasion to start off with). Whereas Saren (a pro-reaper, reaper-modified, geth-esque cyborg...thing) showed genuine remorse to his choices and actions. 

Possibly because Saren was a much stronger character. Saren tried to fight it and lost while the Doc kinda just gave in.

I would love a scene in ME3 where you are being indoctrinated and you have to fight it.

[LGTX]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

thetawaves90 wrote...

Dusty Boy T wrote...

earthbornFemShep wrote...

Slow, careful indoctrination produces a capable subject that can be quite convincing.  If you read the book Retribution and paid special attention in ME1 (especially to Vigil), you know that results vary depending on the type of indoctrination used and the speed of the indoctrination.  Vigil states that the reapers used indoctrinated Protheans to find and join Prothean 'hold-out' camps... only to betray the hold-outs to the reapers.   These subjects are capable of deceit.  Some, like Grayson, believe they can control the influence and that they are not at the complete mercy of the reapers until it is too late. 

My theory on Dr. Kenson's behavior is this:  she was being slowly and subtly indoctrinated.  She did not believe that Object Rho would harm her because she felt that she was taking the appropriate steps.  Her motivations were being subtly twisted by the reapers.  She wanted to get back to the object and she wanted to bring Shepard with her--I am not sure if she even knew her motivations about Shepard until she returned to the base.  Once she returned to the base, I think she knew she was going to try to expose Shepard to the device, capture/indoctrinate him, and hand him to the reapers.  She mentioned that she could hear the 'whispers'... and was dismayed when she could not hear them--that's when she became frantic and irrational. 

To most fans, bringing Shepard back to the base seems like an illogical risk for the Reapers? (after all, don't the reapers know that Shep is THE main character and we can't have ME3 without her/him?)  However, the reapers are known for consistently underestimating Shepard when trying to destroy or capture her/him.  The odds were in their favor this time:  Shepard was alone and severly outnumbered, in foreign territory, and on a mission to save the very tool they were using (Kenson).  If I were a reaper, I would have liked those odds.  

Very well-put. Nice work.

Big +1, puts into a different perspective the main complaints I had over those aspects of the DLC. Though with the point of indoctrination with the Doctor, it still doesn't answer why she was so heavilly influenced to the point of lamenting the loss of contact with the reaper (considering her intentions were to stem the Reaper invasion to start off with). Whereas Saren (a pro-reaper, reaper-modified, geth-esque cyborg...thing) showed genuine remorse to his choices and actions. 

Possibly because Saren was a much stronger character. Saren tried to fight it and lost while the Doc kinda just gave in.

I would love a scene in ME3 where you are being indoctrinated and you have to fight it.

Only IF it isn't made into some finger-wrecking quick-time event 

[AlphaJarmel]

LGTX wrote...

AlphaJarmel wrote...

LGTX wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...
 i mean if you were in the military and had to make a choice on wether to sacrifice millions of people or ditch em how would you react to the pressure?

That's a choice Arrival could have given us but didn't. It matters because choices and the whole RPG element is, you know, kind of a central theme for the game. And especially since the DLCs are meant to experiment differing mechanics for later use in ME3.

And this DLC is about Shepard? Which isn't? 

I'm glad they didn't as it would just be a waste of resources.  If you didn't blow up the relay then the Reapers come and everybody dies.  SImple as that.

I was referring to a choice of reaction, not the actual choice on activating the Project. 

What do you want Shepard to do?  Cry over it?  It was a tactical military call just like in ME1 when Shepard sacrificed part of the Alliance fleet to save the Council.  He wasn't weepy or that either.  You could tell he didn't like it either judging by his body language before you press the 'go ahead' button but it had to be done.

[JediNg]

Far too short. Quite fun. Sometimes challenging, but too short
But at least it confirms Hackett's foreverbros status.

[hawat333]

Even with not reading through the pages, I'm pretty sure that this was already said, so I only want to reinforce the statement: This is a pure action DLC.
There are no choices. There are one place where you can suggest an intention, but even that doesn't matter. We can only choose attitude.
While I've enjoyed the DLC a great deal, it wasn't only a bit short for my taste, it also lacked decision-making.
Mass Effect was qualified as an action/RPG.
I would like to see more decisions, choices, opportunites in future DLCs for the franchise.
1 big + for bringing Hackett in there.

[earthbornFemShep]

Aramintai wrote...

"Arrival" seems to be the worst story DLC of the three for ME2, at least for me.

It has rather weak plot and much less cinematic experience, even compared to "Overlord". It's also kinda boring - half an hour walk though some corridors shooting same looking enemies, yes batarians wear the same armor and helmets as station guards. And there are no real choices to make in this DLC. It all comes down to the last dialogue with Hackett where he implies that Shepard in ME3 will have to visit Earth for his own trial. "Arrival" was just a reason for that trial, excluding his already dubious connection to Cerberus. Looks like a rough stitch job to tie ME2 to the beginning of ME3.

Also I don't understand one thing: a simple asteroid hit should not have destroyed the Relay, since what we know from ME1 it can survive even supernova explosion and is made from the same indestructible material as the Citadel. And even if the asteroid can destroy it why not execute The Project when the Reapers just arrived through it and destroy them all in one big explosion. Otherwise it's just a waste of good Relay and a couple of bad batarians. The Reapers will just find another Relay.

All in all, I'm dissapointed.

I will agree with you in that I'm a bit disappointed, but not in the story.  I felt it was weak and a bit confusing for the combat.  After running around for a bit, I got bored.  I may be one of the few people that hated the Archangel mission, and the prison breakout gave me some flashbacks once Dr. Kenson and I started fighting our way out of there.  Further, many of my Shepards are especially suited for supporting combat roles; I missed my squad.  Not to mention, it made the AI seem really dumb when 'stealthing' through.  (I accidentally fired a few rounds over a guard's head and nothing happened... he just stood there.)  Honestly, I think I would have liked less combat in it--because as it is, the cutscene and combat transitions seem choppy. 

I did appreciate the details that went into the corridors and the landscape.  Running around the station of that asteroid was beautiful.  Also, as an infiltrator, the attempts at stealth were appreciated (even if it wasn't perfect).  I rather like to avoid combat when possible--especially when solo.  Further pluses were playing as the Loki mech,

Honestly, it is too bad that this is canonical (with one outcome).  My renegade, renegon, and paragade Shepards would have had no problem popping Kenson in the back of the head when she ran from me the first time... instead I let her run away and grab a bomb... thus leaving me no time to warn the victims.  Of course, that would hinder those who didn't buy the DLC and didn't have the chance to do so. 

[Tasker]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

LGTX wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...
 i mean if you were in the military and had to make a choice on wether to sacrifice millions of people or ditch em how would you react to the pressure?

That's a choice Arrival could have given us but didn't. It matters because choices and the whole RPG element is, you know, kind of a central theme for the game. And especially since the DLCs are meant to experiment differing mechanics for later use in ME3.

And this DLC is about Shepard? Which isn't? 

I'm glad they didn't as it would just be a waste of resources.  If you didn't blow up the relay then the Reapers come and everybody dies.  SImple as that.

I have to agree with you, the relay had to be destroyed. 

However, having said that, I think there should have been more of a reaction from Shepard. - Renegade could have just gone ahh well and pressed the button and Paragon Shepard could have shown a bit more of an internalal conflict before pressing the button.
 
Also I think the ability to finish the communication to the colonies, giving them the possability of evacuating some of the people should have been an option.

On the whole, despite it being very combat oriented I thought the DLC was well worth the money. - I thought the transitions, cutscenes and external views from the complex were excellent.

Though I was a bit dissapointed that they didn't reuse some of Jokers dialogue, just having his sit there pulling faces was a bit crap.

Modifié par Orkboy, 29 mars 2011 - 09:55 .

[dreman9999]

Aramintai wrote...

"Arrival" seems to be the worst story DLC of the three for ME2, at least for me.

It has rather weak plot and much less cinematic experience, even compared to "Overlord". It's also kinda boring - half an hour walk though some corridors shooting same looking enemies, yes batarians wear the same armor and helmets as station guards. And there are no real choices to make in this DLC. It all comes down to the last dialogue with Hackett where he implies that Shepard in ME3 will have to visit Earth for his own trial. "Arrival" was just a reason for that trial, excluding his already dubious connection to Cerberus. Looks like a rough stitch job to tie ME2 to the beginning of ME3.

Also I don't understand one thing: a simple asteroid hit should not have destroyed the Relay, since what we know from ME1 it can survive even supernova explosion and is made from the same indestructible material as the Citadel. And even if the asteroid can destroy it why not execute The Project when the Reapers just arrived through it and destroy them all in one big explosion. Otherwise it's just a waste of good Relay and a couple of bad batarians. The Reapers will just find another Relay.

All in all, I'm dissapointed.

Let's go over the plot ......
You sent By Hackett to break out a an operative who say that she has proof the the reapers are attacking. Eveything is unclear outside of she is being held hostage by bartarians and  due to stelth is need, it's a solo mission. So you break her out and find out why she knows the reapers are coming and why she was arrested for terrorisim, a reaper artifact. She saw visions from it and  she tells you that they have destroy the systems relay to stop them and she has been preping an astirod to do so with her team. But at this point you think she maybe crazy..because destorying a relay destroys a solar system and killsall the people in it.(All Batarians) But you can't ignore it because the reapers could be coming and  that would end all life as we know it. So you go to the station with its own doom clock, and your lead to the artifact, which you think is seal within  layers and layers of security when it really planet in the middle of the room like a house plant.
You then look at the good Doctor like a crazy person.

"How can you leave this thing out like this, you could get indocrinated?"
And then it hits you like a punch in the gut....or a hot wire in the brain. The images and the overwelming thoughts.... And the haunting voice of Harbinger.......
And then you look at her a she's please with herself as she give you her dark gift. They are indoconated and they are trying to indocinate you. The reapers used you fears agenst you, so that that they can lure you here and capture you. They let the doctor get cause and realse the info on the reaper invasion so that you would come running just in time for them to get here so they can have a new shinny vanguard to help them...

And this you think is a bad story?

[LGTX]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

What do you want Shepard to do?  Cry over it?  It was a tactical military call just like in ME1 when Shepard sacrificed part of the Alliance fleet to save the Council.  He wasn't weepy or that either.  You could tell he didn't like it either judging by his body language before you press the 'go ahead' button but it had to be done.

Makes sense when you put it like this. Okay then, argument lost
Still makes me want to argue pointless details though. Like, okay, just to get it out of my system, there is a big red button for wiping out a whole system, AND you're playing Mass Effect. It kind of makes you want to have that choice, but you know it's predetermined, so, like in any other similar situation in ME1/ME2, you simply reach that preset point via differing emotional responses (paragon/renegade).

...but I guess that's sort of covered when you choose between warning the population and panicking the hell out.

[follis2]

I have just finished Arrival. I did it right after Horizon, which I initially thought wouldn't make much sense. But now I feel it actually adds a new dimension to the game. The meeting with Anderson and the council (which I haven't done yet on this playthrough) will be awkward for Shepard, for instance. I am eager to see if they have heard the news and ask what Shepard has to report about it... If they haven't, the events in Arrival still give the situation an extra dimension for Shepard being reinstated as a Spectre while knowing s/he sacrificed so many lives.The burden of not showing fear and doubt as the leader of the team will be even heavier to carry. Maybe the DLC in isolation wasn't as satisfying as LotsB, but I still think it adds significantly to the main game RPG-wise. 

As for gameplay, I found the game more challenging (on Insanity) than before, which is good. Enemies seem to hit more and are more aggressive.

Modifié par follis2, 29 mars 2011 - 09:55 .

[dreman9999]

Orkboy wrote...

AlphaJarmel wrote...

LGTX wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...
 i mean if you were in the military and had to make a choice on wether to sacrifice millions of people or ditch em how would you react to the pressure?

That's a choice Arrival could have given us but didn't. It matters because choices and the whole RPG element is, you know, kind of a central theme for the game. And especially since the DLCs are meant to experiment differing mechanics for later use in ME3.

And this DLC is about Shepard? Which isn't? 

I'm glad they didn't as it would just be a waste of resources.  If you didn't blow up the relay then the Reapers come and everybody dies.  SImple as that.

I have to agree with you, the relay had to be destroyed. 

However, having said that, I think there should have been more of a reaction from Shepard. - Renegade could ahve just gone ahh well and pressed the button and Paragon Shepard could have shown a bit more of an internalal conflict before pressing the button.
 
Also I think the ability to finish the communication to the colonies, giving them the possability of evacuating some of the people should have been an option.

On the whole, I thought the DLC was excellent.

Not much time left to realy think about it you, think. Bioware just let the debate to be left in your head. That's all.

[Yakko77]

A trial on Earth Hackett mentions. I don't think Earthgov will convict Shep and the batarians wont accept anything less than a death penalty. Expect an assassination attempt or jury rigging or something....

[Tasker]

dreman9999 wrote...

Orkboy wrote...

AlphaJarmel wrote...

LGTX wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...
 i mean if you were in the military and had to make a choice on wether to sacrifice millions of people or ditch em how would you react to the pressure?

That's a choice Arrival could have given us but didn't. It matters because choices and the whole RPG element is, you know, kind of a central theme for the game. And especially since the DLCs are meant to experiment differing mechanics for later use in ME3.

And this DLC is about Shepard? Which isn't? 

I'm glad they didn't as it would just be a waste of resources.  If you didn't blow up the relay then the Reapers come and everybody dies.  SImple as that.

I have to agree with you, the relay had to be destroyed. 

However, having said that, I think there should have been more of a reaction from Shepard. - Renegade could ahve just gone ahh well and pressed the button and Paragon Shepard could have shown a bit more of an internalal conflict before pressing the button.
 
Also I think the ability to finish the communication to the colonies, giving them the possability of evacuating some of the people should have been an option.

On the whole, I thought the DLC was excellent.

Not much time left to realy think about it you, think. Bioware just let the debate to be left in your head. That's all.

I understand what you mean, I just think that scene was lacking that certain spark.

Not going to let it spoil the DLC for me though, the rest of it though a bit samey after a while - was still thoroughly enjoyable.


One thing I will say though...

It's a shame that the DLC isn't limited to being availiable after the suicide mission, as it would have been brilliant if the Reapers jumped in just before the Normandy jumped out - and got splattered by the asteroid/relay explosion in the process.

Modifié par Orkboy, 29 mars 2011 - 10:02 .

[Xiarmethes]

Apologies if this idea was already mentioned earlier in the thread (didn't read every post as of yet), but something occured to me after finishing the Arrival DLC:

Shepard was set up by the Reapers

Their primary path into the galaxy via the Citadel was blocked and their new Human Reaper inductee was wiped out along with the Collectors (assuming this DLC takes place post-suicide mission). Shepard is clearly not going down easy and has proven to be quite determined to intefere with the Reapers at every opportunity, so what better way to strike down the self-appointed savior of the galaxy than by "turning" Shepard into a genocidal maniac to be persecuted and destroyed by the same civilizations he/she saved?

The Reapers, acting through their agent Dr. Kenson, trick Shepard into destroying a relay, which they probably never really needed, and wiping out an inhabited star system. All the intel and proof Shepard had was primarily from the agent and the Reaper aritifact, both under Harbringer's control. The time constraints imposed also serve to snuff out any rational thought on the situation: Took quite a bit of effort to figure out the Citadel was the Reaper main gate in ME1, and now we get intel to find their "back door" just like that? Convenient...

The Council now has "conclusive" proof that Shepard's belief in the Reaper threat has driven him/her mad and must be put down. The Alliance brass will serve up Shepard in the interests of avoiding war with the batarians. Tried, sentenced and powerless on Earth, Shepard and the homeworld would be wiped out by the Reapers in one fell swoop.

At least, that is the plan....

[Tasker]

Xiarmethes wrote...

Apologies if this idea was already mentioned earlier in the thread (didn't read every post as of yet), but something occured to me after finishing the Arrival DLC:

Shepard was set up by the Reapers

Their primary path into the galaxy via the Citadel was blocked and their new Human Reaper inductee was wiped out along with the Collectors (assuming this DLC takes place post-suicide mission). Shepard is clearly not going down easy and has proven to be quite determined to intefere with the Reapers at every opportunity, so what better way to strike down the self-appointed savior of the galaxy than by "turning" Shepard into a genocidal maniac to be persecuted and destroyed by the same civilizations he/she saved?

The Reapers, acting through their agent Dr. Kenson, trick Shepard into destroying a relay, which they probably never really needed, and wiping out an inhabited star system. All the intel and proof Shepard had was primarily from the agent and the Reaper aritifact, both under Harbringer's control. The time constraints imposed also serve to snuff out any rational thought on the situation: Took quite a bit of effort to figure out the Citadel was the Reaper main gate in ME1, and now we get intel to find their "back door" just like that? Convenient...

The Council now has "conclusive" proof that Shepard's belief in the Reaper threat has driven him/her mad and must be put down. The Alliance brass will serve up Shepard in the interests of avoiding war with the batarians. Tried, sentenced and powerless on Earth, Shepard and the homeworld would be wiped out by the Reapers in one fell swoop.

At least, that is the plan....

Plausable, but...

... is Mac Walters clever enough to come up with something that complicated?      ( Just kidding )

Modifié par Orkboy, 29 mars 2011 - 10:04 .

[LGTX]

Yakko77 wrote...

A trial on Earth Hackett mentions. I don't think Earthgov will convict Shep and the batarians wont accept anything less than a death penalty. Expect an assassination attempt or jury rigging or something....

I've actually thought about this quite much. Not about the assassination part, but... there were speculations earlier that ME3 might start off by Shepard being in prison - and I mean, why not?

With ME2, he's pretty much set the gears in motion for rallying up the non-Council races. Urdnot is rolling on all fours at taking over Tuchanka, the Geth/quarian conflict is set for a quick (and not necessarily painless) end with the resolution of the Heretic problem and the state of the Admiralty, the Rachni are making definite promises (if you saved them in ME1, that is), and with the three main Terminus gangs in almost total disarray, it won't be a problem for Aria to take over the whole thing and step forth as yet another asset (she's very much into the Reaper threat if I remember correctly).

ME3 may just consist of you breaking out of prison, adding final nudges to resolving the Terminus conflicts and sticking some evidence up the Council's ass, with the second half of the game being the war itself. So I think it's plausible to say that after Arrival, canonically speaking, Shepard turns himself in/gets arrested on Earth. 

Modifié par LGTX, 29 mars 2011 - 10:07 .

[thetawaves90]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

thetawaves90 wrote...


Big +1, puts into a different perspective the main complaints I had over those aspects of the DLC. Though with the point of indoctrination with the Doctor, it still doesn't answer why she was so heavilly influenced to the point of lamenting the loss of contact with the reaper (considering her intentions were to stem the Reaper invasion to start off with). Whereas Saren (a pro-reaper, reaper-modified, geth-esque cyborg...thing) showed genuine remorse to his choices and actions. 

Possibly because Saren was a much stronger character. Saren tried to fight it and lost while the Doc kinda just gave in.

I would love a scene in ME3 where you are being indoctrinated and you have to fight it.

I guess, plus it suggests that the Habringer was far more insidious in it's approach than Sovereign which seemed to take Saren's lack of faith and implant the crap out of him in response. Good. Sorry Bioware, all is forgiven 

[Nerevar-as]

Orkboy wrote...

It's a shame that the DLC isn't limited to being availiable after the suicide mission, as it would have been brilliant if the Reapers jumped in just before the Normandy jumped out - and got splattered by the asteroid/relay explosion in the process.

The way I understood it, the alpha relay isn´t the one Reapers were arriving through, is the one they were going to use once they reached the galactic border after walking all the way from dark space.

I agree about the DLC not being limited to post SM. In fact, unless it changes some cutscenes, it makes no sense. Harbinger and company only start the trip towards the galaxy after the T-Reaper project fails.

[AlphaJarmel]

LGTX wrote...

AlphaJarmel wrote...

What do you want Shepard to do?  Cry over it?  It was a tactical military call just like in ME1 when Shepard sacrificed part of the Alliance fleet to save the Council.  He wasn't weepy or that either.  You could tell he didn't like it either judging by his body language before you press the 'go ahead' button but it had to be done.

Makes sense when you put it like this. Okay then, argument lost
Still makes me want to argue pointless details though. Like, okay, just to get it out of my system, there is a big red button for wiping out a whole system, AND you're playing Mass Effect. It kind of makes you want to have that choice, but you know it's predetermined, so, like in any other similar situation in ME1/ME2, you simply reach that preset point via differing emotional responses (paragon/renegade).

...but I guess that's sort of covered when you choose between warning the population and panicking the hell out.

There probably should have been some sort of vocal dialogue like Shepard admitting this was a really crappy choice but really that's it.  He's running on a deadline by himself(which is unusual) with all of the station ready to kill him.  So as you can imagine he's a little stressed out too.  Again he did try to warn them and wasn't happy about the call but the call needed to be made.  We got more emotion out of this than we did in ME1 with the Battle of the Citadel.  I also fully expect there to be some serious drama in ME3 where Shepard sees the cost of what he did.

Modifié par AlphaJarmel, 29 mars 2011 - 10:18 .

[AlphaJarmel]

LGTX wrote...

Yakko77 wrote...

A trial on Earth Hackett mentions. I don't think Earthgov will convict Shep and the batarians wont accept anything less than a death penalty. Expect an assassination attempt or jury rigging or something....

I've actually thought about this quite much. Not about the assassination part, but... there were speculations earlier that ME3 might start off by Shepard being in prison - and I mean, why not?

With ME2, he's pretty much set the gears in motion for rallying up the non-Council races. Urdnot is rolling on all fours at taking over Tuchanka, the Geth/quarian conflict is set for a quick (and not necessarily painless) end with the resolution of the Heretic problem and the state of the Admiralty, the Rachni are making definite promises (if you saved them in ME1, that is), and with the three main Terminus gangs in almost total disarray, it won't be a problem for Aria to take over the whole thing and step forth as yet another asset (she's very much into the Reaper threat if I remember correctly).

ME3 may just consist of you breaking out of prison, adding final nudges to resolving the Terminus conflicts and sticking some evidence up the Council's ass, with the second half of the game being the war itself. So I think it's plausible to say that after Arrival, canonically speaking, Shepard turns himself in/gets arrested on Earth. 

Well Bioware can be the first to say they had a jail tutorial in a scifi game.  Shepard better pray that he doesn't drop the soap or some batarian might come to visit.

Modifié par AlphaJarmel, 29 mars 2011 - 10:13 .

[thetawaves90]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

There probably should have been some sort of vocal dialogue like Shepard admitting this was a really crappy choice but really that's it.  He's running on a deadline by himself(which is unusual) with all of the station ready to kill him.  So as you can imagine he's a little stressed out too.  Again he did try to warn them and wasn't happy about the call but the call needed to be made.  We got more emotion out of this then we did in ME1 with the Battle of the Citadel.  I also fully expect there to be some serious drama in ME3 where Shepard sees the cost of what he did.

I agree wholly with that. The final dialogue options with the conversation between Shephard and Hackett left me feeling a little underwhelmed. Shephard came across pretty indifferent to the whole thing, also for a paragon-player where the choices and conversations have portrayed Shephard as some liberal paradigm of galactic unity, the very human-centric theme to the dialogue seemed a bit off as well.