14 réponses à ce sujet

[thisismynameyo]

So I've been playing thru DA2 while waiting for SWTOR to come out and had been working my way thru the side quests in KW. Just wondering, who's idea was it to reuse maps in reverese for quests instead of creating new ones?

Huge disappointment for me, not sure if I even feel like pushing thru to act 2 anymore, hoping this sort of stuff doesn't find it's way into swtor in the form of "well, all battle crusiers look alike, so we can just reuse it over in reverse in flashpoints!" Really liked a lot of the other trimming you did to the combat and itemization, but man, reverse maps.

I guess what the real question at this point is should I keep playing, are there new areas for side quests, or do you just wind up playing the same content thru reverse for the rest of the game outside the main story line?

Thanks ahead of time for any information.

[Darth Obvious]

Yeah, by the end of the second act you have those three or four maps totally memorized. It's much worse than even ME (and at least in ME, having similar modular structures dropped onto planets did sort of make sense.

But having the same damn caves, over and over and OVER, to the point that it drives you crazy? Ugh, it's horrible.

[Dr. Catt]

I think Bioware underestimated how badly this affects the sense of immersion.

You should keep playing because despite it's failings it's still a decent game. However the reuse of maps doesn't get any better at all.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Look at the bright side. You won't get lost.

I remember one very large cavern in Fallout where it took me a while to find my way back out. You'd think all the Vaults would be the same inside, but no. It is so easy to get turned around sometimes.

"Wait, this looks familiar. S***! I knew I should have taken that left toin at Albequerque."

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 28 mars 2011 - 09:18 .

[back pain]

Bioware did not have the time/money to make unique maps for all of the side quests so they were forced to use repeated maps. If they did make unique maps then they would have to cut out a significant portion of the side quests in the game. I leave it up to you to decide if they made the right call.

[Dr. Catt]

back pain wrote...

Bioware did not have the time/money to make unique maps for all of the side quests so they were forced to use repeated maps. If they did make unique maps then they would have to cut out a significant portion of the side quests in the game. I leave it up to you to decide if they made the right call.

If this really is the case then the game had far too short a development cycle. Especially considering just how few unique maps there actually are.

I would prefer a shorter punchier game with more realistically diverse environments (kind of like ME2) then what we got with DA2. Not that I didn't enjoy it overall but for me the maps thing was a big issue.

I wouldn't have minded if they reused some of the floor plans from DA:O for some added variety. I know it's a different graphical style and so it's not going to be that simple but it'd save some design time at the very least.

[Corwyn]

I don't mind a little bit of reusing the same map especially since the one they did use graphically looked a little nicer then just some randomized dungeon but my big problem was the way the game kind slapped you in the face with the fact that it was a reused map.

What I mean is I'd be walking come to the end but the mini-map would keep going even though I couldn't get there or the fact that there was clearly a door I just couldn't open it. At least in the cave get rid of the door just make it so it looks like the cave ends there.

[Will Shred]

Not sure how much shorter they could've gone and still had an actual game. The game is incredibly short on real story, if you didn't have 75% or more of your time spent on side quests there wouldn't be much left to play.

[Dr. Catt]

Will Shred wrote...

Not sure how much shorter they could've gone and still had an actual game. The game is incredibly short on real story, if you didn't have 75% or more of your time spent on side quests there wouldn't be much left to play.

True, but then this points again to the development cycle being too short vs. the laudable vision that Bioware had for the game.

[supakillaii]

Dr. Catt wrote...

back pain wrote...

Bioware did not have the time/money to make unique maps for all of the side quests so they were forced to use repeated maps. If they did make unique maps then they would have to cut out a significant portion of the side quests in the game. I leave it up to you to decide if they made the right call.

If this really is the case then the game had far too short a development cycle. Especially considering just how few unique maps there actually are.

I would prefer a shorter punchier game with more realistically diverse environments (kind of like ME2) then what we got with DA2. Not that I didn't enjoy it overall but for me the maps thing was a big issue.

I wouldn't have minded if they reused some of the floor plans from DA:O for some added variety. I know it's a different graphical style and so it's not going to be that simple but it'd save some design time at the very least.

Considering EA rushed DAII, it's safe to say they didn't have the time for quite a lot of stuff.

[Tainan7509]

Wounded Coast is famous place for kidnapping, ambush, negotiation and collecting trash place. Trust me. you will love it more and more and thanks to Bioware

[dgcatanisiri]

Dr. Catt wrote...

I think Bioware underestimated how badly this affects the sense of immersion.

You should keep playing because despite it's failings it's still a decent game. However the reuse of maps doesn't get any better at all.

That immersion breaking depends on how you look at it - the whole game is Varric telling Cassandra Hawke's story, she isn't interested in hearing him describe the different caves and warehouses, so in his story-telling, he only bothers to describe them once.

[Korusus]

thisismynameyo wrote...

...hoping this sort of stuff doesn't find it's way into swtor in the form of "well, all battle crusiers look alike, so we can just reuse it over in reverse in flashpoints!" Really liked a lot of the other trimming you did to the combat and itemization, but man, reverse maps.

I would die laughing if they did that in SWTOR.  The MMO crowd is utterly without remorse or pity, and BioWare/EA would be flamed to oblivion if they did that.  Multiply the complaints and whines by a thousand of what you see here on the DA2 board.  I would almost want it to happen just to see the result, except I know that if SWTOR fails then so does BioWare.

Honestly, the average gamer has become more sophisticated in recent years...especially the console crowd.  You're talking about a market base that has been in existence for 5 years now... you aren't going to get away with cutting corners in 2011 that you might have gotten away with in 2006.  It is not a content vs. quality issue.  To frame it that way is insulting. Doing amateur crap like that will be noticed and will be commented on (loudly).  I'm with you, I'm absolutely amazed and stunned that the concept even made it out of the planning stage.

[Darth Obvious]

dgcatanisiri wrote...

Dr. Catt wrote...

I think Bioware underestimated how badly this affects the sense of immersion.

You should keep playing because despite it's failings it's still a decent game. However the reuse of maps doesn't get any better at all.

That immersion breaking depends on how you look at it - the whole game is Varric telling Cassandra Hawke's story, she isn't interested in hearing him describe the different caves and warehouses, so in his story-telling, he only bothers to describe them once.

So, rationalizing pure boredom is somehow supposed to make the player less bored? In that case, why bother having different enemies at all? Oh right, they didn't bother much with that either.

I can just hear Varric now.. "so we fought a wave of enemies, and then we fought another wave of the same enemies, and then we fought another wave of the same damn enemies again... and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and AGAIN....

Then we finally completed the fetch-and-carry quest and went home.

The end.

[Urazz]

Darth Obvious wrote...

Yeah, by the end of the second act you have those three or four maps totally memorized. It's much worse than even ME (and at least in ME, having similar modular structures dropped onto planets did sort of make sense.

But having the same damn caves, over and over and OVER, to the point that it drives you crazy? Ugh, it's horrible.

I dunno, it never did make that much sense in ME1.  DA2 is almost as bad in my opinion but at least they have different entry points on how you enter and some areas blocked off to make the caves somewhat different.  Of course looking at the map completely destroyed that effect.  Personally, they just needed like 2 to 3 more of each type of dungeon, cave, warehouse, etc. and the repeating map problem wouldn't have been nearly as bad.