7 réponses à ce sujet

[Rondoudou]

Hi everyone,

I’m having some trouble with tactics. I guess it comes from either my poor comprehension of both tests and action semantics, but I haven’t been able to find any clear information about them.

At first, I thought I was having trouble with Skip Tactics, but after all this, I’it would seem that it is with Jump To.
To get the idea, I’m willing to use Anders as a healer/buffer.

The basic tactics scheme is:

• Preserve self
• if (group is getting pounded) jump to HEAL GROUP
• Buff group
• Skip tactics
• HEAL GROUP:
• Debuff group to release some mana
• Heal group

Square brackets [ ] are for unchecked tactic slots still worth showing for comparison.

Curly brackets { } are for comments.

First version. Note that the Skip tactics is unchecked.

• 4: Self: any >> Activate: Arcane Shield { Preserve self }
• 6: Self: any >> Jump to: 13 { dummy test for testing purposes, should check group health status }
• { From 7 to 11 is Buff group - currently unchecked as jumped over anyway }
• [12: Self: any >> Skip Tactics] { unchecked }
• 13: Self: any >> Deactivate: Elemental Weapons { Bebuff }
• 15: Self: any >> Activate: Panacea
• 17: Self: any >> Use: Aid group

Expected behaviour: Anders

• activates Arcane Shield
• deactivates Elemental Weapon
• activates Panacea
• casts Aid Group
• uses default behaviour

I didn’t wait for abilities to cool down, but I guess he would casts Aid Group
as soon as he can.

Actual behaviour: same. Yeah!

Second version. This time, the Skip tactics action is checked.

• 4: Self: any >> Activate: Arcane Shield
• 6: Self: any >> Jump to: 13
• 12: Self: any >> Skip Tactics { checked }
• 13: Self: any >> Deactivate: Elemental Weapons
• 15: Self: any >> Activate: Panacea
• 17: Self: any >> Use: Aid group

Expected behaviour: Same as previous.

Actual behaviour: Anders

• activates Arcane Shield
• uses default behaviour forever

So I tried replacing 12 with Use: Mind Blast.

Third version (replaced Skip Tactics with Use: Mind Blast)

• 4: Self: any >> Activate: Arcane Shield
• 6: Self: any >> Jump to: 13
• 12: Self: any >> Use: Mind Blast
• 13: Self: any >> Deactivate: Elemental Weapons
• 15: Self: any >> Activate: Panacea
• 17: Self: any >> Use: Aid group

Expected behaviour: same as in first case.

Actual behaviour:

• activates Arcane Shield
• casts Mind Blast
• deactivates Elemental Weapons
• activates Panacea
• casts Aid Group
• uses default behaviour

If I replace the Jump to: 13 action to Jump to: 14, I get what I would expect if I had kept Jump to: 13.

• 4: Self: any >> Activate: Arcane Shield { Preserve self }
• 6: Self: any >> Jump to: 14 { dummy test for testing purposes, should check group health status }
• { From 7 to 11 is Buff group }
• 12: Self: any >> Skip Tactics
• 13: Self: any >> Deactivate: Elemental Weapons { Bebuff }
• 15: Self: any >> Activate: Panacea
• 17: Self: any >> Use: Aid group { getting pounded means we need healing }

Expected behaviour: Anders

• activates Arcane Shield
• does not deactivate Elemental Weapons
• activates Panacea
• casts Aid Group
• uses default behaviour

Actual behaviour: back to what I want.
Anders

• activates Arcane Shield
• does deactivate Elemental Weapons
• activates Panacea
• casts Aid Group
• uses default behaviour

So I guess that I expect from Jump To: n what I get from Jump To: n+1.

Did I get the Jump To action wrong? Is this behaviour the same with everyone? I’m starting to think this looks like a bug.

Edited to clean the layout a little bit.

Modifié par Rondoudou, 29 mars 2011 - 10:58 .

[shoggoth1890]

Tactics can be screwy, especially with Anders. I've deactivate all tactics for him because he only chose to do actions which ended up harming more than helping.

[Tumedus]

I have seen a post before and I have experienced it as well that Jump to seems to jump to n-1 not n. I have heard of other reports of people not getting what they want out of jump to in other situations.

Basically until they fix it, I would just try to restructure your tactics to not include jump to if possible. Fwiw there is a party health condition under the self tab that reads "at least 2,3, or 4 party members are below 50% health" and I have never needed more than that.

Modifié par Tumedus, 29 mars 2011 - 08:39 .

[Rondoudou]

Problem is I can’t think of another way to implement a negative test (e.g. if NOT Ally: Dead NOR at least 2 party members below 50% health). I guess I’ll just try and use Jump to: n+1 for a while and pray it so-so works until next update.

[Lumikki]

Not sure what OP is asking?

Basicly I do this kind of base design.

1. Heal your self if needed
2. Heal others if needed
3. Protect you self if needed
4. Protect others if needed
5. Buff team or you self
6. Control elites and higher if they are there
7. AoE attack enemies if clustered
8. Single attack agaist elites or higher if they are there
9. Fix you mana/stamina if needed
10. Single attacks to any enemies

Healing:

Self: Health < 25% : Drink healing potion
Self: Health < 25% : Cast heal (This is after potion, because saving it for ally)
Ally: Health < 25% : Cast heal

Protection:

Self : Under melee attack: Protective action (Stonefist, Petrify, Horrow, Mind Blast, Crushing Prison, Pinning Shot, Evade, Shealth, Activate protection)
Ally "Name" : Under melee attack: Protective action

Buffing:

Enemy: Any: Haste, taunt or some other temp buff
Self: Health < 50% : Activate more protection

Controlling and attacking Higher enemies:

Enemy: Rank elite or higher: some control action (Petrify, Crussing prison)
Enemy: Rank elite or higher: Some good single damage attacks

Fixing mana or stamina:

Self: Mana/stamina < 25% : use skill if have any
Self: Mana/stamina < 10% : use mana/stamina potion

AoE attacks:

Enemy: Clustered at least 5 enemies: Use major AoE size attack
Self: Surrounded by at least 4 enemies: Use scatter (or any AoE attacks)
Enemy: Clustered at least 3 enemies: Use minor AoE attacks

Single attacks (last normal ones):

Enemy: Range short: Single attack (Pre protection, before melee for ranger)
Enemy: Any: Single attack

Modifié par Lumikki, 29 mars 2011 - 09:33 .

[Rondoudou]

Well, the tactics I wrote did not behave as I expected. So I wanted to ask the community what I was doing wrong. It seems it's related to the Jump To action, which might be broken in my particular case. As the Jump To: action is, as far as I can see, hardly avoidable with the tactic I want to implement, I’ll have to hack around it temporarily.

I just tested it, and as far as it goes, first fight went fine.

[Apathy1989]

I never used jump to in DAO, same in DA2. I don't expect it works well and I've had screwy results with tactics.

These are orders I had on tactics for nightmare:

1) Self: Surrounded by 2 enemies = Use Forcefield
2) (unchecked usually) Enemy: Staggered = Use Crushing Prison
3) Self: Health < 50% = Heal
4) Ally: Health < 25% = Heal
5) Ally: Dead = Regroup
6) Self: 2 or more party members below 50% = Aid Group
7) Self: Mana > 50% = Haste
8) Self: Any = Activate Rock Armour
9) Self: Any = Activate Heroic Aura

If you leave him alone he will use skills outside of Panacea. Its a bug but its useful.

Modifié par Apathy1989, 29 mars 2011 - 11:20 .

[viverravid]

Jump to tactic, use item, use condition for next tactic, all of these get messed up from time to time (might have something to do with scrolling). Their targets get blanked or changed, and the tactic order changes somehow. You need to keep checking they are OK.

Assume OP has done that, can't help further, never use skip to tactic