451 réponses à ce sujet

[Deathwurm]

Haven't played Arrival yet (probably won't until ME3 is closer to being released) but I have to ask the OP: Why does Bioware NEED an excuse for not including the VS?
A lot of people posted about the VS being in this last DLC, but I don't remember anyone from Bioware saying that they would be in it.
What's Bioware's excuse for not having Wrex and Garrus in "Arrival" as your Squad? I liked them...why can't I expect to see them, then?

[Iakus]

Lee337 wrote...

Until ME3 is out, you can't judge which characters have been ignored or favoured. You can't judge equality on a game thats only 2/3 through.
The VS gets a photo on the desk the who way through still, and the scene just before the SM if you stay faithful.Kasumi doesn't comment on the VS, but why would she, theres not a lot of reason to.
I think the short changing stuff is being blown way out of proportion because hopes and emotions are getting to high. Bioware said ME3, so I will wait.

For ME 3, this is true.  Perhaps even for the trilogy as a whole.  But for ME 2, the game we have right now, the situation before our Sheps right now, the game which we have received that last piece of dlc, the VS was treated like dirt, then forgotten about.  For ME 2, the VS was ignored.  For ME 2, other characters were favored.  Anything that might happen in ME 3 is empty speculation, since all we have are vague words that "something" is planned for them.  ME 2 does not leave me optimistic that this "something" is anything good.

[Iakus]

PrinceLionheart wrote...

Hell, I think a lot of this could've been avoided if Ashley/Kaidan had a dossier file in LoTSB. Instead, the only time they're referenced was when Liara said it sucks how they treated Shep. I'm past the raving stage, but I don't think VS fans have an "entitlement complex" by expecting a little more than what they got. 

Wouldn't have hurt, that's for sure.

Would have really helped if the VS more closely resembled:

Meeting Tali on Freedom's progress Initially suspicious, but in the end relieved Shep's still alive.  Regretfully, can't join up right now due to other duties

Wrex:  Just plain happy to see Shep.  Promoted, new responsibilities.  In charge of others now.  Can't join though.

Anderson: Glad Shep's alive, but must by necessity keep him/her at arms length when it comes to Alliance activities.  But always willing to talk

Parassini:  Kick back, have a beer, chat about old times and what they're doing now.

Something like one of these would have reduced the feeling that a dlc was even needed.

The cameo we did get...honestly, Conrad Verner had a better cameo!  And his is bugged!

Why, Bioware, why?  Just answer me that!

Modifié par iakus, 31 mars 2011 - 01:15 .

[Il Divo]

iakus wrote...

For ME 3, this is true.  Perhaps even for the trilogy as a whole.  But for ME 2, the game we have right now, the situation before our Sheps right now, the game which we have received that last piece of dlc, the VS was treated like dirt, then forgotten about.  For ME 2, the VS was ignored.  For ME 2, other characters were favored.  Anything that might happen in ME 3 is empty speculation, since all we have are vague words that "something" is planned for them.  ME 2 does not leave me optimistic that this "something" is anything good.

Perhaps, but I think Liara's dlc is a good indication that Bioware has not completely forgotten about the Mass Effect 1 romances. I actually prefer it this way because the way the story seems to be building up, Bioware won't be able to make Liara/VS interchangeable in terms of their roles. I feel like it would be appropriate for ME3 to feature the VS in a bigger role, coming full circle in a sense. I really don't think Bioware is just going to give up that opportunity.

Modifié par Il Divo, 31 mars 2011 - 01:23 .

[Iakus]

Il Divo wrote...

Perhaps, but I think Liara's dlc is a good indication that Bioware has not completely forgotten about the Mass Effect 1 romances. I actually prefer it this way because the way the story seems to be building up, Bioware won't be able to make Liara/VS interchangeable in terms of their roles. I feel like it would be appropriate for ME3 to feature the VS in a bigger role, coming full circle in a sense. I really don't think Bioware is just going to give up that opportunity.

Perhaps, but at least with LOTSB we know what Liara's role is going to be.  WIth the VS, let's see we have:

Horizon:  "traitor!  You betrayed everything we stood for!" (with a cheesy email apology if you were the LI

Mass Effect:  Genesis "Ashley was a soldier to the core",  "Kaiden(sic) "was a good kid" Liara "As beautiful as she is intelligent"

LOTSB  Ashley/Kaidan was "shortsighted"

Maybe they're lulling us into a sense of apathetic pessimism?   'Cause at the moment, I'm getting the feeling the VS is going the way of Feros ie "Let's just pretend that never happened"

[Almostfaceman]

iakus wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Perhaps, but I think Liara's dlc is a good indication that Bioware has not completely forgotten about the Mass Effect 1 romances. I actually prefer it this way because the way the story seems to be building up, Bioware won't be able to make Liara/VS interchangeable in terms of their roles. I feel like it would be appropriate for ME3 to feature the VS in a bigger role, coming full circle in a sense. I really don't think Bioware is just going to give up that opportunity.

Perhaps, but at least with LOTSB we know what Liara's role is going to be.  WIth the VS, let's see we have:

Horizon:  "traitor!  You betrayed everything we stood for!" (with a cheesy email apology if you were the LI

Mass Effect:  Genesis "Ashley was a soldier to the core",  "Kaiden(sic) "was a good kid" Liara "As beautiful as she is intelligent"

LOTSB  Ashley/Kaidan was "shortsighted"

Maybe they're lulling us into a sense of apathetic pessimism?   'Cause at the moment, I'm getting the feeling the VS is going the way of Feros ie "Let's just pretend that never happened"

If that's the case then Bioware better quit sayin' they saved the VS for something meaningful in ME3.  Seems counter-productive if one wants the VS to slowly fade from memory.

[jeweledleah]

before some of the sentiment in this thread gets me to resemble my avatar again and feed the bitterness I've been trying to fight (not to mention sour other characters that I actualy do like very much, solely on a basis of smugness and hatefulness of their fans, towards Ash/Kaidan), I'll just say that I agree with everything Iakus has been saying in a last 3 posts.

what we're asking for is neither incredibly pricey nor a special treatment. just in line with all the other characters.

I doubt I'll be boycotting ME3 all together, but I'm heavily leaning towards the same decision I made about DA2 - wait until an ultimate edition goes on sale and buy it then.

[Il Divo]

iakus wrote...

Perhaps, but at least with LOTSB we know what Liara's role is going to be.  WIth the VS, let's see we have:

Horizon:  "traitor!  You betrayed everything we stood for!" (with a cheesy email apology if you were the LI

Mass Effect:  Genesis "Ashley was a soldier to the core",  "Kaiden(sic) "was a good kid" Liara "As beautiful as she is intelligent"

LOTSB  Ashley/Kaidan was "shortsighted"

Maybe they're lulling us into a sense of apathetic pessimism?   'Cause at the moment, I'm getting the feeling the VS is going the way of Feros ie "Let's just pretend that never happened"

As far as the VS goes, we do know they have something to do with the Alliance and we also know that Shepard is going back to face trial. I think it's very likely that the two are going to reconvene during this segment. Regardless of how Horizon may have gone off, the effect I think Bioware wants to go for is that by removing the VS for ME2, it builds up much more anticipation for their reappearance in Mass Effect 3. I find it very doubtful that they'll be side-lined again, not after the Horizon react and given the romanceable nature of the VS.

Modifié par Il Divo, 31 mars 2011 - 01:42 .

[DPSSOC]

Almostfaceman wrote...
If that's the case then Bioware better quit sayin' they saved the VS for something meaningful in ME3.  Seems counter-productive if one wants the VS to slowly fade from memory.

Have they ever promised something meaningful in ME3?  They've promised the VS is going to be there buthave they said what?  Could just be to die in the first 2 minutes (sorry the pessimism is strong today).  As for why they'd keep saying that; if they were to say, "Yeah we're cutting the VS they suck." that'd ****** a lot of people off.  If they say, "Yeah they'll be in ME3."  Then people will just be disappointed if it's just some lack luster cameo.  Pissed off people won't buy the product (usually) and might stop supporting the company.  Disappointed people have to buy the product 1st and might still support the company.

[Lee337]

ADLegend21 wrote...

Lee337 wrote...

Until ME3 is out, you can't judge which characters have been ignored or favoured. You can't judge equality on a game thats only 2/3 through.
The VS gets a photo on the desk the who way through still, and the scene just before the SM if you stay faithful.Kasumi doesn't comment on the VS, but why would she, theres not a lot of reason to.
I think the short changing stuff is being blown way out of proportion because hopes and emotions are getting to high. Bioware said ME3, so I will wait.

"I heard about Horizon. It must hav been hard to have a fight like that with someone you love, He'll/She'll come around with some time."
Is that so hard to put in the game?

No it wasn't, Kelly says basically the same thing. Does she say anything about Liara after you meet her?

[Lee337]

Then Liara was worse off in that respect than the VS. You ca even reply to Kelly on the subject, unlike Kasumi.

[Estelindis]

In that respect, yes. And you can be sure Liara fans didn't like that at the time. In the months to come, though, they were vindicated with LotSB. We can hope the same will be true of Ashley and Kaidan's fans when ME3 is released.

[Lee337]

Yeah forgot about TIM and Joker. Seems VS got better treatment than people are making out.

[Quaay]

DPSSOC wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...
If that's the case then Bioware better quit sayin' they saved the VS for something meaningful in ME3.  Seems counter-productive if one wants the VS to slowly fade from memory.

Have they ever promised something meaningful in ME3?  They've promised the VS is going to be there buthave they said what?  Could just be to die in the first 2 minutes (sorry the pessimism is strong today).  As for why they'd keep saying that; if they were to say, "Yeah we're cutting the VS they suck." that'd ****** a lot of people off.  If they say, "Yeah they'll be in ME3."  Then people will just be disappointed if it's just some lack luster cameo.  Pissed off people won't buy the product (usually) and might stop supporting the company.  Disappointed people have to buy the product 1st and might still support the company.

Yes, Casey Hudson promised they'd be meaningful in ME3. "CaseyH-ME2: While Mass Effect fans have grown to love our
characters, you can imagine that after spending years crafting them, we have at
least as much of an attachment to them. So it's definitely not a case of the
team disregarding player's decisions with them or interest in those characters -
in fact, it's the opposite...

CaseyH-ME2:
We actually want to make sure these characters survive the ME2 story, which
ultimately is a suicide mission: some of your crew will almost certainly die.
Some of the ME1 characters are back, and recruitable (more than you might
think), and the ones that aren't still play an important role in the story and
will be around for ME3 - which we can't say for the new characters.

CaseyH-ME2:
Another important thing to consider is that much of the fun of ME1 was the
discovery of new people and places. If we made ME2 out of the same characters,
you'd miss out of the fun of that discovery.

CaseyH-ME2:
Finally, if you are worried about the role of the ME1 love interest in the
trilogy, consider that the romance itself is told across the trilogy, in 3 acts.
Apply the 3-act concept to what's happening in your relationship with them, and
you might guess where we're going with it."

From the ME2 Live Chat here forums.bestbuy.com/t5/Gaming-Gadgets-eReaders/Mass-Effect-2-Live-Chat-Transcript/td-p/89183

[Lee337]

Estelindis wrote...

In that respect, yes. And you can be sure Liara fans didn't like that at the time. In the months to come, though, they were vindicated with LotSB. We can hope the same will be true of Ashley and Kaidan's fans when ME3 is released.

I hope so too, and if they aren't then I will be upset as well, but until then the arguement that they are treated worse seems pretty baseless to me, just arguements based on impatince and fear.

[Estelindis]

Lee337 wrote...

I hope so too, and if they aren't then I will be upset as well, but until then the arguement that they are treated worse seems pretty baseless to me, just arguements based on impatince and fear.

Well, it's not baseless to say that they've been treated worse so far (which is really all any of us can say in the absence of powers to foretell the future, no matter how well-grounded our hopes for ME3 might be).  Ash and Kai did get small references, but I found some of those so unsatisfactory that I reloaded and didn't talk to the character in question at that time.  Joker was the worst on this front, honestly, as pretty much all dialogue responses make it sound like you feel the relationship is over.  (The lowest-right one - "Another reminder that I've lost more than time; I don't need this," in a disgusted and angry voice - is what I've finally settled on in playthroughs when I don't avoid this conversation, even though I don't like being harsh to Joker - I roleplay it as Shepard's frustration getting the better of her.)  In fact, I think that the worst thing for VS fans is the generally unsatisfactory nature of nearly all dialogue options when it comes to Ashley and Kaidan in ME2 - particularly in the Horizon encounter, which many of us think makes Shepard sound like a complete tool - making us feel like we have no choice but to screw up the relationship.  Oh well.  As previously stated, what's done is done, and matters may be salvaged and repaired most gloriously in time.

Modifié par Estelindis, 31 mars 2011 - 02:50 .

[James2912]

I really think the OP should change the stupid way he phrased the topic he is not helping the VS cause. He is just pissing people off. I support VS but the topic name is pretty outrageous and its attracting trolls by the dozen and some really mean people like Tazmission. I mean whats up with the irrational hatred? Its actually pretty scary somebody could get so passionate in wanting to deny someone else their passion. Especially when its just a video game. We are not talking about going to war just a freakin video game and what people want to see in that video game. Its not a big deal! Children are going hungry at night across the world and this is what you choose to have a meltdown over? I mean wow! 

Modifié par James2912, 31 mars 2011 - 03:04 .

[eye basher]

Why wasn't the vs on arrival?Because bioware likes to torture the fanatics by not giving them what they want.

[Dave666]

Just throwing this one out there. I liked the VS have saves with both and while the VS not being in Arrival wasn't a deal breaker it was a missed opportunity (IMO) and in a way I can understand peoples concerns. With ME:2 they rewrote Liara's character, it makes sense from a story perspective, but it was still changed. Had they included the VS we would have some indication of which direction the writers were taking them and people could voice concerns or praise. As it currently stands we have no idea and complaining after ME:3 is already out is pointless.

[Tazzmission]

James2912 wrote...

I really think the OP should change the stupid way he phrased the topic he is not helping the VS cause. He is just pissing people off. I support VS but the topic name is pretty outrageous and its attracting trolls by the dozen and some really mean people like Tazmission. I mean whats up with the irrational hatred? Its actually pretty scary somebody could get so passionate in wanting to deny someone else their passion. Especially when its just a video game. 

woa! woa!woa!woa! woa! denying someones passion? you make it sound like if the charachters are a real person.... if you can honestly sit on these boards and deny the fact that alot ( not all) vs fans do indeed wine **** and moan than you are blind or you really dont look around the boards offten. i also wanna point out im not just targeting vs fans either, im also putting a target on the people who literally believe that bioware forced something down there throats when in fact they had the option to not buy the content. if you really wanna see disgusting comments go look at the mac walters chat thread and tell me if  what i say is worse than that. i have seen posters literally call the devs hacks and ive seen threads titled bioware caters to shooter fans, so before you call me a troll you might wanna look into why i say the **** i do... ive been on these boards for over a year and honestly i have never scene people act the way they do on any other forum like they do here.

Modifié par Tazzmission, 31 mars 2011 - 03:16 .

[James2912]

Tazzmission wrote...

James2912 wrote...

I really think the OP should change the stupid way he phrased the topic he is not helping the VS cause. He is just pissing people off. I support VS but the topic name is pretty outrageous and its attracting trolls by the dozen and some really mean people like Tazmission. I mean whats up with the irrational hatred? Its actually pretty scary somebody could get so passionate in wanting to deny someone else their passion. Especially when its just a video game. 

woa! woa!woa!woa! woa! denying someones passion? you make it sound like if the charachters are a real person.... if you can honestly sit on these boards and deny the fact that alot ( not all) vs fans do indeed wine **** and moan than you are blind or you really dont look around the boards offten. i also wanna point out im not just targeting vs fans either, im also putting a target on the people who literally believe that bioware forced something down there throats when in fact they had the option to not buy the content. if you really wanna see disgusting comments go look at the mac walters chat thread and tell me if if what i say is worse than that. i have seen posters literally call the devs hacks and ive seen threads titled bioware caters to shooter fans, so before you call me a troll you might wanna look into why i say the **** i do..

The point is I don't want to see ANY NASTY comments! What are you three years old? Two wrongs do not make a right! Be the adult even if nobody else wants to be! 

[Tazzmission]

James2912 wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...

James2912 wrote...

I really think the OP should change the stupid way he phrased the topic he is not helping the VS cause. He is just pissing people off. I support VS but the topic name is pretty outrageous and its attracting trolls by the dozen and some really mean people like Tazmission. I mean whats up with the irrational hatred? Its actually pretty scary somebody could get so passionate in wanting to deny someone else their passion. Especially when its just a video game. 

woa! woa!woa!woa! woa! denying someones passion? you make it sound like if the charachters are a real person.... if you can honestly sit on these boards and deny the fact that alot ( not all) vs fans do indeed wine **** and moan than you are blind or you really dont look around the boards offten. i also wanna point out im not just targeting vs fans either, im also putting a target on the people who literally believe that bioware forced something down there throats when in fact they had the option to not buy the content. if you really wanna see disgusting comments go look at the mac walters chat thread and tell me if if what i say is worse than that. i have seen posters literally call the devs hacks and ive seen threads titled bioware caters to shooter fans, so before you call me a troll you might wanna look into why i say the **** i do..

The point is I don't want to see ANY NASTY comments! What are you three years old? Two wrongs do not make a right! Be the adult even if nobody else wants to be! 

first off you dont run anything here and  either do i. but where is the same lecture to the other people who have said far worse? if im gona give my thought's im gona give them, if you dont like it kiss off

[James2912]

Tazzmission wrote...

James2912 wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...

James2912 wrote...

I really think the OP should change the stupid way he phrased the topic he is not helping the VS cause. He is just pissing people off. I support VS but the topic name is pretty outrageous and its attracting trolls by the dozen and some really mean people like Tazmission. I mean whats up with the irrational hatred? Its actually pretty scary somebody could get so passionate in wanting to deny someone else their passion. Especially when its just a video game. 

woa! woa!woa!woa! woa! denying someones passion? you make it sound like if the charachters are a real person.... if you can honestly sit on these boards and deny the fact that alot ( not all) vs fans do indeed wine **** and moan than you are blind or you really dont look around the boards offten. i also wanna point out im not just targeting vs fans either, im also putting a target on the people who literally believe that bioware forced something down there throats when in fact they had the option to not buy the content. if you really wanna see disgusting comments go look at the mac walters chat thread and tell me if if what i say is worse than that. i have seen posters literally call the devs hacks and ive seen threads titled bioware caters to shooter fans, so before you call me a troll you might wanna look into why i say the **** i do..

The point is I don't want to see ANY NASTY comments! What are you three years old? Two wrongs do not make a right! Be the adult even if nobody else wants to be! 

first off you dont run anything here and  either do i. but where is the same lecture to the other people who have said far worse? if im gona give my thought's im gona give them, if you dont like it kiss off

Hey I did I called the OP's claim stupid. I said he should change the topic.  And guess what the VS survivor supporters are "gonna give (their) thought's so (their) gonna give them, if you don't like it kiss off"