10 réponses à ce sujet

[HenchxNarf]

Justice all but says, "If you hate it so much...do something about it.".

So that could be the beginning of it.. Just sayin'. I figured I would point this out to any who don't remember the party banter in Awakenings.

:]

I dunno. I'm so torn on the Anders thing lol my boyfriend and I have been having discussions on it all morning as we've been reading the forums.

EDIT: Since this may be misconstrued, I figured I would clarify that I believe that this may be what got the ball rolling in Anders' want to do something so epically....epic. I dunno. But, I'm not being negative or anything.

Modifié par HenchxNarf, 29 mars 2011 - 07:59 .

[Thiefy]

i dont think anyone question the motives, so much as do the ends justify the means? and even then there are plenty of people convince of either yes or no to the point that they MUST convince others of their viewpoints.

[HenchxNarf]

I don't think that's what I meant. I more meant that some people don't understand why Anders would do something like that. That banter kind of, to me, seems to get the ball rolling.

Modifié par HenchxNarf, 29 mars 2011 - 07:58 .

[MoMan313]

Oh, I listened to the old banters from anders and justice from awakening...
then I heard him say something about those old banters.. and I was like... so that makes sense..

Justice pushed him to it... -_____-
But I don't feel a bitter as he did as the first time he blew up the tower.... I understand where all of this came from.... just... I didn't think justice would take it that far..

[Vhalkyrie]

Anders does mention this very thing in one conversation with Hawke. He says Justice once asked him if he thought mages were so mistreated, why he didn't do anything. Anders explains to Hawke he was just too selfish, and brushed him off. But he never stopped thinking about what Justice said. So when Kristoff's body became too decayed to be useable anymore, Anders agreed to let Justice merge with him and together, they would do something.

It seemed all explained and plausible to me. I sometimes wonder if people just skip through the dialog in order to get to the sexah time or something.

[Thiefy]

HenchxNarf wrote...

I don't think that's what I meant. I more meant that some people don't understand why Anders would do something like that. That banter kind of, to me, seems to get the ball rolling.

nah i knew what you meant, but what i was trying to say is that everyone knows *for the most aprt) why anders did it (to free the mages/to force both sides to do something more drastic and eliminate 'the middle ground') but the main discussion comes form whether is was justified or not.

[Vhalkyrie]

Justice would not take it that far. When he merged with Anders, he became Vengeance. Justice is gone. The moral of the story, from my interpretation, is mages merging with entities from the fade is just generally going to end badly.  Even with noble intentions.

Justice once explained that spirits of the fade don't care about or seek living things beyond the fade. Demons do. In Awakenings, Justice was asked what would happen if he joined with a living host, if they would become an abomination. He was appalled, saying he would never do that. But he admitted he didn't know what would happen, because it had never been done.

Now we know.

Modifié par Vhalkyrie, 29 mars 2011 - 08:21 .

[MG800]

I must say, that was cleverly thought - let gamers know Anders and Justice, and then merge them together in order to get one of the most intresting and tragic persona. I don't know if it was planned from the beginning, and I doubt it, but effect is stunning. 

Modifié par MG800, 29 mars 2011 - 08:27 .

[Kotetsimaru]

Copy pasted from my other posts on Anders

Lot of talk going into Anders thinking and planning what is going to happen but i still believe what he did is just the Vengeance/Justice part of him finally doing something out in the open. I mean when he blows the chantry up he is fighting control with him. 

Myself I can technically see the blowing up the Chantry as the Justice/Vengeance option.  I mean they just sat there letting the templars get away with the atrocities they were committing praying that their god would make it all better.  You can't just ignore something and hope it goes away, in Anders/Justice/Vengeance eyes it probably looked like they were actually one of the main causes for the injustices against the mages because they'd let them happen and didn't do a thing about them causing things to escalate to where they were. 
By blowing up the Chantry it showed the world that this could no longer be allowed to happen, it will have got the attention of everyone to look and see what happens when you abuse people and think it's ok to let it happen.
With the Grand Cleric removed it also meant there was nobody there to keep allowing those things to happen while just brushing it under the carpet and saying it's not happening.

Of course by the end of the game I also feel Anders is Merediths polar opposite, while she sees blood mages hiding behind every corner Anders sees injustice against mages.  He even starts accusing members of your party in party banter.

[HenchxNarf]

I genuinely love Anders and his storyline (I even like his VA better in DA2), and I love what they did with the whole Justice thing. But even I went "WTF Anders?!" at the end, because while I agreed with him, I couldn't see how that was going to help anyone.

And with someone posting that he could be sided with the Templars, it got me thinking. I might try it, even though I think it's a hack someone was able to pull out of the PC version (I have the PS3) it will give me another excuse to play through again lol

[Beerfish]

Justice believed in action but not down right acts of vengeance. Once he jumped into Anders, Anders uncontrolled rage changed justice into vengeance and the rest is history.

Also that blurry line in the sand is conveniently moved around when discussing justice and vengeance.
In the end Anders was very frustrated and felt he had to do something. I think he convinced himself that any big change was better than the status quo. Too bad he probably doomed many innocent mages by his selfish and idiotic action.