333 réponses à ce sujet

[skcih-deraj]

There wouldn't have been time to save the Batarians. By the time you send the message you only have a few hours at best before the Reapers show up. Can the Batarians really save 300,000 people in that short time?

That being said even if you did warn them would they even believe you? The Batarians aren't known for their trusting nature and depending on your Shepard's background their opinion of you is already very low. So is even warning them worth it? Either way it would still mean those Batarian's die.

[Pauravi]

Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...

Saving the DA should have left the alliance with not enough fire power to take down Sovereign IMO.

Well that just tilts it the other way -- having Renegades reap all the benefits is no better than having Paragons reap all the benefits.

I would say that it would make sense to have the Alliance take heavier losses if you save the DA, but it isn't like the Renegade argument is perfectly cut and dried.  It is absolutely plausible that saving the DA would actually be more tactically sound, considering the amount of firepower that it could bring against Sovereign.  Indeed, when I was making the decision I was only thinking partly of the council, and partly of the usefulness of the biggest dreadnaught in the galaxy in a fight.

[DarkBahamut]

There shouldn't ALWAYS be a choice. Sometimes you just lack enough time or resources to do the "good thing that saves everyone", and must choose between doing SOMETHING, even with bad consequences, or doing nothing at all(LOL, it's cool that it IS an option in this DLC).

I was already happy enough to be able to come out from the suicide mission a hero.

But I agree, there should have been worse consequences for saving the council in the first ME. Something like "yeah, we defeated Sovereign, but earth's fleet took such a huge blow we are in a terrible situation now." and then, instead of all aliens being pissed at humanity(like it happens in ME2 if you screw the council) it would be humanity who would be pissed at YOU.

[Pauravi]

archurban wrote...

now, batarians lost home world, and near by entire system. I guess that we can only see very few batarians in ME 3.

??
That wasn't their home world.  It was a colony of 300,000.
Obviously that is nowhere near the total number of Batarians in the galaxy.

[James2912]

Tooneyman wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

God forbid Bioware's favored blessed paladin children aren't coddled and catered to at every step of the game.

This

And yet, there was so much whining when you couldn't be renegade enough in LotSB...

Double-standard?  What double-standard?

As for me, honestly, who in their right mind would sick the Reapers on the whole galaxy to save a handful of Batarian outposts?  Yeah, it sucks that they died, and I wish there had been another way, but come on, really?

I will have to agree with you on this matter. The way the story had been setup tells me. Bioware got lazy and didn't want to give you even a paragon options. I mean they should have at least let you save something. Why are you commander shepard if you can't save something. Heck I could have at least been able to save one Alliance solider from the destruction and maybe use them as a witness in the trial for my fate in ME3. I've got two paragon shepards and this DLC only made me go. Ok, so what was the point of even putting the Batarian Colonies in the star system if I couldn't at least warn them. 

Thats because even paragons have to be renegades to get stuff done!

[Sylvianus]

Thank you bioware have to break the myth of the hero who never fails his mission. which saves everyone every time, to avoid making a chuck norris, to show that even with a paragon character, sometimes there are difficult decisions in a completely impossible situation.

An extreme situation that requires extreme decisions as in any war of survival. Shepard can not prevent the colony, he becomes in an unfortunate incident the the enemy of Batarians. Epic. I can't wait to see what it will give.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 29 mars 2011 - 11:56 .

[88mphSlayer]

Tooneyman wrote...

 Ok, I'm a played the Paragon ending and I was hoping for some type of out come. Instead of shooting the doctor she still ends up killing herself. I wanted to save the batarian colony, but instead it still got blown up. Ok so bioware please make this clear to me. The only thing I saw throughout that DLC was Renegade. There was not one Paragon decision except for the last bit of dialogue, but at that point I was like. Ok, how does this matter. 

what... were you going to let the reapers invade?

[88mphSlayer]

thurmanator692 wrote...

It's the thought that counts lol. For some reason, i thought shooting the doc would be a good idea. I didn't consider it being a dead-mans switch. It was kinda strange that the three dialouge choices for harbinger are
"we probably can't win, but were gonna try"
"blowing up this relay is proof we can kill you"
"I be blowin up systems! Problem?"

it's reminiscent of your conversation with sovereign when you get 3 responses that are all basically all just a matter of how you say it

[008Zulu]

Its no small amount of amusment that the Reapers are entering the galaxy smack dab in the middle of Batarian space, kinda fits my theory that the Batarians will be (albeit unwilling maybe, I did say they could team with) the Reapers. Given that the rest of the galaxy doesnt much like Batarians, it is likely the message that the Reapers are invading will be ignored.

Maybe ME3 will give the Paragon option to try and save the species, or whatever will be left of them.

[DarkBahamut]

I still think that my ultra max paragon sheppard should be able to indocrinate the reapers to be nice and share the galaxy with the intelligent organics, all over a nice cup of tea!

[Kingthlayer]

Pwener2313 wrote...

Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...

So yeah I'm glad that there was no option to save the 300k Batarians and still get off the asteroid alive.

Wait, you die if you call the colony? Damn.... BW is serious on this "dark saga" thing.

No that option doesn't exist.  What I was saying was if there was some Super Paragon option to save the Batarians, it should have been at a real cost.  Unlike the majority of other Paragon options where they save the day with no problems.

[Sylvianus]

BW is serious on this "dark saga" thing.

If  that the case, I would become the biggest fan of Bioware. With my darling Ashley, I'll front against misfortune, against misery, against the dangers, we'll face together and we will survive.

Reapers must be equal to what was said about them. There must be dead, loss, tragedy, to close this wonderful trilogy.

M2 was not quite epic, M3 looks promising in this field.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 30 mars 2011 - 12:21 .

[Kingthlayer]

Pauravi wrote...

Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...

Saving the DA should have left the alliance with not enough fire power to take down Sovereign IMO.

Well that just tilts it the other way -- having Renegades reap all the benefits is no better than having Paragons reap all the benefits.

I would say that it would make sense to have the Alliance take heavier losses if you save the DA, but it isn't like the Renegade argument is perfectly cut and dried.  It is absolutely plausible that saving the DA would actually be more tactically sound, considering the amount of firepower that it could bring against Sovereign.  Indeed, when I was making the decision I was only thinking partly of the council, and partly of the usefulness of the biggest dreadnaught in the galaxy in a fight.

I disagree with saving the DA as being a "tactically sound" decision, considering it's completely overwhelmed by Geth ships.  It would be useless in a fight against the Reaper.  Plus the Asari should have used their ships to protect the DA, that is unless they put all their eggs in one basket and decided that having one super ship is better than an army of smaller ships.  Hopefully letting the DA burned smartened up the Asari.

But as to my major issue with the decision, the Paragons get to keep the Council as useless as they are, but at the cost of nothing except some faceless alliance soldiers.  The decision would be much more impactful if somebody important died.  Say Joker or Hackett.

And the Renegades just get **** on by the rest of the citadel races for destroying the threat and not saving 3 people.

I hope ME3 puts some faces to our decisions when it comes to saving someone or something.

[VolusNamedBob]

It was a no win scenario, something deliberate. Not everything is going to be sunshine and butterflies for Shepard in ME3.

[wargur]

Removed double post
derp:blink:

Modifié par wargur, 30 mars 2011 - 12:44 .

[wargur]

"2 million dead on the first day, another 7 million dead by the end of the first week"

300.000 is nothing compered to what is coming. Basically it was a bad situation, and in my jaded Warhammer 40k fan way, I'm going to say that it was a fairly major victory.
Shepard:

• Delayed the invasion by few months or years
• Blew up a star system
• Took out a relay that was not only cabable of sending the reapers all the way to the Citadel, but was also capable of sending 16, yes, 16 ships at the same time.
• Blew up a star system
• Took out the FIRST relay, which is a big F**K YOU REAPERS AND KISS MY A**
• Oh, and did i menshon : BLEW UP A FRAKING STAR SYSTEM

So all in all, what Sheppard did was a good thing

[scoville.unit]

Tooneyman wrote...

However that is where the DLC failed. Yes you failed, but like I quoted earlier. You still destroyed an entire system. That would have been good enough to make an enemy of the batarians. I mean you weren't really on friendly terms anyway, but still it would have given you something to save at least. Plus you couldn't even save the doctor. She also saw the visions. You would have had her put in Jail if bioware had let you save her and you could have had a chance to use her being a live in the report. Basically what I got in this DLC is you didn't have a choice at all.  This entire DLC was black their was really no white. Bioware talked about making games with Gary type of visions. I didn't see it in this DLC like Overlord. I think thats why Overlord was awesome. You pretty much had the same out come, but I had a paragon option to go with my renegade. Bioware needed to come up with better writing for Arrival. I honestly think that fact your couldn't even save the doctor was sloppy writing and showing that bioware just pushed this DLC out the door. 

Just because you don't care for the outcome doesn't make it "sloppy writing." Nor does it make it lazy - it very well could have been a deliberate choice. That would be my guess. You have 2 hours to stop the invasion from starting right then and there. You can't save the doctor, you can't save the Batarians because you have to save the galaxy, for at least, a little while. 

Changing the lore involving people coming back from indoctronation doing anything other than dying or saying that 300K people would be able to get clear of a solar system in 2 hours because they received a phone call from someone they never met, but hated anyways strictly so that you would feel like you had a meta-game "paragon" ending would have been the lazy way out, and an example of sloppy writing.

You can have your Shepard try to do the right thing - and that is really all you can do. You have a choice. So your choice doesn't get you the result you wanted or expected - that doesn't negate the fact that you  made a choice. My Shepard, mostly Paragon shot the doc, said F the Batarians and then read some Sartre on the way back to the local cluster. Good times.

Modifié par scoville.unit, 30 mars 2011 - 12:50 .

[Pwener2313]

People who say that the ending is "sloppy, lazy and bad" need to get something staright. Just because you don't like it does not make it bad writing. I loved it and for me it was great writing. What makes your statement more valid then mine? Nothing.

[PlumPaul93]

well I'm a paragon and I don't have any real problem with it, as long as it is not a sign of things to come regarding choices (looking at you DA2).

[PrinceLionheart]

Meh, personally I did not mind. Hence why playing 100% Paragon (a naive idealist) and 100% Renegade (A sociopath) are equally stupid. Paragade FTW.

If I weren't convinced Bioware would ignore Shepard's background again, I'd recreate a Ruthless!Shepard so the "Butcher of Torfan" would be brought up if Shep goes to trial.