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[KevShep]

This is my theory on the reapers that I have not seen anyone consider givin the facts in ME1,ME2 and the DLC's
here is the theory and then the facts... sort of.

Its a long post I know but I thought that all of this is intresting(cool reaper theory edited on 06/30/11)

The theory is that the reapers are ancient humans that came from another planet entirely millions maybe billions of years before mammals walked the earth. Humans on earth are just the reapers recreated through evolution!

[/b]Long story short...
The reapers are ancient humans who have lost there organic form in an attampt to achieve the perfect life form.
they are hybrids, so they connected one of themselfs with a VI becoming a human AI to improve there race and make them immortal. There organic side died off and there race died with it. all that is left is the AI which is still a human AI. Indoctrination maybe why the reapers lost there bodies. Indoctrination may have been a tool that the reapers used to connect with an AI, But we know what happends to people that get indoctrinated......They die at some point! Hint hint...this is what cerberus is doing also with Project overlord!!!!!!!!!!!!! The reapers need there original forum back. however there bodys have died off(lack of organics in reapers interior)  They are hybrids but there organic side is nowhere to be seen because its dead, Something may have gone wrong with there transition(indoctrination) and lost there race in the process. They now need to get it back and to do this they must do it through evolution (which takes millions of years) and come back every 50,000 years to make sure that nothing or no one can mess up there plan at resurrecting there race and immortality thats why the citedal and the relays are a trap.Its a trap so the reapers will have an upper hand in the galaxy so they can control evolution without the reapers having to be there . End of long story short.

now to back up my claim.

In Mass Ettect 3 game info on Bioware website it states that the reapers are an unknown ancient alien race.
1."We impose order on the chaos of organic evolution"-Sovereign. There is only one reason why they would do this...Its because they are looking for something specific...but what? Other wise there is no reason to control it. The fact that they ARE controling it says that they are looking for specific results in something genetic. 
2. Mass Effect is really good about explaining everything (codex) in detail, all but Shepards unusual return in ME2...why? Thats because it is a spoiler in ME3 other wise they would explain it like everything alse. So...here is something to consider...Shepards scars are a yellow-orange color and the color of the genitic goo being pumped into the HUMAN REAPER is the...SAME COLOR as his scars on his face, which we know has the power to bring some one back from the dead...hint hint!(thats the same stuff that is going to bring the reaper to life...and Shepard) Another point to consider is when Harbinger gains control of a collecter the same yellow-orange color ingulfs him.
3. Sovereign tries to kill off all of the races of the galaxy with the rachni even before the reaper invasion....why? it could mean that the reapers knew about the humans even before we found our relay.
4. Project Overlord- It is my theory that Jack or...T.I.M. is working for the reapers. We all know that Cerberus and the Reapers live by the same moto 'The ends justify the means". TIM is going to try to place a human with a VI, this in turn will make that VI a human AI (project Overlord). How ever...it too fails, witch means that the VI takes over his mind(this may have happend to the Reapers). Also TIM hints to you at the collecter base that he...does...intend to make a human controled Reaper when you tell him that he is completely ruthess and may biuld a human reaper, TIM then say :my intent is to save humanity at any cost...Ive never hidden that from you!-TIM.
5.Edited 6/23/11 Collecters...They have been doing business with traders and pirates for organics with a genetic abnormality and then stoped, now they are targeting a specific race...humans!...why?  They have never harvested other races...they have only destroyed them completely. Why would they harvest a race to extiction?...Because there not harvesting them, thats why! Also notice that the collecters dont wait untill the invasion to reap...why?
6.Edited 6/23/11! I believe that cerberus is williingly working for the reaper (info at E3 and GI magazines) In the Spike TV video interveiw shepard states that cerberus is  indoctrinated but in the same video casey hudson says that you have to spend part of the time finding out why there with the reapers and if they are indoctrinated then that would already answer that question. Also in the GI mag Casey Hudson says that the reason cerberus is working for the reapers is a "close guarded secret" in bioware!!!!!! If cerberus is pro human and and they are working for the reapers...willingly... and the reapers who are on a non pro human agenda then that must mean that the reapers just might be pro human after all, because why would cerberus willingly work for the reapers? 

Things to consider:

Bioware states that the reapers are an "unknown anceint alien race". The reapers themselves are individuals each a nation and they are independent...something that is rare with AI's. The reapers work together but they are not exactly a hive mind because they are individuals, this points to there organic origin. Legion mentions that one reaper is like many minds(like the geth) but these minds may not be the actuall reaper. These many minds maybe a lot of AI's wired together like a hive mind and controled by the main user and in this case the user is an organic, That organic in my theory used indoctrination as a tool not to brainwash but integrate itself into the AI's and in fact became immortal. We know that through indoctrination that the subjects thoughts are integrated in to the reaper (the reaper then knows everything about you) but it inevitably kills the subject. 

Could in the fact that the indoctrination tool be the reason why the reapers original forum died off? Could this also be the reason that they are interested in organics in an order to bring back there race through evolution? They could be trying to fix there problem of trying to intigrate succesfully into an AI...one that failed...hence the millions of years of harvesting.

Sovereign used the rachni to try to kill off all the other races even before humans found there relay, but sovereign failed. That also explains the protheans in sol as not being protheans but collectors studying us...watching us. Sovereign may have been trying to make the harvest of humans easier with no resistance from non-needed aliens interfering (note that your useing the other races in ME3 do stop them for good this maybe why sovereign was trying to kill them with the rachni to prevent this very thing).

Why did sovereign attempt to kill off all the known races of the galaxy with the rachni? Are NO other races worthy of transending? What of the asari? Asari are the most biotic of any kind and one of the most intelligent races and so are the salarians minis the pure biotics. The protheans did not transend either and they built a relay. If they are looking for genetic diversity then they dont need one race they could just take all of the best traits in all of the races and combined them into one, how ever we know that thats not the case because sovereign tried to kill them off before the invasion. [b]This means that they are looking for a specific race and it also means that they are not looking for genetic diversity as stated in last sentance. I imagine that because reapers are in fact an anicent race(as stated by Bioware as a fact in there ME3 game info) then that race must have been an absolutely dominant race with all the best traits and must have been genetically diverse (to have the best traits they...would...have to be genetically diverse). This sounds a lot like humans to me.

Every race must develop on there own. If a race developes over millions of years with the knowlege of big things in the sky then it would have serious draw backs to there goal of them evolving the way that they need them to . They cant watch it that close without interfering in there evolution, thats where the citadel and the relays come in. They can sit back and save energy with the knowlege that if evolution goes faster then they thought (which is what happend to the protheans) then the reapers still have nothing to worry about because the citadel and the relays are a.....trap! If they introduce the relays and the citadel and make it so no one can figure out how to make one themslves then that allows the reapers to control evolution without being there all the time and possibly undoing there own work, then come back every 50k so that no race evolves faster then needed( protheans likely found there relay shortly after last harvest, gave them more time to study relays and gave us a chance at beating the reapers in the process ).


The reapers have to be carefull at what they introduce to a developing race...even that human (early human vision in ME1) saw a shiny thing in the sky and almost srcewed up there secrecy. Had humans known for a fact that the reapers existed it could mess up there genetic evolution just enough to produce a bad subject(failed attempt). Notice that other races in Mass Effect share similar features such as the quarians and turians and salarians even krogan as well...all four look like they are cut and paste from each other, even the asari look human as do the batarians. Some races look completely different, its only the ones that share similarities that are the dominant races...coincidence?  The other races that are different from the dominant races maybe nothing more then unexpected species emerging from the reapers laboratory galaxy(milky way) since evolution even in a controlled state is going to have unexpected things happen.

If I am right then that means your going to have to pick a side in ME3 since the reapers are human and so are you, who  then are we going to back? Do you still back the current humans or the way more advanced ones(reapers)?   ?Paragon/Renegade?

Modifié par KevShep, 28 août 2011 - 07:12 .

[Harbringer 2.0]

If the Reapers is humans. Then why do they look like... squids, since its said that the Reapers might take their form from the species they are made of.
And then, how would ancient humans exist. As this cycle of destruction have gone on in like a milion years, maybe more. Before humans even had evolved.
And why do they kill the rest of the galaxies civilizations.

[Moiaussi]

Maybe they are humans who really liked seafood

[Lapis Lazuli]

Harbringer 2.0 wrote...

If the Reapers is humans. Then why do they look like... squids....

Because they're humans from Atlantis.

[Villedge]

Guess who the reapers hero is...Renegade Shepard!!!!!

I stopped right there

[SandTrout]

Reapers are not humans, nor were they originally humans. I will assume that your writing skill is lacking and you mean that the Reapers were originally an advanced sapient organic race. This is pretty much the operational assumption that all Reaper origin speculation has been based on. Nothing new here.

1: From a storytelling standpoint, the Codex is a means to flesh out the ME universe in ways that could not reasonably be done within the normal game play. From an in-universe standpoint, the Codex is the equivalent of the Encyclopedia Britannica of Citadel Space, and Shepard's Resurrection and subsequent mission were a closely guarded secret of Cerberus. There is no reason that the Lazarus Project would be in the codex from either a storytelling or in-universe standpoint. Many people have already speculated that the Lazarus Project involved Reaper Technology to bring back Shepard. Nothing new here except of invalid points.

2:Every other race in the ME universe has been homogenized by unified cultures and interbreeding. Humans are an exceptionally young species in the inter-stellar community, and have not yet homogenized from the extremely factional nations and isolated cultures of only a couple centuries ago. This point is even mentioned in the Ascension novel. No new, valid point here either.

3: The idea that TIM is an indoctrinated stooge for the Reapers has been widely debated on these forums, and I personally do not buy it. I will not go into details, but your point that Cerberus and the Reapers share the "Ends justify means" attitude does not validly imply that they are working togeather. Many organizations have share this attitude, but were not working for the Reapers. Just because all Agents of the Reapers believe that the ends justify the means does not mean that all that believe the ends justify the means are Agents of the Reapers. Project Overlord was seeking a very specific goal: to control the Geth. It was never meant to provide a means for just anyone to interface directly with AI.

4: I can barely make any sense of this paragraph and see no connection with imposing order on organic life and the Reapers hero-worshiping Renegade Shepard. There is no indication that Human are descended from the original Reaper species.

5: The Collectors were collecting genetic samples from all the races of the galaxy in order to select the next candidates for ascension to Reaper status. They stopped with humans because we had traits that they sought in a new Reaper, though it is not clear what those traits are, though biotic potential seems to be among them. The reason to start Reaping before the invasion is because there was no reason not to start once humans had been selected, and it just removes a few more worlds that the Reapers don't have to worry about once the invasion does begin. Note that due to their Terminus System status, the abduction of the colonies did not incite any response other than a small human-centered extremist group that was only successful in wiping out the Reapers due to an exceptional leader, some lucky circumstances (discovering the Derelict Reaper for the IFF), and unexpected technology (EDI). By destroying the colonies now, the Reapers remove plausible rally points for the Citadel fleets once the invasion does begin.

6: There is no indication that the Human Reaper was a failure of any form until Shepard aborted it. If it was a failure, then why would they continue to waste precious resources by liquifying the captured humans for their Reaper jelly.

You have presented no real evidence of any of your claims other than the demonstration that you've probably played Halo too many times.

[Mir5]

I am kinda speechless.

But wait, why would they care about their origin? It's kinda like we looked at monkeys and said "HOLY SH**, FINALLY WE CAN LEARN AWAY OUR MISTAKES!"

[KevShep]

Ive been playing video games for a long time and if there is one thing that Ive learned is that stories like this have a really good reason for everything they do Ive been telling people not to trust cerberus for a long time now by telling them that they are working with the reapers (weather they know it or not), and after GI magazine was out that turned out to be true. Then at E3 they showed more and people said that they were just indoctrinated, but...a new GI mag comes out a basiclly says that its a close guarded secret(so that means that they are NOT indoctrinated)..........I was right again!

What iam saying is the story is that HUMANITY is at the... CENTER...of the main plot such as humanity being a jack of all traits(no other alien race is) and cerberus(HUMAN group)...WHO...just happen to be one of the most shady groups in the galaxy. IF THE REAPERS ARE NOT HUMAN THEN WHY IS CERBERUS PART OF THE MAIN PLOT BEING AS SHADY AS THEY ARE AND NOT INDOCTRINATED IN ME3 BUT HELPING THE REAPERS????????????????????????

[KevShep]

sandtrout...I did not explane my theory in detal because it was too long and short on time also it would take to long to return fire for some of the key things your missing(not seeing) in your post so I will just tell you to look at the post above this one and read the the bottom paragragh and anwser that.  You also seem to be taking the story at face value, games like Mass Effect ...ALWAYS...have a BIG secret!

Modifié par KevShep, 18 juin 2011 - 05:30 .

[KevShep]

Harbringer 2.0 wrote...

If the Reapers is humans. Then why do they look like... squids, since its said that the Reapers might take their form from the species they are made of.
And then, how would ancient humans exist. As this cycle of destruction have gone on in like a milion years, maybe more. Before humans even had evolved.
And why do they kill the rest of the galaxies civilizations.

first off EDI is the one that makes and educated...guess...at why they are making it look human. She says that they mite be taking the form of the race used to make it. This is not the case because any time you have a person in the game making a...guess... about something unknown in the main plot (a spoiler for later in series) it is ALWAYS not true. She also states that she cant really make a guess because of lack of intel on the matter, but that is her guess anyway. 

If the the ancient humans were all integraded into AI's then there race as an organic has all but died off, But...something has gone wrong with them (how do we know this...they would not be doing what there doing evey 50 thousand years if nothing was wrong with them). FACT...they are...controling evolution(the entire galaxy is there research lab) it is my opinon that they are trying to... recreate... there dead race(HUMANS) and that other races are failed attempts at making humans. Like Vigl says(ME1) the citidel and the mass relays are a TRAP!!!!!...why?...because any race that makes space flight can undo the reapers work so they come every 50 thousand years to make sure no one does!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SandTrout]

KevShep wrote...
sandtrout...I did not explain my theory in detail because it was too long and short on time also it would take to long to return fire for some of the key things your missing(not seeing) in your post so I will just tell you to look at the post above this one and read the the bottom paragraph and answer that. You also seem to be taking the story at face value, games like Mass Effect ...ALWAYS...have a BIG secret!

^Spellchecked.

You claim to be seeing things that I have not, but you have only posted your conclusions without the supporting evidence. If you want me to understand and sympathize with your position, show me the evidence that you think I am missing.

I've been poking around the ME story for a long time and I am intimately familiar with most aspects of the story, and of storytelling in games in general. You are correct that there is a reason for everything in a game, and that no one should trust Cerberus, but I currently reject the notion that Cerberus has been secretly working for the Reapers, or doing so unwittingly the entire time. The evidence that we do have from the first two games does not support this claim.

We know that there are Cerberus troops working with the Reapers in the trailers for ME3, but we do not know the nature of that alliance other than speculation. Indoctrination is the most obvious cause, and if it is, we do not know the full extent of penetration within the Cerberus organization. Cerberus may also be playing as double-agents in order to subvert the Reapers' plans by playing as allies until they can strike where it hurts most. I do not have evidence of this other than Cerberus's consistent efforts to undermine the Reapers and their allies, the Geth and the Collectors. This is not much evidence, but it is more than you have to support your assertion that the original Reapers were Humans.

[Mabari Owns High Dragon]

Then why would they kill their own species? I don't understand that part. But the argument for why they look like that is they take upon the appearance of whatever form would be most useful to them. Its their core that shows what they originally were.

[KevShep]

SandTrout wrote...

KevShep wrote...
sandtrout...I did not explain my theory in detail because it was too long and short on time also it would take to long to return fire for some of the key things your missing(not seeing) in your post so I will just tell you to look at the post above this one and read the the bottom paragraph and answer that. You also seem to be taking the story at face value, games like Mass Effect ...ALWAYS...have a BIG secret!

^Spellchecked.

You claim to be seeing things that I have not, but you have only posted your conclusions without the supporting evidence. If you want me to understand and sympathize with your position, show me the evidence that you think I am missing.

I've been poking around the ME story for a long time and I am intimately familiar with most aspects of the story, and of storytelling in games in general. You are correct that there is a reason for everything in a game, and that no one should trust Cerberus, but I currently reject the notion that Cerberus has been secretly working for the Reapers, or doing so unwittingly the entire time. The evidence that we do have from the first two games does not support this claim.

We know that there are Cerberus troops working with the Reapers in the trailers for ME3, but we do not know the nature of that alliance other than speculation. Indoctrination is the most obvious cause, and if it is, we do not know the full extent of penetration within the Cerberus organization. Cerberus may also be playing as double-agents in order to subvert the Reapers' plans by playing as allies until they can strike where it hurts most. I do not have evidence of this other than Cerberus's consistent efforts to undermine the Reapers and their allies, the Geth and the Collectors. This is not much evidence, but it is more than you have to support your assertion that the original Reapers were Humans.

who says that cerberus actions in ME2 are undermining the reapers(it could be the other way around)? while you can find what to you may be holes in my theory (things you didnt know where actually there) lets look at this for a minute. We know that they are not double agents because cerberus (a MAJOR player in he main plot) just happends to be a HUMAN group whos actions with the reapers is a close guarded secret with Bioware. Also the reapers are only intrested in HUMANS and no other race. The reapers making a HUMAN reaper. Cerberus perfecting a HUMAN AI hybrid(reapers ALSO just happen hybrids as well)...If that alone is not saying BIG spoiler (cerberus connections with reapers) than I dont know what more I can say to you. Iam looking at whats there in both games and making a really good guess on the real facts(not just some outrageous claims)...and I have not been wrong so far (theory made a long time ago).

Modifié par KevShep, 19 juin 2011 - 02:41 .

[KevShep]

Mabari Owns High Dragon wrote...

Then why would they kill their own species? I don't understand that part. But the argument for why they look like that is they take upon the appearance of whatever form would be most useful to them. Its their core that shows what they originally were.

The ends justify the means thats why they would kill there own(like cerberus killing its own as well who just happen to live by the same moto). The core of what the reapers once were is unknown because they are hybrids of organic and synthetic life forms. That means that at one point in there existance they were just organics...but what? I think the clue to what the reapers are is hidden in the shadows of cerberus!

Modifié par KevShep, 19 juin 2011 - 02:26 .

[SandTrout]

KevShep wrote...

who says that cerberus actions in ME2 are undermining the reapers(it could be the other way around)?

You still have not pointed out a single piece of concrete evidence that I was not aware of. What you have provided, I have been aware of from the beginning, and is circumstantial at best. Destroying the collector base, complete with an embryonic Human Reaper, hardly seems like it undermines Cerberus's position. I cannot say unequivocally that you are wrong, only that you have presented no evidence that you are correct.

We know that they are not double agents because cerberus (a MAJOR player in he main plot) just happends to be a HUMAN group whos actions with the reapers is a close guarded secret with Bioware.

The fact that Cerberus's relationship with the Reapers is a secret is not proof of anything other than BioWare wants people to learn about it by playing the game, not listening to a press release.

Also the reapers are only intrested in HUMANS and no other race. The reapers making a HUMAN reaper. Cerberus perfecting a HUMAN AI hybrid(reapers ALSO just happen hybrids as well)...

Cerberus created Overlord using a very special human for a very specific purpose that was related to defeating the Reapers. As you stated, Cerberus is a human supremacy group. Being liquified and turned into a Reaper is not an act of Human Supremacy, it is an act of Reaper Dominance. It is possible that TIM may consider what the Reapers are offering a desirable goal, but based on what we know of TIM from Ascension and Retribution, such has his attachment to the cultural identity of the human species, I find it unlikely that TIM would be willing to accept humanity being made into a Reaper on anyone's terms but our own, unless he were indoctrinated, which I find doubtful that he would allow.

If that alone is not saying BIG spoiler (cerberus connections with reapers) than I dont know what more I can say to you.

It is not a spoiler, it is an indication that there will be one of BioWare's signature plot-twists regarding Cerberus, and considering that Cerberus seems to be one of our major enemies from the beginning of the game, pointing out that they are working for the Reapers won't be much of a twist.

and I have not been wrong so far (theory made a long time ago).

Care to post a link for me for my own curiosity? I don't base my judgement of a theory on your record of being correct, I base it on weather or not it fits what I have perceived.

Modifié par SandTrout, 19 juin 2011 - 02:45 .

[KevShep]

SandTrout wrote...

KevShep wrote...

who says that cerberus actions in ME2 are undermining the reapers(it could be the other way around)?

You still have not pointed out a single piece of concrete evidence that I was not aware of. What you have provided, I have been aware of from the beginning, and is circumstantial at best. Destroying the collector base, complete with an embryonic Human Reaper, hardly seems like it undermines Cerberus's position. I cannot say unequivocally that you are wrong, only that you have presented no evidence that you are correct.

We know that they are not double agents because cerberus (a MAJOR player in he main plot) just happends to be a HUMAN group whos actions with the reapers is a close guarded secret with Bioware.

The fact that Cerberus's relationship with the Reapers is a secret is not proof of anything other than BioWare wants people to learn about it by playing the game, not listening to a press release.

Also the reapers are only intrested in HUMANS and no other race. The reapers making a HUMAN reaper. Cerberus perfecting a HUMAN AI hybrid(reapers ALSO just happen hybrids as well)...

Cerberus created Overlord using a very special human for a very specific purpose that was related to defeating the Reapers. As you stated, Cerberus is a human supremacy group. Being liquified and turned into a Reaper is not an act of Human Supremacy, it is an act of Reaper Dominance. It is possible that TIM may consider what the Reapers are offering a desirable goal, but based on what we know of TIM from Ascension and Retribution, such has his attachment to the cultural identity of the human species, I find it unlikely that TIM would be willing to accept humanity being made into a Reaper on anyone's terms but our own, unless he were indoctrinated, which I find doubtful that he would allow.

If that alone is not saying BIG spoiler (cerberus connections with reapers) than I dont know what more I can say to you.

It is not a spoiler, it is an indication that there will be one of BioWare's signature plot-twists regarding Cerberus, and considering that Cerberus seems to be one of our major enemies from the beginning of the game, pointing out that they are working for the Reapers won't be much of a twist.

and I have not been wrong so far (theory made a long time ago).

Care to post a link for me for my own curiosity? I don't base my judgement of a theory on your record of being correct, I base it on weather or not it fits what I have perceived.

Its not that cerberus is working for the reapers that is the twist, its the part where the reapers are human that is the spoiler. The reapers are not making humans into reapers, there trying to make a perfect hybrid of HUMAN dominance in a AI (reapers) becuase they have failed every time thats why you only see the reapers as synthetic and no organic anywhere in them(my opinon). This is the problem they are having, they are not what they want to be. the reapers are no longer human so thats where cerberus comes in. Cerberus helping them...IS...helping humanity!

[SandTrout]

You still have presented no evidence that the Reapers were originally some long lost decedent of Humanity, and you ignore many clues that imply that while the Protheans studied humans, it was hunter-gatherer humans that existed somewhere before 50k years ago, there was nothing to suggest that the humans were once a space-fairing species.

There is only so much technology and knowledge that can be lost through any given calamity that does not result in the outright extinction of a species/culture. The remnants of a fallen species would still have a basic knowledge of tools, agriculture, and language, none of which is implied in the quick little flashback on the planet with the Prothean artifact on Eletania in ME1.

The implication from that flashback is that we were a barely sapient species at the time that was still primarily nomadic and non-technological with limited language. You have presented nothing that supports the origin of humans being some ancient advanced species.

Also, based on EDI's description of the Human Reaper just prior to you actually seeing it, Reapers exhibit both synthetic and organic energy signatures, implying that the Reapers' organic side is still present in some manner. Also, why would the Reapers ignore humans during ever previous cycle up until now, if we were their origin and necessary to their existence. Hell, there is even a Mass Relay in our solar system, and the Reapers would have needed to clean up Mars before heading back into dark space.

Your theory does not fit within a reasonable interpretation of the available evidence, and ignores evidence that we had nothing to do with the original Reapers in any manner.

[Harbringer 2.0]

KevShep wrote...
What iam saying is the story is that HUMANITY is at the... CENTER...of the main plot such as humanity being a jack of all traits(no other alien race is) and cerberus(HUMAN group)...WHO...just happen to be one of the most shady groups in the galaxy. IF THE REAPERS ARE NOT HUMAN THEN WHY IS CERBERUS PART OF THE MAIN PLOT BEING AS SHADY AS THEY ARE AND NOT INDOCTRINATED IN ME3 BUT HELPING THE REAPERS????????????????????????

The Illusive Man was effected by reaper technology, at the First Contact War and saw a vision of the Reapers.(Comic)
He could have allied with the Reapers between ME2 and ME3. And since we know the Illusive Man is a lying ego-centric  *ssh*l*, he could very well betray the Reapers at some point. He could allso do the Saren Fail. And then, Cerberus is against all other races in the galaxy and want new technology.
(Speculations)

Mabari Owns High Dragon wrote...
Then why would they kill their own species? I don't understand that part. But the argument for why they look like that is they take upon the appearance of whatever form would be most useful to them. Its their core that shows what they originally were.

So you meen the Reapers true form is a ball of glowing eezo?

KevShep wrote...
Its not that cerberus is working for the reapers that is the twist, its the part where the reapers are human that is the spoiler. The reapers are not making humans into reapers, there trying to make a perfect hybrid of HUMAN dominance in a AI (reapers) becuase they have failed every time thats why you only see the reapers as synthetic and no organic anywhere in them(my opinon). This is the problem they are having, they are not what they want to be. the reapers are no longer human so thats where cerberus comes in. Cerberus helping them...IS...helping humanity!

If the Reaper is Ancient Humans, that is fused with a VI, and became a human AI, and it is dominanted by the VI. Then why would the VI / AI part want to make a Reaper that have its organic parts as dominant.
(Hole in Theory)

Modifié par Harbringer 2.0, 19 juin 2011 - 12:07 .

[AngelicMachinery]

And here I thought that my idea that the reapers were from the future was crazy...

I had been watching the Toclafane episode of doctor who when I came up with the theory though.

[specter520]

you know that the reapers have been around for longer than humans have existed right?

[KevShep]

Ok let me make this easy for those of you that cant think. first off I dont have absolute proof (never said I did) because ME3 is not out yet (last pice of the puzzle), its based on real facts that are all ready there (ME1/ME2).

The ancient humans did NOT come from earth...They DIED OUT A LONG TIME AGO(this is the theory). They are now AI's with there organic part of themselfs dead! This is what they are trying to get back! We are them recreated through evolution. The AI in the reapers is dominate yes, but its still a human AI just like what happend in project overlord.
I know that all that stuff is in the air still but I know that my theory fits it to a T. The facts I have are...and I well say it again...again...are LONG STORY SHORT...
1. the connections with cerberus and the reapers who both seem to have contradicting plans on the serface but actually have the same exact goals and moto's not to mention that cerberus (a major player in ME) just happends to be a HUMAN group with reapers interested in ONLY HUMANS.

2. both are trying to make a perfect hybrid of HUMANS and synthetic Llfe forms.

3 Both the reapers and cerberus and very shady (in the dark about them) which alone is enough to get you to think about a connection. Bioware states that cerberus is not indoctrinated but IS working for the reapers and you have to find out why. they said that the reason is a close guarded secret and a major spoiler in ME3.

4. the whole story revolves around cerberus and the reapers.

5. All you need to do is focus on the parts that we know are an absolute FACT such as bioware stating that they are working for the reapers and NOT indoctrinated...then do the math....its not that hard people! focus on what you know and make a theory on what you have. Ive been saying that cerberus is working for the reapers for about 8 months...people said I have no real proof (true but...) I was right about cerberus stabing shepard in the back so I guess my proof...WAS...real proof after all (even incomplete as it was). Yes my theory has holes but thats ONLY because we are missing the last pice of the puzzle! Its like what Liara says "I cant proof it (YET) but I know Iam right!"

Modifié par KevShep, 20 juin 2011 - 04:54 .

[SandTrout]

0)If humans did not come from Earth, then how did we get here without the Reapers' knowledge to be ignored for millions of years until the current cycle when we gained the ability of interstellar travel, which has been a requirement for every other known species that was Reaped? There is no difference in the current cycle other than the Protheans sabotaging the Citadel Relay protocols.

1) The connections that Cerberus shares with the Reapers, the Reapers also share with the Specters and STG. The Reapers were not interested in humans from the begining, only once the Alliance destroyed Sovereign and gained prominence in the galactic community faster than any previous species did the Reapers take notice. Saren hit Eden Prime because of the Beacon, not because it was a human colony. Additionally, the Reapers have been attempting to get the current harvesting cycle into swing since before Humans even left the middle ages, if the implications that the Rachni Wars were caused by Sovereign.

2) Cerberus only started overlord research until well into the war with the Heretic Geth, after the destruction and subsequent salvage of Sovereign. Even then, they were not seeking a perfect hybrid of humans and synthetic, only a tool to use against the Geth.

3)Specters and the STG are also shady, should we assume that they are connected to the Reapers as well? Also, to my knowledge, BioWare has NOT stated that Cerberus has not been indoctrinated, only that their involvement with the Reapers will be part of the story line, which could be salvaging the organization from the effects of indoctrination, for all we know.

4) The whole story revolves around Shepard and the Reapers. Cerberus were barely considered part of the ME1 story line.

5) We absolutely should stick to the facts, of which you have presented none that support your speculation in any meaningful way. BioWare has not stated that Cerberus has not been indoctrinated, and even if they are, there are still plenty of more plausible explanations that actually have evidence supporting them than the wild speculation that humans were descended from the original Reaper species. You still have not linked to your so-called accurate theory, and just because your conclusion was correct does not mean that the evidence that you used is "proof".

I could say that Lee Harvey Oswald was the only shooter of JFK based on the fact that he has brown hair. My conclusion could be right, and my fact presented as evidence could be factually correct, but just because I present a fact as evidence does not mean it has any relevance to my conclusion.

[KevShep]

SandTrout wrote...

0)If humans did not come from Earth, then how did we get here without the Reapers' knowledge to be ignored for millions of years until the current cycle when we gained the ability of interstellar travel, which has been a requirement for every other known species that was Reaped? There is no difference in the current cycle other than the Protheans sabotaging the Citadel Relay protocols.

1) The connections that Cerberus shares with the Reapers, the Reapers also share with the Specters and STG. The Reapers were not interested in humans from the begining, only once the Alliance destroyed Sovereign and gained prominence in the galactic community faster than any previous species did the Reapers take notice. Saren hit Eden Prime because of the Beacon, not because it was a human colony. Additionally, the Reapers have been attempting to get the current harvesting cycle into swing since before Humans even left the middle ages, if the implications that the Rachni Wars were caused by Sovereign.

2) Cerberus only started overlord research until well into the war with the Heretic Geth, after the destruction and subsequent salvage of Sovereign. Even then, they were not seeking a perfect hybrid of humans and synthetic, only a tool to use against the Geth.

3)Specters and the STG are also shady, should we assume that they are connected to the Reapers as well? Also, to my knowledge, BioWare has NOT stated that Cerberus has not been indoctrinated, only that their involvement with the Reapers will be part of the story line, which could be salvaging the organization from the effects of indoctrination, for all we know.

4) The whole story revolves around Shepard and the Reapers. Cerberus were barely considered part of the ME1 story line.

5) We absolutely should stick to the facts, of which you have presented none that support your speculation in any meaningful way. BioWare has not stated that Cerberus has not been indoctrinated, and even if they are, there are still plenty of more plausible explanations that actually have evidence supporting them than the wild speculation that humans were descended from the original Reaper species. You still have not linked to your so-called accurate theory, and just because your conclusion was correct does not mean that the evidence that you used is "proof".

I could say that Lee Harvey Oswald was the only shooter of JFK based on the fact that he has brown hair. My conclusion could be right, and my fact presented as evidence could be factually correct, but just because I present a fact as evidence does not mean it has any relevance to my conclusion.

Your biased from the start to even think about half the things I say about the theory. How long have you been playing games. You would know that cerberus IS just as big of the story as shepard and the reapers(ME2/ME3) thats more then half the story so yeah they are a big part. Yes you can say that you can link anything to anything (cerberus-reapers) but the thing that makes them worth noting is they... SHARE... the center stage around the biggest plot hole (ME3 spoiler) in the whole series, this is how you know the real connections over the fake ones(because you can link anything to anything). 

1) this has even less proof then what mine does.
2)If TIM is working with the reapers do you really think that he would tell the other cells that he is working for them? NO he would tell them that its to better understand the geth...this is TIM after all...no cell knows what hes up to!
3) yes they are all shady but...the STG are...NOT...part of the main plot...cerberus is! (again how long have you played video games). From the video at spike TV they interview Casey Hudson he states in the video that liara asks why cerberus is attacking them and shepard says that they are indoctrinated, but notice this...If Liara is asking the question then that means that this is the frist time that they have incountered cerberus attacting them other wise she would not be asking the question and it ALSO means that shepard does NOT know as well...he is giving a good guess by saying they are indoctrinated (because hey what alse could it be right?). The part that made me come to this thought is in that SAME video casey hudson says that you have to spend part of the game finding out why cerberus is in on the reapers, so it they cant be indoctrinated because they would have just spoiled that part in the demo (come on man!).
4) already did this one.
5) this would be a lot easyer if it was not on online, so just pay attention to how games stories are told and look at the things that are not on the serface but are clearly there (just not at a first glance). Bottom line is you NEVER take a game with too many BIG unknowns at face value becuase you WILL get a big suprise when the game takes that right trun! There is too many connections with the reapers and cerberus to be nothing more then nothing...the clue that I see is they both revolve around humans with the moto the end s justify the means and there TRUE MOTIVES ARE UNKNOWN(because its a spoiler).  Remember that its a game that means that they are connected.(games have good reasons for everything) do the math. I did my own math and that is the best theory that Ive been seeing for months now and with E3 it has more weight to it now.   

Modifié par KevShep, 21 juin 2011 - 04:01 .

[specter520]

I don't mean to insult you but do you know anything about evolution, the odds of humans developing on two planets with no outside interference is like a googleplex to 1, in order for them to be human their genetic code would have to be exactly the same, in order for evolution to do this we would need to originate from the same organism and have there be no variations in our environment or many other things, your theory makes no scientific sense. this can also be completely shot down because casey hudson said that most reapers are different species who have been 'ascended'. also why would there be a cycle of extinction if it was only some human thing. it has also been confirmed through the comics that TIM is indoctrinated

[KevShep]

specter520 wrote...

I don't mean to insult you but do you know anything about evolution, the odds of humans developing on two planets with no outside interference is like a googleplex to 1, in order for them to be human their genetic code would have to be exactly the same, in order for evolution to do this we would need to originate from the same organism and have there be no variations in our environment or many other things, your theory makes no scientific sense. this can also be completely shot down because casey hudson said that most reapers are different species who have been 'ascended'. also why would there be a cycle of extinction if it was only some human thing. it has also been confirmed through the comics that TIM is indoctrinated

 it does not say that tim is indoctrinated it but is does...seem... that way, we dont know what is done to TIM yet. Yes it is hard to make the same race twice on another planet that why it takes them millions maybe billions of years to do it and the other races are failed attempts at humans(my throey). they have ascended but somthing is wrong with them and we dont know what that is yet other wise they would not be coming back every 50 thousand years. They come back to make sure that no one can mess things up( any space faring race can ). This is how we know that they are looking for something specific!

Modifié par KevShep, 21 juin 2011 - 04:10 .