409 réponses à ce sujet

[Lukertin]

Seboist wrote...
And the worst part of it is that unlike in Dragon Age you're FORCED to pick up all that garbage loot and sort it out.

Even bettah is that characters who can't use certain weapons can equip them anyway.  Oh, I guess this is what the RPGs purists meant by "This genre of games is very sophisticated and requires you to think anything less is a dumbing down for console blablabla"

Modifié par Lukertin, 31 mars 2011 - 08:25 .

[Winterfly]

Seboist wrote...

mrsph wrote...

Mass Effect's inventory system:

*cycle through 100 weapons with little variation*
*melt down to omnigel*
*repeat step one*

And the worst part of it is that unlike in Dragon Age you're FORCED to pick up all that garbage loot and sort it out.

Please, in Dragon Age you had a bag that could take 50 items and you found hordes of them and it was no ease to use inventory. 

[Winterfly]

Lukertin wrote...

Seboist wrote...
And the worst part of it is that unlike in Dragon Age you're FORCED to pick up all that garbage loot and sort it out.

Even bettah is that characters who can't use certain weapons can equip them anyway.  Oh, I guess this is what the RPGs purists meant by "This genre of games is very sophisticated and requires you to think"

Im pretty much sure I can hang a rifle on you and you can press a button and fire a bit with it.. Its not a magical "oh no cannot touch this item!" or a dumb level requirement

"Hey Bob? Why dont you use that rifle?"
"I can't Bob"
"What? You're a soldier!"
"The level for this weapon is too high!"
"What..."

[Thompson family]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Says the person who regards ME2 as pure gold. Just because some people don't have the mental capacity or patience to handle a highly detailed inventory system  ...

Needlepoint embroidery takes more mental capacity and patience than the ME1 inventory system. A lack of desire to lose oneself in such trifles is no sign of lacking either mental capacity or patience.

I've said it before and say it again now: What really ticks RPG elitists off is that somebody, anybody can go through one playthrough of ME2 and have a Shep who's just as powerful and just as well equipped as their carefully crafted creations, honed by such gimmicks as going through multiple playthroughs to level up persuasion and intimidation abilities by being made a Spectre multiple times rather than spending any points..

Mass Effect is and should be a story-driven game in which your character is trying to save all intelligent life in the galaxy, not some digitalized version of hand-painting and dressing up porcelain dolls.

Modifié par Thompson family, 31 mars 2011 - 08:29 .

[Lukertin]

Winterfly wrote...
"Hey Bob? Why dont you use that rifle?"
"I can't Bob"
"What? You're a soldier!"
"The level for this weapon is too high!"
"What..."

1. Roll Vanguard
2. Equip Assault Rifle
3. Shoot enemies at point blank
4. Miss every shot
5. ???
6. Defeat Saren, beat game.

Modifié par Lukertin, 31 mars 2011 - 08:40 .

[PHub88]

I agree with OP %100000, could not possibly agree more.

I dont even understand why they bothered to release this DLC last? Just because it involves Reapers I guess? They almost could of gotten away with releasing this DLC had it been first...This one was by far the worst DLC released, and they saved it for last? wtf

I really think they had ALL the dlc done before the game was even released...they must of..Im not part of the Ash Kaiden crowd but I did find it SHOCKING they didnt bother to enlist either of them in this DLC...I mean it would of been pathetically easy to do so...and it would of made some people happy..I figured since we got Liara we should SURELY get a VS one...and its even Alliance related which just makes no sense...they could of added them into this so easily WTF...I guess it shows more and more the direction Bioware has decided to take

DA2 was a joke...and I have NEVER seen so many people agree on a big name game sucking as with that one...But I am very convinced now at this point MASS EFFECT 3 WILL BE A RENTAL FOR ME...Im not going to put anymore money into a franchise that has done EVERYTHING IN THEIR POWER to go back on all the things I got interested in the franchise for to begin with...Lets face it, importing doesnt matter, choices dont matter...its not an RPG...Its a shooter

I would love to see this all SOMEHOW come back to burn Biowares azz...It really bothers me such a GREAT company went and got involved with the greedy tyrant EA and are now instead of being one of the few great developers left...have become yet again...another crappy TPS FPS clone company...heck even worse...they lie about the labels of their games now...If ME2 is an RPG than so is Bioshock 2.

[DarkSeraphym]

PHub88 wrote...

DA2 was a joke...and I have NEVER seen so many people agree on a big name game sucking as with that one...But I am very convinced now at this point MASS EFFECT 3 WILL BE A RENTAL FOR ME...Im not going to put anymore money into a franchise that has done EVERYTHING IN THEIR POWER to go back on all the things I got interested in the franchise for to begin with...Lets face it, importing doesnt matter, choices dont matter...its not an RPG...Its a shooter

As I pointed out on the previous page, Hudson and Norman have both explained as to why it appears that choices didn't matter in ME2. Of course, there is always the possibility that this was nothing more than a convenient excuse but they have promised that as ME3 is the last game, there are going to be a lot of variables with real consequences to them since there is no continuity left to worry about. You are free to decide whether or not you want to believe them as to whether or not they will do it. For me, the fact that they promised to make the choices matter shows that they are aware of our complaints and appear to want to do something about it. That is about all we have to go on at th emoment.

I think you may have also had your expectations a little too high for the import feature when going into ME2. Realistically, video games are not like a "Choose Your Own Adventure" book where the only resource is the writer's time and some paper and ink. There are writers, programmers, graphic artists, voice actors, etc., that all go into a video game. Create too many variables and you start to make the story not only complicated, but the game development very expensive. I can see why they opted to go the way they did with ME2. Not saying that your complaints are unwarranted, just pointed out that they have been touched on since the month after this game came out in 2010 and they were vocal enough that Hudson felt like he need to discuss why they did the things they did.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 31 mars 2011 - 09:14 .

[Winterfly]

They could off have made it very sentimental if Hackett had bringed in Shepard and Kaiden or Ashley for this quest...many flashbacks, many talks...deep convos. Deep proclamations of love/friendship and a rebounding of their old love/friendship. Would been awesome...PHub88, awesome idea.

I will probably buy Collectors Edition of Mass Effect 3, if its good I will be a happy man if it's bad I will mourn what looked like the best series in computer gaming this side of the gaming crisis.

[DarkSeraphym]

Winterfly wrote...

They could off have made it very sentimental if Hackett had bringed in Shepard and Kaiden or Ashley for this quest...many flashbacks, many talks...deep convos. Deep proclamations of love/friendship and a rebounding of their old love/friendship. Would been awesome...PHub88, awesome idea.

I will probably buy Collectors Edition of Mass Effect 3, if its good I will be a happy man if it's bad I will mourn what looked like the best series in computer gaming this side of the gaming crisis.

Winterfly, this is not to be mean or anything, but I'm getting the vibe from your posts that you are not a native speaker of English. Just to help you out, the past tense of the word "to bring" is "brought", not "bringed". It's an irregular verb. The normal "-ed" ending rule that goes with the past tense in English does not apply to that verb. Like I said, not correcting you to be mean. Only way you'll get any better is if someone corrects it .

I would have liked for Kaidan or Ashley to have shown up simply to balance out the fact that the Liaramancers got their wish and it seems a little unfair that those who romanced the Virmire Survivor did not.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 31 mars 2011 - 09:23 .

[PHub88]

Dark, I fully understand what your saying. But then again at the same time...You cant think that before ME2 was released they didnt already know people were going to be mad that their choices literally made NO difference on the game what so ever. Thats basically giving them a pass for not doing something that was literally a main selling point of the game in the first place. I get that its a difficult feature for a game...but for as much as they used that to hype the ME series, they should of done more with it, like they absolutely implied they WOULD be doing. I see it as a cop out on their part...they said all that stuff to intentionally mislead people. When I first heard of importing...I was amazed at how cool the concept sounded...but at the end of the day when you REALLY look at the choices and what changes...theres nothing to miss...at all...and the days before ME2s release I often found myself wondering..wondering what my choices in ME1 would do...It was saddening to see nothing but emails and a 2 minute conversation with Anderson and Ashley.

[Winterfly]

I wanted more of the council, more with Anderson. There was some minor things but it felt a lot like the game took a distance to its older brother.

Good game but I am looking forward to ME3, which could be a pretty awesome follow up on all these things. It taken a short time to create although, I presume they might off had two team working from ME1 on ME2 and ME3. Ghost Recon did that I believe or maybe was another game? Can't remember.

[DarkSeraphym]

PHub88 wrote...

Dark, I fully understand what your saying. But then again at the same time...You cant think that before ME2 was released they didnt already know people were going to be mad that their choices literally made NO difference on the game what so ever. Thats basically giving them a pass for not doing something that was literally a main selling point of the game in the first place. I get that its a difficult feature for a game...but for as much as they used that to hype the ME series, they should of done more with it, like they absolutely implied they WOULD be doing. I see it as a cop out on their part...they said all that stuff to intentionally mislead people. When I first heard of importing...I was amazed at how cool the concept sounded...but at the end of the day when you REALLY look at the choices and what changes...theres nothing to miss...at all...and the days before ME2s release I often found myself wondering..wondering what my choices in ME1 would do...It was saddening to see nothing but emails and a 2 minute conversation with Anderson and Ashley.

Oh no, I am certain that some of those working on the game had thought that people would be upset at only getting emails and brief cameos. I was when I played the game because I originally expected more as well. However, realistically, I can see why BioWare opted to go the route that they had. If you had consequences in Mass Effect 2 for decisions in Mass Effect, then you were going to introduce even more variables into the game than they already had. As I pointed out on the previous page, when this happens you have variables being created at an exponential rate and that is a task that would prove daunting for just about any video game developer.

Besides, BioWare has really emphasized the idea that the Mass Effect series is going to have a huge emphasis on the import feature. However, the series is not even complete yet. We still have one more game to go and, as the developers themselves stated, the issue of continuity is long gone. Now, I'm sure they won't go totally wild and chaotic with some of the consequences. However, they have said that many decisions from ME1 will have consequences in ME3. If you want to be upset about the hype built up around the series and the import feature, I implore you to first wait on the last game and see for yourself whether or not they keep their promises. If they don't, I'll gladly join you on these forums in complaining about the anticlimatic hype they built up.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 31 mars 2011 - 09:53 .

[Winterfly]

Maybe Bioware need to learn to stop talking. They do a Lionhead Studios more or less.

Like with Dragon Age, proclaiming its Baldurs Gate spiritual successor then they screw everyone that is a fan fo the old days over by blurting out something like "Oh yeah...Dragon Age 1 was too deep and complicated....people wanted more action urrhmmm yeah!" and Dragon Age 2, might be fun but its a mockery and bit of a heresy to do so to a game that is spiritually "Baldurs Gate 4" if you should take them serious in their "spirutual successor" proclamation...a mockery in the face to all old days fans.

Bioware need to stop saying stuff like this and we all know, EA is probably not to blame but Microsoft who turned them towards more action oriented RPG for their console.

[DarkSeraphym]

Winterfly wrote...

Maybe Bioware need to learn to stop talking. They do a Lionhead Studios more or less.

Like with Dragon Age, proclaiming its Baldurs Gate spiritual successor then they screw everyone that is a fan fo the old days over by blurting out something like "Oh yeah...Dragon Age 1 was too deep and complicated....people wanted more action urrhmmm yeah!" and Dragon Age 2, might be fun but its a mockery and bit of a heresy to do so to a game that is spiritually "Baldurs Gate 4" if you should take them serious in their "spirutual successor" proclamation...a mockery in the face to all old days fans.

Bioware need to stop saying stuff like this and we all know, EA is probably not to blame but Microsoft who turned them towards more action oriented RPG for their console.

If I'm not mistaken, didn't BioWare say that Dragon Age: Origins was the spiritual successor to Baldurs Gate and then turned around and said that Dragon Age 2 is not going to be Dragon Age: Origins 2? Correct me if I am wrong Winterfly, but I believe that is some of the stuff I remember reading from the IGN articles long ago. If that is the case, I don't particularly see where they went in the wrong there with that particular thing. I think a lot of people made the mistake of expecting Origins 2 even though BioWare clearly said that was not what DA2 was going to be.

I don't want to dive too much into Dragon Age 2 for two reasons though. For one, the teams that work on Dragon Age and Mass Effect are not the same teams. They are all under the same company, but they are not the same teams. For another, this is the Mass Effect forum and I don't want to dive too much into the mistakes that BioWare made with Dragon Age 2. In my opinion, attacking Mass Effect 3 because Dragon Age 2 wasn't the success that BioWare wanted is the same as attacking the Ladie's Basketball team for -insert random university- because their Men's Basketball team had lost the play-offs.

I am of the opinion that if you want to question whether or not Mass Effect 3 is "doomed", we should be looking at what the Mass Effect team has done and not at what the Dragon Age team has done. Plenty of people have real concerns, much as the OP does about Mass Effect, and I think it would be best to keep the topic discussing the promises of the Mass Effect team and not the Dragon Age team.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 31 mars 2011 - 10:07 .

[termokanden]

PHub88 wrote...

I dont even understand why they bothered to release this DLC last? Just because it involves Reapers I guess? They almost could of gotten away with releasing this DLC had it been first...This one was by far the worst DLC released, and they saved it for last?

After finally getting to play it last night, I just have to wonder why people are complaining about Arrival. I thought it was good. Not as good as LotSB, but still fine.

The only thing that annoyed me was the stealth achievement, because I thought the varren in the beginning didn't count. I always hate stealth in non-stealth games anyway.

[Foolsfolly]

To OP.

While ME1 was an rpg

Correction, fine sir. ME1 was more like a third person Contra-like arcade game. You just fired your unlimited ammo in the general direction of the enemy and spammed Immunity/Lift/Singularity.

Not really engaging shooter or RPG mechanics in that system.

and ME2 was a shooter with rpg elements in it

As was the ME1 if you need to know.

if Arrival/LoTSB are any indication to what ME3 will be, ME3 will be nothing but a shooter.

LotSB was the single greatest DLC BioWare's ever released. If ME3 is anything like LotSB then bring on ME3.

And that's as far as I got in your post. Thanks for playing.

[termokanden]

Shooter with RPG elements? That's a bit misleading since that's even true for the CoD games in multiplayer, although they are clearly a completely different beast. In a sense you're right, but "shooter with RPG elements" is just such a huge genre that the label contains almost no information.

I see both ME1 and 2 as RPGs.

But ultimately the genre isn't what's important anyway.

Modifié par termokanden, 31 mars 2011 - 10:26 .

[PHub88]

termokanden wrote...

PHub88 wrote...

I dont even understand why they bothered to release this DLC last? Just because it involves Reapers I guess? They almost could of gotten away with releasing this DLC had it been first...This one was by far the worst DLC released, and they saved it for last?

After finally getting to play it last night, I just have to wonder why people are complaining about Arrival. I thought it was good. Not as good as LotSB, but still fine.

The only thing that annoyed me was the stealth achievement, because I thought the varren in the beginning didn't count. I always hate stealth in non-stealth games anyway.

If it was released at another time it would be an entirely different story. Its underwhelming for being the FINAL DLC in the game. It has very little interaction...and is mostly just a straight forward shoot em up, while definatly seeming to be the shortest one as well. Plus I dont see it even being possible for anyone to even say it was better than SB DLC. As for that achievment...those Varren DONT count...you must of done something wrong? The Varren are impossible to not fight as far as I know...its only the men which count...and I must also say that its even a pointless achievment...why not a beat on insanity at least or something? It requires no effort to get...theres no timing involved what so ever...you can never step into an area too early...or too late...not to mention the guys still dont see you when your literally right in their face.

Modifié par PHub88, 31 mars 2011 - 10:28 .

[PHub88]

Foolsfolly wrote...

To OP.

While ME1 was an rpg

Correction, fine sir. ME1 was more like a third person Contra-like arcade game. You just fired your unlimited ammo in the general direction of the enemy and spammed Immunity/Lift/Singularity.

Not really engaging shooter or RPG mechanics in that system.

and ME2 was a shooter with rpg elements in it

As was the ME1 if you need to know.

if Arrival/LoTSB are any indication to what ME3 will be, ME3 will be nothing but a shooter.

LotSB was the single greatest DLC BioWare's ever released. If ME3 is anything like LotSB then bring on ME3.

And that's as far as I got in your post. Thanks for playing.

I see this sort of thing brought up a lot. I dont get why people are always so quick to shoot that type of statement down, I feel anyone who has played the games would understand the OP. Sure, ME1 was a shooter when you take into perspective a heavy aspect of the game is combat, which is shooting. But FAR more of the game was RPG involved than ME2 was...which makes it a whole lot easier to just say ME1 was an RPG with shooting in it...and ME2 is basically a downright shooter...with dialogue.

[termokanden]

PHub88 wrote...

If it was released at another time it would be an entirely different story. Its underwhelming for being the FINAL DLC in the game. It has very little interaction...and is mostly just a straight forward shoot em up, while definatly seeming to be the shortest one as well.

If we don't count the stuff that came with the Cerberus Network, Overlord has to be my least favorite DLC. Didn't like the platforming/collection while flying around. The rest of Overlord was good though.

You're right in saying Arrival is very straightforward. There aren't any real decisions to make either. You can warn the colony or not, but wait, it doesn't matter anyway. I can understand if that was disappointing.

But I just want to point out that this was a 560 point DLC. You can't expect a huge epic story for that. I liked what we did get, as straightforward as it is. Maybe we will have to disagree on that then.

As for that achievment...those Varren DONT count...you must of done something wrong?

 
I guess so. I didn't get spotted before reaching Kenson though. Weird...

The Varren are impossible to not fight as far as I know...its only the men which count...and I must also say that its even a pointless achievment...why not a beat on insanity at least or something? It requires no effort to get...theres no timing involved what so ever...you can never step into an area too early...or too late...not to mention the guys still dont see you when your literally right in their face.

That's what I meant. Leave stealth for the games with proper stealth mechanics. Gears also had a DLC with stealth and that was just annoying. Games likes the Thief series did a better job there, but they're based around it.

[Foolsfolly]

So what makes Alpha Protocol a RPG and not a shooter?

Is it because a part of your accuracy relies on a dice roll? If so, I'd rather have player skill over random number generation deciding if I score a headshot.

[DarkSeraphym]

Foolsfolly wrote...

So what makes Alpha Protocol a RPG and not a shooter?

Is it because a part of your accuracy relies on a dice roll? If so, I'd rather have player skill over random number generation deciding if I score a headshot.

Agreed.

[Phaedon]

Alpha Protocol is the worst example of how to make a shooter/RPG hybrid.
But it's a good game.

[Dominus]

It wasn't a mess from an RPG standpoint, but the shooting action aspect felt like an underwhelming remake of Metal Gear Solid.

[xSTONEYx187x]

Thompson family wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Says the person who regards ME2 as pure gold. Just because some people don't have the mental capacity or patience to handle a highly detailed inventory system  ...

Needlepoint embroidery takes more mental capacity and patience than the ME1 inventory system. A lack of desire to lose oneself in such trifles is no sign of lacking either mental capacity or patience.

I've said it before and say it again now: What really ticks RPG elitists off is that somebody, anybody can go through one playthrough of ME2 and have a Shep who's just as powerful and just as well equipped as their carefully crafted creations, honed by such gimmicks as going through multiple playthroughs to level up persuasion and intimidation abilities by being made a Spectre multiple times rather than spending any points..

Mass Effect is and should be a story-driven game in which your character is trying to save all intelligent life in the galaxy, not some digitalized version of hand-painting and dressing up porcelain dolls.

Well put. I couldn't have said it better myself.