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[The Angry One]

ToJKa1 wrote...

The story was about how the Champion became the champion. The epilogue is released later as Dragon Age 3. ...Was my impression.

And maybe if Dragon Age had always been about Hawke then that could make some sense.
Otherwise to many of us this is the story stopping to go off on a tangent about Hawke then continuing just before the game ends and we have to wait till Dragon Age 3 to find out what all this was for.

[Foolsfolly]

ToJKa1 wrote...

The story was about how the Champion became the champion. The epilogue is released later as Dragon Age 3. ...Was my impression.

No it's not.

If it was then the game should have ended with the Arishok's death and Hawke becoming the Champion. It would also mean Cassandra's questioning would have been more academic like she was trying to record the historic event and would ask how and why Hawke became a Champion not how or why Hawke started a war.

She started the game believing Hawke started the war on purpose, even bringing the Idol from the Deep Roads up on purpose.

[MKDAWUSS]

Foolsfolly wrote...

ToJKa1 wrote...

The story was about how the Champion became the champion. The epilogue is released later as Dragon Age 3. ...Was my impression.

No it's not.

If it was then the game should have ended with the Arishok's death and Hawke becoming the Champion. It would also mean Cassandra's questioning would have been more academic like she was trying to record the historic event and would ask how and why Hawke became a Champion not how or why Hawke started a war.

She started the game believing Hawke started the war on purpose, even bringing the Idol from the Deep Roads up on purpose.

There still could have been a conflict after that. People could have seen that the Qun and the Qunari weren't as bad as advertised, and as such, the Qunari start getting converts all throughout Thedas. Chantry doesn't like this one bit. Holy War begins.

IMO that had much more potential than how the Annulment War started.

[Foolsfolly]

But I wasn't talking about potential, obviously one of the most popular things about the game are the Qunari. I was just saying the plot is not about how Hawke became Champion. It just isn't.

[The Angry One]

Does anyone else feel they dropped the ball by mentioning that the Chantry was falling apart and that there were massive troubles right at the start?
I think they could've been more subtle about that myself, because we basically already know what's going to happen and spend the rest of the game until act 3 meandering about on what seems like irrelevant fluff.

[Lithuasil]

That's framed narrative for you. Kind of didn't like it either. (I did like the meandering about, but that's just me)

[The Angry One]

I actually like meandering too, but the emphasis of the BIG HORRIBLE CRISIS right at the start means that I spend that time wondering about when we're going to get to that.

Modifié par The Angry One, 31 mars 2011 - 01:58 .

[Lithuasil]

I feel with you - it's just another try of appealing to too many audiences - both those that want the overaching epic events rubbed under their noses, and those that can appreciate just being part of the world for a while.

Which is a shame - a lot, including many of the chekovs guns, would have worked better, without varrics foreshadowing.

[Foolsfolly]

Eh....eh...

Maybe.

The whole purpose doing a framed narrative like this would be to make the player wonder about how we got from Point A to Point B. And then unique to video games have the narrative show up and tell us about the affects of our actions.

That second part is why it felt like a no brainer for RPGs to use. You could cut down the epilogues simply by having the narrative tell you what happened.

The problem's pacing. The plot takes until Act 3 to happen while the player's been aware of the finale for days (or one super crazy unemployed sitting).

I think either tightening up the pacing of the game, and bringing the plot closer to the player, or cutting out the framed narrative would have been nice. To do a slow Hawke gets dragged into events in a framed narrative where we're told the results before we play as the guy is a mistake.

So.

Yeah. I guess it was a bit of a mistake to say the Chantry's in pieces and the world's on the brink of war right at the beginning. But it's only a problem because of pacing.

[The Angry One]

Yes it probably is pacing. I mean, framing like this works in a movie because you have less than 2 hours to get to the point.

[Lithuasil]

I wouldn't call DA2's pacing bad as such (aside from rushing the third act, anyway). Let's call it *insufficient* to allow for both meandering, and a working framed narrative.

[Foolsfolly]

Well, meandering is a problem in a story. If it were GTA or a TES game then it's fine. You do the story at your own pace, doing side missions or goofing off with your house instead of plot missions. But meandering with your plot missions is a huge problem.

There's a difference between 'player chooses the pace' and the 'here's an unskippable mission with nothing in common with the main quest.' Or having a whole first act of the game devoid of purpose.

Although, I liked the exploration of Kirkwall's tensions and hatreds but that never really evolves over the game. There's never any additional depth so there's really no reason for Act 1 to lack so much drive.

[Lithuasil]

What the game lacks in act one, is the sense of urgency it managed to maintain for about the very first conversation. In theory, having lost the smugglers/mercenaries protection, Hawke is in a desperate hurry here. That sense of urgency, coupled with bringing all the quests that get started here, back later - whether you did them or not (like they did the kirkwall killer), would have given the first act the necessary drive, without forcing such an amount of foreshadowing on us, and leaving how the 50 sovereigns are collected largely up to hawke.

[ZombiePowered]

Lithuasil wrote...

What the game lacks in act one, is the sense of urgency it managed to maintain for about the very first conversation. In theory, having lost the smugglers/mercenaries protection, Hawke is in a desperate hurry here. That sense of urgency, coupled with bringing all the quests that get started here, back later - whether you did them or not (like they did the kirkwall killer), would have given the first act the necessary drive, without forcing such an amount of foreshadowing on us, and leaving how the 50 sovereigns are collected largely up to hawke.

Agreed here. I liked the first act and the way it was contructed, but it needed two things. One was Templars chasing Hawke/Bethany (since protection against the Templars is allegedly why Hawke wants in on the expedition in the first place), and the other was an introduction to Orsino and Meredith. Seeing an argument between the two where Hawke cannot say anything would be a nice contrast between them vying for your favor in the beginning of Act III. The other two acts progressed quite nicely, I thought, but while I understood the reasons for Hawke wanting to be a part of the expedition, I never felt the drive that gave those reasons urgency.

[Tainan7509]

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