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[Obadiah]

Kijin wrote...

Obadiah wrote...

Kijin wrote...
...
The Maker imprisoned the Old Gods after the Tevinter Magisters approached the Golden City, not before.
...

Where does it say that? That's not in the codex entries, and it's not in the front page of this topic. I'm pretty sure any fair reading of the Old Gods codex entry would lead one to believe the Old Gods were imprisoned when the Tevinter Magisters contacted them.

I have already posted a link to the information I was referencing, but here is part of the timeline: 

1 TE: The Tevinter Imperium is created with the crowning of the first Archon

800 TE: The first effort to free the Old Gods from their underground prisons is undertaken by the most powerful magister lords, who open a gate to the Golden City at the heart of the Fade. The result is catastrophic, destroying the Golden City and letting the taint into the world, creating the first darkspawn. The Old God Dumat is freed and transformed into the first archdemon. The First Blight begins. The darkspawn attack en masse, concentrating at first on the underground Deep Roads used by the dwarven kingdoms. As the dwarven kingdoms begin to fall, the darkspawn use the Deep Roads to appear throughout the continent. All of the Imperium is under siege and in a state of chaos. Finally, the nations of the Imperium begin to settle in for a long war as they become accustomed to the surges of the darkspawn. Communication becomes difficult across the Imperium, but cooperation is paramount. The people of Tevinter pray to the remaining Old Gods for help against Dumat, but they receive only silence. The people’s faith waning, unrest sees many temples destroyed as the Imperial people begin to turn from the Old Gods, believing themselves betrayed.

1000 TE: Slowly, the last of the darkspawn hordes are defeated. They are forced into the Far Steppes west of the Anderfels and into the Deep Roads. For the dwarves, the war continues underground, but for humanity, the battle is believed to be over. Weak after centuries of fighting, the Imperium is ripe to be attacked.

That says the Old Gods were imprisoned at the time the Tevinter Magisters tried to open the Gate to Heaven, not that the Maker imprisoned them after the Tevinter Magisters opened the gates to the Golden City.

The imprisonment of the Old Gods and the casting down of the Tevinter Magisters into darkspawn are two separate events.

Modifié par Obadiah, 05 avril 2011 - 02:58 .

[Kijin]

Obadiah wrote...

Kijin wrote...

Obadiah wrote...

Kijin wrote...
...
The Maker imprisoned the Old Gods after the Tevinter Magisters approached the Golden City, not before.
...

Where does it say that? That's not in the codex entries, and it's not in the front page of this topic. I'm pretty sure any fair reading of the Old Gods codex entry would lead one to believe the Old Gods were imprisoned when the Tevinter Magisters contacted them.

I have already posted a link to the information I was referencing, but here is part of the timeline: 

1 TE: The Tevinter Imperium is created with the crowning of the first Archon

800 TE: The first effort to free the Old Gods from their underground prisons is undertaken by the most powerful magister lords, who open a gate to the Golden City at the heart of the Fade. The result is catastrophic, destroying the Golden City and letting the taint into the world, creating the first darkspawn. The Old God Dumat is freed and transformed into the first archdemon. The First Blight begins. The darkspawn attack en masse, concentrating at first on the underground Deep Roads used by the dwarven kingdoms. As the dwarven kingdoms begin to fall, the darkspawn use the Deep Roads to appear throughout the continent. All of the Imperium is under siege and in a state of chaos. Finally, the nations of the Imperium begin to settle in for a long war as they become accustomed to the surges of the darkspawn. Communication becomes difficult across the Imperium, but cooperation is paramount. The people of Tevinter pray to the remaining Old Gods for help against Dumat, but they receive only silence. The people’s faith waning, unrest sees many temples destroyed as the Imperial people begin to turn from the Old Gods, believing themselves betrayed.

1000 TE: Slowly, the last of the darkspawn hordes are defeated. They are forced into the Far Steppes west of the Anderfels and into the Deep Roads. For the dwarves, the war continues underground, but for humanity, the battle is believed to be over. Weak after centuries of fighting, the Imperium is ripe to be attacked.

That says the Old Gods were imprisoned at the time the Tevinter Magisters tried to open the Gate to Heaven, not that the Maker imprisoned them after the Tevinter Magisters opened the Gates to the Golden City.

The imprisonment of the Old Gods and the casting down of the Tevinter Magisters into darkspawn are two separate events.

Yup you're right, my timeline was messed up. The Maker casting down the Old Gods predates the Tevinter Magisters approaching the Golden City. For some reason, I thought the two events happend simultaneously - probably because the sealing of the Old Gods occured before written history, as I cannot find a date for it. That was my bad.

Edit: Apparently the Old Gods communicated with their followers through the Fade, which I should have known - so they told the Magisters to approach the Golden City. Which led to the Taint being unleashed - and the rest is history I suppose. 

Modifié par Kijin, 05 avril 2011 - 03:07 .

[Obadiah]

Kijin wrote...
...
Apparently the Old Gods communicated with their followers through the Fade, which I should have known - so they told the Magisters to approach the Golden City. Which led to the Taint being unleashed - and the rest is history I suppose. 

That would make sense. After all, that's where the Warden was (dreaming, and therefore in the Fade) when he got visions of the Archdemon.

[lorvincent]

http://social.biowar...39587/1#6939587

Just another theory.  It includes all my current beliefs that dragons were sentient, and Flemeth is a dragon, dragons returning, etc.

Whether the Old Gods were dragons or not, I am unsure though.  Either way, this post is extremely speculative, and that is what it is meant for.  Go have a look, consider the facts I listed, and draw your own conclusions for posting.  I am interested what you guys think of everything.  Ultimately, we know too little to call this a theory, and it is more just random speculation (even though I am positive I use the word theory once in that article)

Modifié par lorvincent, 05 avril 2011 - 05:52 .

[Blacklash93]

Big bump. No one likes talking about the lore here...

It's worth noting that Dragons infected with the taint (dragon thralls) can use a "Blood Magic" ability in and Reaver abilities.

[Obadiah]

Is that what those dragon thralls are? Always wondered about that....

[Torax]

 David Gaider talks about Old Gods and what not.

[King Killoth]

I have a theary about Flemeth and her dragon form. We dont realy know how the old gods slumber. My idea is that they get a mortal looking shell. their dragon mind is asleep and they have a shell mind. Flemeth is an old god who awoke centerys ago. useing her true mind in conflict with her shell mind she whent insain. if you lisen to flemeths story its only after her husband is killed by the king she was sold to that she gets her great power and knowlage. thats would explane how she can know things about the world no other could. this also makes me think that sandel is an old god that is still asleep. as bodhan says he just found him standing in the deep roads alone. and every time sandle is attacked he utterly whipes out those who attack him. not to mention his powers of enchantment. it would also explane the old lady speach and his profacy. the scary old lady is flemeth trying to wake the old god with in him. and the proficy is part of what the old god in him can see. thats just my theary

[Torax]

In Flemeth's version of the story, she suggested the deal and only turned on the Lord for breaking his end of the Bargain. Promises are one of the strongest and most terrible powers according to Marethari. I wouldn't go as far as to thinking Old Gods are slumbering in people. If that is the case they wouldn't have needed to be trapped under ground by the Maker. It is possible that the Forgotten Ones or the Tevinter's Old Gods to have been dragons in their full form. But I wouldn't go as far as to think the Dread Wolf or the Pantheon were also dragons. They were diametrically apposed to the Forgotten Ones. Not the same types in creation.

Now it is believed by Elves that Spirits and Demons are one and the same. The one true thing that Gaider seemed to imply is the Pantheon and the Old Gods are not the same at all down to their source. Which could be true for the Forgotten Ones and the Pantheons. But to assume they are all walking around in minds of mortals? That I don't see at all.

[Blacklash93]

Flemeth may be far older than we assume. Her misadventures in the legends could just be one of her many lifetimes.

[TOBY FLENDERSON]

I agree but I also believe the old gods had a duel existence in dragon forms and human forms like Flemeth. Flemeth is almost certainly an old god, and Morrigans kid is most assuredly one given Flemeths Grimoire and Uthenriel (the archdemons) essence. I also suspect the old gods have some relationship to the dalish gods given Merithari's familiarity with Flemeth (Ashabelenor).

[Obadiah]

Torax wrote...

 David Gaider talks about Old Gods and what not.

Can't believe that thread only lasted 5 pages.

[The Big Nothing]

Dragons are real.

We just need to believe in them before they will return.

[Blacklash93]

Massive bump. This was an interesting discussion. I'd like to see it continued.

There has to be a connection between the Old Gods and regular dragons. My theory is that dragons ruled over the ancient world of Thedas and then... something happended that coincided with the imprisonment of the Old Gods that took away their magic and even intelligence. It greatly shortened their lifespan or perhaps even immortality (especially of males) preventing them from becoming like the Old Gods. Flemeth is one of those ancient dragons that somehow survived that calamity.