1529 réponses à ce sujet

[Synobal]

You're all forgetting that if someone isn't a sacrificial lamb the Batarians are going to war, with the alliance possibly with council support. I can see Shepard submitting to a trail to prevent a war that the galaxy can't afford in the face of the coming Reaper invasion.

[Zulu_DFA]

Sparroww wrote...

Anyone considered the possibility that wherever Shep could be held in custody before any sort of trial that the a group of Batarians raid the prison in an attempt to capture and interrogate Shepard themselves?

Getting ambushed by Batarians and in need of a prison break would be a good way to start of ME3 than Shep voluntarily going to a human court when in honesty as 'humanity's saviour' shouldn't have to answer for helping his own race.

Yes, voluntary going to the trial, knowing you're going to be a scapegoat, stinks. Because you can be just as much of a scapegoat by refusing to go to trial and becoming a "fugitive from justice".

But going to the trial voluntarily makes sense for at least the "lawful good" Shepards, while having the trial of any kind of Shepard on Earth makes absolutely no sense in the ME universe.

[SalsaDMA]

Almostfaceman wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

From the wiki, regarding Spectres:

Spectres Edit Spectres sectionEdit

    Main article: Spectres

The Council's elite, invested with the Council's authority, Spectres are vital to keeping the peace across Citadel space. They are individuals who act either on the Council's orders or on their own initiative, to preserve galactic stability. Sometimes, in situations where the Council cannot be seen to act officially, they will send a Spectre instead. Spectres have absolute freedom under the law and answer only to the Council. All details of them are classified.

I underlined the interesting parts.

Trial on earth my ass:sick:

If there is a trial, it won't be because it's a legal matter - politics/diplomacy will definitley be the motivator.

Ad that 'politic/diplomacy' will be.... believing a well known citadel war hero on active duty to preserve galactic stability might be the cause of what is literally a terroist attack that destabilizes relations between 2 galactic species?

Compared to... say....

Believing a well known pro-human anti-alien terroist cell called Cerberus were the perpetrators? Especially considering that the batarians knew there was a whole cell of humans operating in their system and knowing that this cell had plans for conducting such an attack, and had known for a while, yet just couldn't find the base of operations for this cell?


No. It doesn't make sense in any way to suddenly pin everything on Shepard.

None. What. So. Ever.

It's extremely sloppy writing that we are even having this debate, as the 'go to trial on earth' comment should never have happened in the first place in the game.

[Almostfaceman]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

From the wiki, regarding Spectres:

Spectres Edit Spectres sectionEdit

    Main article: Spectres

The Council's elite, invested with the Council's authority, Spectres are vital to keeping the peace across Citadel space. They are individuals who act either on the Council's orders or on their own initiative, to preserve galactic stability. Sometimes, in situations where the Council cannot be seen to act officially, they will send a Spectre instead. Spectres have absolute freedom under the law and answer only to the Council. All details of them are classified.

I underlined the interesting parts.

Trial on earth my ass:sick:

If there is a trial, it won't be because it's a legal matter - politics/diplomacy will definitley be the motivator.

Ad that 'politic/diplomacy' will be.... believing a well known citadel war hero on active duty to preserve galactic stability might be the cause of what is literally a terroist attack that destabilizes relations between 2 galactic species?

Compared to... say....

Believing a well known pro-human anti-alien terroist cell called Cerberus were the perpetrators? Especially considering that the batarians knew there was a whole cell of humans operating in their system and knowing that this cell had plans for conducting such an attack, and had known for a while, yet just couldn't find the base of operations for this cell?


No. It doesn't make sense in any way to suddenly pin everything on Shepard.

None. What. So. Ever.

It's extremely sloppy writing that we are even having this debate, as the 'go to trial on earth' comment should never have happened in the first place in the game.

You're entitled to your opinion, but you may want to consider that you haven't seen the writing yet in ME3 - so it's impossible to judge that writing.

Regardless of whether you like it or not, the odds are pretty good this trial on Earth is going to happen.

[SalsaDMA]

Almostfaceman wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

From the wiki, regarding Spectres:

Spectres Edit Spectres sectionEdit

    Main article: Spectres

The Council's elite, invested with the Council's authority, Spectres are vital to keeping the peace across Citadel space. They are individuals who act either on the Council's orders or on their own initiative, to preserve galactic stability. Sometimes, in situations where the Council cannot be seen to act officially, they will send a Spectre instead. Spectres have absolute freedom under the law and answer only to the Council. All details of them are classified.

I underlined the interesting parts.

Trial on earth my ass:sick:

If there is a trial, it won't be because it's a legal matter - politics/diplomacy will definitley be the motivator.

Ad that 'politic/diplomacy' will be.... believing a well known citadel war hero on active duty to preserve galactic stability might be the cause of what is literally a terroist attack that destabilizes relations between 2 galactic species?

Compared to... say....

Believing a well known pro-human anti-alien terroist cell called Cerberus were the perpetrators? Especially considering that the batarians knew there was a whole cell of humans operating in their system and knowing that this cell had plans for conducting such an attack, and had known for a while, yet just couldn't find the base of operations for this cell?


No. It doesn't make sense in any way to suddenly pin everything on Shepard.

None. What. So. Ever.

It's extremely sloppy writing that we are even having this debate, as the 'go to trial on earth' comment should never have happened in the first place in the game.

You're entitled to your opinion, but you may want to consider that you haven't seen the writing yet in ME3 - so it's impossible to judge that writing.

Regardless of whether you like it or not, the odds are pretty good this trial on Earth is going to happen.

Considering how illogical the leap of logic Hackett made in arrival was, I'm not holding my breath for quality writing, tbh.

Sure.. It'll be dramatic and all, with music to underline it proper, but with flaws this big in the writing already for setting the start of ME3 I seriously doubt much thought have been put into the story. Whether this is because they have been under too much pressure from a timetable or what, I can't tell, the evidence is plain to see in cheesehole fest that is arrival, though.

[Zulu_DFA]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Considering how illogical the leap of logic Hackett made in arrival was, I'm not holding my breath for quality writing, tbh.

Sure.. It'll be dramatic and all, with music to underline it proper, but with flaws this big in the writing already for setting the start of ME3 I seriously doubt much thought have been put into the story. Whether this is because they have been under too much pressure from a timetable or what, I can't tell, the evidence is plain to see in cheesehole fest that is arrival, though.

^THIS.


Also:

SalsaDMA wrote...

cheesehole

This thread needed this pic, badly!

Modifié par Zulu_DFA, 02 avril 2011 - 11:29 .

[FlyingSquirrel]

Wouldn't the trial being held on Earth probably be mostly for symbolic value? The issue here probably wouldn't be so much who Shepard's "employer" was at the time of the mass relay explosion or who has jurisdiction over Shepard's actions, but simply that a human blew up the relay and the batarians would see it as an Alliance/humanity-based attack.

Sure, you can argue that Shepard is a Spectre and therefore under the Council's authority (if your Shepard was reinstated as a Spectre), but Shepard is also an Alliance "citizen," and the Alliance would be facing pressure to do something about an incident like this, especially since the Council would likely just refuse to take any responsibility for it.

[Zulu_DFA]

FlyingSquirrel wrote...

Wouldn't the trial being held on Earth probably be mostly for symbolic value?

NO.

In my (and the default) version of ME2&3 the Humans control the Citadel. Earth is an irrelevant blue planet.

FlyingSquirrel wrote...

The issue here probably wouldn't be so much who Shepard's "employer" was at the time of the mass relay explosion or who has jurisdiction over Shepard's actions, but simply that a human blew up the relay and the batarians would see it as an Alliance/humanity-based attack.

The Alliance, the political body of Humanity on the Galactic stage is based on the Arcturus Station.

The Batarian nemesis, the Alliance Navy has headquarters at the Arcturus Station.

Any Batarians that might have ever had any official bilateral talks/business with the Humans would have come to the Arcturus Station for that.

FlyingSquirrel wrote...

Sure, you can argue that Shepard is a Spectre and therefore under the Council's authority (if your Shepard was reinstated as a Spectre), but Shepard is also an Alliance "citizen," and the Alliance would be facing pressure to do something about an incident like this, especially since the Council would likely just refuse to take any responsibility for it.

Then Shepards spectre status has to be revoked first. Otherwise, the Alliance simply can't take that risk - manhandle a Council agent.

The way I see it:

• Shepard = SpecTRe; Council = Old. Trial on the Citadel, nuff said.
• Shepard = not SpecTRe; Council = Old. Trial on the Arcturus Station, as the Council doen't want to take the responsibility for Shepard's action.
• Shepard = SpecTRe,  Council = New. Trial on the Arcturus Station, as Udina wants to downplay the significance of the SpecTRes (Alliance >> SpecTRes)
• Shepard = not SpecTRe; Council = New. Trial on the Citadel, as Udina wants to show who's boss in the Galaxy, and a "just" boss at that.

It's also worth noting that the Alliance should be only happy, if this problem is dealt with by the Council. That would allow the Alliance to avoid assuming the responsibility. It's much better than having scapegoat, and AFAIK, it was the very reason Hackett chose Shepard for the mission.

But Earth is not a place for this trial in any case.

Modifié par Zulu_DFA, 03 avril 2011 - 02:36 .

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Shepard's still not technically/officially alive (if you listen to the news stations, etc. the Council does not confirm his existence and he's still assumed dead)... so the trial on Earth could be political.

The fact that Shepard is alive has a crapstorm swirling around it on its own... yet alone tying that to the mass murder of Batarians.

Modifié par Mr. Gogeta34, 03 avril 2011 - 04:29 .

[schwarzaj]

There seems to be one basic point that nearly everyone has missed here. Shepard was found to be working for Cerberus after a two year absence. The "Trial" that Hackett was talking about may very well be more about Shepard's involvement with Cerberus then the actual actions in Arrival. When you consider that the DLC in ME1 had little to no impact in ME2, then the actual impact that Arrival will have on the rest of the story in ME3 is questionable, IMO. Also, depending on whether or not your Shepard is a Specter, like mine is, the trial could range from a future version of a US Senate Hearing to an actual tribunal. As stated by many of you, if Shepard is a Specter, a person who is literally above galactic law, then his actions can not be held as illegal, especially considering that the victims of Shepard's actions in Arrival where of a non-Citadel race, making the whole "Citadel would hold the trial" argument a bit mute. Speaking of the Citadel Trial argument, before Shepard is inducted into the Specters, the Council flat out denied Udina's request for a combined Citadel member fleet to enter the Atican Traverse. Why? Because the Geth attacks were of human colonies, making the issue a purely human matter. While in some ways it looks like a dick move, the logic behind the argument is actually sound. Human colonies under Alliance protection are being attacked. Why can't the Alliance fleet go in and defend them? Plus, when you actually see the scene with Udina's famous "This is and outrage!" line, your coming into the argument near the end, meaning you really only get the sound bites of the debate. The purpose of pointing that part of ME1 out is simple. The Batarians have an antagonistic diplomatic relationship with humans. Thus, it's a human issue. If you read the Cerberus Daily News bits that went on for a year, you see that a Turian uprising on a Turian controlled planet is quelled by by the Truian Hierarchy, not the combined forces of the Citadel. This confirms that the Council's stance in ME1 still applied in ME2, regardless of whether you saved the Council, like I did, or let them die, and that it applied to Council member races as well. Finally, you have to remember that the Council told Shepard that he can be a Specter again if he keeps his actions within the Terminous Systems. Last time I checked, the Terminous included the Batarians, meaning that Shepard was following the directives given to him by the Council at the start of ME2.

All of this evidence, plus the fact that your ENTIRE MISSION WAS DONE WITH NONE OF YOUR SQUAD MATES IN THE MOST ADVANCED STEALTH FRIGATE IN THE ENTIRE GALAXY, makes the concept of Shepard's "trial" just about the events that took place in Arrival false.

[Fixers0]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

FlyingSquirrel wrote...

Wouldn't the trial being held on Earth probably be mostly for symbolic value?

NO.

In my (and the default) version of ME2&3 the Humans control the Citadel. Earth is an irrelevant blue planet.

FlyingSquirrel wrote...

The issue here probably wouldn't be so much who Shepard's "employer" was at the time of the mass relay explosion or who has jurisdiction over Shepard's actions, but simply that a human blew up the relay and the batarians would see it as an Alliance/humanity-based attack.

The Alliance, the political body of Humanity on the Galactic stage is based on the Arcturus Station.

The Batarian nemesis, the Alliance Navy has headquarters at the Arcturus Station.

Any Batarians that might have ever had any official bilateral talks/business with the Humans would have come to the Arcturus Station for that.

FlyingSquirrel wrote...

Sure, you can argue that Shepard is a Spectre and therefore under the Council's authority (if your Shepard was reinstated as a Spectre), but Shepard is also an Alliance "citizen," and the Alliance would be facing pressure to do something about an incident like this, especially since the Council would likely just refuse to take any responsibility for it.

Then Shepards spectre status has to be revoked first. Otherwise, the Alliance simply can't take that risk - manhandle a Council agent.

The way I see it:

• Shepard = SpecTRe; Council = Old. Trial on the Citadel, nuff said.
• Shepard = not SpecTRe; Council = Old. Trial on the Arcturus Station, as the Council doen't want to take the responsibility for Shepard's action.
• Shepard = SpecTRe,  Council = New. Trial on the Arcturus Station, as Udina wants to downplay the significance of the SpecTRes (Alliance >> SpecTRes)
• Shepard = not SpecTRe; Council = New. Trial on the Citadel, as Udina wants to show who's boss in the Galaxy, and a "just" boss at that.

It's also worth noting that the Alliance should be only happy, if this problem is dealt with by the Council. That would allow the Alliance to avoid assuming the responsibility. It's much better than having scapegoat, and AFAIK, it was the very reason Hackett chose Shepard for the mission.

But Earth is not a place for this trial in any case.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              The problem is Shepard can only a spectre with a new council if Anderson is made councilor, Also the crew on the on Project base was alliance personel, and the Batarians knew that.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                         Other then that, i think the symbolic value on earth does indeed matter for the writers, and while Arcturus is more lore consistand, it's evidenced by ME2 that you can retcon as much as you want, just make a good presenation that will cover it up.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Also as i said a few pages earlier maybe you should create a poll of what is more important to humanity: Earth or Arcturus. 

Modifié par Fixers0, 03 avril 2011 - 08:10 .

[Dracotamer]

They set it up for the Citadel so I hope it is there.

[ifander]

I think people are reading too much into this. This court martial is just for show/to appease the batarians. Where it's held is irrelevant. Sure, Arcturus is the "capital" of the Systems Alliance, but Earth is still the Homeworld, and as we all know, symbolically, Homeworld > Capital. I think the average court martial/slap on the hands would be held on Arcturus, if only because it's closer to the other systems, but for the event to truly carry some weight the Alliance might opt to hold the trial on Earth. There really are far greater problems, lore and story wise, in this series than this.

A bigger issue for me is with my Shep's who are still in the Spectres. Then it makes absolutely no sense to hold the trial in the Allliance, since ultimately Shepard answers to the Council. Unless they simply cut ties with Shep and turn him over. Which would ****** me off, since being a Spectre has little to no effect on the story as it is. 

It doesn't matter much to me wether the trial is held on Earth or Arcturus. What I would like is for it to be held either in the Alliance or on the Citadel, depending on whether you're a Spectre or not. And Shepard should be allowed to choose to "face the music" (paragon) or disobey orders and go all renegade "I'll save your asses wether you like it or not, you ungrateful pricks". I won't hold my breath though...

[oksbad]

ifander wrote...

I think people are reading too much into this. This court martial is just for show/to appease the batarians. Where it's held is irrelevant. Sure, Arcturus is the "capital" of the Systems Alliance, but Earth is still the Homeworld, and as we all know, symbolically, Homeworld > Capital. I think the average court martial/slap on the hands would be held on Arcturus, if only because it's closer to the other systems, but for the event to truly carry some weight the Alliance might opt to hold the trial on Earth. There really are far greater problems, lore and story wise, in this series than this.

A bigger issue for me is with my Shep's who are still in the Spectres. Then it makes absolutely no sense to hold the trial in the Allliance, since ultimately Shepard answers to the Council. Unless they simply cut ties with Shep and turn him over. Which would ****** me off, since being a Spectre has little to no effect on the story as it is. 

It doesn't matter much to me wether the trial is held on Earth or Arcturus. What I would like is for it to be held either in the Alliance or on the Citadel, depending on whether you're a Spectre or not. And Shepard should be allowed to choose to "face the music" (paragon) or disobey orders and go all renegade "I'll save your asses wether you like it or not, you ungrateful pricks". I won't hold my breath though...

This x 100

[SalsaDMA]

Even if we ignore all the other points of debates I'd like to point out something:

Bahak system: ~300,000 Batarians died in the incident.
This appearantly calls for a major political 'show'

Terra Nova: 4.4 million Humans lived on the planet tageted by the x57 incident, only prevented from happening by a happenstance Shepard stumbling through the Asgard system.
This gets a single linesfeed in the news section with no politcal actions whatsoever...

Am I the only one having a hard time to see the reasoning for needing a scapegoat undet these circumstances? Trying a terroist stunt on humans that amount to almost 15 times the severity results in a shrug on the shoulder, yet the Bahak incident demands that 'blood' be put on the table?

Bahak versus Balak just seems totally out of place in reactions provoked, even despite the writers obviously refering to the old incident with lots of subtle hints.

[ifander]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Even if we ignore all the other points of debates I'd like to point out something:

Bahak system: ~300,000 Batarians died in the incident.
This appearantly calls for a major political 'show'

Terra Nova: 4.4 million Humans lived on the planet tageted by the x57 incident, only prevented from happening by a happenstance Shepard stumbling through the Asgard system.
This gets a single linesfeed in the news section with no politcal actions whatsoever...

Am I the only one having a hard time to see the reasoning for needing a scapegoat undet these circumstances? Trying a terroist stunt on humans that amount to almost 15 times the severity results in a shrug on the shoulder, yet the Bahak incident demands that 'blood' be put on the table?

Bahak versus Balak just seems totally out of place in reactions provoked, even despite the writers obviously refering to the old incident with lots of subtle hints.

To be fair, the Terra Nova incident was prevented. Also, Balak was not (officially) acting on behalf of the Hedgemony. The same excuse could probably be used with Shepard, but in Shep's case, 300 000 batarians did die, and that makes all the difference in the world. Another thing to consider: the Alliance is subject to the Citadel conventions/regulations/what have you, and the Hedgemony isn't. What applies to one doesn't necessarily apply to the other. Regardless, I'm starting to think this is not all about the batarians. As evidenced by the dossiers in LotSB, there's some grumbling in the Alliance to get rid of Shepard. Maybe this incident is just an excuse to get rid of her.

[Asheer_Khan]

I think it's time to visit Geth Prime (or whoever is the "leader" of the Geth), made contact with Queen and ask Wrex for couple Krogan Battlemasters as personal Guard and then head to Earth at front of small armada...

I seriously start questioning level of story writing for ME...
Apparently current lead writer and his team have NOT a slightest idea how to create plausible story lore without creating more cheese holes in already full of holes one...

For the first time i agree with Zulu that this whole earth trial idea have as same logic... oh wait... there IS no logic in this...

And like many pointed here earth is LAST place in the whole god damn galaxy which have any legal legitimacy to hold such trial... but i can already see 'explanation" for those events handed over by CHudson or M.Walters...

"You wanted to see Earth in ME game".

Yes, many wanted to see earth but NOT under another IDIOT BALL events pulled out to give a reason to go there.

Last thing i wanted to see in ME 3 is some sort "Drumhead trial" pulled out of blue by writers to excuse thier apparent lack of fresh ideas how to pull forward whole story...
I known it's already too late for anything since ME 3 is practicly ready so this whole "trial" idea give me one more pint on my veeery long list of negatives which will keep me out of buying ME 3 until i will read PLAYERS MADE reviews of the game including every even smallest spoilers...

[sponge56]

A quick question, if the council does not authorise a spectre's mission (eg the arrival mission) then does this mean that the council has any responsibility for their actions? If they don't then doesn't a trial at the citadel make no sense as the council would essentially be punishing someone for a crime committed outside council space against a non council race by one of their agents who they never sent there in the first place. The council would surely want to stay as far away from this incident as possible. Also, a trial on Arcturus station is surely admitting to the fact that 'an alliance soldier did this, it is the alliance's fault' whereas a trial on earth suggests that 'this was a human's fault'. It seems to make perfect political sense to have the trial on earth.

[xSTONEYx187x]

It's always Zulu looking to put a downer on this forum with his constanst negativity.

[SalsaDMA]

sponge56 wrote...

A quick question, if the council does not authorise a spectre's mission (eg the arrival mission) then does this mean that the council has any responsibility for their actions?

Spectres are asked to act on their own initiative without pestering the council all the time. If anything, he is operating in the Terminus systems which he was specifically asked to do by the council, which would indicate he was working on direct orders to any outsider.

Heck, whenever we hear about spectre work we get th eimpression that in general they are just not liked by the common fold, but more feared because of their abilities to work without repercusions from the law.

In ME1, the council flat out asks Shepard if he is prepared to sacrifice innocent lives when needs be, as that is part of what spectres do.

Also, if you play an earthborn in ME1, you get a side assignment with a guy from a gang Shepard appearantly used to belong to in his past. You can get a confrontation going then where you talk with a Turian and the 'gangster' confronts you and threatens you with verbal accusations. At this point the Turian flat out expects you to shoot the guy in cold blood, cause that's what Spectres do...

[RGFrog]

There won't be a trial. The Reapers were minutes away from the system. The next closest system with a mass effect relay is SOL or as it is in game Local Cluster.

It may not be an "alpha" relay (or is it?) but there won't be time for a trial nor enough time for it to matter.

Shep may be recalled back to earth but the reapers will be there already or shortly thereafter.

Now, to the plot problems. This was an ultra black operation to begin with. That means no records. Any and all evidence was wiped clean when the relay went critical and caused a super-nova like event.

From the evidence in the game, the only thing that might have gotten away was the shuttle that took off just before Shep arrived at the com. tower. In a race to escape, did the occupants think to take evidence of what the project was and proof that it was Shep. that pressed the big red shiny button?

All the Batarians that saw Shep are dead. Either killed by during the escape or during the super-nova. Presumably all that knew anything about the "Project" are dead.

The only two characters that we know for certain are alive are Hacket and Shep. Since Hacket refused to take or read Shep's report, he can't even say what happened for sure. The only thing Hacket can testify to is that he sent a black ops team to the system.

[sponge56]

SalsaDMA wrote...

sponge56 wrote...

A quick question, if the council does not authorise a spectre's mission (eg the arrival mission) then does this mean that the council has any responsibility for their actions?

Spectres are asked to act on their own initiative without pestering the council all the time. If anything, he is operating in the Terminus systems which he was specifically asked to do by the council, which would indicate he was working on direct orders to any outsider.

Heck, whenever we hear about spectre work we get th eimpression that in general they are just not liked by the common fold, but more feared because of their abilities to work without repercusions from the law.

In ME1, the council flat out asks Shepard if he is prepared to sacrifice innocent lives when needs be, as that is part of what spectres do.

Also, if you play an earthborn in ME1, you get a side assignment with a guy from a gang Shepard appearantly used to belong to in his past. You can get a confrontation going then where you talk with a Turian and the 'gangster' confronts you and threatens you with verbal accusations. At this point the Turian flat out expects you to shoot the guy in cold blood, cause that's what Spectres do...

I think there must be a limit though. eg spectres can shoot people who get in their way but they surely cannot be be able to blow up whole mass relays and wipe out an entire system and get away with it. especialy against a threat that the council says dosen't exist such as the reapers

[SalsaDMA]

sponge56 wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

sponge56 wrote...

A quick question, if the council does not authorise a spectre's mission (eg the arrival mission) then does this mean that the council has any responsibility for their actions?

Spectres are asked to act on their own initiative without pestering the council all the time. If anything, he is operating in the Terminus systems which he was specifically asked to do by the council, which would indicate he was working on direct orders to any outsider.

Heck, whenever we hear about spectre work we get th eimpression that in general they are just not liked by the common fold, but more feared because of their abilities to work without repercusions from the law.

In ME1, the council flat out asks Shepard if he is prepared to sacrifice innocent lives when needs be, as that is part of what spectres do.

Also, if you play an earthborn in ME1, you get a side assignment with a guy from a gang Shepard appearantly used to belong to in his past. You can get a confrontation going then where you talk with a Turian and the 'gangster' confronts you and threatens you with verbal accusations. At this point the Turian flat out expects you to shoot the guy in cold blood, cause that's what Spectres do...

I think there must be a limit though. eg spectres can shoot people who get in their way but they surely cannot be be able to blow up whole mass relays and wipe out an entire system and get away with it. especialy against a threat that the council says dosen't exist such as the reapers

The only evidence that can exist points to a human cell of terroists that was residing on a hidden base in the bahak system.

Going from: "Shepard was in the system" to "Shepard must be responsible for carrying out a plan we know was well under way before he ever set his foot in the system" is quite the leap of logic.

Besides, Spectres act under a 'by any means necesary' clause to ensure galactic peace. If that peace comes at the cost of innocent lives, so be it. The council themselves have even pointed this out to Shepard.

[Reever]

Was just too entertaining to see Zulu and Saphra Deden go at it =D (while listening to Metallica´s Am I Evil xD)

As for the actual problem discussed in this thread: I say wait and see. There could be a plausible explanation, or not.
I for one don´t really care, as long as the rest of the game doesn´t look like the swiss cheese pic Zulu posted.

Still, I don´t think that the "little blue planet" is regarded to be as insignificant as Zulu says. That´s not even what the Codex says. But whatever...

Wizz wrote...

You guys are ignoring the fact that there is also shuttle full of indocrinated scientiest, who esaped from asteroid

That´s something I thought about as well. I don´t think that only scientists escaped, but there are some indoctrinated folks in that shuttle. Wonder what they´re up to... (they´re possibly gonna die, if the reapers gave up on them / can´t control them anymore...)

[v3paR]

i don't know if it was mentioned before but does any one consider "the trial" as simple hearing to set events in ME3. at the beginning of the game Shepard will be called to earth (so fans could see it) probably to answer a few questions about his past decisions (the important ones). this way players who played ME1/ME2 could confirm their actions (probably from save game) and new players will have some sort of "the story so far" info. we have similar thing in ME2 with Miranda.