1529 réponses à ce sujet

[Sajuro]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Sajuro wrote...

Here's a reason, if they (the council, the alliance, whoever) wants him to be tried on earth, shep gets tried on earth.

And where is the reason for the Council, the Alliance or whoever to want him be tried on Earth - away from where the most important political and military figures seat?

Elementary Zulu, we already know the Alliance brass think the Reapers are real and I personally believe that the other races know it too (lied to Shepard to keep a mass hysteria from happening and he was with puppy-rus). They know Shepard is the reason we were able to beat Sovereign but after his shenanigans in Arrival (to put it lightly) there will be several people demanding that Shepard be put on trial and locked away. The Council, knowing we are in deep s#it if Shepard can't counter the Reapers, and if he is in a citadel jail guess where they will go after first, so they say, "fine, the human will be tried on Earth and serve out his sentence there". They take whatever blowback comes from that and move Shepard to Earth, staging an attempt for his crew to bust in and rescue him. They then declare him to be a rogue Spectre and send someone like the VI 'after' him, thus in game giving you the chance to recruit the VI when they catch up to you, since everyone important knows it is a farce.

[Almostfaceman]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

name-calling

Where?

No wonder you can't find the resoures Earth produces - you can't even find where you name-called.

That's because you're not helping me!

Show me where I name-called, and show me where Earth exports its products.

And not only that here's a few more questions:
If Earth is a big suck-hole - why are the colonies sending them any resources?
If Earth has little to no influence on the Alliance - why are all these resources flowing to Earth?  
Why aren't they flowing to Arcturus Station?  
Why hasn't the Alliance embargo'd Earth and confisicated all those resources flowing into Earth?
If Earth is nothing more than an Alliance colony - why do the other colonies give a rats' patootie about Earth?  Why not keep all the resources for themselves?
Why would the Alliance guard these colonies and Earth if Earth is a big suck hole with no influence or little influence on the Alliance?

[Someone With Mass]

Zulu_DFA wrote...
Um, the Alliance fleet is the Alliance's fleet. It took action without Earth's authorities consent during the FCW, thus proving the de facto independence of Earth, reindorces three years later by the establishment of the Alliance Parliamnet.

EVIDENCE! YOU MUST PRESENT EVIDENCE!

See, I can play your stupid game too.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 12 avril 2011 - 05:41 .

[Someone With Mass]

Zulu_DFA wrote...
The Alliance builds it's own ships now, at the Arcturus Station. They've been churning out a new dreadnought every year. The Alliance isn't like the Quarians, you know, who live aboard ancient dilapidated craft to cling to their fantom "homeworld".

I guess I should have dumbed it down.

Back then. You know, before the FCW. Not now. Before. In the PAST.

[Nashiktal]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...
Um, the Alliance fleet is the Alliance's fleet. It took action without Earth's authorities consent during the FCW, thus proving the de facto independence of Earth, reindorces three years later by the establishment of the Alliance Parliamnet.

EVIDENCE! YOU MUST PRESENT EVIDENCE!

See, I can play your stupid game too.

He already did a page or two back, direct quotes from codex too.

[Someone With Mass]

Nashiktal wrote...
He already did a page or two back, direct quotes from codex too.

Yes. It's very apparent that some people can't make a judgment or think outside the box unless it's written down on a paper and shoved in their face.

[Zulu_DFA]

Almostfaceman wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

name-calling

Where?

No wonder you can't find the resoures Earth produces - you can't even find where you name-called.

That's because you're not helping me!

Show me where I name-called, and show me where Earth exports its products.

I can show you Earth's #1 export - the Alliance.  The Earth produced the Alliance.

And then the Alliance kinda stole itself from Earth. I guess Earth could try to sue the Alliance in some Citadel court... if it was recognized by the Council.

Almostfaceman wrote...

The point I'm making, Zulu, with this silly back-n-forth is that you're making an assumption - because you have no facts to point at specifically saying that Earth does not produce.

I gave you the quotes from the in-game Codex, which I work of making my argument. You, on the contrary, are assuming that I'm wrong, and not even trying to make a counter-argument, which is a sound tactic though, since you can't back it up with any canon material to support yourself.

Almostfaceman wrote...

All I have to do is look at Exogeni as an example of Earth producing a human colony.  If Earth was this big suck-hole, why are they in the business of colonization?  That money and resources belong in the hole dammit!  [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/w00t.png[/smilie]

And who earns this money for ExoGeni? That's right, the colonists, who produce more stuff than they consume, as opposed to Earth's population, that lives from the dividend yeild of their initial investment and nothing more. Politically they are powerless though. If the Alliance "nationalized" the corporate assets in the colonies, just like it "nationalized" the Arcturus Station and the Navy already, the Earth's nations would starve.

[Zulu_DFA]

Sajuro wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Sajuro wrote...

Here's a reason, if they (the council, the alliance, whoever) wants him to be tried on earth, shep gets tried on earth.

And where is the reason for the Council, the Alliance or whoever to want him be tried on Earth - away from where the most important political and military figures seat?

Elementary Zulu, we already know the Alliance brass think the Reapers are real and I personally believe that the other races know it too (lied to Shepard to keep a mass hysteria from happening and he was with puppy-rus). They know Shepard is the reason we were able to beat Sovereign but after his shenanigans in Arrival (to put it lightly) there will be several people demanding that Shepard be put on trial and locked away. The Council, knowing we are in deep s#it if Shepard can't counter the Reapers, and if he is in a citadel jail guess where they will go after first, so they say, "fine, the human will be tried on Earth and serve out his sentence there". They take whatever blowback comes from that and move Shepard to Earth, staging an attempt for his crew to bust in and rescue him. They then declare him to be a rogue Spectre and send someone like the VI 'after' him, thus in game giving you the chance to recruit the VI when they catch up to you, since everyone important knows it is a farce.

There is a plot hole in your explanation. Nobody, but Hackett knows that Shepard was involved in the "Arrival shenanigans". So they could just put any Ensign Ricky on that trial. And keep Shepard out of it.

[Sajuro]

Almostfaceman wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

name-calling

Where?

No wonder you can't find the resoures Earth produces - you can't even find where you name-called.

That's because you're not helping me!

Show me where I name-called, and show me where Earth exports its products.

And not only that here's a few more questions:
If Earth is a big suck-hole - why are the colonies sending them any resources?
If Earth has little to no influence on the Alliance - why are all these resources flowing to Earth?  
Why aren't they flowing to Arcturus Station?  
Why hasn't the Alliance embargo'd Earth and confisicated all those resources flowing into Earth?
If Earth is nothing more than an Alliance colony - why do the other colonies give a rats' patootie about Earth?  Why not keep all the resources for themselves?
Why would the Alliance guard these colonies and Earth if Earth is a big suck hole with no influence or little influence on the Alliance?

1: Because it is a big suck-hole that consumes a ****load and gives money to the other colonies for all they consume?
2 Capitalism oh and #1
3.......^
4. because they sell the resources to Earth and make money.
5. because there are humans there, it hold sentimental value, and oh... people sell their **** to earth.

[Zulu_DFA]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...
He already did a page or two back, direct quotes from codex too.

Yes. It's very apparent that some people can't make a judgment or think outside the box unless it's written down on a paper and shoved in their face.

That's exactly what I do, while some people are fantasizing that the "homeworld" is somehow important for the Alliance politicians.

[Nashiktal]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...
He already did a page or two back, direct quotes from codex too.

Yes. It's very apparent that some people can't make a judgment or think outside the box unless it's written down on a paper and shoved in their face.

So wait... first you argue against the codex... Then you want proof, then you say you should think outside the codex? Little bit off there.

[SalsaDMA]

candidate88766 wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Wait what? The fact that is IS inconsistent with pre-established lore means it IS a plothole. Whether people tolerate it or not is a different matter.

"A plot hole, or plothole, is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot"

I'd be interested in seeing evidence of any lore that directly states that Alliance trials cannot be held on Earth, or that the Alliance has no bases on Earth. Or indeed that a former (or indeed current) Alliance soldier cannot be tried anywhere other than Arcturus.

My Shepard is a Spectre. Go read about those and who has jurisdiciton of putting those on trial.

This fact is totally disregarded by Hackett in arrival, and thus disregarded by an event that is considered canon. Therefore we have a canon plotline that contradicts canon lore. Pure laziness from the writers that they did not even bother looking up their own stuff before hamfisting together the prolonged cutscene DLC called Arrival.

[Sajuro]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Sajuro wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Sajuro wrote...

Here's a reason, if they (the council, the alliance, whoever) wants him to be tried on earth, shep gets tried on earth.

And where is the reason for the Council, the Alliance or whoever to want him be tried on Earth - away from where the most important political and military figures seat?

Elementary Zulu, we already know the Alliance brass think the Reapers are real and I personally believe that the other races know it too (lied to Shepard to keep a mass hysteria from happening and he was with puppy-rus). They know Shepard is the reason we were able to beat Sovereign but after his shenanigans in Arrival (to put it lightly) there will be several people demanding that Shepard be put on trial and locked away. The Council, knowing we are in deep s#it if Shepard can't counter the Reapers, and if he is in a citadel jail guess where they will go after first, so they say, "fine, the human will be tried on Earth and serve out his sentence there". They take whatever blowback comes from that and move Shepard to Earth, staging an attempt for his crew to bust in and rescue him. They then declare him to be a rogue Spectre and send someone like the VI 'after' him, thus in game giving you the chance to recruit the VI when they catch up to you, since everyone important knows it is a farce.

There is a plot hole in your explanation. Nobody, but Hackett knows that Shepard was involved in the "Arrival shenanigans". So they could just put any Ensign Ricky on that trial. And keep Shepard out of it.

and what would it take for all that to be exposed for someone to have Jmminy Cricket shank them with bad feelings, an intrepid reporter, or someone raising hell because Ensign Ricky was halfway across the Galaxy partaking in a life day celebration.

[chester013]

Well it's happening nit pickers, deal with it and move on.

[Someone With Mass]

Zulu_DFA wrote...
That's exactly what I do, while some people are fantasizing that the "homeworld" is somehow important for the Alliance politicians.

Earth is the most populated human controlled planet in the galaxy in case you haven't noticed.

[Quole]

Why is this thread still going? Zulu is a troll. I thought that was common knowledge.

[Nashiktal]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...
That's exactly what I do, while some people are fantasizing that the "homeworld" is somehow important for the Alliance politicians.

Earth is the most populated human controlled planet in the galaxy in case you haven't noticed.

Population =/= power. 

Strategic resource control + military  + political = power.

Modifié par Nashiktal, 12 avril 2011 - 06:04 .

[Someone With Mass]

Nashiktal wrote...
So wait... first you argue against the codex... Then you want proof, then you say you should think outside the codex? Little bit off there.

I don't say you should think outside the Codex. It's there to help. Making biased assumptions is not something you should do. Making logical assumptions, like the Alliance being based of goverments on Earth is something I think is okay. 

For instance. Let's pretend that if Earth isn't that important because the Alliance isn't controlled from there, then there would be no harm in letting the Reapers establish a foothold there.

See? That's what I hear from some people here, and that's what I find laughable.

[Someone With Mass]

Nashiktal wrote...

Population =/= power. 

Strategic resource control + military  + political = power.

Wow. Just...wow.

[Nashiktal]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...
So wait... first you argue against the codex... Then you want proof, then you say you should think outside the codex? Little bit off there.

I don't say you should think outside the Codex. It's there to help. Making biased assumptions is not something you should do. Making logical assumptions, like the Alliance being based of goverments on Earth is something I think is okay. 

For instance. Let's pretend that if Earth isn't that important because the Alliance isn't controlled from there, then there would be no harm in letting the Reapers establish a foothold there.

See? That's what I hear from some people here, and that's what I find laughable.

No, its more like if the Earth is lost in the coming reaper war, humanity will still survive, and maybe even thrive because of certain factors we have been outlining in this thread.

[Someone With Mass]

Quole wrote...

Why is this thread still going? Zulu is a troll. I thought that was common knowledge.

Knowledge is apparently a luxury some people can't afford.

But I agree with you.

[Nashiktal]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Quole wrote...

Why is this thread still going? Zulu is a troll. I thought that was common knowledge.

Knowledge is apparently a luxury some people can't afford.

But I agree with you.

Veiled insults from someone who doesnt accept facts from the codex doesn't support the argument against Earth.

[Zulu_DFA]

Almostfaceman wrote...

And not only that here's a few more questions:
If Earth is a big suck-hole - why are the colonies sending them any resources?
If Earth has little to no influence on the Alliance - why are all these resources flowing to Earth?  
Why aren't they flowing to Arcturus Station?  
Why hasn't the Alliance embargo'd Earth and confisicated all those resources flowing into Earth?
If Earth is nothing more than an Alliance colony - why do the other colonies give a rats' patootie about Earth?  Why not keep all the resources for themselves?
Why would the Alliance guard these colonies and Earth if Earth is a big suck hole with no influence or little influence on the Alliance?

Out of mercy, no less.

The colonies sure don't experience any shortage of those resources, so the public there probably doesn't mind sharing a portion of them with the "homeworld". Besides, stealing from the weak doesn't work so good for your public image, and can negatively impact your business relations with your peers, so "nationalization" is out of the question for the time being.

[SalsaDMA]

chester013 wrote...

Well it's happening nit pickers, deal with it and move on.

DA2 happened too and people 'dealt with it and moved on' and away from that franchise (I know I did).

I'd rather prefer we get a bit more quality in writing than that particular game, and what we got hinted at in arrival.

If not, EA's influence on abandoning the story for the sake of flashiness will mean SW:OR is the only thing left for Bioware before they get annexed like the studios before it that got 'hit' by EA.

[SalsaDMA]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Population =/= power. 

Strategic resource control + military  + political = power.

Wow. Just...wow.

If you doubt this, tell me something. Who has control in china? The numerous population, or the military with resource control and political power?