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[Torax]

fantasypisces wrote...

Normally I defend David Gaider with a passion, I love the man's writing...

But even I raised an eyebrow when he said (along these lines) "I don't think we have explained it, and I don't think we will explain it anytime soon, just understand and accept that it happened".

I envisioned a big middle finger coming out of my computer screen, lol.
I dunno, overall it isn't a big deal. But I am slightly bothered (or at least starting to get bothered) that all the games will just be isolated stories, I'm starting to wonder if that's the case why even import choices at all. All that happened was some cameos that weren't really important, a couple lines of dialogue here and there, maybe some small sidequests.

I dunno, I guess I'm just slowly drifting over to "what's the point" crowd.

Well considering you are not in Fereldon for this game beyond the running from Lothering. What were you expecting to see? What were you expecting to feel the impact of if you are not even living there? Assuming plot flags even stuck. Also assuming you had Anora give the boon since apparently Alistair's may not have functioned right. This is alot of depencies when my character doesn't even live in Fereldon for the game. All you would get is references if you were living in the Free Marches and not Fereldon. Just like Nathaniel Howe came home to see his life destroyed in Awaknening. You are now across the ocean after all. Hard to see how Orzimmar is doing from there.

Modifié par Torax, 03 avril 2011 - 08:10 .

[DanteCousland]

Harrowmont is weak and he ends up with a civil war and the caste system which opresses people in place. Stalin used cruel methods but he revolutionised Russia making it a superpower that it is today. Revisionists argue that the future lives of russians decades after the fall of Stalin were greatly improved due to his actions at the cost of 14-15 million peasants and kulaks during Collectivisation. In my minds Bhelen was like Stalin, he had harsh measures but gave greater rewards. Harrowmont is a failed old man who ends up putting orzammar in civil war and keeping people enslaved by the caste system (Because that not at all tyrannical rightr)

[fantasypisces]

Torax wrote...

fantasypisces wrote...

Normally I defend David Gaider with a passion, I love the man's writing...

But even I raised an eyebrow when he said (along these lines) "I don't think we have explained it, and I don't think we will explain it anytime soon, just understand and accept that it happened".

I envisioned a big middle finger coming out of my computer screen, lol.
I dunno, overall it isn't a big deal. But I am slightly bothered (or at least starting to get bothered) that all the games will just be isolated stories, I'm starting to wonder if that's the case why even import choices at all. All that happened was some cameos that weren't really important, a couple lines of dialogue here and there, maybe some small sidequests.

I dunno, I guess I'm just slowly drifting over to "what's the point" crowd.

Well considering you are not in Fereldon for this game beyond the running from Lothering. What were you expecting to see? What were you expecting to feel the impact of if you are not even living there? Assuming plot flags even stuck. Also assuming you had Anora give the boon since apparently Alistair's may not have functioned right. This is alot of depencies when my character doesn't even live in Fereldon for the game. All you would get is references if you were living in the Free Marches and not Fereldon. Just like Nathaniel Howe came home to see his life destroyed in Awaknening. You are now across the ocean after all. Hard to see how Orzimmar is doing from there.

errr yeah, that's my point?
I'm trying to say everything that could import doesn't matter because it means jack in the new setting, and (most of it) jack to the overall storyline (if there is an overall storyline in the series that will materialize anytime soon).

[DanteCousland]

Morrigan and flemeth needs to be focused on and I hope for gods sake they dont screw up the OGB plotline or lack thereof, Leliana to me was forgivable because I didnt really care for her or kill her but I hope they dont screw this up.

[Torax]

fantasypisces wrote...

Torax wrote...

fantasypisces wrote...

Normally I defend David Gaider with a passion, I love the man's writing...

But even I raised an eyebrow when he said (along these lines) "I don't think we have explained it, and I don't think we will explain it anytime soon, just understand and accept that it happened".

I envisioned a big middle finger coming out of my computer screen, lol.
I dunno, overall it isn't a big deal. But I am slightly bothered (or at least starting to get bothered) that all the games will just be isolated stories, I'm starting to wonder if that's the case why even import choices at all. All that happened was some cameos that weren't really important, a couple lines of dialogue here and there, maybe some small sidequests.

I dunno, I guess I'm just slowly drifting over to "what's the point" crowd.

Well considering you are not in Fereldon for this game beyond the running from Lothering. What were you expecting to see? What were you expecting to feel the impact of if you are not even living there? Assuming plot flags even stuck. Also assuming you had Anora give the boon since apparently Alistair's may not have functioned right. This is alot of depencies when my character doesn't even live in Fereldon for the game. All you would get is references if you were living in the Free Marches and not Fereldon. Just like Nathaniel Howe came home to see his life destroyed in Awaknening. You are now across the ocean after all. Hard to see how Orzimmar is doing from there.

errr yeah, that's my point?
I'm trying to say everything that could import doesn't matter because it means jack in the new setting, and (most of it) jack to the overall storyline (if there is an overall storyline in the series that will materialize anytime soon).

 In the end we have to wait and even see what the 3rd game offers. For all we know. We'll never see Fereldon again anyway. Personally I wouldn't mind seeing further north. Fereldon was pretty boring. Seheron sounds pretty nice. Orlais could look great. Who knows even where they are going with it. The whole Earth Shattering danger was Origins. Mages vs. Templars just didn't seem as scary.

[Nialos]

fantasypisces wrote...

Torax wrote...

fantasypisces wrote...

Normally I defend David Gaider with a passion, I love the man's writing...

But even I raised an eyebrow when he said (along these lines) "I don't think we have explained it, and I don't think we will explain it anytime soon, just understand and accept that it happened".

I envisioned a big middle finger coming out of my computer screen, lol.
I dunno, overall it isn't a big deal. But I am slightly bothered (or at least starting to get bothered) that all the games will just be isolated stories, I'm starting to wonder if that's the case why even import choices at all. All that happened was some cameos that weren't really important, a couple lines of dialogue here and there, maybe some small sidequests.

I dunno, I guess I'm just slowly drifting over to "what's the point" crowd.

Well considering you are not in Fereldon for this game beyond the running from Lothering. What were you expecting to see? What were you expecting to feel the impact of if you are not even living there? Assuming plot flags even stuck. Also assuming you had Anora give the boon since apparently Alistair's may not have functioned right. This is alot of depencies when my character doesn't even live in Fereldon for the game. All you would get is references if you were living in the Free Marches and not Fereldon. Just like Nathaniel Howe came home to see his life destroyed in Awaknening. You are now across the ocean after all. Hard to see how Orzimmar is doing from there.

errr yeah, that's my point?
I'm trying to say everything that could import doesn't matter because it means jack in the new setting, and (most of it) jack to the overall storyline (if there is an overall storyline in the series that will materialize anytime soon).

Well, they can't make every single choice from DA:O important, and likewise, they can't just throw away characters fans loved. The cameos were meant to be nudgings towards that main storyline (which there really isn't, since the Dragon Age series is supposed to be a collection of stories set in the Dragon Age) you're talking about - Ferelden going to war with Orlais as mentioned by Alistair, Leliana with her mysterious Seeker agenda, Zevran apparently moving to change the Crows forever - and they include these fan favorites in sweeping plot shifts.

It's showing that the world is still alive outside of Kirkwall, but it just isn't as important to the main plot of DA2. DA3-4, maybe.

[DanteCousland]

Who knows if there will even be a 3rd game. My guess, tons of expansions and DLC which will probably do poorley and will get DA pulled.

[Nialos]

DanteCousland wrote...

Who knows if there will even be a 3rd game. My guess, tons of expansions and DLC which will probably do poorley and will get DA pulled.

For every fan lost, another flocks to fill the spot. Besides, with the development time that DA2 had, it doesn't even have to sell as many copies as DA:O to be a success - DLC and expansions are just icing on the cake.

[David Gaider]

Lord_Valandil wrote...
Right.
David Gaider said..."Don't expect to receive an explanation anytime soon".
In other words, "We don't have an explanation, so stop complaining and get over it".

Err... no. It means it's not something that's going to be explained on a forum thread.

[The Angry One]

David Gaider wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...
Right.
David Gaider said..."Don't expect to receive an explanation anytime soon".
In other words, "We don't have an explanation, so stop complaining and get over it".

Err... no. It means it's not something that's going to be explained on a forum thread.

Phft. If you don't explain it in the forums where will you. In some sort of video game?
Preposterous.

[Nialos]

David Gaider wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...
Right.
David Gaider said..."Don't expect to receive an explanation anytime soon".
In other words, "We don't have an explanation, so stop complaining and get over it".

Err... no. It means it's not something that's going to be explained on a forum thread.

Well clearly, you should explain your plans for the entire plot right now. Then everyone will be happy.

Really.

[Torax]

David Gaider wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...
Right.
David Gaider said..."Don't expect to receive an explanation anytime soon".
In other words, "We don't have an explanation, so stop complaining and get over it".

Err... no. It means it's not something that's going to be explained on a forum thread.

Since it's such a small fact. For example players who never played origins would not even know that said option existed? I doubt it's all that crucial. Could argue the choices in Origins were probably too many. Even random references by a guy in a bar could maybe say something contradictory. For example I wouldn't even lose sleep over Shale killing Pigeons instead of going to Tevinter to become a dwarf again. A new player would just think "Who is Leliana?" "Who is killing all those birds?"

[Conduit0]

David Gaider wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...
Right.
David Gaider said..."Don't expect to receive an explanation anytime soon".
In other words, "We don't have an explanation, so stop complaining and get over it".

Err... no. It means it's not something that's going to be explained on a forum thread.

Translation: Stay tuned to find out who shot J.R. in DA3!

[DanteCousland]

Itll be quite interesting to find out I just hope its plausible. I mean if its like The maker decided I shouldnt die because Im the new prophet or whatever then that would just be annoying :./. Oh and Laidlaw himself stated Origins was 1 year to 2 years in that pre release DA2 Podcast surely there is some timeline clashes there, there has to be :/. Admit it you heathens!, Admit your flaws and let me suckle on your sweet tears of failure and retcon!.

[LobselVith8]

Nialos wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Err... no. It means it's not something that's going to be explained on a forum thread.

Well clearly, you should explain your plans for the entire plot right now. Then everyone will be happy.

Really.

Maybe the plot ends with Merrill saying "...the Aristocrats!"

[Nialos]

DanteCousland wrote...

Itll be quite interesting to find out I just hope its plausible. I mean if its like The maker decided I shouldnt die because Im the new prophet or whatever then that would just be annoying :./. Oh and Laidlaw himself stated Origins was 1 year to 2 years in that pre release DA2 Podcast surely there is some timeline clashes there, there has to be :/. Admit it you heathens!, Admit your flaws and let me suckle on your sweet tears of failure and retcon!.

Alright, now you're just being a little creepy. Step away from keyboard...

@Lobs: Yes.

Modifié par Nialos, 03 avril 2011 - 09:10 .

[Fireblader70]

Looky here what I found:
http://social.biowar...index/6826665/4

It would be great if someone, like David Gaider, could confirm the screenshots (in the topic) as real. You know, as a definite answer.

[lorvincent]

Fireblader70 wrote...

Looky here what I found:
http://social.biowar...index/6826665/4

It would be great if someone, like David Gaider, could confirm the screenshots (in the topic) as real. You know, as a definite answer.

I just laughed my *ss off.

Leliana claims the maker brought her back, and everyone buys it as, A) fact and  literal.

We are talking about a character that has a tendancy to lie, be sly, and also use figurative language.  She also has a strange furvent belief that the Maker talks to her, which was rejected by Andraste's Gaurdian.

Leliana's return can be explained by multiple character involvements, but either way, I don't care.  RP your story as you like and try and fit an explanation, but personally I think that retconning a "main story" and "destroying your hopes and dreams of your personal RP world" is fine.

There are tonnes of open-ended "mysterious hero" RPGs.  This is a story with a focus, that has games that gives you tonnes of options to break away from it.  Many of these elements will carry over, but ultimately you cannot expect them to program a new scenario for EVERY bloody change you guys make in your game.


This is a story-driven game, unlike games like ES:O, which allowed you to run through a simple bland story with your own RP material.

Modifié par lorvincent, 03 avril 2011 - 09:21 .

[Fireblader70]

"You know, one good thing about the Blight is how it brings people together."

[Pyrate_d]

I get that this guy isn't going to say "my game sucked" but at the same time I really hope he's thinking "hmm, maybe people aren't satisfied when I resurrect more people than Jesus."

[Conduit0]

lorvincent wrote...

Fireblader70 wrote...

Looky here what I found:
http://social.biowar...index/6826665/4

It would be great if someone, like David Gaider, could confirm the screenshots (in the topic) as real. You know, as a definite answer.

I just laughed my *ss off.

Leliana claims the maker brought her back, and everyone buys it as, A) fact and  literal.

We are talking about a character that has a tendancy to lie, be sly, and also use figurative language.  She also has a strange furvent belief that the Maker talks to her, which was rejected by Andraste's Gaurdian.

Leliana's return can be explained by multiple character involvements, but either way, I don't care.  RP your story as you like and try and fit an explanation, but personally I think that retconning a "main story" and "destroying your hopes and dreams of your personal RP world" is fine.

There are tonnes of open-ended "mysterious hero" RPGs.  This is a story with a focus, that has games that gives you tonnes of options to break away from it.  Many of these elements will carry over, but ultimately you cannot expect them to program a new scenario for EVERY bloody change you guys make in your game.


This is a story-driven game, unlike games like ES:O, which allowed you to run through a simple bland story with your own RP material.

I want to write this post on a branding iron and then travel to the homes of everyone who complains about killing Leliana and slam the branding iron into their forward, so that maybe they'll finally get the point.

[Pyrate_d]

Conduit0 wrote...

I want to write this post on a branding iron and then travel to the homes of everyone who complains about killing Leliana and slam the branding iron into their forward, so that maybe they'll finally get the point.

You might want to see a shrink.

[Torax]

@ Conduit0 the other threads that could use a branding iron. Guys angry cause Anders flirted with them...

If they didn't like it don't click the hearts.

[just.a.dude]

Leliana was left for dead.

Yes, I know Dante, you used the decapitate move on her, but to account for how you kill someone in a multi-game spanning story is just too much to ask. Especially, if decapitation is an auto-attack move... I am sorry, but that is the way it is. It should be simple to accept that Leliana was left for dead (unless Bioware gives us an explanation in a later game).

Orsino, states that up until the moment he uses it, he had never used Blood Magic. This does not mean he has not studied it. In fact, it is confirmed by Orsino himself that he studied Blood Magic extensively over the years. By not trying to root out the maleficars, he supported them. Over the years, he slowly succumbs to the immense pressure Meredith puts on the Circle. Outwardly he seems to retain his composure, but he completely cracks in the end.

That make sense to me.

The other thing people who scream RETCON! RETCON! PLOTHOLE! PLOTHOLE! do not seem to get is that time actually passes in this game, meaning not all developments are from one minute to the next.

[TGFKAMAdmaX]

i didnt notice a bad story......they left sufficient wiggle room withing the conclusions of the aforementioned "plotholes" that either they will allow fans to stew and try and figure out for themselves or they will explain at a later date. it could be a major point at a later entry into the series. and if it is never answered thats a not a big deal. not every question needs answers...