58 réponses à ce sujet

[PMC65]

Interesting ... I am staying ready for anything in ME3. My Shep trusts no one!

[DxWill10]

Doubtful. Interesting idea but if anyone will be agents for the Reapers, it's the Batarians

[amcnow]

corporal doody wrote...

amcnow wrote...

I honestly think it's more likely the Batarians would be that race. The seeds of contempt for the galaxy are already there. At this point, it may be easy enough for the Reapers to pursuede the Batarians to willingly help them in exchange for being spared (with their fingers crossed, of course).

With that said, the OP does make some good points for the Asari. I wouldn't be surprised if the Reapers used both. The Humans are the most vocal about the Reapers; but only a small group (Cerberus) are making all the noise. That means most Humans would be more concerned with a Batarian raid, especially after the events of Arrival. The Batarians could be used to pre-occupy the Humans while the Asari (with their silver-tongues and promiscuity) befriend and betray everyone else.

??  source please

Have you not played the game?  Both are pretty well implied.

[AngelicMachinery]

This would be horribly tragic... I love the Asari.

[corporal doody]

amcnow wrote...

corporal doody wrote...

amcnow wrote...

I honestly think it's more likely the Batarians would be that race. The seeds of contempt for the galaxy are already there. At this point, it may be easy enough for the Reapers to pursuede the Batarians to willingly help them in exchange for being spared (with their fingers crossed, of course).

With that said, the OP does make some good points for the Asari. I wouldn't be surprised if the Reapers used both. The Humans are the most vocal about the Reapers; but only a small group (Cerberus) are making all the noise. That means most Humans would be more concerned with a Batarian raid, especially after the events of Arrival. The Batarians could be used to pre-occupy the Humans while the Asari (with their silver-tongues and promiscuity) befriend and betray everyone else.

??  source please

Have you not played the game?  Both are pretty well implied.

Because of their natural sensuality and ability to mate with any
species, asari are sometimes rumoured to be promiscuous. These rumours
are mostly a result of misinformation (or wishful thinking). In fact,
asari have to accept that if they mate outside their own species, they
will almost inevitably outlive their partner (with the notable exception
of the krogan,
who have a similarly immense longevity). Therefore they have had to
apply their philosophical "long view" to relationships as well,
savouring the time they spend with their partners rather than focusing
on their inevitable loss. On the Citadel, an asari and her turian
companion are trying to decide on a souvenir to purchase, and while her
friend feels a fish is too short-lived to make a good memento, the asari
notes that they must "enjoy the time they have with the fish." Also
while browsing at the Memories of Illium kiosk on Illium,
an asari and her salarian father are trying to decide on a memento to
purchase for her mother. As a result of the age difference many asari
raise their daughters alone, especially if the "father" species is
short-lived. Despite their partner's death, a part of them will live
within their other.



source...wiki but is also in ME1 codex

[corporal doody]

as far as silver-tongued characters in game....A MAJORITY HAVE BEEN HUMAN.
sure there have been a few lying asari...who turn up dead eventually, but most of their motives were clear cut. the individuals thus far that have shown ambitions on the larger scale have been human and batarian.

everything i have read about the asari just makes the possibility of the entire species being turncoats unlikely. everything about them screams survival...survival does not equal submission. the asari WILL be wiped out with the other species if Reapers succeed.

IM going with the Batarians or Vorsha who want power cuz they are tired of being scum to sign up with the Reapers in mass.

Modifié par corporal doody, 26 avril 2011 - 05:09 .

[ItsFreakinJesus]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

At this point, I don't think we'll be seeing a "puppet race". There's no need for it. The Reapers are here, and they are the End. They are massive galaxy-cleansing machines that have been killing advanced organic life for longer than most stars have been in existence. They have no need of "avatars" or "puppet armies"... Not ones that aren't husks, anyways. Now that they're in-country, I think they'll wind up doing what they do best; killin' things that breathe.

Husks can't pilot ships to get to systems well in advance of the Reaper force to whittle away defenses so the Reapers have an easier time of reaping.  Both Husks and Indoctrinated have a place.  Indoctrinated because they're capable of using technology to travel and fight more effectively, and Husks because they give the Reapers an inexhaustible supply of foot soldiers.  Should the Indoctrinated die, they can be repurposed into Husks to continue fighting.

[ExtremeOne]

I like the idea Op

[corporal doody]

i find the idea of the asari being the pawns of the Reapers offensive!! how do explain the Asari indoctrinated by Sovereign? if they were pawns they would have been like" roger that big daddy!"
nah nah! it's all wrong!!

[PMC65]

Destroy Raiden wrote...

Yeah big explosive title but bare with me....

Vigil said people fled and went to others they trusted they were taken in by these people but what those fleeing to them didnt' know was that these supposedly nice people were infact already controlled by the reapers they either killed or gave to the reapers any refugees they had.

I would be disappointed if this didn't come to be so in ME3 people betraying one another due to indoctrination and I think Asari are the ones for the job.

No other race can link their minds and nervous systems to another. We've seen several examples were Asari are easily manipulated or can become the manipulators.

The keepers were created by the reapers and look how "unthreatening" they seem. Yet they had a purpose that they followed until this last cycle (score 1 for the protheans).

Betrayal or WTF? comes from unexpected places. The Asari would be a WTF? or what I call a "What you talking about Willis?" Vorcha or batarians? Who would care?  

I do think that there is more to the Asari then we know at this time, but I hope it doesn't mean that Liara and I will break up as I empty a clip in her. That would suck! I might even throw my game out the window like a 6 year old. 

[ExtremeOne]

PMC65 wrote...

Destroy Raiden wrote...

Yeah big explosive title but bare with me....

Vigil said people fled and went to others they trusted they were taken in by these people but what those fleeing to them didnt' know was that these supposedly nice people were infact already controlled by the reapers they either killed or gave to the reapers any refugees they had.

I would be disappointed if this didn't come to be so in ME3 people betraying one another due to indoctrination and I think Asari are the ones for the job.

No other race can link their minds and nervous systems to another. We've seen several examples were Asari are easily manipulated or can become the manipulators.

The keepers were created by the reapers and look how "unthreatening" they seem. Yet they had a purpose that they followed until this last cycle (score 1 for the protheans).

Betrayal or WTF? comes from unexpected places. The Asari would be a WTF? or what I call a "What you talking about Willis?" Vorcha or batarians? Who would care?  

I do think that there is more to the Asari then we know at this time, but I hope it doesn't mean that Liara and I will break up as I empty a clip in her. That would suck! I might even throw my game out the window like a 6 year old. 

   




It would be a interesting idea . You said it yourself we have no idea what the Asari are about . 

[PMC65]

corporal doody wrote...

i find the idea of the asari being the pawns of the Reapers offensive!! how do explain the Asari indoctrinated by Sovereign? if they were pawns they would have been like" roger that big daddy!"
nah nah! it's all wrong!!

If they do end up being the moles then my main shep is in big trouble. Liara is her LI and I don't want Kaiden looking at me with a smirk, "You picked her over me? How is that working for you?"

But then that would mean that I would have to make some hard decisions & game changes ... well, right after I walk outside & retrieve my controller, down a few shots of tequila and try and shoot Kaiden.

One part of me would be pissed and the other part would be challenged to readjust my Shepard to an unforeseen situation. How would she handle this information? More tequila! then ... "Joker, patch me through to the Shadow Broker!"

[amcnow]

corporal doody wrote...

Because of their natural sensuality and ability to mate with any
species, asari are sometimes rumoured to be promiscuous. These rumours
are mostly a result of misinformation (or wishful thinking). In fact,
asari have to accept that if they mate outside their own species, they
will almost inevitably outlive their partner (with the notable exception
of the krogan,
who have a similarly immense longevity). Therefore they have had to
apply their philosophical "long view" to relationships as well,
savouring the time they spend with their partners rather than focusing
on their inevitable loss. On the Citadel, an asari and her turian
companion are trying to decide on a souvenir to purchase, and while her
friend feels a fish is too short-lived to make a good memento, the asari
notes that they must "enjoy the time they have with the fish." Also
while browsing at the Memories of Illium kiosk on Illium,
an asari and her salarian father are trying to decide on a memento to
purchase for her mother. As a result of the age difference many asari
raise their daughters alone, especially if the "father" species is
short-lived. Despite their partner's death, a part of them will live
within their other.



source...wiki but is also in ME1 codex

corporal doody wrote...

as far as silver-tongued characters in game....A MAJORITY HAVE BEEN HUMAN.
sure there have been a few lying asari...who turn up dead eventually, but most of their motives were clear cut. the individuals thus far that have shown ambitions on the larger scale have been human and batarian.

everything i have read about the asari just makes the possibility of the entire species being turncoats unlikely. everything about them screams survival...survival does not equal submission. the asari WILL be wiped out with the other species if Reapers succeed.

IM going with the Batarians or Vorsha who want power cuz they are tired of being scum to sign up with the Reapers in mass.

1. I think you're doing too much reading and not enough watching.  While playing ME1 and (especially) ME2, you come across plenty of asari who either are (or are implied to be) silver tongued and/or promiscuous.

2. I think you are taking this topic way too seriously.  This IS a thread born from speculation, afterall.

3. I think you should look up the definitions of "silver tongued" and "promiscuity" before dismissing my post(s).

Modifié par amcnow, 26 avril 2011 - 01:59 .

[Jedi Master of Orion]

If the Asari were puppets for the Reapers, you'd think they'd have been more useful during the Battle of the Citadel.

[kyg_20X6]

Bartarians. They hate everyone else and their systems are the first point of contact with the Reapers. Either they get wiped out (who's gonna aid them?) or they work for the Reapers. I don't think BioWare would wipe out the Bartarians off-screen (since the Reapers are already at Earth at the start of ME3).

[Destroy Raiden_]

So the asari are going to be used though they sound really ugly...I didn't want them ugly BW I wanted them blue now they're obvious puppets. Can we at least get some blue like the consort, the yakshi girls, and half of Chora's den?

[SalsaDMA]

Thargorichiban wrote...

I'd be more interested in knowing whether an Asari could conceivably conceive with a Reaper partner.

...

Eh?

...

Eh? Embrace that eternity and such? They have some organic sludge in them, I'm sure some Asari somewhere could hit that... But if that was the case... *gasp* Doesn't that mean an Argat-Yashi (sp?) could kill a Reaper all on her lonesome?

Theoretically I guess an Ardat-Yakshi could kill a reaper. Only problem being that she would need to overcome the willpower of 'one', which I think is quite the feat given their somewhat unique base.

So theoretically, yes. Practically, no.

[corporal doody]

amcnow wrote...


1. I think you're doing too much reading and not enough watching.  While playing ME1 and (especially) ME2, you come across plenty of asari who either are (or are implied to be) silver tongued and/or promiscuous.

2. I think you are taking this topic way too seriously.  This IS a thread born from speculation, afterall.

3. I think you should look up the definitions of "silver tongued" and "promiscuity" before dismissing my post(s).

1. yes u do think..but nope

2.  yes u do think...but nope

3. DISMISSED....

[Turran]

I thought the people that Vigil talked about were their own race, as in the Reapers indoctrinated some and used them as a 'refuge' for other surviving Protheans, only to betray and turn them in to the Reapers?

[Drachasor]

ciaweth wrote...

Pwener2313 wrote...

Indoctrination can't bring people from the dead, just brainwashes them. that's what Dragonsteeth is for. I would indeed like for a race to ally with the Reapers actually.

My guess is hanar will do this.  My guess is based upon this CDN entry (one of the official BioWare ones).

You should look at what that Hanar is emphasizing though.  He's talking about how the important part is helping and guiding another race (like they believe the Protheans did for them and like they are doing for the Drell).  The Reapers are an abomination of that, using their guidance to lead other races into a trap.  The mere fact the Reapers killed the Protheans would be enough for the Hanar to HATE them with a ferver.

[Drachasor]

Turran wrote...

I thought the people that Vigil talked about were their own race, as in the Reapers indoctrinated some and used them as a 'refuge' for other surviving Protheans, only to betray and turn them in to the Reapers?

That is what Vigil was saying as I remember it as well.  As best we know, the Protheans didn't know any other sentient species.

[darthbuert]

ExtremeOne wrote...

PMC65 wrote...

Destroy Raiden wrote...

Yeah big explosive title but bare with me....

Vigil said people fled and went to others they trusted they were taken in by these people but what those fleeing to them didnt' know was that these supposedly nice people were infact already controlled by the reapers they either killed or gave to the reapers any refugees they had.

I would be disappointed if this didn't come to be so in ME3 people betraying one another due to indoctrination and I think Asari are the ones for the job.

No other race can link their minds and nervous systems to another. We've seen several examples were Asari are easily manipulated or can become the manipulators.

The keepers were created by the reapers and look how "unthreatening" they seem. Yet they had a purpose that they followed until this last cycle (score 1 for the protheans).

Betrayal or WTF? comes from unexpected places. The Asari would be a WTF? or what I call a "What you talking about Willis?" Vorcha or batarians? Who would care?  

I do think that there is more to the Asari then we know at this time, but I hope it doesn't mean that Liara and I will break up as I empty a clip in her. That would suck! I might even throw my game out the window like a 6 year old. 

   


It would be a interesting idea . You said it yourself we have no idea what the Asari are about . 

Good theory that is actually very viable and plausible. Any good magician or con artist will tell you that the best way to fool people is with mis-direction. The Batarians or Vorcha are the obvious choices because of their personalities and allignments which makes them unlikely. They misdirect you on the probable choice; the Asari. It would not be a plot twist if it turned out to be Batarians or Vorcha. But if it did end up being the Asari, that would majorly suck! Liara is my favorite character. Though it would make sense for it to happen, and Bioware is no stranger to those WTF betrayal moments...we've had one in every Bioware game if my memory serves.

I have long since theorized that Liara (even though I think she's awesome) specifically will be the one to betray Shep in Mass Effect 3. As I mentioned earlier, (though compelling) Bioware has distinctive patterns when it comes to their storytelling style. In each of their games I've personally played, there was always a betrayal of some sort of varying degrees of loss to the player character.

**spoilers

In DA:O it was Morrigan...she reveals that she's been playin' you all along to set up some ritual to use to ensure the old-god spirit doesn't die off...then she leaves you regardless of your relationship level. Adios amigo!

In DA2 it would be Anders...that S.O.B. commits a (bombing) terrorist act that starts the war between mage and Templar...

In Jade Empire it was the Glorious Strategist...he was playing you all along. He was your mentor, but also the one who masterminded the whole thing. (and he kills you)

KOtOR had Bastilla play the part of betrayer...(a major love interest) depending on your relationship level and clever choices, you either had to kill her or could convince her to become "good" again.

KoTOR 2 (technically not Bioware but Obsidian) - but a lot of people associates them with Bioware...and they were continuing the story thread (and style of narrative) pioneered by Bioware. Kreia is the betrayer there...

I never played Balders Gate so I can't reference that...

***end spoilers

...but it now brings us to the Mass Effect franchise. So far we have seen no major betrayal. (unless you consider the VS one...but I don't) The logical choice would have to be Liara. She is the only squaddie in every game that no matter what decisions you make (whether paragon or renegade) cannot be killed under any circumstances. We know she is paramount to the main storyline. She has played a pretty significant role already. If it weren't for her Sovereign would've already won..(and/or) Shepard would've remained dead; a trophy of the Collectors.

I ask you, who else better to set up as a future betrayer? She comes on the scene in ME1 as the sweet, shy, and cute, nerdy scientist (aiding in the defeat of her own mother) thusly earning our trust whether romanced or not. She helps in identifying the planet Ilos as the one housing the conduit - and deciphering all the Prothean visions burned into Sheps brain from the beacons.

Later in ME2 her personality takes a decidedly darker turn, and you begin to see the propensity for violence she is capable of. She's pretty ruthless, and she makes a threatening statement eerily similar to her indoctrinated mother on Noveria. I personally don't find it farfetched at all that she could try to kill Shepard seeing as how emotionally detached she was at the middle of the game when we met her, asking us to hack terminals and such. She even ends up becomming the new Shadow-Broker, a position that could conceivably easily corrupt her. Remember the old addage "absolute power corrupts absolutely?" - she's being set up to be the bad-guy...but if she isn't, it would certainly surprise me because she is taylor-made to be the "trusted" betrayer.

In short: It would certainly be a major WTF moment if Liara turned out to be the major betrayer in the final chapter. We were promised major twists in ME3 and that would certainly qualify as one.

As far as the Asari being a race used by the Reapers, it's certainly plausible. They have the means to take down a large portion of the galaxy because "all-major species" finds them attractive - which means they have major "pull" in the opinions of the galaxy...just a thought.

Modifié par darthbuert, 09 mai 2011 - 04:25 .

[Drachasor]

Making the "Asari" into betrayers ruins the race, imho. We've had a lot of very different Asari characters and turning them into some sort of Trojan Horse would basically be saying it was all faked. Not very plausible.

More likely would be the Rachni Queen, if saved, being twisted by the Reapers again (though I don't think that's PARTICULARLY likely or at least not inevitable).

More likely would be it might be impossible to get the Geth and Quarians on your side if you didn't make at least some of the right decisions in ME1 and ME2 -- and hence you have to side with Tali or with Legion.

More likely would be Miranda betraying you to keep her sister safe (betrayers always have had MOTIVE in Bioware games, which the Asari race as a whole would not have).

There are a lot of more plausible betrayals overall.

[darthbuert]

Drachasor wrote...

Making the "Asari" into betrayers ruins the race, imho. We've had a lot of very different Asari characters and turning them into some sort of Trojan Horse would basically be saying it was all faked. Not very plausible.

More likely would be the Rachni Queen, if saved, being twisted by the Reapers again (though I don't think that's PARTICULARLY likely or at least not inevitable).

More likely would be it might be impossible to get the Geth and Quarians on your side if you didn't make at least some of the right decisions in ME1 and ME2 -- and hence you have to side with Tali or with Legion.

More likely would be Miranda betraying you to keep her sister safe (betrayers always have had MOTIVE in Bioware games, which the Asari race as a whole would not have).

There are a lot of more plausible betrayals overall.

I agree that it would effectively ruin the Asari race for me as well. I love the Asari...but that doesn't mean that it would be a horrible storytelling device. And it is actually very plausible. If you were a sapient being that claimed near god-like omnipotence (like the Reapers do) - would you send in sleeper agents that people would suspect? I wouldn't. The Asari would be the perfect choice. Personally I don't believe that the Asari will be used in such a way...but it is certainly an intriquing idea. I actually tend to lean more toward Liara herself, than her entire race...

Honestly, in my opinion I think the Collectors served that purpose already...

A more effective betrayal is from someone you trust and care about. i.e a friend or lover. Provides more "shock value". That way it "tugs more at your heart-strings". The Rachni-Queen to me would seem to be an obvious choice...thereby making her less effective as a story-telling device to force you to make emotionally tough decisions. I could easily put a bullet through her head if she betrayed me...but if it were Liara...it would be much more difficult for emotional reasons. In this regard Miranda would also make a good choice...but unlikely since she is a character that can be killed in the second game. It wouldn't make any sense to create a story thread of betrayal and make it be someone that might not even be around for the final installment of the series.

Modifié par darthbuert, 09 mai 2011 - 04:40 .

[SalsaDMA]

DA:O - Morrighan didn't betray you. If anything, she helped you. Sure, she was to get something herself from the 'transaction', but she didn't betray you. Loghain, in the very beginning of the game, however, DID betray the wardens.

KotOR - Bastilla was brainwashed while in the custody of THE evil sith of the game. She doesn't betray you. She just gets forcibly put on the other side of the conflict of you while you are seperated.

I haven't tried the other games you mentioned, but suffice to say I disagree with the examples listed above.