117 réponses à ce sujet

[Bamboozalist]

Valmarn wrote...

I mean the Reapers could do what they do because their giant cheese monster God tells them to. Or maybe there is a universe wide civilization of good Reapers and these are the rejects who are mentally unstable and retarded. It doesn't really need to be explained because every explination will remove the divine aspect of the Reapers.

Are you, at all, familiar with the suspension of disbelief?
If not, that would be one thing you have in common with the writers at BioWare.

Clearly, the Reapers require the inhabitants of the galaxy, for one reason or another. So, sorry to break it to you, but their divine aspect is already nullified.

Again, you make not require an explanation, but some of us hold storytellin to a higher standard.

Expecting to be spoonfed isn't holding story telling to a higher standard. It's not the explanation we need, what we need is to be shown real tangable results from the Reapers different plans that we can try to interpret while their motives and thought process remain beyond our comprehension it at least grounds what they're doing in some feasibility. But those examples I was using were complete hyperbole, those would jump the shark so hard it wouldn't be funny.

Modifié par Bamboozalist, 01 avril 2011 - 09:02 .

[bluewolv1970]

I agree will all who say plan B is a plan for a different problem...i view it as happening concurrently to either plan A or C, regradless of which one succeeded...and it was important to stop simply on the merits of human lives that could be lost to it...also while the arrival CAN be played pre Horizon, does not mean it should be...

[Valmarn]

Bamboozalist wrote...

Expecting to be spoonfed isn't holding story telling to a higher standard. It's not the explanation we need, what we need is to be shown real tangable results from the Reapers different plans that we can try to interpret while their motives and thought process remain beyond our comprehension it at least grounds what they're doing in some feasibility. But those examples I was using were complete hyperbole, those would jump the shark so hard it wouldn't be funny.

Who said anything about spoon-feeding? I just want it to be made evident, gradually or otherwise, why they harvest the inhabitants of the galaxy. "They're unknown beings" is just a weak, half-hearted excuse that you seem to have eaten up, and then asked for seconds of.

I got to hand it to you: you have an enviable disregard for rational storytelling, and for the deeper meaning to the Reapers' extinction cycles.

Modifié par Valmarn, 01 avril 2011 - 09:23 .

[Valmarn]

bluewolv1970 wrote...

I agree will all who say plan B is a plan for a different problem...i view it as happening concurrently to either plan A or C, regradless of which one succeeded...and it was important to stop simply on the merits of human lives that could be lost to it...also while the arrival CAN be played pre Horizon, does not mean it should be...

They screwed the pooch, and should have made Arrival only active after the Suicide Mission.

It almosy looks like they're desperate for decent storytelling when they're constantly shooting themselves in the foot with plotholes, ret-cons, and the like.

Modifié par Valmarn, 01 avril 2011 - 09:22 .

[desonnac00]

At this point the reapers are very cartoon-villain-y.
Plan B is them handing a carrot from a ledge, suspended over a 15 inch pool of 2 chemicals that make acid when they make contact with plastic, which are harmless to humans btw, but trigger a combustion and burn a wire 15 feet away, which will fire a tranc gun at your thumb so the Reapers can strap you into a James Bond kind of device which you will almost certainly escape from...
When we reveal that we DON'T LIKE CARROTS The reapers just say:
OMG!!! My incredibly convoluted and needlessly complicated plan was somehow foiled!
Bullocks to that then. At which point the reapers take the machine gun resting in their hands and put a bullet in our heads.
This is all CHIT! Nothing more than male cow CHIT!

If plan B was serving a completely different purpose- I can buy it. But how likely is it really? C'mon?

To the argument- they were just starting their assimilation process early- That's pretty good. I can live with that retardation of the reapers cuz it's born of Hubris, which they have already exhibited- it ties into the story.

But how likely is it that the writers suddenly got good?

I've put up with a lot in ME2- I still enjoyed it even though it was less about the sidecharacters than DA:O. When we were given a small amount of non- DLC weapons. story deficiency, etc.
Even the miserable Story DLC support- ONE BRIDGING DLC!!!
BUT THIS IS TOO SUNTING MUCH!
An hour and a half of running in a glass corridor/basement and then something that took considerable solvent sniffing to seem logical as a finale to prepare us for ME3... WHAT-THE-DUCK!

[Almostfaceman]

Valmarn wrote...

Who said anything about spoon-feeding? I just want it to be made evident, gradually or otherwise, why they harvest the inhabitants of the galaxy. "They're unknown beings" is just a weak, half-hearted excuse that you seem to have eaten up, and then asked for seconds of.

I got to hand it to you: you have an enviable disregard for rational storytelling, and for the deeper meaning to the Reapers' extinction cycles.

Are you the kind of guy who likes to read the end of mystery novels?  'cause Bioware ain't gonna tell us all about the Reapers until Act 3.  They gave us some clues in Act 2 with the Collectors and the Collector Base, but they're saving all the real answers for the end of the book.

[desonnac00]

samurai crusade wrote...
They reapers want to take everything out... and leave very little evidence. Everything is done quietly and efficiently that's why they don't just rush in and announce themselves. They have to isolate star systems. Destroy defenses. Divide and conquere.

Correct me if I'm wrong but did not Vigil say(I'm paraphrasing it):
"They Killed us system by system, covered the skies of every world (...) The extirmation of a species is a long process- took them decades, centuries etc."

Yes, the reapers cut comunications but there are still the beacons which functioned NO PROBLEM. I don't know the exact line but the Protheans knew what was going on but were no match for the Reaper fleet.
Think about it. 
A galaxy wide empire could not withstand the Reapers- what chance do the Terminus, Citadel, and that other place's fleets have when they're still fighting each other.
Reapers have exhibited extreme arrogance- why be cautious- u r a god and u know it- why sneak?

If they do want to take everything out- WHY PLAN B!?
I don't care if you have had any military education or something remotely related- Sending ONE CRIPLE WITH A FLAIR GUN is NOT BETTER than a SUCKING ARMY!
AN ARMY WHICH HAS PROVEN ITSELF THROUGHOUT THE AGES AS A TERMINATOR ARMY WITH NO JOHN CONNOR!

[kidbd15]

Arrival is meant to be played after ME2 ending... only reason BW allows you to play it before hand is for the upgrades and what not. They should have made it mandatory to only be played post SM.

As for the story itself:
ME1: Plan would have immediately crippled the core of the galactic community, making it easier to harvest the rest of the galaxy.

ME2: Humanity showed great strength, elected to be new child of the Reapers. Upon completion, plan from ME1 could have continued. Remember, main goal is to wipe out everything on the Citadel, to cripple the rest of the galaxy.

Arrival: Plans above failed. ME2 ending saw Reapers coming towards the galaxy. Again, Arrival is MEANT to be played post-SM, so for me, that's how the story is meant to be perceived. Thus, Arrival has them on the edge of the galaxy, going to use the Alpha relay to travel to all other relays. Good plan, but not as good as ME1 plan since they can't get to the Citadel and immediately wipe it out, giving the rest of the galaxy warning of their arrival. Shep delays this as well, giving the galaxy even more time to amass their forces.

Modifié par kidbd15, 01 avril 2011 - 09:59 .

[desonnac00]

kidbd15 wrote...

Arrival is meant to be played after ME2 ending... only reason BW allows you to play it before hand is for the upgrades and what not. They should have made it mandatory to only be played post SM.

As for the story itself:
ME1: Plan would have immediately crippled the core of the galactic community, making it easier to harvest the rest of the galaxy.

ME2: Humanity showed great strength, elected to be new child of the Reapers. Upon completion, plan from ME1 could have continued. Remember, main goal is to wipe out everything on the Citadel, to cripple the rest of the galaxy.

Arrival: Plans above failed. ME2 ending saw Reapers coming towards the galaxy. Again, Arrival is MEANT to be played post-SM, so for me, that's how the story is meant to be perceived. Thus, Arrival has them on the edge of the galaxy, going to use the Alpha relay to travel to all other relays. Good plan, but not as good as ME1 plan since they can't get to the Citadel and immediately wipe it out, giving the rest of the galaxy warning of their arrival. Shep delays this as well, giving the galaxy even more time to amass their forces.

I am not questioning the viability of any individual plan.
A makes sense, B makes sense, C makes sense. It's the sequence of it and the retarded reasoning behind it.
Yes any one would work- I AM NOT quesioning that.- why do B before C? 
Remember- B resulted in PROJECT LAZARUS.
Why do this chit?

[Vieuxcruex]

Because the Reapers had no clue that Project Lazarus was going to happen. They might not have even known it was possible, and merely wanted shepherd to become the HR, for his skills and knowledge. Heck, the time that the SB found out about PL might have started the whole Plan B thing, to distract their time and resources away from PL while they worked on something else.

[johnbonhamatron]

One thing I'm curious about is where the idea of "the (spoiler-free) beastie we vapourised in the SM being a vanguard to replace Sovereign" came from, because in all my playthroughs, I can't find any hints of that in the game. Was it forum speculation that came up with that idea, 'cos I genuinely have no clue?

My take on it has always been that plan B (as the OP puts it) was never part of their plan to return, but part of the whole reason why they do the reaping in the first place. They just kickstarted it early in this cycle.

One possible theory on why they kickstarted the reapin' before they actually turned up: they're having to improvise, and after untold millions (at least) of years of the same cycle, they're not that good at improvising.

[Mister Ford]

Valmarn wrote...

Who said anything about spoon-feeding?

You did, in the very next sentence you wrote:

I just want it to be made evident, gradually or otherwise, why they harvest the inhabitants of the galaxy. .

You want the writers to tell you precisely what the Reapers are doing and why. 

I understand, it's sometimes frustrating when you have a great mystery, and in the end you don't get a precise answer.  But it's also frustrating when writers DO try to answer those questions, because it usually ends up coming out quite lame.  Better to leave a few things unsaid. 

I'm sure the ME writers have a few things left to reveal about the Reapers, why they exterminate organic life possibly being one of them.  But I for one hope they don't try to answer everything just for people who can't accept that unanswered questions sometimes make a better story.  What if they had tried to explain every detail of the ending to 2001, or spinning top in Inception, or the briefcase in Pulp Fiction?  I'm sure there are plenty of other examples.  Not answering everything doesn't mean it's bad storytelling.  Sometimes writers require people to think for themselves.

[desonnac00]

Vieuxcruex wrote...

Because the Reapers had no clue that Project Lazarus was going to happen.

Lazarus doesn't matter- it was just an example.
Plan B is very high profile, it gives organics information and a heads up- A CRIPLE WITH A FLAIRGUN
Plan B is far less clandestine than Plan C. IT DOESN"T MAKE ANY SENSE!

[TwistedComplex]

It sounds like you should have taken the hint when Harbinger said "You only delay the inevitable" oh... FIFTY GOD DAMN TIMES

[kidbd15]

desonnac00 wrote...

kidbd15 wrote...

snip

I am not questioning the viability of any individual plan.
A makes sense, B makes sense, C makes sense. It's the sequence of it and the retarded reasoning behind it.
Yes any one would work- I AM NOT quesioning that.- why do B before C? 
Remember- B resulted in PROJECT LAZARUS.
Why do this chit?

My reasoning: B was done before C to re-try A. If the Reapers are anything, they are patient.  Their main goal is getting to the Citadel first because that is the tactical move... work from the inside going out. They gain all their intel via the Citadel (which planets and systems have advanced life on it, and focus solely on those). Without that info, they would waste so much time going over every planet.  And I personally think they value each individual Reaper. It takes them a very long time to "reproduce", so the plan that minimizes their casualties is probably a plan that has HIGH value to them. Thus, building a new vanguard Reaper to re-try plan A was perhaps a sound move in their thinking.  

You mentioned that the Protheans had beacons that allowed other systems to receive that warning.  But perhaps the Reapers didn't know this.  Vigil himself said the Protheans built their own Mass Relay, and maybe they were the first to ever do so besides the Reapers.  Perhaps the Reapers never harvested a species that was almost as advanced as they were in terms of intelligence, and the odds of that repeating was unlikely.  Even if it was likely, getting to the Citadel first was still the best move and worth their patience. Obviously we don't have all the facts because BW hasn't told us, so all we can do is speculate and question.

But perhaps to get to your underlying problem of ME2, I shall say this:  ME2 was NOT  necessary. Many threads of this same topic have been created.  I myself believe ME2 could be more accurately described as ME1.5 or one big expansion to ME1 that warranted its own game. We essentially end where ME1 ended, but we learned more about Cerberus, the Genophage, the Geth, Quarians, Krogan, Shadow Broker (DLC) and to a lesser extent the Protheans and Reapers.  I'm sure players can go straight from ME1 to ME3 without missing much of a beat.  

I don't know why BW did this.  Obvious reason is $$, and as a business, makes perfect sense.  They wanted to make a new game with new mechanics, introduce new characters, fill in some background information, and SET UP for continuing their main story in ME3.... it was ME1.5. 

[mcsupersport]

Plan A was to send a signal to the Citadel and open the relay and destroy the leadership of the races and shut down all active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan B was to get the Rachni to beat back the Citadel races and then open the relay and destroy the leadership of the races and shut down active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan C was to use Saren and the Geth to figure out why the relay wouldn't respond to the signal in the first place and then let Sovereign in the Citadel so he can open the relay and kill the leadership of the races and shut down all active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan D was to fly straight to the galaxy, and do it the hard way, maybe/probably facing united galactic fleets taking damage but still doing the job with the help of relays. Maybe even getting to the Citadel killing the leadership and shutting down the relays isolating systems to themselves.

Plan E to be determined.

The Suicide Mission was all a side mission in which the collectors found a workable race, tried out a bio-weapon(mordin's recruitment) and started work on a new reaper which by all information is what happens every cycle. Bio-races are harvested and "uplifted" into a new reaper making it there salvation through destruction.

As far as being obvious......
1) No one but reaper or collector could pass through the Omega 4 relay and survive.
2) Few knew Reapers were connected to the Collectors because most don't even know Reapers exist.
3) Colonies were taken from remote corners using almost complete stealth, causing no information to be left connecting them to the disappearances.


As a side note: there is no indication whether or not the Reapers need a starting relay to get to the Citadel, it may be such that they can self launch when going to the Citadel because it is a special kind of relay, due to it's size and control technology.

[kidbd15]

mcsupersport wrote...

Plan A was to send a signal to the Citadel and open the relay and destroy the leadership of the races and shut down all active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan B was to get the Rachni to beat back the Citadel races and then open the relay and destroy the leadership of the races and shut down active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan C was to use Saren and the Geth to figure out why the relay wouldn't respond to the signal in the first place and then let Sovereign in the Citadel so he can open the relay and kill the leadership of the races and shut down all active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan D was to fly straight to the galaxy, and do it the hard way, maybe/probably facing united galactic fleets taking damage but still doing the job with the help of relays. Maybe even getting to the Citadel killing the leadership and shutting down the relays isolating systems to themselves.

Plan E to be determined.

The Suicide Mission was all a side mission in which the collectors found a workable race, tried out a bio-weapon(mordin's recruitment) and started work on a new reaper which by all information is what happens every cycle. Bio-races are harvested and "uplifted" into a new reaper making it there salvation through destruction.

As far as being obvious......
1) No one but reaper or collector could pass through the Omega 4 relay and survive.
2) Few knew Reapers were connected to the Collectors because most don't even know Reapers exist.
3) Colonies were taken from remote corners using almost complete stealth, causing no information to be left connecting them to the disappearances.


As a side note: there is no indication whether or not the Reapers need a starting relay to get to the Citadel, it may be such that they can self launch when going to the Citadel because it is a special kind of relay, due to it's size and control technology.

Oh yea, forgot about your plan A &B... makes sense.

Modifié par kidbd15, 01 avril 2011 - 11:21 .

[desonnac00]

kidbd15 wrote...

My reasoning: B was done before C to re-try A. If the Reapers are anything, they are patient.  Their main goal is getting to the Citadel first because that is the tactical move... work from the inside going out.

How does retard tryclops and drawing the attention of everyone with half a brain in the galaxy count as a good strategy?
How were they planning to get tryclops in the citadel when he was finished? Btw- he had decades before being finished.
Why wait?
It doesn't matter what they usually do- Sovereign is dead!
They don't need the Citadel, but also can't use it anymore.
There's no point in a subvursive tactics, whose preparation alerts your enemies to you promixity. All the reapers>milky way. There is no reason to wait. They just come here and kill things! They don't need tactics, and hardly have room for any- Citadel is no longer usable by Reapers.

MAYBE there is something else like the citadel, MAYBE baby tryclops had some mysterious purpose that advocates the collectors' behaviour- DRAWING ATTENTION. MAYBE!.
Too bad no story, or narrative TOLD ME ANYTHING LIKE THIS.
STOP MAKING CHIT UP FORUMERS. Use what's there, not your own fanfiction.

[kidbd15]

desonnac00 wrote...

kidbd15 wrote...

My reasoning: B was done before C to re-try A. If the Reapers are anything, they are patient.  Their main goal is getting to the Citadel first because that is the tactical move... work from the inside going out.

How does retard tryclops and drawing the attention of everyone with half a brain in the galaxy count as a good strategy?
How were they planning to get tryclops in the citadel when he was finished? Btw- he had decades before being finished.
Why wait?
It doesn't matter what they usually do- Sovereign is dead!
They don't need the Citadel, but also can't use it anymore.
There's no point in a subvursive tactics, whose preparation alerts your enemies to you promixity. All the reapers>milky way. There is no reason to wait. They just come here and kill things! They don't need tactics, and hardly have room for any- Citadel is no longer usable by Reapers.

MAYBE there is something else like the citadel, MAYBE baby tryclops had some mysterious purpose that advocates the collectors' behaviour- DRAWING ATTENTION. MAYBE!.
Too bad no story, or narrative TOLD ME ANYTHING LIKE THIS.
STOP MAKING CHIT UP FORUMERS. Use what's there, not your own fanfiction.

kidbd15 wrote...
Obviously we don't have all the facts because BW hasn't told us, so all we can do is speculate and question.

But perhaps to get to your underlying problem of ME2, I shall say this:  [color=rgb(128, 128, 128)">ME2 was NOT  ]We essentially end where ME1 ended[/color], but we learned more about Cerberus, the Genophage, the Geth, Quarians, Krogan, Shadow Broker (DLC) and to a lesser extent the Protheans and Reapers.  I'm sure players can go straight from ME1 to ME3 without missing much of a beat.  

I don't know why BW did this.  [b]Obvious reason is $$, and as a business, makes perfect sense.  They wanted to make a new game with new mechanics, introduce new characters, fill in some background information, and SET UP for continuing their main story in ME3.... it was ME1.5. 

There is no valid reason yet, no explanation given, which is why speculation by us forumers must happen until we are given the facts by BioWare. That's what some people do... they fspeculate until the story writer fills in the info for them.

I'm not saying what I said is what happened, I'm saying that is one of MANY different possibilities for why ME2 tryclops or whatever happened. Maybe the Reapers just wanted to start making their new child for their Arrival... who knows? BioWare, that's who.  And if you so badly want your answers I suggest going to BW headquarters, chain yourself to a pole, go on a hunger strike and demand your answers.  Until you go do that, why don't you chill the f*ck out, speculate your own theory on why any of this ME stuff happened, and move on with your life... bottom line: stop caring so much

edit: Forgot to add... IF it's still not explained by the end of ME3, then you have every right to complain.  I'll join you. But not right now.

Modifié par kidbd15, 02 avril 2011 - 10:54 .

[Phaedon]

1) Harbinger to Collector General: "You have failed" Meaning that the Human Reaper project was important.
2) Harbinger to Collector General: "We will find another way" Implying that the HR would open up a way.
3) Reapers turning their 'lights' on: Implying that they are being re-activated.
4) Reapers moving towards the galaxy: Meaning that they are um, moving towards the galaxy, in order to reach the Alpha Relay.

Have some of you...played Mass Effect 2?

[Valmarn]

Almostfaceman wrote...

Valmarn wrote...

Who said anything about spoon-feeding? I just want it to be made evident, gradually or otherwise, why they harvest the inhabitants of the galaxy. "They're unknown beings" is just a weak, half-hearted excuse that you seem to have eaten up, and then asked for seconds of.

I got to hand it to you: you have an enviable disregard for rational storytelling, and for the deeper meaning to the Reapers' extinction cycles.

Are you the kind of guy who likes to read the end of mystery novels?  'cause Bioware ain't gonna tell us all about the Reapers until Act 3.  They gave us some clues in Act 2 with the Collectors and the Collector Base, but they're saving all the real answers for the end of the book.

You assume too much.

I thought I made it clear enough in my previous posts that "Act 3" is exactly when I expect the question(s) to be answered. The debate between Bamboozalist and I was about the importance of the writers addressing the mystery of the Reapers' extinction cycles of advanced species'; about them answering these looming questions that have arisen. My posts are, most certainly, not about getting answers any sooner than Mass Effect 3's release date.

In the future, if you wish to respond to a post that is an exchange between two other forum members, feel free to look back at some of their other posts, lest you make false assumptions about either person.

Modifié par Valmarn, 02 avril 2011 - 01:34 .

[Valmarn]

mcsupersport wrote...

Plan A was to send a signal to the Citadel and open the relay and destroy the leadership of the races and shut down all active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan B was to get the Rachni to beat back the Citadel races and then open the relay and destroy the leadership of the races and shut down active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan C was to use Saren and the Geth to figure out why the relay wouldn't respond to the signal in the first place and then let Sovereign in the Citadel so he can open the relay and kill the leadership of the races and shut down all active relays isolating every system to itself.

Plan D was to fly straight to the galaxy, and do it the hard way, maybe/probably facing united galactic fleets taking damage but still doing the job with the help of relays. Maybe even getting to the Citadel killing the leadership and shutting down the relays isolating systems to themselves.

Plan E to be determined.

The Suicide Mission was all a side mission in which the collectors found a workable race, tried out a bio-weapon(mordin's recruitment) and started work on a new reaper which by all information is what happens every cycle. Bio-races are harvested and "uplifted" into a new reaper making it there salvation through destruction.

As far as being obvious......
1) No one but reaper or collector could pass through the Omega 4 relay and survive.
2) Few knew Reapers were connected to the Collectors because most don't even know Reapers exist.
3) Colonies were taken from remote corners using almost complete stealth, causing no information to be left connecting them to the disappearances.


As a side note: there is no indication whether or not the Reapers need a starting relay to get to the Citadel, it may be such that they can self launch when going to the Citadel because it is a special kind of relay, due to it's size and control technology.

You make some very good points, though I would like to point out that it doesn't seem to happen every cycle, otherwise the Reapers would resemble Protheans. I would hypothesize that it happens every other cycle, or even every other other cycle. Between the cycles that the Reapers take a new form ("Rebirth Cycles"), they enslave the various races to harvest the race(s) during the Rebirth Cycles.

[desonnac00]

I fusing give up... FINE- IGNORE IT and sing yourselves to sleep with "IT ALL MAKES PERFECT SENSE" chants and whatnot- I give up.

[ShepardOsiris]

johnbonhamatron wrote...

One thing I'm curious about is where the idea of "the (spoiler-free) beastie we vapourised in the SM being a vanguard to replace Sovereign" came from, because in all my playthroughs, I can't find any hints of that in the game. Was it forum speculation that came up with that idea, 'cos I genuinely have no clue?

  It's never been exactly stated that this was the case, but many believe it to be, because it makes the most sense.  Plan A has seemingly flawlessly worked for potentially millions of years, so it's clearly the single best option.  Losing Sovereign/Nazara  took that plan off the table.  Building the HR would clearly allow the Reapers a chance to still execute plan A, thier far and away choice, so logic would say that's what was happening.  A replacement for Nazara would be able to figure out why exactly plan A failed and potentially fix it all.  

  Plus, having a HR may give them other benefits, including a test run of thier new favored species, so why not do it now if the opportunity is there?  It's a win win if they could have pulled it off.   Now things have changed.  

 

  My take on things is this.  We know that the Reapers are at least partially synthetic, and they have somewhat of a machine/statistical way of looking at things.  So it's likely that the 50,000 year figure is a rough estimate of when civilization has reached it's peak point of when it will offer the most rewards for harvesting of technology, population, and whatever else is needed, but at the same time still be completely unable to fight back against the reapers.  
  I don't buy into the whole concept of the Reapers needing to strike because of low energy or any of that, because if that were the case, it would need to be an exact time frame for them to return.  This is clearly not the case because part of Sovereign's job was to monitor known Civilization until it was clear it was time to strike, so to me, that proves that the Reapers hand is not forced due to energy concerns. 

  I think it comes down to technology.  Obviously for whatever reason, the Reapers need civilization to develop to at least a certain point, but that's a tricky road to take, because technology doesn't stop improving.  The Reapers are out in dark space, they got what they got, however powerful it is, once civilization reaches it's optimum harvest time, that window between them and the Reapers is constantly closing.  Take the Thanix cannon, a very recent weapon, and anyone that upgraded to it in ME 2 knows it's worth.  In ME 1, that weapon wasn't an option it didn't exist.  Now it does, how much farther will things be able to go in another 2, 4, 10 years?  There will come a time when the galaxy develops enough that it can fight the Reapers and win, especially if it's still got it's leaders.  

  I think you basically had plan A fail in ME 1, ME 2 was essentially the Reapers deciding the best course of action, that course was to still try plan A by replacing Nazara.  There may be more going on in the background with ME 2, but primarily, I see it as a different route to thier best tactical option.  Obviously, that also fails.  

  Now restarting plan A via another ME 2 style is awfully risky due to people being wise to it now, and having to start all over is a time issue.   The technology of the galaxy has to be becoming some concern no matter how confident the Reapers are.  If they take another long approach plan meaning years of waiting while they slowly plan things out and execute them through some new foot soldier, thier calculations have to tell them that it's going to be a battle, not a cake walk.   

   So now we get to arrival.  Obviously it's faulty if you play it before the SM, so it's clearly meant for after that. I see it's unlock conditions as just a gesture to make it more accessable to players.  I see the events of Arrival though as something that was always available to the Reapers but not at all preferred because of various tactical disadvantages.   However thier long plans have been shot down, they can't wait infinitely for technology to get to a point where it may be a factor for them, and on top of all that, they clearly do have some emotion, and they are pissed off.  So they slap thier little metal chests, scream "This Is Sparta!" and off to war it is.  
  I don't claim this outlook is perfect, but it's plausible enough and it's a way to have what we've been presented with so far make relatively good sense.    

[Sidac]

desonnac00 wrote...BUT IF they'll just get here in 2 years- WHY BOTHER!?
What are two years for an ageless machine that just go on autopilot and "sleep"?
2 years!?
Why draw attention to yourself? Why risk losing assets(*ME2 ending*[If])? Why create such a liability as *ME2 ending*?
Did the reapers NOT KNOW that they'd be there 2 years later? And that their "speedy way in" would not be finished by then?*ME2 ending*

Arrival seems to be using the concept of the "scorched earth" policy is to slow your enemy down and starve them of useful resources so you can by yourself time to prepare. In this case, the resource is the relay. In ME it would be a few months or years. Plenty of time to pull back troops from the fringes of space and prep defenses.

ps. FOR those of you THAT maKe fuTure threads like THIS....
PLEASE make it SOMEWHAT legible!!!!!
I hate to be a GRAMMER facist, but IT GETS RATHER annoying to *read*
after the FIVE thousandth tImE SOMETHING is *capitalized*

Modifié par Sidac, 02 avril 2011 - 04:44 .