531 réponses à ce sujet

[D3ndat]

First i would like to say thanks to AreleX for the awesome work and effort on this guide, and ask a question: what build and tatics would you recommend for isabela for the team of Hawke, Anders, Varric, Isabela ? (i'm asking because it uses almost all of my favorite npcs, just missing merril)

[PsychicHammer]

I'm playing DW Shadow/Assassin (not exactly following the guide, since I prefer to go Shadow as first spec for one and I only put 5 pints in DW tree) but it's the first time I'm playing a Rogue without a Warrior in the party. Didn't expect it to be so effective. Team 'You Won't Be Forgiven For This!' is a goddamn glass canon (I'm just an average player, mind you) but most things die too fast to do anything. Though I'm thinking about actually trying out the Duealist spec - I've never used it b4. Well, we'll see. Anyways, I bow to your unquestionable awesomness. 

Modifié par Scott_Press, 03 novembre 2011 - 10:07 .

[JosieJ]

 OK, I know AreleX hates Fenris, but anybody got a build for him that would go with a DW Shadow/Assassin?  I'm totally sick of Aveline since I just used her in a runthrough, and I totally suck at builds!  This runthrough will be on Hard, not NM--I also totally suck at playing the game! 

[PsychicHammer]

Team YWBFFT just beat Xebbie in two minutes on nightmare without leaving the room! Anyone but Merril was really glassy: Anders got pts in con and rest into mag, Varric was my disarm, lockpick bot so his points were all cun/dex, and Hawke all dex to max out crit chance. Team could only go more glassy if Izzy was present. Damn they hit hard! It's the second time ever I beat Xebbie in the room - I'm kinda proud of meself, but I'd never happen had Arelex not suggested the party setup. Really, before the only thing that seemed more crazy to me than playing rogue with no-tank-party was soloing - with any class. Thanks Arelex for making it happen! Cheers!

Modifié par Scott_Press, 12 novembre 2011 - 08:27 .

[PatrickBateman]

JosieJ wrote...

 OK, I know AreleX hates Fenris, but anybody got a build for him that would go with a DW Shadow/Assassin?  I'm totally sick of Aveline since I just used her in a runthrough, and I totally suck at builds!  This runthrough will be on Hard, not NM--I also totally suck at playing the game! 

Can't stand Fenris on nightmare, unless you micro mangage him 24/7 he will one-shot your DW rogue from FF every encounter

Might work with Fenris + 3 mages or 2 mages/ranged rogue on nightmare but haven't tried it.

[PsychicHammer]

JosieJ wrote...


 OK, I know AreleX hates Fenris, but anybody got a build for him that would go with a DW Shadow/Assassin?  I'm totally sick of Aveline since I just used her in a runthrough, and I totally suck at builds!  This runthrough will be on Hard, not NM--I also totally suck at playing the game! 

If you're gonna play DW Rogue with Fenris, you gotta forget about 2h. I'd do sth like this: 
1.Pommel Strike
2.Taunt
3.Control
4.Might
5.Rally
6.Cleave
7.Lyrium Ghost
8.Pommel Blow
9.Destroyer
10.Muscle
11.Bolster
12.Unite
13.Claymore
14.Massacre
15.Veneer of Calm
16.Lyrium Specter
17.Deflect
18.Battle Tempo
19.Inner Reserves
20.Bellow
21.Second Wind
22.Deep Breath
23.Deep Reserves
24.Last Push

Tactics: Aggressive/Custom
1. self: any - activate: Lyrium Ghost
2. self: any - activate: Might
3. self: health < 25% - health potion
4. enemy: target rank is normal or higher - Cleave
5. enemy: target rank is elite or higher - jump to 12
6. enemy: target of Hawke - Rally
7. self: mana or stamina < 10% - Second Wind
8. enemy at close range - Taunt
9. ally: mana or stamina < 25% - Rally 
10. self: mana stamina < 10% - Bolster
11. enemy: target rank is elite or higher - Pommel Blow (actual jump destination is here, if I got this right)
12. enemy: target rank is elite or higher - Rally
13. enemy: nearest visible - attack
14. enemy: attacking Anders (assuming he's in the party) - attack
15. enemy: attacking Hawke - attack


I actually tried this out and it was pretty good. No friendly fire, Explosive Strike (or Vendetta, if you play Duelist) CCC, crowd control via Taunt/Bellow, decent dps (give him full strenght). It also worked well for my Spirit Healer Hawke. Dual Haste equals Fenris-Beast. 

This is meant for NM. If you're going to play Hard, throw in Might Blow and Scythe. Fenris Doesn't really get much better than that. You can give him Bravery, but that just destroys the build I listed above completely. His stamina pool isn't that big, so I prefer to stay safe and go deeper into Battlemaster tree instead - fixes any stamina issues Fenris might be having.

NOTE: I'm on PC. I dunno about console players, but I can give Fenris S&B, namely Courage and 'insert-1h-weapon'. Courage is cool. Just saying.

Hope that helps. 

Modifié par Scott_Press, 26 novembre 2011 - 07:46 .

[frustratemyself]

Fenris and Aveline spend their whole time getting in the way of a DW rogue. Would you really want to do that to yourself?

[PsychicHammer]

Hey, I play Anders/Merril/Varric

But there are companion quests when Fenris is locked in

[frustratemyself]

True and he's a pain the ass at those times.

[PsychicHammer]

His first quest (Bait and Switch, was it?) is a major issue for me. The only time I enjoyed doing that one was when I played my first Warrior, before 1.03 came along and turned everything upside down. Hawke just went Claymore+Sunder and Chain Lightning did the rest, one shotting every shade within radius. I miss 600% damage...

[PsychicHammer]

Rally should be set to the same tactics as Haste.

You missed tactic 6 

Modifié par Scott_Press, 01 décembre 2011 - 05:57 .

[frustratemyself]

6. enemy: target of Hawke - Rally

This would have him spamming Rally without anything to really control it whenever Hawke targets anything, trash or otherwise.

[PsychicHammer]

The point is to give Hawke free +25% crit dmg as often as possible. At the same time it will keep Anders at good mana levels, so the point of this tactic IS spamming Rally. Remember that Fenris is just a companion and while he does have good dps, Hawke outclasses him heavily, therefore I say buffing Hawke's dmg as much as possible is good. You could, of course, mess with the tactics a bit more, since there are slots left, but I was trying to keep Fenris's tactics simple, to make sure they fired off when they should. This Fenris build is something between typical Warrior dmg build and tank - he has some crowd control stuff but will also take care of little guys attacking Anders, keeping Blondie alive.

Modifié par Scott_Press, 02 décembre 2011 - 12:56 .

[Volman]

That's all great as always you're doing it the best Arelex!
But can you please add daggers and where to get from, some like what you've done in the warrior build, that would be really helpful and is gratefully

Modifié par Volman, 20 décembre 2011 - 04:48 .

[glitter_guld]

Hi,
I would like to know if this guide is the latest version or are there some updates or optimizations to it in terms of rogue skills, companion skills and combat script. Thanks.

[SuicidalBaby]

glitter_guld wrote...

Hi,
I would like to know if this guide is the latest version or are there some updates or optimizations to it in terms of rogue skills, companion skills and combat script. Thanks.

Toward the bottom of the OP:

Patch 1.02 (Console) and 1.03 (PC) Build/Tactics/Notes Updates

Everything after that is what you are looking for.

[glitter_guld]

I am planning to try assassin on nightmare for the first time. Will be interesting to see if I will be able to shuffle my party or not. So far, the portion before Kirkwall was not so bad. The ogre died just like he always did.

[SuicidalBaby]

This build will make you check the difficulty setting repeatedly simply because it will feel as if you are playing normal and not nightmare when in fact you are on Nightmare.

Modifié par SuicidialBaby, 26 mars 2012 - 07:25 .

[gauntz]

Is the patch really so horrible? I'm playing rogue with the "old" Assassin/Duelist build listed, and pretty much steamrolling everything on nightmare (though I'm only at the end of Act 1), and the only real trouble I've gotten is the Arvashad or whatever, but that was mostly due to having no potions left. I'm even playing with Isabela/Merril/Varric/Bethany, so I don't even have a warrior/tank.

Mark of Death + Twin Fangs kills pretty much everything in 2 secs. Is the complaint with the patch that Shadow is a much better somehow than Assassin/Duelist now? 'Cause I took a cursory glanced at the patch notes (havn't played since release until now), and all I saw was some stamina changes and seemingly insignificant nerfs to CCC skills. Does Overkill doing 200% bonus instead of 400% really matter that much now that bosses can't be bursted down as quickly anymore?

[SuicidalBaby]

shadow makes the build faceroll auto attack

[punkgamer01]

any build for sebastien, aveline, isabella, post-patch ?? in your video you used sebastien and i'd love to see aveline and isabella post-patch, and maybe sebastian, for the +5% damage resistance ^^'

i don't want to take lacerate for nothing ^^', adding to that, i love to used all of my compagnion, but i'm not very good to set tactics. i was good pre-patch, but don't know if the tactics mechanic has been modified, because pre-patch, your sustain activated first and post-patch they activated last. when i activated sustain first (before all the CCC and activated talents) not all sustain trriger (in the post-patch version of the game)

edit : i have another question : is arelex going to add build and tactics for the others compagnion ? or did he just given up on this tutorial, because with all the compagnion you have in the game, it's a little bit odd to see all the guide arelex made and i feel this one is just has been abandonned. it's a shame, i really enjoy dw assasin even post-patch, would someone have idea of tactics for sebastian orr isabella at least ?

Modifié par punkgamer01, 19 juin 2012 - 02:05 .

[punkgamer01]

 this topic is really abandonned or what ?


(sorry if i'm too direct about that, but need a answer to it)

btw, my question about adding the other compagnion build /tactics is always of actuality ^^'

[mr_afk]

the game is pretty old..
don't think i've touched it for ~9months plus, Arelex probably for longer.

if you're still interested in the game and want to challenge yourself with new builds etc I would recommend just learning the basics yourself. pretty much all the info is available in suicidal's tactics guides and you can use either Arelex's or my guides as a template/example for certain setups.

i don't think the tactics were changed in the patch, besides maybe consumables working as intended. the order your abilities activate will depend on the order you set them in - so if you want the sustains to activate first, stick them up the top of the tactics order. Alternatively, just activate them manually and leave them out of the tactics (so no deactivate: sustain).

are you intending to do a 3 rogue 1 warrior setup? Bit.. odd.


Anyway sebastian will be somewhat similar to varric but with royal archer instead of marksman.
I don't really know what Arelex was doing with him in his guide, since I think he was using him to obscure hawke whereas I prefer shadow veil, but here's an example sebastian build:

Tactics:
1. Self: Health <25% - Use:Health Potion
2. Self: Stamina <10% - Use:Stamina Draught
3. Self: Any - Activate:Speed
4. Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Use current condition for next tactic
5. Enemy: BRITTLE - Archer's Lance (if you don't have a mage, no need for this)
6. Enemy: Clustered with at least four enemies - Fatiguing Fog
7. Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Wounding Arrow
8. Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Brand (not as much point with 3 rogues)
9. Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Use current condition for next tactic
10. Enemy: Health <50% - Pinning Shot
11. Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Use current condition for next tactic
12. Enemy: Health <50% - Arrow of Judgement
13. Self: Being attacked by a melee attack - Rush
14. Self: Surrounded by at least three enemies - Guardian Angel
15. Enemy: Attacking Anders/Isabela - Attack
16. Enemy: Target of Hawke - Attack

note: I kinda don't like sebastian and don't use him. also these tactics may or may not work, depending on what you're looking for. also, getting the full chain to trigger is pretty hard without some extensive optimisation of tactics - so your arrow of judgement/wounding arrows probably won't be fully charged


I use isabela like this to take the most advantage of staggers, blindside etc:
Abilities

Tactics
1. Self: Health <50% - Use:Health Potion
2. Self: Any - Activate: Precision (change to Speed once her crit chance is high enough)
3. Self: Any - Activate: Lacerate
4. Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Use current condition for next tactic
5. Enemy: STAGGERED - Explosive Strike
6. Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Use current condition for next tactic
7. Enemy: STAGGERED - Twin Fangs
8. Enemy: Clustered with at least four enemies - All Hands on Deck
9. Enemy: STAGGERED - Attack
10. Self: Being attacked by a melee attack - Rush
11. Self: surrounded by at least three enemies - Rush
12 Self: Being attacked by a melee attack - Armistice
13. Self: Being attacked by a melee or ranged attack - Use current condition for next tactic
14. Aveline: Any - Goad (upgrade to Corral for archers)
15. Enemy: Attacking Aveline - Attack
16. Enemy: Target of Aveline - Attack

Do note that if Aveline is going to be using assault/scatters (on nightmare), isabela is probably going to die.

I'll leave Aveline for you to figure out. If you want to use her without friendly fire you can check out my all-melee party here, where aveline is focused on setting up staggers and buffing the party (switch control for might if you're not using fenris as well).
If you decide to change isabela for a ranged character/don't mind killing isabela and hawke, a more powerful setup where Aveline can use assaults/scatters is possible.

Modifié par mr_afk, 20 juin 2012 - 06:58 .

[AreleX]

protip: don't use mr afk's guides

he is the worst player