516 réponses à ce sujet

[DragonAgePoo]

This is so laughably bad. I can't wait to see the week 4 sales numbers. Even with the price dropping like a rock I dont think the lower price is going to help them sell more units.

Such a flop. That's what they get and they can only blame themselves.

[Night Prowler76]

hex23 wrote...

Otterwarden wrote...


Official or not, it is the numbers that their competitors will be seeing.  This will give them a good gut feel of how successful this "experiment" has been.

www.pcworld.idg.com.au/review/games/ea-games/dragon_age_2/381003

"Indeed, in doing something so dramatically different, Bioware has
inadvertently given other developers and publishers all the reason in
the world to keep their top franchises safe and stale — if you take
risks, you'll ****** off some very vocal fanboys."

Personally, I don't agree with this writer's spin.  Another way of seeing it is that if you serve up something that is completely different from what your customer base praised you for, you get called out.

It isn't the numbers their competitors will be seeing because nobody in their right mind pays attention to VG or NPD. Both are notoriously inaccurate. This has been known for years. Those places only get quoted by people who don't know any better.

I think you should leave your bubble and come back to  the real world.

[Night Prowler76]

The Metalion wrote...

Boiny Bunny wrote...

Which is what I responded to in The Metalion's post - that he/she said they were going to make a loss.

That's not what (he) said...

I said that selling a million copies of a game is a success in my books.  Over a MILLION people have already bought this game.  1,000,000 copies sold and counting.  On its way to TWO million!  You may have different standards, but to me, that's a huge success.

I didn't say anything about profit/loss.  Regardless of expectations, I doubt any investors lost money in this.

If a game developer does not make money on a game, its not a success, no matter how you spin it, Im sure BioWare will make its money back, but there will be very little profit from the game, 1 million people buyin a game does not make it a success in anyones eyes, sorry, its not 2001 anymore dude.

Modifié par Night Prowler76, 04 avril 2011 - 05:21 .

[LooksLikeTrouble]

Looks like the mods are looking for any reason they can to close threads about the ****** poor sales.

That alone should tell you things aint all pleasant up in Bioware land.

[konokonohamaru]

It looks like with DA2, Buyoware made a big withdrawal from their reputational bank account.

[naughty99]

It looks like they have just cracked 1million units if I understand the charts correctly.

PS3 260k
PC 207k
Xbox 583k

I guess congratulations are in order? 

Modifié par naughty99, 04 avril 2011 - 08:31 .

[Night Prowler76]

naughty99 wrote...

It looks like they have just cracked 1million units if I understand the charts correctly.

PS3 260k
PC 207k
Xbox 583k

I guess congratulations are in order? 

Have you not read this thread? 1 million units wont even make them a profit, thank you, come again.

[PlumPaul93]

Night Prowler76 wrote...

naughty99 wrote...

It looks like they have just cracked 1million units if I understand the charts correctly.

PS3 260k
PC 207k
Xbox 583k

I guess congratulations are in order? 

Have you not read this thread? 1 million units wont even make them a profit, thank you, come again.

, personally I feel Bioware deserves this because they rushed the game thinking they could get a cheap payout, sadly from the looks of it they were wrong. Hopefully this gives them motivation to work harder on the next game and not take shortcuts or rush it out but...

[naughty99]

Night Prowler76 wrote...

Have you not read this thread? 1 million units wont even make them a profit, thank you, come again.

I have no idea what share of the pie goes to MS and Sony.

The production, packaging and shipping of each physical disc should be in the range of $1 - $2 except for special editions and excluding PS3/Xbox licensing fees. Obviously the same costs for digital download sales, which numbers have not been published, will be almost nothing.

Based on what I have seen of EA's' marketing campaign I would estimate it to be in the range of $12 - 15m.

Whatever the production budget was, I imagine there was a portion of that overhead that went to development fees (additional revenue for Bioware). 

At any rate it's a nice milestone and I suppose Bioware and EA deserve a pat on the back. <3

Over the lifespan I suppose DA2 will likely wind up in the neighborhood of 2m physical discs sold, with who knows how many digital downloads or "Ultimate Edition/GOTY" copies sold. Not tremendous compared to Bioware's track record, but IMO this is not too bad for any consumer entertainment product with $60 MSRP (wholesale price paid by retailers to EA is probably in the range of 50% of the MSRP).

Personally, I really enjoyed the game.

Modifié par naughty99, 04 avril 2011 - 09:10 .

[AkiKishi]

naughty99 wrote...

Night Prowler76 wrote...

Have you not read this thread? 1 million units wont even make them a profit, thank you, come again.

I have no idea what share of the pie goes to MS and Sony.

The production, packaging and shipping of each physical disc should be in the range of $1 - $2 except for special editions and excluding PS3/Xbox licensing fees. Obviously the same costs for digital download sales, which numbers have not been published, will be almost nothing.

Based on what I have seen of EA's' marketing campaign I would estimate it to be in the range of $12 - 15m.

Whatever the production budget was, I imagine there was a portion of that overhead that went to development fees (additional revenue for Bioware). 

At any rate it's a nice milestone and I suppose Bioware and EA deserve a pat on the back. <3

Over the lifespan DA2 will likely wind up in the neighborhood of 2m physical discs sold, with who knows how many digital downloads or "Ultimate Edition/GOTY" copies sold.

Well console games are priced higher than PC games for that reason.

It's not enough to just look at the profit either DA2 is a "wasted" cycle as far as profits go. You can only make so many games over a certain time period.

[konokonohamaru]

LOL some folks here are just like Buyoware. They only care about profits.

To me the most telling statistic is the massive dropoff in sales by week, rather than total quantity sold or whatever the profit is.

[ink07]

naughty99 wrote...

I have no idea what share of the pie goes to MS and Sony.

The production, packaging and shipping of each physical disc should be in the range of $1 - $2 except for special editions and excluding PS3/Xbox licensing fees. Obviously the same costs for digital download sales, which numbers have not been published, will be almost nothing.

Based on what I have seen of EA's' marketing campaign I would estimate it to be in the range of $12 - 15m.

Whatever the production budget was, I imagine there was a portion of that overhead that went to development fees (additional revenue for Bioware). 

At any rate it's a nice milestone and I suppose Bioware and EA deserve a pat on the back. <3

According to analyst Michael Pachter it is like this:

For every $60 console game:

$12 - go to the retail store
$12 - go to the console manufacturer
$ 36 - go to the publisher, of which:

~$10 go to the studio who made the game (R&D costs, salaries mainly)
~$9 marketing (it really depends on the game, so the figures vary)
~$17 = profit.

For Digital copies in Steam it is:

(30%*) $18 for Steam
(70%*) $42 for EA (minus R&D & MKTG)


For Digital copies in EADM it is 100% profit (again, minus R&D & MKTG & bandwith costs)

*These are estimations, but very close.

Modifié par ink07, 04 avril 2011 - 09:25 .

[naughty99]

ink07 wrote...

According to analyst Michael Pachter it is like this:

For every $60 console game:

$12 - go to the retail store
$12 - go to the console manufacturer
$ 36 - go to the publisher, of which:

~$10 go to the studio who made the game (R&D costs, salaries mainly)
~$9 marketing (it really depends on the game, so the figures vary)
~$17 = profit.

For Digital copies in Steam it is:

$18 for Steam
$42 for EA (minus R&D & MKTG)

For Digital copies in EADM it is 100% profit (again, minus R&D & MKTG & bandwith costs)

Fascinating, thanks for sharing this.

Very surprised to hear about the low retailer margins (retailers are paying $48 wholesale for units that sell at $60).

In the film industry in which I work, the major retailers are only willing to pay about 50% MSRP for DVDs and Blu-Rays, even for boxed sets that retail at $50-60.  

Modifié par naughty99, 04 avril 2011 - 09:28 .

[Nerivant]

PlumPaul82393 wrote...
, personally I feel Bioware deserves this because they rushed the game thinking they could get a cheap payout, sadly from the looks of it they were wrong. Hopefully this gives them motivation to work harder on the next game and not take shortcuts or rush it out but...

You have no idea how game developement works and you should brush up on it before you start slinging blame around.

[ink07]

They make up for it with the sales of used games I suppose, I don't think many retailers carry used DVDs & BRs.

Modifié par ink07, 04 avril 2011 - 09:34 .

[PlumPaul93]

Nerivant wrote...

PlumPaul82393 wrote...
, personally I feel Bioware deserves this because they rushed the game thinking they could get a cheap payout, sadly from the looks of it they were wrong. Hopefully this gives them motivation to work harder on the next game and not take shortcuts or rush it out but...

You have no idea how game developement works and you should brush up on it before you start slinging blame around.

Aah yes it is all EA's fault Bioware had nothing to do with it and they were forced to do what they were told, they didn't agree to anything and didn't profit from this at all, sound about right?

[Nerivant]

PlumPaul82393 wrote...

Nerivant wrote...

PlumPaul82393 wrote...
, personally I feel Bioware deserves this because they rushed the game thinking they could get a cheap payout, sadly from the looks of it they were wrong. Hopefully this gives them motivation to work harder on the next game and not take shortcuts or rush it out but...

You have no idea how game developement works and you should brush up on it before you start slinging blame around.

Aah yes it is all EA's fault Bioware had nothing to do with it and they were forced to do what they were told, they didn't agree to anything and didn't profit from this at all, sound about right?

Nope, still wrong. Try again.

[PlumPaul93]

Nerivant wrote...

PlumPaul82393 wrote...

Nerivant wrote...

PlumPaul82393 wrote...
, personally I feel Bioware deserves this because they rushed the game thinking they could get a cheap payout, sadly from the looks of it they were wrong. Hopefully this gives them motivation to work harder on the next game and not take shortcuts or rush it out but...

You have no idea how game developement works and you should brush up on it before you start slinging blame around.

Aah yes it is all EA's fault Bioware had nothing to do with it and they were forced to do what they were told, they didn't agree to anything and didn't profit from this at all, sound about right?

Nope, still wrong. Try again.

aah then please explain smart person since you are obviously so intelligent that I could not possibly comprehend your line of thinking

[I Have Big Boobs]

ink07 wrote...

According to analyst Michael Pachter it is like this:

For every $60 console game:

$12 - go to the retail store
$12 - go to the console manufacturer
$ 36 - go to the publisher, of which:

~$10 go to the studio who made the game (R&D costs, salaries mainly)
~$9 marketing (it really depends on the game, so the figures vary)
~$17 = profit.

For Digital copies in Steam it is:

(30%*) $18 for Steam
(70%*) $42 for EA (minus R&D & MKTG)


For Digital copies in EADM it is 100% profit (again, minus R&D & MKTG & bandwith costs)

*These are estimations, but very close.

OK so lets use these numbers with the numbers from the original post and see how it all shakes down.


843215 total console copies sold after 3 weeks

$50,592,900 @ $60

which breaks down to

$10,118,580 retailers

$10,118,580 consoles manufacturers

$8,432,150 studio/Bioware

$7,588,935 advertising

$14,334,655 profit


Now I'm inclined to believe the advertising camapign was probably closer to the $15 million range.  I'm still seeing commercials.  There's no way to be sure, although for some reason I think I did hear an exact number used in an interview or on a website somewhere, which would eat into that $14 mil profit by a ton.

That would leave only about $7.5 million in total profit and EA must be crying over that.  $7.5 million might sound like a lot to some of us, but to video game publishers that is absolutely nothing, especially for a high profile title.  Bioware, the retailers Microsoft and Sony made more than the total profit for EA.  Thats pathetic for EA.  Totally awful.

Now keep in mind these numbers dont include ANY PC sales, and the game retailed at $60 on PC.  We wont know the Steam numbers, but they cant have been good.  Steam forums are raging about the game and you can see by it's time played on steam it's very, very low.  And nobody buys from EA store, those sales have to be almost negligable. 

So even adding PC sales EA's profit total wouldnt match retailers, MS/Sony, etc.  And the sales are only going to continue to drop, and the game is already being heavily discounted.  When the game gets discounted MS/Sony, retailers all keep their same profit, only EA and the studio takes the price drop loss.  So that is also terrible.

The game is a flop.

Modifié par I Have Big Boobs, 04 avril 2011 - 10:03 .

[naughty99]

I Have Big Boobs wrote...

Now keep in mind these numbers dont include ANY PC sales, and the game retailed at $60 on PC.  

The physical boxed PC copies sold is reported by VGChartz to be at 207k units.

[Vicious]

Interesting thread full of folks who only post trying to prove that DA2 wasn't successful for the sole purpose of saying to Bioware "see you changed the game to something I didn't like and LOOK WHAT HAPPENED! Now cater to me from now on!"


It's no wonder they take the cries of your kind with a grain of salt, and it's no wonder they don't seek to cater to your tastes anymore, either.

What a 'fan' base.

Modifié par Vicious, 04 avril 2011 - 10:08 .

[I Have Big Boobs]

naughty99 wrote...

I Have Big Boobs wrote...

Now keep in mind these numbers dont include ANY PC sales, and the game retailed at $60 on PC.  

The physical boxed PC copies sold is reported by VGChartz to be at 207k units.

It's not worth noting though because someone is still going to come in and say "Thats just phycal copiezzzz what about Steamzzzz and EA Storezzzzz"  not realizing that even if we had those numbers the basic breakdown would still be the same with EA making the least amount of money compared to everyone else involved due to poor sales. And when that happens thats called a flop.

Run similar numbers against DAO and ME2 (just use the console numbers for the first 3 weeks like I did to make sure it's fair and accurate) and you'll see why this is so bad.  This is probably the end of the Dragon Age series.

Modifié par I Have Big Boobs, 04 avril 2011 - 10:14 .

[silver-crescent]

Did you really create a new account just to spell the doom of the DA series?

Anyway

1) if you run similar numbers for DAO you get the same results, because DAO and DA2 sold exactly the same amount of copies in the first 3 weeks.

2) trying to calculate profit while ignoring a big part of the game's sales is just plain silly.

3) the game hasn't been "heavily discounted" anywhere. After 4 weeks, it got some fairly small price cuts from some European stores, and that's it.

[Warheadz]

silver-crescent wrote...

Did you really create a new account just to spell the doom of the DA series?

Anyway

1) if you run similar numbers for DAO you get the same results, because DAO and DA2 sold exactly the same amount of copies in the first 3 weeks.

That already means that DA2 sort of failed; the game established a fanbase after Origins, and they also had a rather massive marketing campaign. And still didn't do better.