1062 réponses à ce sujet

[BentOrgy]

KevShep wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

The only problem I see with this is the amount of biting we'd have to do; God knows how many Reapers there are, hundreds, thousands, millions? We supposed to infiltrate them all?

Not to mention how we'd bypass the Reaper's shield/defense systems to get inside in the first place.

Not to be a downer, but I just can't see it being feasible. Against a few hundred, maybe. Maaaaaybe. But not against as many as we're talking.

We dont take on the reaper when there in mass numbers. We divide and conqure....weaken there numbers. Single reapers out and swarm them,  they cant stop all of us swarming it. Since we control the citedal we can shut down the relays and only let friendlys in and out. This is what the reapers do to unsuspecting races during cycles.

Bypass a sheild is easy. all it is is a magnetic field that changes the direction of a projectile or dispenses an energy weapon. Sheilds do...not...act as a wall that stop things dead in its tracks. There are ways you can fly through another ships magnetic field without being thrown. In real life this is how it can be done if you can create a powerfull enough field. However in ME not only is a sheild a magnetic field but it also uses mass effect fields which use dark energy (something that cant actually be harnest in real life). I dont know why bioware makes the sheilds in ME to use mass effect fields when a powerfull enough magnetic field will do just fine.

Single out a reaper?

From what Sovereign told us in ME1, and from what we saw in the ME3 trailer, they kinda stick together. They're picking apart entire planets, at the same time, which means the probably move from system to system, at the same time.

Try weeding out one from a mass of god-like death machines sounds unlikely. I highly doubt (If the Reapers act like they should, and according to Sovereign's own description of their attack protocols,) we'll see a single reaper by itself, let alone the amount we'd need for that attack would need to be realistic.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 24 juillet 2011 - 07:04 .

[ubermensch007]

BentOrgy wrote...

Arcadia364 wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

I think its incredible; for a thread to have a subject with so much potential, go practically nowhere.... For four months.

Boggles the braincase.

I hope some eggheads at bioware have better ideas than we do

I think some of those eggheads have been hardboiled.

Case in point;

Mass Effect 1, Sovereign: "Organic life is a mutation, an accident." "We have no beggining, and we have no end, we simply, are."

Mass Effect 2, Harbinger (AKA, wannabe Sovereign.): "We are your genetic destiny." "I'm a fairy."

Okay, so that last quote was a lie. But Sovvy still makes it pretty clear that they regard organics as freak accidents, and synthetic life basically came first. But then in ME2 we hear how Reapers are synthetic AND organic.

Contradiction? Yeah, I'm thinkin' so.

Actually, I don't think that it is a "contradiction"...When I compare the two living Reapers that we have seen and heard speak thus far; Soveriegn and Harbinger. I see a stark contrast betwixt them (of sorts). While Soveriegn was given a great task and responsibilty; what with being "The Vanguard of our Destruction" and all.Even in Mass Effect 1, I got the sense that it may not know as much about itself as it thinks it does.Harbinger on the other hand, is clearly higher up on the Reaper Food-Chain (so to speak).

I don't think Soveriegn even knew about The Collector Base or the Collectors -  for that matter..For if he did.Than why weren't they working with him from the get-go? Soveriegn's Gig and Intel, was a "Need to Know" kind of operation.The Declassification of the greatest secrets and mysteries of the Reapers was beyond its 'pay-grade'.

[BentOrgy]

ubermensch007 wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

Arcadia364 wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

I think its incredible; for a thread to have a subject with so much potential, go practically nowhere.... For four months.

Boggles the braincase.

I hope some eggheads at bioware have better ideas than we do

I think some of those eggheads have been hardboiled.

Case in point;

Mass Effect 1, Sovereign: "Organic life is a mutation, an accident." "We have no beggining, and we have no end, we simply, are."

Mass Effect 2, Harbinger (AKA, wannabe Sovereign.): "We are your genetic destiny." "I'm a fairy."

Okay, so that last quote was a lie. But Sovvy still makes it pretty clear that they regard organics as freak accidents, and synthetic life basically came first. But then in ME2 we hear how Reapers are synthetic AND organic.

Contradiction? Yeah, I'm thinkin' so.

Actually, I don't think that it is a "contradiction"...When I compare the two living Reapers that we have seen and heard speak thus far; Soveriegn and Harbinger. I see a stark contrast betwixt them (of sorts). While Soveriegn was given a great task and responsibilty; what with being "The Vanguard of our Destruction" and all.Even in Mass Effect 1, I got the sense that it may not know as much about itself as it thinks it does.Harbinger on the other hand, is clearly higher up on the Reaper Food-Chain (so to speak).

I don't think Soveriegn even knew about The Collector Base or the Collectors -  for that matter..For if he did.Than why weren't they working with him from the get-go? Soveriegn's Gig and Intel, was a "Need to Know" kind of operation.The Declassification of the greatest secrets and mysteries of the Reapers was beyond its 'pay-grade'.

I always chalked the lack of Collectors in ME1 to the writers hadn't created them yet, because I also thought "Why the hell didn't Sovereign just come in with a horde of Collectors instead of relying on an unstable organic like Saren, and a bunch of lower machines like the Geth? Just ask Harby to part with some of his toys instead of outsourcing."

Its interecting that you think Harbinger outranked Sovereign, 'cause I actually thought the opposite. Odd huh?

Due to the extremely important nature of Sovereign's mission, and the manner in which he spoke to Shep on Virmire, in contrast to Harbinger's lackluster repetitive dialogue and reliance on the Collectors, I felt that Harbinger was the lower guy on the totempole.

True, the apparant mission of the Collectors was to create a new Reaper, which seems fairly imprtant, but I dunno, how it was represented, combined with Harbingers generally underwhelming presence in the story, conspired to make me think that Harbinger was more like the Igor character, and less like Dr. Frakenstein.

That, and I can't really se a reason why an "Uplifted" species like the Reapers would feel compelled to keep secrets from echother. What would be the point? They all think of themselves and eachother as gods, I just can't make sense of  "I know something you don't know," in their ranks.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 24 juillet 2011 - 11:49 .

[BentOrgy]

Double post.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 24 juillet 2011 - 11:47 .

[Arcadia364]

I figured that Sovereign wanted unimportant servants to take the damage from an invasion rather than an important reaper bulding team (Collecters) to be harmed. as far as i know they only have one ship a ship that could easily be destroyed by a galactic fleet

Modifié par Arcadia364, 24 juillet 2011 - 01:41 .

[BentOrgy]

Arcadia364 wrote...

I figured that Sovereign wanted unimportant servants to take the damage from an invasion rather than an important reaper bulding team (Collecters) to be harmed. as far as i know they only have one ship a ship that could easily be destroyed by a galactic fleet

.... Huh, I'll be damned; that makes a decent amount of sense.

We never really knew how many Collectors there were, and considering their origins, I doubt they're easily replaceable. But then again, you could always say that the Geth could have been used to harvest the organics in their stead.

Meh.

[GSSAGE7]

Is it ever stated if Sovereign's power is typical for a Reaper? For all we know, the Reapers left their strongest behind, and the others are a lot easier to kill.

[Arcadia364]

GSSAGE7 wrote...

Is it ever stated if Sovereign's power is typical for a Reaper? For all we know, the Reapers left their strongest behind, and the others are a lot easier to kill.

I dont think it is stated but it is made clear in the ME3 trailers that some reapers are weaker than others "such as the one that was stunned by one attack from a fleet"

Also i think i should mention that we in the 21st century have already developed EMP resistant tech and im quite sure the reapers must be able to withstand a substantialy greater amount. I think if we could get in a reaper then a tactical nuke would be far more viable

Modifié par Arcadia364, 24 juillet 2011 - 05:23 .

[The h0bb1t]

That's exactly the best point about reapers.
Their unbeatable appearance makes them more scarier and makes the game more exciting to play,

[Raven4030]

Just wondering: why does anybody think boarding a reaper is a viable option? Here are the obstacles you'd run across in attempting to do that:

1) You have to get close. Kinetic barriers can be tuned so that they repel not just mass accelerator rounds but even ships attempting to board. A reaper likely has alot more control over their barrier projectors (in fact, depending on how fast Reapers think, activating a barrier projector might be a concious choice allowing them to distinguish between slow moving debris and a ship attempting to board). In short, you'd need to first take down the Reaper's shields to even get on board.

2) One fast moving object has to land on another. It's hard enough to land a fighter jet on a moving air-craft carrier, can you imagine trying to land a shuttle or something else on a moving reaper? With three-dimensions with which to maneuver? Maneuvering in space is hard enough, let alone trying to board an enemy that doesn't want to be boarded that probably knows you're coming. I mean, the Normandy uses the most advanced stealth systems in the galaxy and is perfectly detectable by the Collectors, so why would the Reapers have any problems detecting other supposed 'stealth' ships like the Kodiak? So, as a result, the shuttle is attempting to board a ship that doesn't want to be boarded with no advantage of stealth, a maneuver where one unexpected course change could transform an incredibly expensive shuttle into a smear on a reaper shell.

3) We don't know how thick/powerful the armor is. We do know the armor is fairly weak, once Sovereign's barriers went down a single shot from the Normandy's main gun (which, being a frigate, would have a weak main gun compared to dreadnaughts and cruisers) was capable of ripping right through it. But how thick is that armor? Do we have torches capable of cutting their way through? Even if the armor is weak, thick enough armor can still mean the difference between cutting a hole and digging a trench. But still, we'd need to know where to board, which is a problem because...

4) We know next to nothing about the interior of a Reaper. First off, given their nature we have no reason to assume Reapers follow a uniform design pattern, so when cutting our way in we can't be entirely certain we are cutting into a place that would make a viable boarding point. Now if you can find an access point sure, but combined with all the other problems the probability of landing near a viable access point is low and once again, we have no way of knowing whether or not we can break through. Basically, you're either sitting on the outside of a hostile dreadnaught that knows you're there in the middle of a pitched space battle hoping you can either stumble across a hatch you're able to bust open or that the hole your cutting will actually get you where you need to go. And then, once you get inside the ship...

5) Any team you send in could just end up indoctrinated. We know that while generic indoctrination could take weeks, there are forms of rapid indoctrination available to the Reaper that knows little organics are now crawling around inside of it. How long would it take the assault team to find a spot to set off a nuke that'll take the Reaper out? How long do they have before they start thinking that platform with the retractable spike would make an awfully comfortable bed and nobody would care if they nodded off for 10 minutes?

Basically, I can't see boarding a reaper and setting off a nuke to be a viable means in conventional space warfare let alone a means to combat the reapers.

[Arcadia364]

To clarify i wasnt suggesting that bording a reaper to blow it up from within was a good idea i was saying nukes would be better than an EMP pulse

Also if we could take their sheilds down then it seems crazy to bother bording when a few cruiser shots could blow it to bits

[KevShep]

Raven4030 wrote...

Just wondering: why does anybody think boarding a reaper is a viable option? Here are the obstacles you'd run across in attempting to do that:


Basically, I can't see boarding a reaper and setting off a nuke to be a viable means in conventional space warfare let alone a means to combat the reapers.

We know that ship to ship is going to be a no go (we know how that turned out). You have to combat them some how. 
 
1)Getting passed the sheilds is the hardest part. If you have a non metallic object or if you slow down enough at the point of the barrier you can get through. doing this in large numbers you can get maybe a couple of squads on borad.

2) They dont have to be expensive shuttles (expensive ones will do no better then a cheep one against a reaper). As hard as it is to board a moving object it is possible...you will lose a lot of people getting to one reaper but its better then wasting powerfull ships(and expensive ones at that) against them.

3) There armor is not really as strong as you think. In ME1 when sovereigns sheilds were down a single torpedo from normandy destroyed it.

4) You dont really have to know your way around a reaper in order to weaken or destroy it (bug bites). Thats why you use EMP's there dont cost as much as a nuke and evey shuttles will have them. The key points in a reaper body should not be that hard to find.

5) Even quick indoctrination does not happen that fast.

[KevShep]

BentOrgy wrote...

Single out a reaper?

From what Sovereign told us in ME1, and from what we saw in the ME3 trailer, they kinda stick together. They're picking apart entire planets, at the same time, which means the probably move from system to system, at the same time.

Try weeding out one from a mass of god-like death machines sounds unlikely. I highly doubt (If the Reapers act like they should, and according to Sovereign's own description of their attack protocols,) we'll see a single reaper by itself, let alone the amount we'd need for that attack would need to be realistic.

 They stayed together because they controled the relays but now they dont. If they stay together in one system at a time then we might be able to kill them all by destroying that relay (in arrivl the system is destroyed in seconds). This means that the explosion moved faster then the speed of light and not even a reaper can move that fast without the aid of a relay. they would have to divided there numbers in order to not have that happen.

[Raven4030]

[quote]KevShep wrote...

1)Getting passed the sheilds is the hardest part. If you have a non metallic object or if you slow down enough at the point of the barrier you can get through. doing this in large numbers you can get maybe a couple of squads on borad.[/quote]

What does metal have to do with it? They're kinetic barriers, they slow or stop objects using a mass effect field. To quote the codex:

[quote]Kinetic barriers are repulsive mass effect fields
projected from tiny emitters. These shields safely deflect small
objects traveling at rapid velocities. This affords protection from
bullets and other dangerous projectiles, but still allows the user to
sit down without knocking away their chair.
[/quote]

So yah, any shuttle moving above whatever rate of speed the reaper deems 'dangerous' can be repulsed. Meaning you have to take down the shields and at that point you may as well just use conventional ship weapons.

[quote]2) They dont have to be expensive shuttles (expensive ones will do no better then a cheep one against a reaper). As hard as it is to board a moving object it is possible...you will lose a lot of people getting to one reaper but its better then wasting powerfull ships(and expensive ones at that) against them.[/quote]

3) There armor is not really as strong as you think. In ME1 when sovereigns sheilds were down a single torpedo from normandy destroyed it.[/quote]

Wow, you didn't even read my post, did you? You just sort of skimmed it and saw 'three million credit shuttle' and 'thick armor' and assumed you knew what I said, right? Do your parents know you're playing a game with implied sex with aliens in it?

[quote]4) You dont really have to know your way around a reaper in order to weaken or destroy it (bug bites). Thats why you use EMP's there dont cost as much as a nuke and evey shuttles will have them. The key points in a reaper body should not be that hard to find.[/quote]

Really? Did you design any of the Reapers? Do you have schematics showing the interior of the damn things? Can you even be sure they follow a uniform, mass produced pattern? You can't be sure infiltration teams will even be able to recognize a vital area let alone know where to find it on a such a massive ship. Oh, and keep in mind: Sovereign was the biggest ship in the galaxy, the second largest? The Destiny Ascension. In ME1 you hear a Volus talking, he spent all day touring that dreadnaught and didn't even see a tenth of it. What do you think the odds are of a boarding party finding a good spot to set off their bomb in a decent amount of time? Especially with husks and indoctrinated soldiers coming at them from all sides?

By the time a boarding party found a good spot to set their bomb, the battle would be over.

[quote]5) Even quick indoctrination does not happen that fast.[/quote]

There are forms of rapid indoctrination mentioned that cause neural decay within days, though admittedly this is not the crux of my argument. It is just something a team that as I mentioned above would have to be wary of given the fact they will be spending hours on board and the Reaper they are boarding is more interested in neutralizing the threat than creating a sustainable agent for long-term use.

[KevShep]

Raven4030 wrote...
Wow, you didn't even read my post, did you? You just sort of skimmed it and saw 'three million credit shuttle' and 'thick armor' and assumed you knew what I said, right? Do your parents know you're playing a game with implied sex with aliens in it?

You dont have to be rude. please try to keep all discussions in an aduilt manner, we are all fans of the same thing so lets act like it. Yes I did read all of your post I was just making a statment there armor has weak points its just a matter of finding them so you can cut through it.

Raven4030 wrote...
What does metal have to do with it? They're kinetic barriers, they slow or stop objects using a mass effect field. To quote the codex:

Kinetic barriers are repulsive mass effect fields
projected from tiny emitters. These shields safely deflect small
objects traveling at rapid velocities. This affords protection from
bullets and other dangerous projectiles, but still allows the user to
sit down without knocking away their chair.

So yah, any shuttle moving above whatever rate of speed the reaper deems 'dangerous' can be repulsed. Meaning you have to take down the shields and at that point you may as well just use conventional ship weapons.

As I said if you slow down to around the same speed as you get close you might be able to get through it. If not then sovereign would not have been able to connect to the citedal with the sheilds on, like is says in the codex about siting in the chair. I also know about kinetic barriers if you read my other post I mention Magnetic fields different/same as the mass effect fields use in the series. Magnetic fields do effect metal and energy as do kinetic, but kinetic uses dark energy to effect any object.

Raven4030 wrote...

Really? Did you design any of the Reapers? Do you have schematics showing the interior of the damn things? Can you even be sure they follow a uniform, mass produced pattern? You can't be sure infiltration teams will even be able to recognize a vital area let alone know where to find it on a such a massive ship. Oh, and keep in mind: Sovereign was the biggest ship in the galaxy, the second largest? The Destiny Ascension. In ME1 you hear a Volus talking, he spent all day touring that dreadnaught and didn't even see a tenth of it. What do you think the odds are of a boarding party finding a good spot to set off their bomb in a decent amount of time? Especially with husks and indoctrinated soldiers coming at them from all sides?

By the time a boarding party found a good spot to set their bomb, the battle would be over.

EDI can have info on the reapers design. If there all different then at least she can tell us what to look for.

Modifié par KevShep, 25 juillet 2011 - 03:53 .

[BentOrgy]

KevShep wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

Single out a reaper?

From what Sovereign told us in ME1, and from what we saw in the ME3 trailer, they kinda stick together. They're picking apart entire planets, at the same time, which means the probably move from system to system, at the same time.

Try weeding out one from a mass of god-like death machines sounds unlikely. I highly doubt (If the Reapers act like they should, and according to Sovereign's own description of their attack protocols,) we'll see a single reaper by itself, let alone the amount we'd need for that attack would need to be realistic.

 They stayed together because they controled the relays but now they dont. If they stay together in one system at a time then we might be able to kill them all by destroying that relay (in arrivl the system is destroyed in seconds). This means that the explosion moved faster then the speed of light and not even a reaper can move that fast without the aid of a relay. they would have to divided there numbers in order to not have that happen.

Please tell me when it was said that they no longer control the relays? Add to that I'm sure they can still jump to FTL without them, just like our ships (Of significantly lower technology.) can. Which means that IF they SOMEHOW feel threatened by an attack, they can just book it and leave.

And how many do you think constitute a reaper pack, flock, gaggle, invasion force, whatever? We're talking hundreds, at any given time.

No matter how you slice it, our chances still don't look good.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 25 juillet 2011 - 04:00 .

[KevShep]

BentOrgy wrote...

Please tell me when it was said that they no longer control the relays? Add to that I'm sure they can still jump to FTL without them, just like our ships (Of significantly lower technology.) can. Which means that IF they SOMEHOW feel threatened by an attack, they can just book it and leave.

And how many do you think constitute a reaper pack, flock, gaggle, invasion force, whatever? We're talking hundreds, at any given time.

No matter how you slice it, our chances still don't look good.

They have to control the relays through the citadel if we lock down the relays (I dont know if we know how to) then they have to use FTL. Even at FTL I highly doubt that they can travel across a whole system in 3 to 4 seconds....thats what the relays are for. They can try to flee but they cant get out fast enough with just FTL. I think Ashley mentions in ME1 that she traveled home from a near by system with FTL and it was a days trip. Also even when going up against a pack of reapers your still going to lose a lot of people I know...Thats why you swarm them. The only way to take down somthing so strong and powerfull is to overwhelm them. 

[BentOrgy]

KevShep wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

Please tell me when it was said that they no longer control the relays? Add to that I'm sure they can still jump to FTL without them, just like our ships (Of significantly lower technology.) can. Which means that IF they SOMEHOW feel threatened by an attack, they can just book it and leave.

And how many do you think constitute a reaper pack, flock, gaggle, invasion force, whatever? We're talking hundreds, at any given time.

No matter how you slice it, our chances still don't look good.

They have to control the relays through the citadel if we lock down the relays (I dont know if we know how to) then they have to use FTL. Even at FTL I highly doubt that they can travel across a whole system in 3 to 4 seconds....thats what the relays are for. They can try to flee but they cant get out fast enough with just FTL. I think Ashley mentions in ME1 that she traveled home from a near by system with FTL and it was a days trip. Also even when going up against a pack of reapers your still going to lose a lot of people I know...Thats why you swarm them. The only way to take down somthing so strong and powerfull is to overwhelm them. 

While we're on the subject, please tell me when its been said if they EVER controlled the relays? Sure, they presumably built them, but have they been able to turn them on or off? Have they ever been able to manipulate them at all? Again, I don't think its ever been mentioned.

FTL is still more than enough to get the hell away from someone trying to turn you to dust, which was my point. They could jump just a single lightyear and be perfectly safe; just locate the nearest relay, and bam, back in business.

And I think you're missing my point; Sovereign didn't give a damn about what was most of the entire Citadel Fleet, in fact, we didn't do any damage  until Shep and Co. blasted Saren one last time, which caused Sovvy's shields to drop.

So please tell me what damage we could possibly do to over a HUNDRED Reapers? You keep saying swarm them, swarm them! But that doesn't solve anything in the end. There's still no way in hell we'd stand a chance against a ship to ship enagement with them.

[Raven4030]

KevShep wrote...

You dont have to be rude. please try to keep all discussions in an aduilt manner, we are all fans of the same thing so lets act like it. Yes I did read all of your post I was just making a statment there armor has weak points its just a matter of finding them so you can cut through it.

I get rude when I make a point and it is completely ignored or missed. This tells me the other party is simply disinterested or incapable of comprehending what I said. You didn't refute my point, you simply brought up something unrelated to my point and pretended this was refuting it.  Now that you actually did say something that touched on a point I was trying to make though:

The armor may have weak points I admit, but as I stated earlier, do you have any ideas where those weak points would be? And the issue is not armor strength, I'm confident we can cut through it, the issue is THICKNESS. As I said, thickness is the difference between cutting a hole and digging a trench. Now, with the right tools you could 'dig' through the armor, but this obviously would take a heck of alot more time than simply cutting a hole. Basically, you have to hope that there is either an access hatch or a place where the armor is thin enough that the tools you brought with you can cut through it, otherwise... well, you're screwed.

As I said if you slow down to around the same speed as you get close you might be able to get through it. If not then sovereign would not have been able to connect to the citedal with the sheilds on, like is says in the codex about siting in the chair. I also know about kinetic barriers if you read my other post I mention Magneticfields different/same as the mass effect fields use in the series. Magnetic fields do effect metal and energy as do kinetic, but kinetic uses dark energy to effect any object.

See, here is the thing: organic ships have kinetic barriers with reflex systems built in to automatically stop objects traveling above a certain speed. Reapers, being machines, are probably capable of manually activating the shields fast enough to stop projectiles moving at a speed of, at most, 1 or 2 percent of light speed. It would be trivial of them to activate barriers as a shuttle gets close, deflecting it when it tries to land.

EDI can have info on the reapers design. If there all different then at least she can tell us what to look for.

EDI would know what Sovereign looked like, what the derelict reaper looked like, and that's about it. Given how each Reaper must accomodate the differently shaped 'cores' that make them up, it is likely the internal configuration is drastically different based on the species used to make the reaper in the first place. There is no way to predict the internal configuration of these ships.

Modifié par Raven4030, 25 juillet 2011 - 05:30 .

[KevShep]

BentOrgy wrote...

While we're on the subject, please tell me when its been said if they EVER controlled the relays? Sure, they presumably built them, but have they been able to turn them on or off? Have they ever been able to manipulate them at all? Again, I don't think its ever been mentioned.

FTL is still more than enough to get the hell away from someone trying to turn you to dust, which was my point. They could jump just a single lightyear and be perfectly safe; just locate the nearest relay, and bam, back in business.

And I think you're missing my point; Sovereign didn't give a damn about what was most of the entire Citadel Fleet, in fact, we didn't do any damage  until Shep and Co. blasted Saren one last time, which caused Sovvy's shields to drop.

So please tell me what damage we could possibly do to over a HUNDRED Reapers? You keep saying swarm them, swarm them! But that doesn't solve anything in the end. There's still no way in hell we'd stand a chance against a ship to ship enagement with them.

In ME1 vigil says that they control the relays through the citadel so they can isolate each system and render all races useless in trying to fight the reapers.

You cant jump a single light year in seconds. That system in arrvil DLC was destroyed in about 3 seconds. This means that the explosion was traveling faster then the speed of light due in part to the relays dark energy. Even though FTL is faster then the speed of light our traditional FTL is not that fast, thats what the relays are for.

Like I said ship to ship combat is a no-go. With really small ships we can cut back on cost and production time to make as many as we need in a short time. The reapers only have so many weapons they will not be able to target all of them in time.

I dont think that the reapers are as strong as some people say other wise they would not need to use the relays and the citadel as a trap in the first place. If there unbeatable then they dont need to worry about a trap at all.

[KevShep]

Raven4030 wrote...

KevShep wrote...

You dont have to be rude. please try to keep all discussions in an aduilt manner, we are all fans of the same thing so lets act like it. Yes I did read all of your post I was just making a statment there armor has weak points its just a matter of finding them so you can cut through it.

I get rude when I make a point and it is completely ignored or missed. This tells me the other party is simply disinterested or incapable of comprehending what I said. You didn't refute my point, you simply brought up something unrelated to my point and pretended this was refuting it.  Now that you actually did say something that touched on a point I was trying to make though:

The armor may have weak points I admit, but as I stated earlier, do you have any ideas where those weak points would be? And the issue is not armor strength, I'm confident we can cut through it, the issue is THICKNESS. As I said, thickness is the difference between cutting a hole and digging a trench. Now, with the right tools you could 'dig' through the armor, but this obviously would take a heck of alot more time than simply cutting a hole. Basically, you have to hope that there is either an access hatch or a place where the armor is thin enough that the tools you brought with you can cut through it, otherwise... well, you're screwed.

As I said if you slow down to around the same speed as you get close you might be able to get through it. If not then sovereign would not have been able to connect to the citedal with the sheilds on, like is says in the codex about siting in the chair. I also know about kinetic barriers if you read my other post I mention Magneticfields different/same as the mass effect fields use in the series. Magnetic fields do effect metal and energy as do kinetic, but kinetic uses dark energy to effect any object.

See, here is the thing: organic ships have kinetic barriers with reflex systems built in to automatically stop objects traveling above a certain speed. Reapers, being machines, are probably capable of manually activating the shields fast enough to stop projectiles moving at a speed of, at most, 1 or 2 percent of light speed. It would be trivial of them to activate barriers as a shuttle gets close, deflecting it when it tries to land.

EDI can have info on the reapers design. If there all different then at least she can tell us what to look for.

EDI would know what Sovereign looked like, what the derelict reaper looked like, and that's about it. Given how each Reaper must accomodate the differently shaped 'cores' that make them up, it is likely the internal configuration is drastically different based on the species used to make the reaper in the first place. There is no way to predict the internal configuration of these ships.

You should clarify your problem with my statements instead of being rude, I doubt you would actuall do that to some ones face in the first place especially if that person was not being rude themselves.

Yes it would take time to cut through but at that point the hardest part is done. Now all you have to do is worry about what is waiting for you inside. EDI would have the most intel of there design then any one, she would be able to tell us where the most weakest point is iam guessing.

Iam not sure about the "reflex" system is but it sounds like its a magnetic field since thats what they do(not sure about speed though).

[BentOrgy]

KevShep wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

While we're on the subject, please tell me when its been said if they EVER controlled the relays? Sure, they presumably built them, but have they been able to turn them on or off? Have they ever been able to manipulate them at all? Again, I don't think its ever been mentioned.

FTL is still more than enough to get the hell away from someone trying to turn you to dust, which was my point. They could jump just a single lightyear and be perfectly safe; just locate the nearest relay, and bam, back in business.

And I think you're missing my point; Sovereign didn't give a damn about what was most of the entire Citadel Fleet, in fact, we didn't do any damage  until Shep and Co. blasted Saren one last time, which caused Sovvy's shields to drop.

So please tell me what damage we could possibly do to over a HUNDRED Reapers? You keep saying swarm them, swarm them! But that doesn't solve anything in the end. There's still no way in hell we'd stand a chance against a ship to ship enagement with them.

In ME1 vigil says that they control the relays through the citadel so they can isolate each system and render all races useless in trying to fight the reapers.

You cant jump a single light year in seconds. That system in arrvil DLC was destroyed in about 3 seconds. This means that the explosion was traveling faster then the speed of light due in part to the relays dark energy. Even though FTL is faster then the speed of light our traditional FTL is not that fast, thats what the relays are for.

Like I said ship to ship combat is a no-go. With really small ships we can cut back on cost and production time to make as many as we need in a short time. The reapers only have so many weapons they will not be able to target all of them in time.

I dont think that the reapers are as strong as some people say other wise they would not need to use the relays and the citadel as a trap in the first place. If there unbeatable then they dont need to worry about a trap at all.

I'm going to quickly point out that you're now revising your original strategy, which seems now to pull an Arrival instead of merely swarming the Reapers, please keep your story staight.

And again, you're missing the point, or perhaps I'm not making myself clear; Once an enemy jumps FTL, you can't touch them, they're gone, poof. How else can you explain how The Normandy was able to escape, mere seconds before detonation? The Codex page itself also says that at least a dozen lightyears can be traversed in about a day. Reapers possess the most sophisticated tech in the known galaxy, which means their FTL speeds are more than likely a hell of a lot faster than normal, considering the fact that they were able to make it to Earth in about two and a half years, assuming they left for Earth at the end of ME1.

You're blatantly skewing fact with your own opinion now; Reapers have been around for like, a billion years (Assuming the Leviathan of Dis is one of them.) I think they've figured out a way to deal with a gaggle of little fighters. Your stratagey also throws even more pilots to their deaths, good idea. That, and your argument still does nothing to lay to rest that Sovereign STILL withstood the Citadel Fleet, which includes the Destiny Ascension. And its giant ass main gun.

And the trap is presumably for the sake of making things easier for them; powerful as they are, it must be tedious to do it the long way when there's a sure fire alternative to making things faster. Its not thay odd. Their power has been witnessed, discussed, and pretty much officially confirmed.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 25 juillet 2011 - 11:20 .

[Arcadia364]

How about we take all the turians and turn them into a mega reaper:devil:

[BentOrgy]

Arcadia364 wrote...

How about we take all the turians and turn them into a mega reaper:devil:

It'd be the Clint Eastwood of all Reapers. Thanks to Garrus I always see Turians as kinda the cowboys/Dirty Harry's of the Galaxy.

Go ahead, make my day.