579 réponses à ce sujet

[Altima Darkspells]

It's hard to determine what constitutes a failure.

If DA2 had been pushed back, it would have interfered with other EA products being released (like Crysis 2).

However, it does seem like DA2 has at least made back its production cost (though it is to be determined if it also matched the marketing campaign, which was pretty significant for a while before sales petered off). At best, I expect DA2 to post a minor profit. Not a huge loss, but not a huge gain, especially for a 'AAA' title. Though I imagine the costs were quite low for such a title as well.

However, many fans were extremely disappointed with DA2. We've no idea how many were disatisfied with their purchase. This means future dollars lost. If people lose faith in the BioWare name, that means all future releases will suffer (like, say, a quarter billion dollar plus MMO coming out...).

Personally, I'd say it was a failure. It didn't attract new fans, drove off many others, and isn't even meeting the same sales as the original. Many people lost their faith in BioWare's quality. Hell, there are indie developers who wouldn't be as half-assed as BioWare was. Not to mention that the reviews were just blatantly bought off and/or forged by BioWare employees. So it's an overt display of the fact that all future BioWare games should be taken with a grain of salt.

[skyrend]

ezrafetch wrote...

I'd say it was hardly a failure? I'd give it a solid 8/10, really. The game itself is a (reasonably) well-polished, coherent effort. Does it grab one like Origins does? No, but grading DA2 relative to DA:O is quite simply a tall order and really it's not how one should judge the game. Even in comparison to other Bioware games I'd consider it better than ME1. And it's miles better than the chaff that all the other studios put out now. I think overall people are, quite simply, overreacting to the fact that DA2 =/= DA:O. I also think from a place such as this, overreactions are more frequent. Sure, Bioware could have probably taken a bit more time to hash it out, but I wouldn't call DA2 a failure in the least.

What bothers me about this post is the fact that you think "all the other studios put out" chaff.  DA2 would rank almost dead last of all the games I've bought in recent memory.  Games from many, many studios are thoughtful and fun, whereas DA2 was pretty much drudgery.  In fact, many of these "other studios" pull off many aspects of what DA2 was going for much better than Bioware did.

[Well]

GeorgeZip wrote...

No. DA2 improved alot of things from DAO like skill trees, look of gear, quality of loot, inventory space. It also fell short in areas, companion dialogue, depth of characters and story, lack of new environments especially in Act 3. If you want a better DA3 don't ignore what was good in DA2 and make them start over from scratch. Trust me you wont be happy; again.

No way GZ.I thought DA2 was the pits on some of what you listed.I hated the skill trees.I prefered DAO.Quality of loot?Yep they really screwed the pooch on that.As far as the weapons and armor look...Epic Fail.I dont believe DA2 was a failure.It was ok.Not good but just so so.Just my opinion.I know i wont preorder from BW again.I even took ME3 off preorder.I sure BW is all broken hearted over it.Ok maybe not.I been a BW fan since BG first came out.They make good games.This one surprised me.Just my humble opinion.Well maybe not so humble.

[dulak999]

I was disappointed. I expected something good and got something repetative and very boring. Same scenery, lack of customization. Im just waiting for a mod that will rip out its guts and reinsert them the way it should have been.

[Dallo]

I played right through DA:O with a character from each origin. I started a rogue (my fave class) in DA2 and finished Act 2 about 3 weeks ago, and haven't gotten back to it.

Is the game a failure? Well, I don't like it much so speaking personally I guess it is.

[abaris]

Altima Darkspells wrote...

However, it does seem like DA2 has at least made back its production cost (though it is to be determined if it also matched the marketing campaign, which was pretty significant for a while before sales petered off). At best, I expect DA2 to post a minor profit. Not a huge loss, but not a huge gain, especially for a 'AAA' title. Though I imagine the costs were quite low for such a title as well.

They're probably making a profit, period. But it remains to be seen, how bad word of mouth and a general loss in reputation influences future sales.

[Shadowbanner]

DA2 was a complete failure however way you look at it; DA2: Rise to Apathy.

It failed the transitition from cRPG to Action-RPG.
It failed to expand its customer base appealing to new ones (COD crowd).
Moreover, it successfully managed to alienate its hardcore fanbase!
It has failed to sell a large number of copies compared to DA:O.
As a result of the afore, its failed to make money as expected.
Its failed to consolidate its fanbase.
Its failed in user reviews as its being slated the world over, not only in English-speaking forums like this one.
Its a failed story/plot.
Its mindlessley boring.
Failed quests and sidequests (fedex).
It lacks replayability (unless you don't mind visiting another 10 times the same dungeon in a new playthrough).
Failed customization.
Failed combat (successive waves of enemies, removal of isometric camera etc.)
Uninteresting companions and at times outright obsessed (Anders, Sebastian).
Terrible ending.
Day-one DLC's which were actually unashamedly cut-off content from the game itself! Day-one DLC's should be forbidden.

I could go on and on.

Modifié par Shadowbanner, 01 mai 2011 - 09:35 .

[Geert2010]

please I hope they don't screw up Skyrim, I loved Oblivion, that's still one of the best games ever!

[Shadowbanner]

Geert2010 wrote...

please I hope they don't screw up Skyrim, I loved Oblivion, that's still one of the best games ever!

Bethesda are also streamlining Skyrim removing elements. I really dislike this ongoing trend.

[FellowerOfOdin]

Shadowbanner wrote...

Geert2010 wrote...

please I hope they don't screw up Skyrim, I loved Oblivion, that's still one of the best games ever!

Bethesda are also streamlining Skyrim removing elements. I really dislike this ongoing trend.

Unlike Bioware, they listen to their community and remove or improve stupid stuff like hard scaling and the "Get hit by a rat 500 times to increase Heavy Armor".

[Shadowbanner]

FellowerOfOdin wrote...

Shadowbanner wrote...

Geert2010 wrote...

please I hope they don't screw up Skyrim, I loved Oblivion, that's still one of the best games ever!

Bethesda are also streamlining Skyrim removing elements. I really dislike this ongoing trend.

Unlike Bioware, they listen to their community and remove or improve stupid stuff like hard scaling and the "Get hit by a rat 500 times to increase Heavy Armor".

Actually I used mud crabs to improve my heavy armor, but never mind.

Hopefully no "adoring fan" this time, thank you.

Modifié par Shadowbanner, 01 mai 2011 - 09:50 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

At least Skyrim will have the toolset.

Oblivion w/ mods and Oblivion w/o mods are really two different games. The latter being terrible, and the former being quite good.

Also, mudcrabs, nasty creatures.

edit: oopsies.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 01 mai 2011 - 11:56 .

[Aloren]

I loved it. And I'm probably not alone... so I'd say it's not a general consensus.

[EternalPink]

Available as a budget game in the UK within 2/3 months of original release doesn't scream success to me.

As a budget game its alright, can't say i like the linear story that your unable to affect but it's not what i would have expected from a AAA studio

Compared to other budget games i've brought in the past

ME1 (long time after it was released) i'd say it was inferior, ME1 was a strong enough game that within minutes of completing i'd already begun the steam purchase for the full price ME2

Ufo : Afterlight - Indie studio, has delivered about the same amount of play time

Sid Meirer's Pirates - I'd rate DA2 as stronger/more worthwhile purchase

[DSGrant]

goering wrote...

It is generally regarded as a HUGE FINANCIAL SUCCESS!

Think about it: Nearly the same amount of copies sold as Dragon Age Origins after 3 weeks .... but they developed it in less than a 4th of the time.

There are a few different posts on these forums showing approximate sales numbers between Origins and DA2. One in particular even breaks it down in a nicely illustrated bar graph here: http://social.biowar...1/index/7236826. Origins has sold three times as much as DA 2 has, and while it would be fair to point out that Origins has been out for quite a while longer, it should also be noted that Origins has continued to sell well long after its release whereas DA2 sales are dropping like a sack of rocks. Given the rapid rate of decline in sales, the general prediction is that DA2 will not ever hit 2 million sales. Keep in mind that DA2 owes about 400k of its sales to pre-orders, most of which were placed by avid fans of Origins. Without those, DA2 would not have hit 1 million sales yet.

That all being said, the much shorter development cycle for DA2 also means that they need to sell less before posting a profit. Will DA2 be a financial success for Bioware? I'm pretty confident they will end up in the black even with the abysmal number of sales right now. However, in comparison, DA2 is not nearly as successful as Origins. What's also at stake here is the impact this will have on DA3, and by extension, the future of the franchise. Due to the overwhelming criticism of the game by both those who liked and disliked the game, it's reasonable to assume DA2's lackluster performance will probably affect initial sales for DA3. I'm betting that we'll see significantly less pre-orders for DA3, meaning that unlike DA2, it won't be able to rely on pre-orders even if it sucks. If DA3 does end up disappointing fans as much or more as DA2 did, it will indeed be a financial failure. If it's a financial failure, you can be certain that Bioware's EA overlords will pull the plug on the franchise.

Modifié par DSGrant, 01 mai 2011 - 12:50 .

[Boiny Bunny]

^ Indeed - I'm sure many will not be buying Dragon Age 3 at all until it has been out at least 1 month and they're well aware of everything bad about it.

[neppakyo]

Also agree with DSGrant. Very well put, and valid points as well.

@Asari Bunny Lady.

Maybe a few will wait for the first patch before getting or think about getting the next DA game (if its made)

[agesilaj12]

Hahahaha.Nice OP.It isnt't complete failue in my case, cs it forced me to play Two Worlds 2 [ after quiting on it thinking it was bad ] just to find out that I actually enjoy playing it this time around. On the other hand , I do miss my 60$ spent on pre ordering DA2 signiture edition. But than again failure is all mine . I should have know what one can expect when dealing with the likes of EA.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

agesilaj12 wrote...

Hahahaha.Nice OP.It isnt't complete failue in my case, cs it forced me to play Two Worlds 2 [ after quiting on it thinking it was bad ] just to find out that I actually enjoy playing it this time around. On the other hand , I do miss my 60$ spent on pre ordering DA2 signiture edition. But than again failure is all mine . I should have know what one can expect when dealing with the likes of EA.

Two Worlds II > Dragon Age II.

Ouch man.

I don't have the game myself, is it actually any good?

I've been stalled while writing up new material for my New Vegas AAR/story and I feel like I could use a break by playing other games.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 02 mai 2011 - 07:07 .

[Sabriana]

Well, personally, I usually don't rate success/failure in profit vs. loss. For example:

If I wish to reach X amount of sales for a product, but fall far short of my expectations, I've failed

If I wish to reach a X score of quality for my product, and fall far short of my expectation, I've failed.

If I wish to attract a X amount of new customers, and I fall far short of that expectation, I've failed. This failure is then even more pronounced when I alienate my loyal customers (those I could count on reliably in the past). That's my yard-stick. My personal one. Just as it it my opinion

Did DA 2 make a profit? Probably. But at what cost? That remains to be seen, imo..



Edited. Spelling. Bah! Humbug!

Modifié par Sabriana, 02 mai 2011 - 07:28 .

[agesilaj12]

Honestly, I played first one and thougt it sucked bad. Got second one cs friends at work told me that they actually enjoyed it. First time around I quit it. Than after DA2 exp. went back to it . Read user reviews on metacritics , and decide for yourself. Reason I quit it first time is mostly due to flashbacks how stupidly bad voice and dialog was in first one, and in the beginging of the 2nd one everything pointed in that direction again. Now if you can look past voice acting, story that is pretty much cookie cutter fantasy tale [ dont know if you liked DOA, I did, but nobody ever accused DOA of having original Planscape like storyline] it is actually quite enjoyable experience for me so far since im still playing it. It is still pricey kind of, sells for full price on Steam. So if you are budgeting for games you might want to hold on to money since common wisdom tells you that Witcher 2, Skyrim, Dark Souls , Dungeon Siege 3 should all be better than TW2. However I thought same for DA2.......

[Sanguinerin]

Dragon Age II fell far below my expectations. I wouldn't consider it a failure, but I do consider it a warning. I'll have to pay more attention to future BioWare games. Between a combination of trusting BioWare products to be good and all of the bonus content, I let myself pre-order the game. It's unlikely that I'll do that again, and for the next time, I'll probably be waiting around for more reviews.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

agesilaj12 wrote...

Honestly, I played first one and thougt it sucked bad. Got second one cs friends at work told me that they actually enjoyed it. First time around I quit it. Than after DA2 exp. went back to it . Read user reviews on metacritics , and decide for yourself. Reason I quit it first time is mostly due to flashbacks how stupidly bad voice and dialog was in first one, and in the beginging of the 2nd one everything pointed in that direction again. Now if you can look past voice acting, story that is pretty much cookie cutter fantasy tale [ dont know if you liked DOA, I did, but nobody ever accused DOA of having original Planscape like storyline] it is actually quite enjoyable experience for me so far since im still playing it. It is still pricey kind of, sells for full price on Steam. So if you are budgeting for games you might want to hold on to money since common wisdom tells you that Witcher 2, Skyrim, Dark Souls , Dungeon Siege 3 should all be better than TW2. However I thought same for DA2.......

Ahh, ok. I probably won't get Two Worlds 2 then as my urge to write is pretty damn sporadic and I'm just better off waiting for Witcher 2 which I've already pre-ordered. I can just keep playing New Vegas in the meantime and hope I get something good to write about. Plus, if Witcher 2 somehow sucks or bugs out, I can play the Gothic 2 Gold Edition that comes with my pre-order.



Thanks for that.

As for Dragon Age 2 success/failure. It depends.

I don't like to call it an outright failure, but it's clear that for Dragon Age 2 to be considered a success, you have to lower your goals and standards.

Better reviews than Origins? Nope. But they are still good.

Better sales than Origins? Nope. But it's still selling okay.

Better game than Origins? Subjective, but a lot of people think it's not. But it took less time and money to make.

etc etc.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 02 mai 2011 - 07:40 .