137 réponses à ce sujet

[Mavkiel]

I thought this was going to be a chance to show off how cool mass effect 3 is going to be. Instead it was just so-so.

[Jzadek72]

I disliked the way that I wasn't allowed to have any objections whatsoever to killing 300,000, yet normally, I can express regret over a few hostages. It was written like a film, rather than a role-playing game, and as such, there was not much of an opportunity for roleplaying.

[didymos1120]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
Your scientist here was also much less developed and interesting than the Overlord scientist or the rogue Spectre in LotSB, and the "illusion of choice" was far less.

In fact, it seemed that they quite deliberately dispelled that illusion.  You couldn't win the battle in the Object Rho room no matter how skillfully you played. Aratoht was screwed.  There was nothing Shep could do.  Kenson was too far gone.  You could not save her. Etc.  I actually liked that myself.  It was a sort of "This is what the Reapers can force us into doing" thing.  Shep's choices didn't get to have any effect on anyone other than Shep this time.  There was no magic Paragon/Renegade option to save the hostage, get the charges dismissed, whatever. Nope, sorry: 304492 people simply had to die.  At least it was quicker and kinder than what the Reapers would have done to them.

Modifié par didymos1120, 02 avril 2011 - 11:27 .

[didymos1120]

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

Can it be blown up?? i thought it was indestructable??

No, it can die.  Shep then activates another one.  I did it a few times just for the hell of it.

[didymos1120]

Locutus_of_BORG wrote...

One disappointing part of this DLC is that there are segments where what usually counts as playing particularly well in ME2 actually means playing bad.

Wait, how does that work?  I'm not seeing it.

[didymos1120]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

Now, before you say anything, I know they wouldn't do that because it would be counter-productive to say that their DLC isn't going to be awesome... But in this case non-action is just as powerful as action would have been. 

Enh, it's a fair point, but I still see it as them getting free work out of the fans, who did all the "heavy lifting".  Not sure if you'd say they "lucked out" there or not, given there's been some backlash. On the other hand, they've got their DLC sales, so....

Modifié par didymos1120, 02 avril 2011 - 11:26 .

[Anacronian Stryx]

didymos1120 wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
Your scientist here was also much less developed and interesting than the Overlord scientist or the rogue Spectre in LotSB, and the "illusion of choice" was far less.

In fact, it seemed that they quite deliberately dispelled that illusion.  Aratoht was screwed.  There was nothing Shep could do.  Kenson was too far gone.  You could not save her. Etc.  I actually liked that myself.  It was a sort of "This is what the Reapers can force us into doing" thing.  Shep's choices didn't get to have any effect on anyone other than Shep this time.  There was no magic Paragon/Renegade option to save the hostage, get the charges dismissed, whatever. Nope, sorry: 304492 people simply had to die.  At least it was quicker and kinder than what the Reapers would have done to them.

The moral choice is still there, Do you warn the Batarians or do you just walk away, What people are really complaining about is that their choice didn't have the expected result, This is actually a problem i think.

We have become so accustomed to "if i take the blue option something nice will happen and if i take the red one something nasty is going down" my self included, So it was nice for once that the game surprised me with a healthy F*** you this will not go to plan.

[Synobal]

It was just Batarians no one cares about them.

[HappyHappyJoyJoy]

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

We have become so accustomed to "if i take the blue option something nice will happen and if i take the red one something nasty is going down" my self included, So it was nice for once that the game surprised me with a healthy F*** you this will not go to plan.

"For once"?  What about the end of ME1, which had you choose between sacrificing human lives and all souls on the Destiny Ascension?   Or the choice of Virmire Survivor?  Or all the colonists from Horizon who die regardless of what you do?

It's a cheap plot trick.

[didymos1120]

Anacronian Stryx wrote...
We have become so accustomed to "if i take the blue option something nice will happen and if i take the red one something nasty is going down" my self included, So it was nice for once that the game surprised me with a healthy F*** you this will not go to plan.

Yeah, that's what I liked: you were continually thwarted. The standard ME choice would pop-up and then they'd snatch it away.  At best, all you can know is that you tried, if indeed you did.  And at the end Harbinger was like: Sure. Fine. Whatever. Enjoy your little "victory" human.  See you soon!

[Anacronian Stryx]

HappyHappyJoyJoy wrote...

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

We have become so accustomed to "if i take the blue option something nice will happen and if i take the red one something nasty is going down" my self included, So it was nice for once that the game surprised me with a healthy F*** you this will not go to plan.

"For once"?  What about the end of ME1, which had you choose between sacrificing human lives and all souls on the Destiny Ascension?   Or the choice of Virmire Survivor?  Or all the colonists from Horizon who die regardless of what you do?

It's a cheap plot trick.

All those instances still conform to the "If i take the blue option it will have a nicer outcome than the red" You still save more people by saving the Ascension than by not doing it.

The Virmire survivor is not a P/R choice neither do you have any choice regarding the Horizon colonists.

[Kingthlayer]

People hyped themselves up a crazy amount for this DLC, some kind of sexy time with the VS. And when that didn't happen(because it was never the plan) they got all mad. Just your average day on the internet.

[Anacronian Stryx]

didymos1120 wrote...

Anacronian Stryx wrote...
We have become so accustomed to "if i take the blue option something nice will happen and if i take the red one something nasty is going down" my self included, So it was nice for once that the game surprised me with a healthy F*** you this will not go to plan.

Yeah, that's what I liked: you were continually thwarted. The standard ME choice would pop-up and then they'd snatch it away.  At best, all you can know is that you tried, if indeed you did.  And at the end Harbinger was like: Sure. Fine. Whatever. Enjoy your little "victory" human.  See you soon!

Indeed it helps in removing a little of the bad taste from them actually making the choice on Legions mission a P/R choice...well a little.

[Jzadek72]

mrsph wrote...

If anything, it is hilarious that people would sacrifice the entire galaxy for a few more paragon points.

My gripe was that my Shep was completely accepting of it, despite it being totally out of character for her. She probably would have destroyed the relay in the end, but she wouldn't have been so blase about it.

[Anacronian Stryx]

Jzadek72 wrote...

mrsph wrote...

If anything, it is hilarious that people would sacrifice the entire galaxy for a few more paragon points.

My gripe was that my Shep was completely accepting of it, despite it being totally out of character for her. She probably would have destroyed the relay in the end, but she wouldn't have been so blase about it.

I really gotta play though arrival with one of my female characters because i though maleshep was "accurate" for him.

[Jzadek72]

mrsph wrote...

Jzadek72 wrote...
My gripe was that my Shep was completely accepting of it, despite it being totally out of character for her. She probably would have destroyed the relay in the end, but she wouldn't have been so blase about it.

Your Shepard is Bioware's. And she will do what the plot demands.

Except normally, she's allowed to have an opinion. Obviously, she has to destroy the relay in the end, they can only give you so much freedom to characterise Shepard. But in arrival, there was none. And in an RPG, that's a pretty major flaw.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
Your scientist here was also much less developed and interesting than the Overlord scientist or the rogue Spectre in LotSB, and the "illusion of choice" was far less.

In fact, it seemed that they quite deliberately dispelled that illusion.  Aratoht was screwed.  There was nothing Shep could do.  Kenson was too far gone.  You could not save her. Etc.  I actually liked that myself.  It was a sort of "This is what the Reapers can force us into doing" thing.  Shep's choices didn't get to have any effect on anyone other than Shep this time.  There was no magic Paragon/Renegade option to save the hostage, get the charges dismissed, whatever. Nope, sorry: 304492 people simply had to die.  At least it was quicker and kinder than what the Reapers would have done to them.

The moral choice is still there, Do you warn the Batarians or do you just walk away, What people are really complaining about is that their choice didn't have the expected result, This is actually a problem i think.

We have become so accustomed to "if i take the blue option something nice will happen and if i take the red one something nasty is going down" my self included, So it was nice for once that the game surprised me with a healthy F*** you this will not go to plan.

That isn't the issue at all. Let me try to explain again...

When I played LotSB there was nothing I could do to alter the outcome, but I did get a valuable thing - an interlude with Liara. I felt like "Being there" for her during that time helped and had impact, in a way that I didn't feel like "being there" during arrival did.

Basically, during most of Mass Effect I feel like there is a reason Shepard could have done a better job than anyone else. In Lair, it was because Liara needed support and frienship, and a familiar face. In Overlord, it was the choice I was called upon to make. In every other aspect of Mass Effect gameplay, I've felt that there was something in how I played the game that made it good that I was the person on the mission... that I had agency of some sort. I can't describe it any better than that, than a complete lack of agency.

I also would have been a bit more satisfied with this particular foregone conclusion if it had seemed like anyone put any thought or planning into the mission whatsoever. The only reason I couldn't properly warn the Batarians was because nobody was sent in to look for me when I went missing for over a day, after my original objective was satisfied. I understand the design reasons for this plot development, but I can't justify it from a narrative perspective. Before, I've never felt like Shepard messed things up, failed to plan, or planned terribly. In this DLC I felt all of those things. I would have felt better if we had a bunch of clear safeguards in position, and they all failed in sequence. This is one of the reasons I would have been happier with a cutscene rather than the DLC... in a cutscene I wouldn't have seen the inner workings of our mission plan, and so I wouldn't have seen all the flaws and seams. 

I didn't expect to be able to save the batarians. i'm not looking for a blue option to make everything go well, and characterizing people who want choice in that way seems disingenuos. Nobody has requested that so far, but many are acting like it's a common thread in criticisms of the DLC. Either a single actual character we got information from or interaction with would have been fine - like at the end, with Hackett... there could have been more conversation about what Shep intended to do about the trial - fess up and try to explain about the Reapers? Argue with Hackett about the fact that there is absolutely no evidence against her... for all ANYONE knows, the Normandy was there trying to stop the Relay being destroyed, and escaped at the last moment while some completely unrelated terrorists blew up the relay. Something like that. Even if it didn't have a direct impact on the next game, talking about your intentions, your regrets, and alternate plans for the trial would have allowed you to give your Shep some ownership over his own fate. I don't care if in ME3 you get arrested no matter what the plan is, the ability to go a bit more into whether Shep is remorseful and upset rather than defiant and angry would make me feel like I did a thing of my own free will, rather than being railroaded into it.

[Sparrow44]

Arrival's ending is supposed to be canon and therefore had to happen, it'd be hard to show any emotion when the choice is 300,000 Batarians dead and a Mass Relay obliterated, or a number at least 1000x times that if you hadn't destroyed the relay.

You get to show some emotion of your actions to Hackett at the end depending on choice and as a ME3 prelude I'm sure there will be a reprise of Arrival in terms of how it emotionally affected your Shepard.

Modifié par Sparroww, 03 avril 2011 - 12:00 .

[JamieCOTC]

After LotSB there were very high expectations for it. There are some bugs, the textures are not as good, Shepard is kind of left out of our hands in several scenes, and it was way too short. I liked the combat, the base, Shepard going solo and Lance Henrikson, (not to mention the implications for Shep in ME3). In other words, I liked it in spite of its many flaws.

Modifié par JamieCOTC, 03 avril 2011 - 12:00 .

[DxWill10]

People are upset because they wanted a DLC as good as Shadow Broker even though they were paying less for it

[Myrphy]

I've installed, uninstalled, and reinstalled and I stiill cannot get the game to play.