323 réponses à ce sujet

[Tanith001]

Am I the only one who is troubled by the fact that they picked the name Hawke (with a weirde at the end) in the first place? Everyone else has a cool high-fantasy cognomen and you get hawke... I mean its the middle-ages isn't that kind of out of place?

[SIx_Foot_Imp]

Bowie Hawkins wrote...

ThomasBlaine wrote...

The only -ONLY- thing he ever does for sure which has any real significance outside of the Wounded Coast, is making sure Anders stays in town long enough to decide to nuke the chantry, and that's assuming Anders can't or won't do it anyway, whether Hawke is there or not.

I must disagree. Preventing Kirkwall from falling to the Qunari is more than slightly significant.

While he may have saved some of the nobles and prevented som ebloodshed, the entire templar order and circle of mages was right behind him, the arishock wouldn't have stood a chance against them, again hawke was just at the right place at the right time to steal the glory from all the people who are actually important to the plot.

[Taura-Tierno]

SIx_Foot_Imp wrote...

Bowie Hawkins wrote...

ThomasBlaine wrote...

The only -ONLY- thing he ever does for sure which has any real significance outside of the Wounded Coast, is making sure Anders stays in town long enough to decide to nuke the chantry, and that's assuming Anders can't or won't do it anyway, whether Hawke is there or not.

I must disagree. Preventing Kirkwall from falling to the Qunari is more than slightly significant.

While he may have saved some of the nobles and prevented som ebloodshed, the entire templar order and circle of mages was right behind him, the arishock wouldn't have stood a chance against them, again hawke was just at the right place at the right time to steal the glory from all the people who are actually important to the plot.

Or maybe Arishok would have gotten a lucky shot and killed Meredith and Orsino in one sweep, decimating the order's leadership and demoralising the troops, after which he'd slaughter the shocked templars and then force the nobles to surrender. And thus, Kirkwall became a Qunari city. 

Hawke was there and saved the day. We do not know what would've happened if he had not been. 

The same goes for the other stuff as well. The idol might have been found without him. It's definitely a possibility. But what if adventurer X Varric had recruited otherwise had been just a bit worse at fighting, and ended up getting Varric killed in the Deep Roads? No detour, expedition called off. No idol, no crazy Meredith. 

[Bowie Hawkins]

SIx_Foot_Imp wrote...

Bowie Hawkins wrote...

ThomasBlaine wrote...

The only -ONLY- thing he ever does for sure which has any real significance outside of the Wounded Coast, is making sure Anders stays in town long enough to decide to nuke the chantry, and that's assuming Anders can't or won't do it anyway, whether Hawke is there or not.

I must disagree. Preventing Kirkwall from falling to the Qunari is more than slightly significant.

...again hawke was just at the right place at the right time to steal the glory from all the people who are actually important to the plot.

I was replying to someone who stated that Hawke did not do anything of significance outside of the Wounded Coast and keeping Anders in town. Nothing you wrote actually disputes the significance of Hawke being the one who brought the Arishok's war on Kirkwall to an end,

[Volourn]

What makes the Warden 'special'? Nothing. He's certainly not unique not even in his Wardenhood. Heck, Awakening proved this. Even Hawke's sibling can be amde a warden. L0L

Youn know, there's only one thing that makes the Warden or Hawke special. One thing only. They're the PC. Period.

Even the Bhaalspawn from Bg wans't really special since there were a billion bhaalspawn even friggin' animals got that honour. L0LZ But,t he PC bhaalspawn was a PC hence why he is special.

Which makes this thread rather useless. Ha.

[LobselVith8]

What made the Warden special? He determined the next ruler of Orzammar, whether the Anvil of the Void would be spared, the fate of the Dalish elves and the werewolves, whether the village of Redcliffe would be saved or abandoned, whether Connor would be killed... possessed... or saved, who would rule over Ferelden, whether Amaranthine would be burned or rescued, and whether the Architect should live or die. He killed the Archdemon, he saved the nation of Ferelden from the darkspawn armies.

Hawke, on the other hand, became wealthy, and mostly reacts to the actions of others - including Anders towards the end of the storyline.

[Volourn]

"What made the Warden special? He determined the next ruler of Orzammar, whether the Anvil of the Void would be spared, the fate of the Dalish elves and the werewolves, whether the village of Redcliffe would be saved or abandoned, whether Connor would be killed... possessed... or saved, who would rule over Ferelden, whether Amaranthine would be burned or rescued, and whether the Architect should live or die. He killed the Archdemon, he saved the nation of Ferelden from the darkspawn armies."

Not special. Anyone could have done it. And, he didn't do any of that alone. He makes those decisions because he is the PC. That's what make him special. Period.

[Frybread76]

ThomasBlaine wrote...


What makes Hawke important enough to develop even one, let alone two games about?

After setting off the war, however it happens, Hawke really doesn't have any logical relevance to Thedas as a whole. The most important thing he does in the game is to keep Anders around in time to nuke the Chantry, at which point he's just another skilled fighter/apostate with a bit of money to his name and a reputation, either hated or respected by the Templars of Kirkwall.

Whereas the Warden is, you guessed it, a Grey Warden, and thus at least moderately essential to the safety of the people besides being the hero of Ferelden, Hawke is a shortly formulated borderline retard with nothing but a few bets placed in the coming war.

Desipte this, Bioware/EA advertises HAWKE as the ultimate hero and has decided that he's the one they want to build future games on, no justification whatsoever, seemingly because they expected the players to share their enthusiasm with him.

My biggest problem is exactly that, Hawke is treated as the Messiah of Thedas by Laidlaw, Bioware, and almost every major character in the game, while the only event in DA2 with any real importance to the overall state of the world -the start of the mage/templar war- had almost nothing to do with him, and would quite likely have unfolded whether he was there or not.

Did I miss something, or is this just weird and confusing, besides a bit unfair?

Edit: Can't believe I have to state this outright. This is NOT a hate-thread. This is a discussion, the next self-righteous bigot who implies otherwise gets reported. (You know I can't do that, so please just stop

I think Laidlaw/Bioware/EA hoped Hawke would be the Commander Shepard of Dragon Effect--er Dragon Age.

[Frybread76]

Volourn wrote...

"What made the Warden special? He determined the next ruler of Orzammar, whether the Anvil of the Void would be spared, the fate of the Dalish elves and the werewolves, whether the village of Redcliffe would be saved or abandoned, whether Connor would be killed... possessed... or saved, who would rule over Ferelden, whether Amaranthine would be burned or rescued, and whether the Architect should live or die. He killed the Archdemon, he saved the nation of Ferelden from the darkspawn armies."

Not special. Anyone could have done it. And, he didn't do any of that alone. He makes those decisions because he is the PC. That's what make him special. Period.

You're wrong.  Depending on how you play, the Warden can become chancellor, Warden-Commander of Fereldan or even king-consort.  That's part of what makes him special.

Modifié par Frybread76, 05 avril 2011 - 06:17 .

[Frybread76]

Taura-Tierno wrote...

SIx_Foot_Imp wrote...

Bowie Hawkins wrote...

ThomasBlaine wrote...

The only -ONLY- thing he ever does for sure which has any real significance outside of the Wounded Coast, is making sure Anders stays in town long enough to decide to nuke the chantry, and that's assuming Anders can't or won't do it anyway, whether Hawke is there or not.

I must disagree. Preventing Kirkwall from falling to the Qunari is more than slightly significant.

While he may have saved some of the nobles and prevented som ebloodshed, the entire templar order and circle of mages was right behind him, the arishock wouldn't have stood a chance against them, again hawke was just at the right place at the right time to steal the glory from all the people who are actually important to the plot.

Or maybe Arishok would have gotten a lucky shot and killed Meredith and Orsino in one sweep, decimating the order's leadership and demoralising the troops, after which he'd slaughter the shocked templars and then force the nobles to surrender. And thus, Kirkwall became a Qunari city. 

Hawke was there and saved the day. We do not know what would've happened if he had not been. 

The same goes for the other stuff as well. The idol might have been found without him. It's definitely a possibility. But what if adventurer X Varric had recruited otherwise had been just a bit worse at fighting, and ended up getting Varric killed in the Deep Roads? No detour, expedition called off. No idol, no crazy Meredith. 

LOL.  Even though Meredith's death would be a huge blow, the Templars would not just roll over and begin crying if she was killed.  They deal with abominations on a weekly basis in Kirkwall.  They would have gone beserk and slaughtered all of the Qunari.  Same with the mages.

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

After DA:O, I thought that Hawke being a more limited character was supposed to make him/her more prevalent in Thedas' lore. It's funny how the character seems less significant than my Warden characters. Hawke leaves the impression on me of just being this guy/gal that randomly walks into a rooms as the big kids are talking then becomes famous for being there later.

[Sheogorath27]

Volourn wrote...

What makes the Warden 'special'? Nothing. He's certainly not unique not even in his Wardenhood. Heck, Awakening proved this. Even Hawke's sibling can be amde a warden. L0L

Youn know, there's only one thing that makes the Warden or Hawke special. One thing only. They're the PC. Period.

Even the Bhaalspawn from Bg wans't really special since there were a billion bhaalspawn even friggin' animals got that honour. L0LZ But,t he PC bhaalspawn was a PC hence why he is special.

Which makes this thread rather useless. Ha.

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 Exactly. Just the vessel to convey the story. He is as cool/significant as you choose him to be.

[AngelicMachinery]

Revan's moar speshuls than all of dem!

[Volourn]

"You're wrong. Depending on how you play, the Warden can become chancellor, Warden-Commander of Fereldan or even king-consort. That's part of what makes him special."

Nope. It's ebcause he's the PC. Just like Hawke. Just like the Bhaalspawn PC.

The only 'special' characetrs BIO have done is JE and KOTOR protagonist. The others ar eonly 'special' because theya re the PC. Anything they accomplished could have been done by others.

[Squeeze the Fish]

Aren't most "heroes" products of circumstance? The right things happened at the right time and maybe the right people were there to foster things along? Okay, so Hawke could have been anyone, the Warden could have been anyone (with appropriate skills)...but so what? Isn't that kind of the point of this kind of story?

[Volourn]

Exactly. There's nothing wrong or special or unique about either character.

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

Which is a waste since if Hawke is no greater or more special than the Warden, why get rid of player options for race or the idea of different starting origins? It seems to me much more was lost than gained by limiting character creation options.

[Baelyn]

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Revan's moar speshuls than all of dem!

*goes to play KoToR again...*

Damn you!

[LobselVith8]

"Exactly. There's nothing wrong or special or unique about either character."

The Warden changes the world around him. Hawke is there when change happens. You keep pushing the idea that the only thing special about either character is that they are the PC, and that isn't the case. Hawke is advertised as being the most important person in Thedas, but he didn't accomplish anything to earn such a distinction. The Warden, on the other hand, has an irrevocable impact on societies.

[ThomasBlaine]

maegi46 wrote...

Scared, stop posting spoilers in a no spoilers thread FFS dude.

I've already written nummerous spoilers in the OP, let's just be casual about this, If you don't like a bit of foreshadowing then overlook them gently.
Rules aren't there to be followed, but to guide people who are too stupid to think for themselves. Forum protocol is no exception.

Modifié par ThomasBlaine, 05 avril 2011 - 06:42 .

[ThomasBlaine]

Bowie Hawkins wrote...

ThomasBlaine wrote...

The only -ONLY- thing he ever does for sure which has any real significance outside of the Wounded Coast, is making sure Anders stays in town long enough to decide to nuke the chantry, and that's assuming Anders can't or won't do it anyway, whether Hawke is there or not.

I must disagree. Preventing Kirkwall from falling to the Qunari is more than slightly significant.

We've already dealt with the Qunari issue serveral times. Read the thread before posting recyled arguments.

[Volourn]

"Which is a waste since if Hawke is no greater or more special than the Warden, why get rid of player options for race or the idea of different starting origins? It seems to me much more was lost than gained by limiting character creation options."

I agree with this. I would have loved if they stick with multiple races and origins.

[Haexpane]

You can't have an AWESOME VISCERAL game without a BEARDED BADD ASS with a cheeseball 1980s nickname now can you?

[Frybread76]

Volourn wrote...

"You're wrong. Depending on how you play, the Warden can become chancellor, Warden-Commander of Fereldan or even king-consort. That's part of what makes him special."

Nope. It's ebcause he's the PC. Just like Hawke. Just like the Bhaalspawn PC.

The only 'special' characetrs BIO have done is JE and KOTOR protagonist. The others ar eonly 'special' because theya re the PC. Anything they accomplished could have been done by others.

your fanboyism on numerous threads is geting old.  the warden is special for what he does and becomes.  hawke is  a catalyst.  simple as that.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Bowie Hawkins wrote...

ThomasBlaine wrote...

The only -ONLY- thing he ever does for sure which has any real significance outside of the Wounded Coast, is making sure Anders stays in town long enough to decide to nuke the chantry, and that's assuming Anders can't or won't do it anyway, whether Hawke is there or not.

I must disagree. Preventing Kirkwall from falling to the Qunari is more than slightly significant.

He prevented it? When?

There was just ONE ship of qunari..and half of them got killed or deserted by the time the "invasion" started.
Kirkwall is a massive city.  With mages and templars that were joining the fight.
The Arishok made a bee-line for the viscounts keep and used the element of surprise...and getting as far as he did is already streatching credibility.

In other words - the arishoks "invasion" was doomed to failure before it even started.

Hawke did nothing. And acts 2 and 3 felt forced. He/She had a buisness venture and a mansion in Act2 - there was no need for him to do mercenary work and be everyones errand boy.
There was no need for him, no real reason to get involved in anything after act 1.

At least with the Warden it makes sense - the Blight is not a local problem. He can run from Ferelden, but if the blight isn't stop, ti will come for him regardless. It made sense to stay and fight.


Oh, and Anders does his little act of terrorism even if you do everything in your power to thwart him. You can ignore him, refuse all of his quests...he still does it. So Hawke has 0 influence on abomination boy.