111 réponses à ce sujet

[Hyper Cutter]

For God's sake, there's enough of this argument in the DA2 section, we don't need it here too...

[Severyx]

Uh, it wasn't cut. It was never there. I think it was pointed out that all of that dialogue is in the game, not unused. It's called conversation branching, people. Notice how you never once hear romance scene dialogue from FemShep.

It suits Tali's personality for her to react to Shepard the way she does, regardless of gender UP UNTIL actual romance dialogue. Also remember that the dialogue is the same, if not similar up until the 'lock in this romance' part, where Tali nervously breaks the conversation with FemShep (depending on your conversation choices), etc. It saves recording time, and I'm pretty sure that Bioware wanted FemShep and ManShep to have the SAME script except for parts unique to the gender (I.E. romance scenes). That's why the character (Tali in this case) had to break the conversation.

Tali likes Shepard, even as a female, but not enough to go there. Leave the lesbian!Tali to rabid-fan-created content.

This following quote has my official stamp of approval:

Goodwood wrote...

Goodwood has long maintained that characters should be established as straight, gay or bi from the beginning, and not, not, NOT made to be otherwise later on just to "appease the fans."

Also, this:

Hyper Cutter wrote...

For God's sake, there's enough of this argument in the DA2 section, we don't need it here too...

[Influ]

expanding panic wrote...

Make a male shep. Problem solved.

I have five brosheps. That's beyond the point.

[jamesp81]

Nodscouter wrote...

Yes, Cyanide, believe it or not, but I'm not one saying that every romance should be bi or even that the old romances should be converted into bisexuals. Right now, we're assuming we've only played ME1.

jamesp81 wrote...

Nodscouter wrote...

The fact that you ignore my arguments is a good one in my mind.
Once again, statistics does not prove anything. You can guess that she's heterosexual because of statistics, but it is, once again, not proof of anything, at all, no matter how much you try to make it so. It's reasonable to a point. You can't just assume everyone you meet is straight because most people are. Every now and then you're going to be wrong.
And once again, she never mentions her sexuality. Why would I be confused if she was bisexual? Because, once again, most people are straight?
And you're trying to say Tali wouldn't be a believeable character if she was bi, simply because, once more, most people are straight?

I find it rather easy to paint someone a practitioner of idiocy, when they are.

Tali would be believable as a bisexual character if it was established early.  Not at this late time.

As for being a practitioner of idiocy, feel free to prove it with hard evidence.  If you can't, then feel free to keep it to yourself.

This whole argument is damn hard evidence. And now, you've finally decided to stop debating some of my points, and stick to one that's irrelevant to the argument. Yes, Tali is not bisexual, that was proven in ME2 and is besides the point.
And what do you consider ''believable'' as a bisexual character? Do they have to act stereotypically bisexual? Do they have to run around the place screaming that they are bi? What the hell do you mean?

You are raving.  You are not able to think clearly about this for reasons I'm not aware of, nor do I care about.

[Nodscouter]

Yes, because obviously when I'm making a valid point I'm ''raving'', nice quick way to get out of a debate huh? Shame it doesn't really work when you have an opponent that doesn't back off that easily.
A few curses here and there does not mean I'm raving. Asking questions does not mean I'm raving. Either prove me wrong or admit you are, either way works for me, as long as you don't try something like that ''you're raving'' thing.
Besides, what is making you think I can't think clearly? I can say the same about you, and guess what? I have exactly as much evidence as you for that point.

[fourstringwizard]

Oh God, threads like this are a waste of bandwidth. She's not bi, case closed. Nor does she have to be. Stop complaining.

[Nodscouter]

And that is completely irrelevant to our current argument Nice attempt, but failed.

[expanding panic]

Influ wrote...

expanding panic wrote...

Make a male shep. Problem solved.

I have five brosheps. That's beyond the point.

Ta wa. Tail's not a Lesbian that sucks to be you but get over it. 

[Nodscouter]

And once again, you miss the point.You would benefit from reading the thread you know.

[Inquisitor Recon]

Somewhere on the Enterprise E, Picard face-palms.

Go back to DA2 and enjoy everybody sleeping with people who will sleep with anything and everything. Because in the real world everybody is bisexual.

[Nodscouter]

How many times do I have to repeat:

Nodscouter wrote...

And once again, you miss the point.You would benefit from reading the thread you know.

And if you hadn't noticed, Dragon Age is fantasy.

Modifié par Nodscouter, 05 avril 2011 - 08:52 .

[AdmiralCheez]

The lack of Tali/Femshep in ME2 made Cheez a sad panda. However, I will allow Bioware to keep all sexual orientations as they are IF AND ONLY IF there are gay/bi options in ME3.

[Valcutio]

Tali is straight. It's part of her established character. Changing that now would contribute to destroying the lore of the game.

The ME2 team, unlike the DA2 team, actually considers their work to be art. Not flexible crap that they change on a whim because people cry about not being able to romance anything with a heartbeat.

[AdmiralCheez]

Valcutio wrote...

Tali is straight. It's part of her established character. Changing that now would contribute to destroying the lore of the game.

It is never explicitly stated nor implied that Tali is straight.  In fact, the Shadow Broker's dossier on her is exactly the same whether you are male or female, hinting that she has the hots for Shep no matter the gender.  I'd say she's more canonically bi than anything else.

Seriously, play as Femshep.  Talk to Tali.  You awkwardly flirt for a little bit,
but suddenly the conversation cuts off and it's back to cleaning the
engines.  It's pretty obvious they cut content at the last minute.

And it's not like she's going to run off with Gabby or something if she's bi.  She still has eyes only for Shepard;.you can just romance her in 100% of your playthroughs now.

Not saying that it should be changed in ME3 (although I'd much like it if they did), but that cutting it out was cheap, sloppy, and cowardly.

EDIT: HURF DURF TYPO (and some weird wording).

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 05 avril 2011 - 09:23 .

[Someone With Mass]

Gender doesn't play a big role in the quarian society, so I wouldn't be surprised if she's at least bisexual.

Regarding the romance option for female Shepards? Eh, I don't care, as long there's no OOC going on because of it.

[Bamboozalist]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

It is never explicitly stated not implied that Tali is straight.  In fact, the Shadow Broker's dossier on her is exactly the same whether you are male or female, hinting that she has the hots for Shep no matter the gender.  In fact, I'd say she's more canonically bi than anything else.

Seriously, play as Femshep.  Talk to Tali.  You awkwardly flirt for a little bit,
but suddenly the conversation cuts off and it's back to cleaning the
engines.  It's pretty obvious they cut content at the last minute.

And it's not like she's going to run off with Gabby or something if she's bi.  She still has eyes only for Shepard;.you can just romance her in 100% of your playthroughs now.

Not saying that it should be changed in ME3 (although I'd much like it if they did), but that cutting it out was cheap, sloppy, and cowardly.

This, Tali is never established to be straight, nor is she established to be interested in any humans beyond Shepard, she's not heterosexual, she's not bisexual, she's not homosexual. She's Shepardsexual.

And yes Cheez is right, you still get to akwardly flirt with Tali before she realizes what she says and goes back to the engines and she still nerve stim pros like there's no tomorrow and downloads a human dating manual even if you are a femshep (and considering that she has NO reason to like any other humans that manual is pretty hard to ignore)

Tali is a filthy, filthy Shepardsexual and we should all be ashamed to even let her in our party.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

LOL, I I made a thread that was basically Goodwood's comment and I got flamed.......

I love this site.

[OrlesianWardenCommander]

This is Biowares Sociopathic network everybody gets flamed!

[LiquidGrape]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

LOL, I I made a thread that was basically Goodwood's comment and I got flamed.......

I love this site.

You weren't "flamed" for what you said. You were rightfully admonished for the way in which you said it and argued for it.
Huge difference. But you wouldn't recognise that back then either.

[Mr.House]

Everyone is bi.

[Mondo47]

Actually, when you're talking about different species, with different concepts of beauty, different cultures, different bodyshapes in some cases, different approaches to sexual behaviour... if you develop an attraction to someone outside of your own species, surely who they will count for more than what they are? I mean, in the case of Garrus, is coitus with a human even feasable, let alone comfortable? How does a Femme-Shep even look to him, other than inside-out maybe? But it happens anyway. Because of who Shep is - Shepard's personality, deeds, actions and history make them space-catnip for aliens. So, surely a bisexual Tali (or Thane, or Wrex for that matter - sorry, that one's a personal kink I guess ) is not some terrible deconstruction of the character, but perhaps just as likely when you think about in in the context of a girl with odd legs, glowing eyes, terrible allergies and a bucket on her head all the time. Personality has to count more than just having the right equipment - if you can even prove it'd fit.

So in my book, it works without breaking anything... except some player's fragile egos. Everyone's probably bisexual in the future anyway...

[Mr.House]

Valcutio wrote...
The ME2 team, unlike the DA2 team, actually considers their work to be art. Not flexible crap that they change on a whim because people cry about not being able to romance anything with a heartbeat.

Tali=maleshep
Miri=maleshep
Jack=maleshep
Ash=maleshep
Liara=both
Jacob=femshep
Garrus=femshep
Kaidan=femshep
Thane=femshep

Ya so fair....

[jlb524]

Valcutio wrote...

The ME2 team, unlike the DA2 team, actually considers their work to be art. Not flexible crap that they change on a whim because people cry about not being able to romance anything with a heartbeat.

Yes, the Mass Effect 2 romances, with their two pretty shallow conversations squeezed in after having to finish some pointless loyalty mission, where art....BW's best romances yet.  They were also all hetero too, which makes them instantly realistic, deep, emotional, and impressive.