24 réponses à ce sujet

[stjasonl1]

 Does it do 1000% to my companions  Feneris can only take 2 hit from a firestrom that dosen't even kill the weakest enemy, am I missing something?  I've been experimenting  with diffrent types of enemies different  spells, Fist of the Maker the weakest damaging spell seems to one hit kill any companions, whats going on?   Also does it do damage to character casting the spell?

Modifié par stjasonl1, 03 avril 2011 - 03:23 .

[Apathy1989]

NPCs have way more health than your companions (but npcs do comparatively terrible damage), so while you are doing same damage the effect is huge.

Just poor design by bioware, they should have made it do 10% damage against allies since npcs have 10x or more hp. Or make npcs and players more similar stats.


Edit: And yes some spells hurt casters. Firestorm hurts the caster I believe, but skills like makers fist do not. Obviously explosions from walking bombs will kill the caster.

Modifié par Apathy1989, 03 avril 2011 - 03:28 .

[Toastedsnow]

I've yet to play on NM so feel free to disregard if I'm incorrect but from what I've heard, AoE seems to be extremely situational in that mode - to the point of being of very limited use due to the lesser damage output (proportional to baddies that is) and FF. If you must spell AoE, I'd imagine you'd want some sort of elemental mitigation up on your party, the two coming to mind being Aveline's Elemental Aegis which can be party-wide via talenting (the skill eludes me) and that glowy blue bubble thingy that's in the Arcane tree and whose name again eludes me. Either way, it'd probably be best for you to merely pick priority targets and focus fire them down via CCC and liberal use of CC. Petrify/Dessicate is great for setting up a brittle combo but it can also take a target completely out of commission for the duration, allowing you to blast down something else before it becomes a threat.

[rumination888]

1 fire ward rune adds 90% resistance for your companions.
This not only helps with FF, but it makes traps, dragon breath, mage auto-attack, and rage demon auto-attack a non-issue. It synergizes well with Bursting Arrow's CCC and obscure effect, too.

Modifié par rumination888, 03 avril 2011 - 04:01 .

[SuicidalBaby]

FF does 100% Thing is, most if not all of your abilities do enough base line damage to kill anyone in your party.

To start off stick with Primal, Chain Lightning and Tempest are both Enemy only. If you're going to let a warrior run free, disable their 2h weapon abilities, s/s scatter & assault. Keep them to Sheild Bash, Pommel Strike and defensive capibilities only via tactics. Otherwise you will have dead party members quite often.

You can get away with Fist of the Maker on a party member and they will live without issue. Its not a spell I would recomend upgrading. If you're looking for 0 damage AoE control spells use Telekinetic Blast, Pull of the Abyss, and Gravitic Ring.  The latter being the best control spell in the game.

Winter's Grasp has a small AoE that can 1 shot your group members. Use it, but do so carefully, triggering it personally or keep a close eye on the situations when it will be fired off and keep your melee clear of the impact zone.

Use these charts to understand which targets are immune. Youll run into it alot in nightmare.
Enemy elemental resistance reference sheet (Nightmare)
Enemy non-elemental immunity reference sheet (Nightmare)

why people who haven't played nightmare bother to comment on it will continue to astound me.


edit: ward runes will add a level of resistance based on the level of the item they are placed in.

Modifié par SuicidialBaby, 03 avril 2011 - 04:14 .

[Waltzingbear]

Yes AOE is much less viable than in Origins. Aside from the fact that one burst can just straight kill you, enemies move so fast that they would be all over you before you could finish the animation. They also die a lot faster and then another wave spawns from every direction around you which makes it practically impossible to control and ineffective at best.

Definitely a victory to combat improvement in that section. I can't understand how I was able to bear playing Origins where I looked at a situation and knew exactly how to plan using my abilities or was able to use Cone of Cold on my allies without them dying.

Modifié par Waltzingbear, 03 avril 2011 - 04:27 .

[rumination888]

SuicidialBaby wrote...

edit: ward runes will add a level of resistance based on the level of the item they are placed in.

The level of resistance will increase as your companions level rises, so its a constant 90%. kthxbye

[SuicidalBaby]

kthx be specific, because Avalines shield doesn't scale. her armor does. My statement still holds true.

[stjasonl1]

As for the force mage spells they're kind of worthless on NM too, Gravitic Ring slows all party member to a halt can't even move them out of the way for a AOE, Pull of the Abyss pulls all of them except Aveline.  Fist of the Maker when upgraded for the stagger effect is the one that's worth it, for my build it turns it's 90 dam into 810 dam amking it the most powerful spell I can get.
          I did a primal mage on Hard (which was almost too easy) and was just trying to switch it up a bit. The best thing about the elemental tree is the two +25 fire dam if your using a fire staff the staff will do more damage than fireball add Haste and you have a quick fight (as long as it's not a dragon). That seems to be the most powerful combo in the game especially if you and Anders both have Haste.

Modifié par stjasonl1, 03 avril 2011 - 05:01 .

[rumination888]

SuicidialBaby wrote...

kthx be specific, because Avalines shield doesn't scale. her armor does. My statement still holds true.

rumination888 wrote...

1 fire ward rune adds 90% resistance for your companions.

Notice the plural?

Only Hawke and a single companion can equip a shield. It is poor to assume someone would be daft enough not to realize I was talking about something that affects companions.

Either english isn't your first language, or you didn't realize the 90% resistance for companions is a constant throughout the game and are now trying to cover yourself up.

Edit: There were some private messages between SuicidalBaby and me and these responses simply spilled onto these forums. Extremely poor form of me to let it continue, I know.

Modifié par rumination888, 03 avril 2011 - 05:05 .

[SuicidalBaby]

what ever your issue is, get over it. which ever runeslot is being discussed, there is nothing false about my statement. Take down your threat level, because there isn't any coming from me.

[rumination888]

SuicidialBaby wrote...

what ever your issue is, get over it. which ever runeslot is being discussed, there is nothing false about my statement. Take down your threat level, because there isn't any coming from me.

There was nothing false about my statement, either. Yet you claimed otherwise in the private message you sent.

[ent1]

The biggest FF threat is a warrior, and walking bomb is pretty much unusable. Keep people out of the way of a 2H warrior and be careful that an ally is not touching the hitbox of the enemy when using Winter's Grasp. Other than that, the tactics you use with AOE spells is pretty much the same as Origins.

AOE spells which do additional damage to debuffed targets also are effective. Fist of the Maker was mentioned (though it still slams your allies to the ground), and Hemmorhage will deal only minor damage to allies while destroying staggered enemies.

[CLime]

Blood magic AoEs seem to be incapable of friendly fire. I can't confirm this on mage Hawke, but Merrill's Wrath of the Elvhen and Wounds of the Past both don't hurt companions.

[Apathy1989]

CLime wrote...

Blood magic AoEs seem to be incapable of friendly fire. I can't confirm this on mage Hawke, but Merrill's Wrath of the Elvhen and Wounds of the Past both don't hurt companions.

Confirming that Hemorrhage is not FF. Works very well, especially if Fenris staggers a group.

However, overall I have been disappointed in playing blood mage spec. Blood Control lasts far too short a time, so useless. Grave Robber also barely affects hostiles since your HP is so small compared to hostile HP. And I have to invest alot of SP into it to just survive.

[Lumikki]

I don't think FF has much meaning. It makes many area affected spell (AoE) using little harder, but that's all. Example, if you do defensive stun around you self, it also stuns you companions, who are in area.

I find resistance more annoying than FF in NM.

Modifié par Lumikki, 04 avril 2011 - 06:12 .

[AgenTBC]

A thought: Will spirit resistance runes in companion armor make you resistant enough to use Walking Bomb on enemies you are in close proximity to, or will you still take enough damage to wipe your party?

[stjasonl1]

Walking bomb does physical damage I'm pretty sure. 

Also I've noticed that Elemental Ageis upgraded plus Meghan Vael's locket does wonders to protect Aveline from fire damage but not so much from cone of cold.

Modifié par stjasonl1, 04 avril 2011 - 11:58 .

[Sabotin]

No, walking bomb does spirit damage. Anyway I use generally the primal tree for my mages even for damage, because I just like it more than elemental. Coincidentally it's also friendly fire friendly.

And there is a huge difference to how you play your characters. WIth an auto-hit warrior build, even if I was hittin enemies for 1k+ crits I still didn't have to watch as much as a skill damage based one. Sometimes I would even sacrifice some companion hp just beacuse I'd be lazy to pause/manually move him away or he was the one thing short of having a perfect hitting position.

But yeah, the problem with ff is that enemies and allies aren't using the same mechanics. Party characters are doing multiple times their hp in damage (let's say you have 200 hp and are doing 3k to enemies). Mobs are inversely doing a tiny fraction of their hp (let's say they have 5k hp and if they do 50 damage that's already a lot). So yeah, it can be dangerous. Maybe they should have implemented glacing blows for skills also, but eh, I don't really care that much.

[Zan Mura]

AgenTBC wrote...

A thought: Will spirit resistance runes in companion armor make you resistant enough to use Walking Bomb on enemies you are in close proximity to, or will you still take enough damage to wipe your party?

My Aveline uses Elemental Aegis with a Frost & Spirit Warding rune, which produces those nice "Immune" messages as I pop the mobs around her. So yeah, it works. I suppose if you want to give the same resistances to your other groupmates, that could work too, but personally I'd consider that too much of a hassle. The spell does such an insane amount of damage that you'd need full immunity on everyone. Much easier to just fix your aggro management skills and make sure the mobs don't go anywhere near your softies. And when they do, it won't be more than 1 - 2 at a time, in which case a WB would be a waste anyway.

[AgenTBC]

Okay, how about Pull of the Abyss + Walking Bomb? Pull would suck everyone into a tight group for the splodey time, right?

[Waltzingbear]

I think that using Barrier on the tank just before the burst would do better. I have yet to try it though but that was pretty much a "win" strategy in Origins; Force Field however held for much much longer in Origins of course.

[AgenTBC]

Yeah that's a way to go. The timing might be tight though if you are only running one mage. You'd have to throw up the barrier, throw up the bomb, and then kill the target from range. With two mages it'd be pretty easy.

I guess I'll drink a potion and try pull of the abyss and walking bomb to check. Although I used one earlier and for some reason I still have the upgraded cone of cold even though I specced out of basic cone of cold which seems weird so I'm wondering if it is glitchy.

[Waltzingbear]

You are experiencing the Maker's Sigh bug. If you'd keep respeccing you'd end up with more talent points than you should have. You probably have more than you should right now.

[stjasonl1]

Pull of the abyss will pull your tank right along with everyone else.