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[Vormaerin]

Frankly, the option I wanted was to be able to grab the "O" note and storm off to scream at Meredith and Orsino. It never occurred to me to blame Avelline. Probably becuase she was a mainstay of my party in the first playthrough, so it felt like she was doing stuff all along.

[Zan Mura]

The Angry One wrote...

Talladarr wrote...

Lord Gremlin wrote...I wanted an option to hug LI and cry.

^^
this

Thirded.

Fourthed or sixth depending on how many other posters were inbetween.

I fear that BW has reason to suspect that the "normal" customer does not want their protagonist to appear weak. To me that spells a lack of very needed humanity. In general, there's a lot of personal loss in DA2 that isn't being capitalized on at all. I suppose we should be thankful there even IS any loss to give any kind of personal connection to our characters in the first place. And I am, thankful that is. But I just wish there was more and that it went deeper.

Sure I want to play epic, powerful and highly capable heroes. But I also want the option to make them human. Not just emotionless machines who everyone else leans on, but who never needs their help or support, never needs to break down and just express themselves. This was talked about a lot in Mass Effect 2 too (which thankfully the LotSB DLC took notice of).

[Kilshrek]

Zan Mura wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Talladarr wrote...

Lord Gremlin wrote...I wanted an option to hug LI and cry.

^^
this

Thirded.

Fourthed or sixth depending on how many other posters were inbetween.

I fear that BW has reason to suspect that the "normal" customer does not want their protagonist to appear weak. To me that spells a lack of very needed humanity. In general, there's a lot of personal loss in DA2 that isn't being capitalized on at all. I suppose we should be thankful there even IS any loss to give any kind of personal connection to our characters in the first place. And I am, thankful that is. But I just wish there was more and that it went deeper.

Sure I want to play epic, powerful and highly capable heroes. But I also want the option to make them human. Not just emotionless machines who everyone else leans on, but who never needs their help or support, never needs to break down and just express themselves. This was talked about a lot in Mass Effect 2 too (which thankfully the LotSB DLC took notice of).

Makes me wanna fire up another round of ME 2 really. I want me some little blue babies . Hawke sat on a bed doing a fine Keanu Reeves impression, and that was that. I think the cry bit may be stretching it but there were so many tears shed in ME 2, why not throw it in for DA 2? (Okay I'm exaggerating about lots of tears but there was crying, in a video game! 'course the runny makeup was kinda scary but there was a great effort to make the characters less super) But a hug would've been nice. I mean, turds, my mum just died, horribly and all I get is a little talk?

[ejoslin]

Zan Mura wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Talladarr wrote...

Lord Gremlin wrote...I wanted an option to hug LI and cry.

^^
this

Thirded.

Fourthed or sixth depending on how many other posters were inbetween.

I fear that BW has reason to suspect that the "normal" customer does not want their protagonist to appear weak. To me that spells a lack of very needed humanity. In general, there's a lot of personal loss in DA2 that isn't being capitalized on at all. I suppose we should be thankful there even IS any loss to give any kind of personal connection to our characters in the first place. And I am, thankful that is. But I just wish there was more and that it went deeper.

Sure I want to play epic, powerful and highly capable heroes. But I also want the option to make them human. Not just emotionless machines who everyone else leans on, but who never needs their help or support, never needs to break down and just express themselves. This was talked about a lot in Mass Effect 2 too (which thankfully the LotSB DLC took notice of).

I thought the scene where the LI came in to comfort a very upset Hawke was touching.  Would a hug have made it better?  Possibly.  I would have loved an arm tossed around the shoulder or something.  But you DID have Hawke mourning, upset, and the LI coming in to comfort him/her.  Or Aveline, if you didn't have an LI.

[Zan Mura]

ejoslin wrote...

I thought the scene where the LI came in to comfort a very upset Hawke was touching.  Would a hug have made it better?  Possibly.  I would have loved an arm tossed around the shoulder or something.  But you DID have Hawke mourning, upset, and the LI coming in to comfort him/her.  Or Aveline, if you didn't have an LI.

Like I said, I'm not ungrateful for that. But I would have liked more. What more? Well, examples:

- Crying into the LI's chest / lap with head buried and having them comfort Hawke over the night.
- Having Hawk ask for their LI to hold them, just for a bit. No crying involved, just a silent moment with the comfort of another. Your basic long hug.
- Truly raging, busting the place up and blaming everyone else. With the LI coming in to calm Hawke down with a hug. Possibly being able to turn it down and rage some more. Or to play the part and finally cool off in the caring embrace of a loved one.

Basically, you had the options as is. But they lacked the duration and the emotional power that was clearly needed of the situation. I could even have used another scene during the morning, or maybe something a few days after returning to Leandra's death and Hawke's following moment with their LI. Then talking over if they felt better with a bit of option for more soft drama or badassery depending on what the player chose.

It's just that same as with Beth's or Carver's death or recruitment into the Gray Wardens / Templars / Circle, it's basically handled by forgetting it ever happened and then maybe hinting at it once in a letter or in one short dialogue in the very end of the game. That's just nowhere NEAR enough considering how important an event like that would be for Hawke.

One last time, I'm not ungrateful to BW. After all, I played Fallout 3. I mean, an entire game where I couldn't give a rat's ass about a single character including my character's father. And he was voiced by Liam Neeson for god's sakes! BW can make you care, they make the characters seem like people as opposed to paper billboards for quest I don't even care about. And I appreciate that. I'm just saying, I could do with a lot more where this level of drama is concerned. It's your frigging mother!

Modifié par Zan Mura, 04 avril 2011 - 03:09 .

[Mnemnosyne]

Vormaerin wrote...

Frankly, the option I wanted was to be able to grab the "O" note and storm off to scream at Meredith and Orsino. It never occurred to me to blame Avelline. Probably becuase she was a mainstay of my party in the first playthrough, so it felt like she was doing stuff all along.

Meredith I can see, for the reasons I gave earlier: Templars didn't do their damned job, that's why this whole mess happened.  At best that means they allowed a mage to escape because they didn't want to be bothered doing a thorough search of the place where the phylactery pointed them to.

But Orsino?  Just from a note that is signed 'O'?  How many people have an O name in Kirkwall?  Is there any actual evidence tying him to Quentin other than a note that could be from damn near anyone, and we only know to connect it with Orsino due to various metagaming reasons - limited number of named characters in the game, thus making it comparably easy to deduce it must be Orsino, and the fact that he mentions it before going wacko.  I see absolutely no way Hawke could possibly connect the note to Orsino without further evidence.

[ejoslin]

Zan Mura wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

I thought the scene where the LI came in to comfort a very upset Hawke was touching.  Would a hug have made it better?  Possibly.  I would have loved an arm tossed around the shoulder or something.  But you DID have Hawke mourning, upset, and the LI coming in to comfort him/her.  Or Aveline, if you didn't have an LI.

Like I said, I'm not ungrateful for that. But I would have liked more. What more? Well, examples:

- Crying into the LI's chest / lap with head buried and having them comfort Hawke over the night.
- Having Hawk ask for their LI to hold them, just for a bit. No crying involved, just a silent moment with the comfort of another. Your basic long hug.
- Truly raging, busting the place up and blaming everyone else. With the LI coming in to calm Hawke down with a hug. Possibly being able to turn it down and rage some more. Or to play the part and finally cool off in the caring embrace of a loved one.

Basically, you had the options as is. But they lacked the duration and the emotional power that was clearly needed of the situation. I could even have used another scene during the morning, or maybe something a few days after returning to Leandra's death and Hawke's following moment with their LI. Then talking over if they felt better with a bit of option for more soft drama or badassery depending on what the player chose.

It's just that same as with Beth's or Carver's death or recruitment into the Gray Wardens / Templars / Circle, it's basically handled by forgetting it ever happened and then maybe hinting at it once in a letter or in one short dialogue in the very end of the game. That's just nowhere NEAR enough considering how important an event like that would be for Hawke.

One last time, I'm not ungrateful to BW. After all, I played Fallout 3. I mean, an entire game where I couldn't give a rat's ass about a single character including my character's father. And he was voiced by Liam Neeson for god's sakes! BW can make you care, they make the characters seem like people as opposed to paper billboards for quest I don't even care about. And I appreciate that. I'm just saying, I could do with a lot more where this level of drama is concerned. It's your frigging mother!

Hmmmm, you click on certain characters afterwards, and you do get condolences.  A few banters refer to it.

That's the type of thing I can see having to cut other things for -- its a lot of work -- and cuts of anything else would be bad (there were way too many shortcuts and streamlines as it is).  I have to admit, there is nothing like that in Origins at all.  It was the one detail that they added that I really appreciated.  I think they did it right.  Though, honestly, it would have been nice had it happened before a timeskip so you don't have that weird disconnect of geting to business immediately afterwards -- maybe a cutscene of a funeral would have put a bit more of a feeling of time passing between the LI comfort and getting back to business.  

I did like that they put in the effort of having your LI comfort Hawke.  The fade to black is appropriate, I think, because various things could be happening in the relationship (including Hawke and the LI being broken up).  Different people see their Hawke as various types of stoic or emotional.  Leaving some things to the imagination is a good thing.

The game engine does not allow for tears I don't believe.

Edit: I would say, an animation I would have liked is when the LI sat down next to Hawke, if an arm when around the shoulder and Hawke leaned into him/her.  But still, I'm glad for what IS there.

Modifié par ejoslin, 04 avril 2011 - 04:22 .