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#76
Cutlass Jack

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Rifneno wrote...

On a slightly related note... am I the only gullible sap who actually thought the Justice quest would end with Justice being peacefully seperated from Anders?  :(


Sadly I knew what it was really about once I heard the Ingredient list. No one gathers that much manure and saltpeter to make a potion. I figured it out well ahead of the reveal. Or even being asked by him to distract Elthina.

The knowledge didn't let me do anything to stop it however. But I made a personal vow at that moment that if he did something to kill Elthina, it would be the one act I wouldn't let him walk away from. Much to my great regret, it all unfolded exactly as I predicted.
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#77
Rifneno

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Cutlass Jack wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

On a slightly related note... am I the only gullible sap who actually thought the Justice quest would end with Justice being peacefully seperated from Anders?  :(


Sadly I knew what it was really about once I heard the Ingredient list. No one gathers that much manure and saltpeter to make a potion. I figured it out well ahead of the reveal. Or even being asked by him to distract Elthina.

The knowledge didn't let me do anything to stop it however. But I made a personal vow at that moment that if he did something to kill Elthina, it would be the one act I wouldn't let him walk away from. Much to my great regret, it all unfolded exactly as I predicted.
Image IPB


Ahh, I probably would've picked up on it if I knew that's what those things were used for.  Although now that I think about it, you have to wonder how he got ahold of the recipe himself.  The Qunari are pretty protective of it, and we haven't seen any evidence that anyone else in Thedas has discovered black powder.

#78
Anarcala

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I disagree with all the talk of abominations. An abomination is someone outright possessed by a demon. The process seems irreversable, the mage's conscious mind is completely gone and replaced with the demon's, and they're warped into some twisted form. Anders doesn't fit the criteria even if you did consider Justice a demon now (I think he's now more a neutral force than either good or evil). But then, pretty much everything about the Anders/Justice situation defies everything we've been told or shown about possession and fade creatures. I hope they give us a good explanation for him later, because right now it just doesn't make sense.


True, he's a whole other animal. My point was more about making a 'Faustian' deal I guess. Anders was looking for an easy option.

I've been really surprised that so many people said they'd leg it, or just keep their heads down. Having said that I suppose that's what most people do in real life situations.

#79
Cutlass Jack

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Rifneno wrote...

Ahh, I probably would've picked up on it if I knew that's what those things were used for.  Although now that I think about it, you have to wonder how he got ahold of the recipe himself.  The Qunari are pretty protective of it, and we haven't seen any evidence that anyone else in Thedas has discovered black powder.


Well I think he was telling the truth about it being Tevinter research. After all, they're at war with the Qunari and would have the most motivation to figure out explosives of their own.

#80
Lithuasil

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Anarcala wrote...
I've been really surprised that so many people said they'd leg it, or just keep their heads down. Having said that I suppose that's what most people do in real life situations.


It's the more sensible thing to do, plainly. I value my freedom and Indepence, and I go at great length to protect it. But I'm also smart enough to realize, when there's three swat teams stationed outside my flat, specifically to keep me inside, and weapons free the second I try anything funny - then anything other then playing along and trying to be nice, is pretty much suicide.
Especially, when anything I could find outside, is most likely much, much worse then what said swat teams kindly provide me with, inside my flat, without asking anything in return.

And that's the situation at hand - without some unforseeable events in a third game, the mages don't have a snowballs chance in hell, to win open war with the templars. At best, they don't all get killed, and some get recaptured, under much worse conditions. And inside the circles, if you keep your head down, life is much nicer, more stable, and even safer, then it is for 95% of thedas populace.

#81
Anarcala

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It's the more sensible thing to do, plainly. I value my freedom and Indepence, and I go at great length to protect it. But I'm also smart enough to realize, when there's three swat teams stationed outside my flat, specifically to keep me inside, and weapons free the second I try anything funny - then anything other then playing along and trying to be nice, is pretty much suicide.

Especially, when anything I could find outside, is most likely much, much worse then what said swat teams kindly provide me with, inside my flat, without asking anything in return.


Sure the SWAT team is right outside your flat, but you have a massive arsenal quite literally at your fingertips, that you could employ so fast that the SWAT team would barely have time to yelp before they hit the floor.

I don't see how the outside is worse.  I'd much rather be on the run and free, than caged and guarded.

And that's the situation at hand - without some unforseeable events in a third game, the mages don't have a snowballs chance in hell, to win open war with the templars. At best, they don't all get killed, and some get recaptured, under much worse conditions. And inside the circles, if you keep your head down, life is much nicer, more stable, and even safer, then it is for 95% of thedas populace.


Are you kidding?  Every Mage has a whole wealth of abilities that could easily wipe out regiments with just minimal training.

My main point here is that freedom is precious, and it's a fallacy to say the Circle is secure.  The Rite of Annulment can be invoked for you even if you had nothing to do with the Mages that caused it.  Keeping your head down does little to keep you safe.  For the Mages to survive they need to support one another, not look out for their individual interests.

Modifié par Anarcala, 05 avril 2011 - 02:33 .


#82
DA_GamerGal

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I guess my reaction would depend on a few things... such as, do I believe in the Maker and what the Chantry stands for ? Do I agree that the circle is a necessary to protect all people - mages and non-mages- from demons and the abuse of power?  How have I been treated in the circle that I reside in? Or do I even reside in on of the circle... I could be an apostate on the run.

None of my Hawks thus far have condoned what Anders did, but she always understood why. My mage Hawk was the only one to let him go, as she supported the mages on principle alone. She understood that not all mages succumb to the temptations that mages are faced with on a daily basis. Not all mages want to rule over non-mages or to become the most powerful mage alive.
She understood that with great power comes great responsibility and that one most always follow some sort of moral compass... but she does believe that all mages should live free as long as they deserve that freedom. As soon as a mage resorts to blood magic, that mage does not deserve to live free and is a danger - to others and to the mage. That mage should be sent to a circle to live.

I do know that my reaction would be one of sadness... that because of the action of one man, the world will be plunged into a war where both sides will lose.

Modifié par krissyjf, 05 avril 2011 - 02:38 .


#83
TobiTobsen

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Anarcala wrote...

And that's the situation at hand - without some unforseeable events in a third game, the mages don't have a snowballs chance in hell, to win open war with the templars. At best, they don't all get killed, and some get recaptured, under much worse conditions. And inside the circles, if you keep your head down, life is much nicer, more stable, and even safer, then it is for 95% of thedas populace.


Are you kidding?  Every Mage has a whole wealth of abilities that could easily wipe out regiments with just minimal training.

My main point here is that freedom is precious, and it's a fallacy to say the Circle is secure.  The Rite of Annulment can be invoked for you even if you had nothing to do with the Mages that caused it.  Keeping your head down does little to keep you safe.  For the Mages to survive they need to support one another, not look out for their individual interests.


Uhm... not every mage is as powerfull as our main characters or First Entchanters. Most of the normal mages are probably considered skilled if they master 4 or 5 spells and know some others. There is a reason the mages in the Gallows go down as fast as they do, when the templars rush in. The templars are trained since they were kids to fight mages and drink lyrium to better resist magic.

The only time we hear about mages wiping out whole templar regiments it's either an Arcane Horror or an Abomination.

Modifié par TobiTobsen, 05 avril 2011 - 02:46 .


#84
Lithuasil

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Anarcala wrote...
Sure the SWAT team is right outside your flat, but you have a massive arsenal quite literally at your fingertips, that you could employ so fast that the SWAT team would barely have time to yelp before they hit the floor.

I don't see how the outside is worse.  I'd much rather be on the run and free, than caged and guarded.


Except that said swat team has specifically been trained their whole life, to counter my abilities, and has years of combat training, where I have years of reading, sitting in a tower and getting fat. 

And compare the life in a circle to that of an average thedas citizen. The right of annulment has (including ferelden and Kirkwall) been invoked 19 times. In 937 Years. What do you think how many towns/villages were plundered, burned down/raided/eaten by darkspawn during that period of time?
Life in the circle isn't safe, but it's safer then anywhere else, and presumably also sucks less, then most lives, a few nobles excluded. 

#85
sonoko

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After playing DAO a couple of times as an elven mage I've got a strong hatred towards Chantry and the Circle system. Chantry, not the templars. Jowan, Cullen, Lily, my own pc, that brainwashed magic-hating apprentice girl - they all IMO victims of the said system and Chantry propaganda. The atmosphere in the Ferelden circle was far from healthy, and that was the nicest circle of all.

That's why if my mage wasn't recruited by Duncan in DAO she would fight for her freedom and freedom of other mages. To her Anders would be a hero, an example, a man who changed the world.

#86
Anarcala

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Lithuasil wrote...

Anarcala wrote...
Sure the SWAT team is right outside your flat, but you have a massive arsenal quite literally at your fingertips, that you could employ so fast that the SWAT team would barely have time to yelp before they hit the floor.

I don't see how the outside is worse.  I'd much rather be on the run and free, than caged and guarded.


Except that said swat team has specifically been trained their whole life, to counter my abilities, and has years of combat training, where I have years of reading, sitting in a tower and getting fat. 

And compare the life in a circle to that of an average thedas citizen. The right of annulment has (including ferelden and Kirkwall) been invoked 19 times. In 937 Years. What do you think how many towns/villages were plundered, burned down/raided/eaten by darkspawn during that period of time?
Life in the circle isn't safe, but it's safer then anywhere else, and presumably also sucks less, then most lives, a few nobles excluded. 


I'd take my chances.  They can only counter me close up :D

A cage is still a cage, no matter how gilded it is.  Plus those people outside the Circle can live.  They can have families, they're free to do whatever they want within their means.  If you have magic in Thedas then you become a Mage and that is all defining.  You can't be a carpenter, or bartender, or whatever...you're just put to one side to live your life within the restrictions the Chantry place on you.  End of.

Nah.  I'd peg it. 

#87
Crimea River

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Honestly, it would depend on which Circle for reasons that had been stated above. In general, I'm not a person that would be happy being a mage, and if I was a mage, I'd either be a Tranquil at one of the Circles, a bound and leashed Qunari saarebas, a slightly happy mage in a Tevinter Circle, or an [elven or human] apostate who turned to blood magic out of both spite and necessity (and probably ended up getting angry over something and turned into a Rage Abomination; I have anger issues). If I was a non-mage human, I'd probably actually be a templar in the Chantry.

If I was Tranquil, well, I wouldn't think. You know how it is; I'd pretty much see the world with clarity, without emotions, and I'd do whatever my superiors told me to do, whether they were templars or mages. Even in Ferelden's Circle, I don't see myself as being an Apprentice or a Harrowed Mage; I'd hate my magic too much, and it would drive me to anger every day. As it is, I hate what I am, and there I would hate what I was too.  I'd actually opt to do my Harrowing; at least then, I'd die rather than becoming a Tranquil.

If a saarebas, belief in the Qun would have sustained me, and the Qun would be the only belief I'd been taught, so my situation and my thinking would be very different from the above. I would of course be bound and leashed and I would want it no other way, fearing I'd be corrupt as I'd think the unbound bas'saarebas are. I doubt that I would hear about all of the disorder, but if I did, my opinion would be simply that this was inevitable in the human-dominated world, but that it would probably make my people converting them to the Qun that much easier. Going back to the original question, I would think Anders to be a fool and a murderer. But such is the way of the kabethari (those who have not come to know the wisdom of the Qun). Their disorder is their weakness and perhaps they will be seeking order when the Qunari finally come to bring the Qun to the unenlightened lands.

As an apostate, I'd use the opportunity to keep my identity a secret. That wouldn't stop me from hating Anders and thinking that the murder of all those priests -- and those are women for the most part who do not know how to fight -- was unnecessary and uncalled for. Sure, I would have probably killed templars in my time, but they were after me and they were capable of putting up a fight, defending themselves. Even as an apostate, I would do my best not to let innocents be harmed. I would not want to get caught up in the middle of their war, so I'd probably end up making it to Tevinter -- where I'd plan to go, were I an Apostate -- relatively unharmed.

As a Tevinter in one of its Circles, I'd be somewhat amused by the whole situation. I'd hope that the Magisters would take advantage of this, and hope that they would sign a peace treaty with the Qunari, giving them Seheron and all the people that have converted to the Qun. Without the war with the Qunari to distract Tevinter, they'd be able to take advantage of this chaos and conquer the rest of Thedas, possibly bringing the world under the power of the Magisters again...though the Qunari would probably make a move in that time, and all of this warring would be bloody indeed. I've often wondered if something similar to this would happen in DA3...though I'm pretty much rambling here. xD

Finally, as a templar, I'd probably have been a rather decent person, towards mages. Upon hearing what Anders did, however, I'd see mages as a dangerous thing that must be put down, and would hope my superiors felt the same. It's pretty much the same way my first Hawke felt when Anders blew up the Chantry. Julian had been somewhat friendly with Anders, and after what happened to his mother, he merely tolerated him. He welcomed the idea of separating him from Justice, but refused Anders once he learned that this potion he'd been concocting wasn't about freeing Anders from Justice, and that he'd been betrayed. He wouldn't have agreed to do it whether Anders had told him what he was up to or not, and if Anders had told him he planned to blow up the Chantry, one way or another, Julian would have killed him then and there, so I'd say he was pretty smart in being cryptic. When he did blow up the Chantry, Julian turned ice-cold towards mages, especially hearing Sebastian's response. Julian knew what it was like to lose someone very close to him -- having lost his brother, his sister, and his mother, the latter to magic -- and it struck a chord in him. Julian himself wouldn't have killed Anders; he'd have told Sebastian to do it, to avenge Elthina, and Sebastian would have put an arrow through his skull. Julian aided Meredith in the Rite of Annulment, annihilating every mage and demon he and his group of Aveline, Fenris, and Sebastian came across.

(walloftext, lol, I went off on a tangent.)

Modifié par Crimea River, 05 avril 2011 - 03:22 .


#88
Lithuasil

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Anarcala wrote...

I'd take my chances.  They can only counter me close up :D

A cage is still a cage, no matter how gilded it is.  Plus those people outside the Circle can live.  They can have families, they're free to do whatever they want within their means.  If you have magic in Thedas then you become a Mage and that is all defining.  You can't be a carpenter, or bartender, or whatever...you're just put to one side to live your life within the restrictions the Chantry place on you.  End of.

Nah.  I'd peg it. 


They can still counter you at any range. To kill you, they need to get close. Or bring bows. :P

If you'd rather die, then live more comfortable and with equal freedoms to the better part of the populace, more power to you - I just don't like to be called a coward for being reasonable ;)

#89
Madkipz

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As an apostate i would probably swear alot and go about my own way to find a safe refuge in the wilds. As for Anders the murderknife couldnt have come at a later date. While i understand that he blows up the chantry and there is nothing i can do about it ingame. Had i had the option to do so I would have killed him sooner if i had the chance.


He is a) a vocal apostate that openly confronts Meredith using
Hawkes name as a safeguard (templar supporting hawke should have killed
him here). B) "I might hurt you, i am an abomination romance lulz
twillight inspired" c) Friendship points with fenris :D

edit : Within a rebelling circle i would side with the templars instantly, at the very least i would start killing my rebelling inmates and become a mage hunting mage or i would get beheaded or i would run away and hunt runaway abominations. At the very least these alternatives are better than errr. Siding with the rebellion.

Modifié par Madkipz, 05 avril 2011 - 03:27 .


#90
Rifneno

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TobiTobsen wrote...

Anarcala wrote...

And that's the situation at hand - without some unforseeable events in a third game, the mages don't have a snowballs chance in hell, to win open war with the templars. At best, they don't all get killed, and some get recaptured, under much worse conditions. And inside the circles, if you keep your head down, life is much nicer, more stable, and even safer, then it is for 95% of thedas populace.


Are you kidding?  Every Mage has a whole wealth of abilities that could easily wipe out regiments with just minimal training.

My main point here is that freedom is precious, and it's a fallacy to say the Circle is secure.  The Rite of Annulment can be invoked for you even if you had nothing to do with the Mages that caused it.  Keeping your head down does little to keep you safe.  For the Mages to survive they need to support one another, not look out for their individual interests.


Uhm... not every mage is as powerfull as our main characters or First Entchanters. Most of the normal mages are probably considered skilled if they master 4 or 5 spells and know some others. There is a reason the mages in the Gallows go down as fast as they do, when the templars rush in. The templars are trained since they were kids to fight mages and drink lyrium to better resist magic.

The only time we hear about mages wiping out whole templar regiments it's either an Arcane Horror or an Abomination.


Not every mage is as powerful as a first enchanter...  but you don't seem to realize the reverse is also true.  Not every templar is as powerful as a knight commander.  A lot of them are, quite frankly, drug-addled retards.  They're resistant to magic, they're NOT immune to it.  The entire point of the ending is that the mages realize the templars aren't as invulnerable as they both think.

Actually, the mages can take away the templar's only advantage now that they're not confined to the Circle.  Ever read war strategy?  Cut off the enemy's supply line.  Head to Orzammar.  Try to secure their lyrium trade.  If Bhelen is king you can bet he's willing to align himself with whomever can benefit him the most.  If Harrowmont is king, who knows... but he's still no fan of the Chantry.  If the mages can cut off the templar's lyrium supply, they win.  It's just that simple.  Even if the Orzammar crown won't deal, there's only one way out of Orzammar and likely one road for quite a ways.  Ambush any caravans that are likely carrying lyrium.  Or even get a man on the inside and poison the lyrium.  That'd be hilarious.

#91
Anarcala

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They can still counter you at any range. To kill you, they need to get close. Or bring bows. :P

If you'd rather die, then live more comfortable and with equal freedoms to the better part of the populace, more power to you - I just don't like to be called a coward for being reasonable


Nah, look at the game. Templar abilities are far more constrained than that.

Mages don't have equal freedoms. Just because they have a roof over the head, clothes and food doesn't mean they have equal freedom - far from it. Look at what happened to Wynne and her child.

#92
Rifneno

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Lithuasil wrote...

Anarcala wrote...

I'd take my chances.  They can only counter me close up :D

A cage is still a cage, no matter how gilded it is.  Plus those people outside the Circle can live.  They can have families, they're free to do whatever they want within their means.  If you have magic in Thedas then you become a Mage and that is all defining.  You can't be a carpenter, or bartender, or whatever...you're just put to one side to live your life within the restrictions the Chantry place on you.  End of.

Nah.  I'd peg it. 


They can still counter you at any range. To kill you, they need to get close. Or bring bows. :P

If you'd rather die, then live more comfortable and with equal freedoms to the better part of the populace, more power to you - I just don't like to be called a coward for being reasonable ;)


Comfortable with equal freedoms?  ....  What.

#93
Lithuasil

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Anarcala wrote...
Nah, look at the game. Templar abilities are far more constrained than that.

Mages don't have equal freedoms. Just because they have a roof over the head, clothes and food doesn't mean they have equal freedom - far from it. Look at what happened to Wynne and her child.


Counterspell / silence are pretty powerful, even in the confined, pseudo balanced limits of gameplay.

And my entire point is - you're comparing the mage freedom to the freedom we enjoy as modern westerners. A thedas citizen doesn't enjoy that freedom. They enjoy the freedom of producing ten children, five of which they watch starving, two of which die to some diseases and three of which are allowed to work their asses of on the families farm, as somebodies servant. 
That's medieval reality, and compared to that, mages have it pretty dam good.

#94
Anarcala

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And my entire point is - you're comparing the mage freedom to the freedom we enjoy as modern westerners. A thedas citizen doesn't enjoy that freedom. They enjoy the freedom of producing ten children, five of which they watch starving, two of which die to some diseases and three of which are allowed to work their asses of on the families farm, as somebodies servant.
That's medieval reality, and compared to that, mages have it pretty dam good.


No, I'm not. Freedom is the ability to make your own choices. What you're suggesting is regardless of what 'freedoms' people have (or what that even means) the general populace has it worse. No-one would dispute that.

However, what I'm saying is that Mages should have the ability to make decisions for themselves in the same way as the general populace do. If they decide to have children, they should be allowed to do so, and to keep those children. If they want to open up a tavern in Denerim, or tutor, or become a guardsman, they should be allowed to do that. They shouldn't have to give up their human rights at birth.

#95
Rifneno

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Lithuasil wrote...

And my entire point is - you're comparing the mage freedom to the freedom we enjoy as modern westerners. A thedas citizen doesn't enjoy that freedom. They enjoy the freedom of producing ten children, five of which they watch starving, two of which die to some diseases and three of which are allowed to work their asses of on the families farm, as somebodies servant. 
That's medieval reality, and compared to that, mages have it pretty dam good.


Huh.  Very good point.  I admit, I hadn't thought of it like that.  I still think it's worth fighting for freedom from drug addicts who freely commit every abuse from rape to soul-stealing, but the point about us comparing it to modern day Western society is a fallacy is quite true.

#96
Lithuasil

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Anarcala wrote...


However, what I'm saying is that Mages should have the ability to make decisions for themselves in the same way as the general populace do. If they decide to have children, they should be allowed to do so, and to keep those children. If they want to open up a tavern in Denerim, or tutor, or become a guardsman, they should be allowed to do that. They shouldn't have to give up their human rights at birth.


In theory, I agree with you. I'm sure in theory, all those peasants and slaves and servants, who are born into their role, and will die as peasants, simply because their parents were, would agree with you, and would like to have those freedoms you describe as well.
But that's not what this thread was about, since neither the real world, nor thedas, run on wishes and theories ;)

#97
Rifneno

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Anarcala wrote...

However, what I'm saying is that Mages should have the ability to make decisions for themselves in the same way as the general populace do. If they decide to have children, they should be allowed to do so, and to keep those children.


This is the biggest thing IMO.  I mean mages aren't allowed the most basic and best parts of life.  They can't have a family, they can't have children (at least, keep them), they can't even love one another.  If these things aren't worth fighting for... what the hell is?

#98
Anarcala

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Lithuasil wrote...

Anarcala wrote...


However, what I'm saying is that Mages should have the ability to make decisions for themselves in the same way as the general populace do. If they decide to have children, they should be allowed to do so, and to keep those children. If they want to open up a tavern in Denerim, or tutor, or become a guardsman, they should be allowed to do that. They shouldn't have to give up their human rights at birth.


In theory, I agree with you. I'm sure in theory, all those peasants and slaves and servants, who are born into their role, and will die as peasants, simply because their parents were, would agree with you, and would like to have those freedoms you describe as well.
But that's not what this thread was about, since neither the real world, nor thedas, run on wishes and theories ;)


Isn't that what the rebellion is about though?  Trying to change all that?  Hence why I'd sign right up :wizard:

#99
Lithuasil

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Rifneno wrote...

Anarcala wrote...

However, what I'm saying is that Mages should have the ability to make decisions for themselves in the same way as the general populace do. If they decide to have children, they should be allowed to do so, and to keep those children.


This is the biggest thing IMO.  I mean mages aren't allowed the most basic and best parts of life.  They can't have a family, they can't have children (at least, keep them), they can't even love one another.  If these things aren't worth fighting for... what the hell is?


Afaik, they can love each other, as long as no offspring comes from it.

#100
TobiTobsen

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Rifneno wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...

Anarcala wrote...

And that's the situation at hand - without some unforseeable events in a third game, the mages don't have a snowballs chance in hell, to win open war with the templars. At best, they don't all get killed, and some get recaptured, under much worse conditions. And inside the circles, if you keep your head down, life is much nicer, more stable, and even safer, then it is for 95% of thedas populace.


Are you kidding?  Every Mage has a whole wealth of abilities that could easily wipe out regiments with just minimal training.

My main point here is that freedom is precious, and it's a fallacy to say the Circle is secure.  The Rite of Annulment can be invoked for you even if you had nothing to do with the Mages that caused it.  Keeping your head down does little to keep you safe.  For the Mages to survive they need to support one another, not look out for their individual interests.


Uhm... not every mage is as powerfull as our main characters or First Entchanters. Most of the normal mages are probably considered skilled if they master 4 or 5 spells and know some others. There is a reason the mages in the Gallows go down as fast as they do, when the templars rush in. The templars are trained since they were kids to fight mages and drink lyrium to better resist magic.

The only time we hear about mages wiping out whole templar regiments it's either an Arcane Horror or an Abomination.


Not every mage is as powerful as a first enchanter...  but you don't seem to realize the reverse is also true.  Not every templar is as powerful as a knight commander.  A lot of them are, quite frankly, drug-addled retards.  They're resistant to magic, they're NOT immune to it.  The entire point of the ending is that the mages realize the templars aren't as invulnerable as they both think.

Actually, the mages can take away the templar's only advantage now that they're not confined to the Circle.  Ever read war strategy?  Cut off the enemy's supply line.  Head to Orzammar.  Try to secure their lyrium trade.  If Bhelen is king you can bet he's willing to align himself with whomever can benefit him the most.  If Harrowmont is king, who knows... but he's still no fan of the Chantry.  If the mages can cut off the templar's lyrium supply, they win.  It's just that simple.  Even if the Orzammar crown won't deal, there's only one way out of Orzammar and likely one road for quite a ways.  Ambush any caravans that are likely carrying lyrium.  Or even get a man on the inside and poison the lyrium.  That'd be hilarious.


Of course i realize that not every templar is a Knight Commander. But even a reguar templar is still a trained warrior. A mage that is not really talented is just a human/elf in a robe with a heavy staff vs. a trained warrior in plate or chainmail armor with a weapon and maybe a shield.

And you suggest to ambush dwarfs with magic? They are even more resitant to magic than you regular templar, just because mother nature said so. And I don't see a reason why exactly the king of Orzammar should deal with a small part of the whole human populace that are considered rebells by the rest. Even if they don't like the chantry they must know better than to ****** of the main religion of a huge part of Thedas that is known for his crusades against anybody that looks strange at it.

Mainly I just wanted to say that a mage cannot just wave with his hand and eradicate a bunch of templars. It's just not working that easy. They're not the invincible magickillers that the chantry wants them to be, but they are still a huge threat for any mage.