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[LPPrince]

The status quo is an interesting thing in Westeros.

[legion999]

TobiTobsen wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

It'll probably focus on the character everyone knew "Robb", and that he was a Stark, the family everyone knows.

Introducing too many secondary characters dilutes the show.

As long as I get my pies I wont complain

Seeing Wendel gave me hope we'll see White Harbour. I can't wait for the best house in the North to make an appearance.

[TobiTobsen]

legion999 wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

It'll probably focus on the character everyone knew "Robb", and that he was a Stark, the family everyone knows.

Introducing too many secondary characters dilutes the show.

As long as I get my pies I wont complain

*snip*

Seeing Wendel gave me hope we'll see White Harbour. I can't wait for the best house in the North to make an appearance.

I actually just had to google him in this episode. Didn't saw his merman pin! Nice!

Modifié par TobiTobsen, 04 juin 2013 - 05:30 .

[MisterJB]

So, who here has played "Ascent"?
Playing it now. Just swore my fealty to House Lannister, of course.

[Fireblader70]

LPPrince wrote...

simfamSP wrote...

Fireblader70 wrote...

What a great adaptation of the books! Horrific! Gory! Tragic!

With the unnecessary addition of the brutal stabbing of an unborn child, which wasn't even in the books at all. That's too much, I'm sorry. Has no relevance to the plot and is only there for the shock factor.

Meh. I found it quite fitting to the universe. Or didn't the Goldcloaks kill every bastard in KL?

Killing babies is okay, its the killing of an UNborn baby that has some people going, "naaah"

For me, it's just because it was only used as gratuitous violence (in the sense that it wasn't in the books, and they only introduced it for the shock factor).

[MisterJB]

As for its quality, it's nothing really special. Basically, you are a new lord elevated by Jon Arryn and must earn power through missions, upgrade your keep, etc. All of the missions are faily straigthfoward with options for solving them through intrigue, battle and trade. The problem is, you don't actually get to do the mission; you send a sworn sword who may or not suceed depending on his points in all three previously mentioned options.
On the other hand, it does offer you the freedom to swear fealty to any of the five kings each with different benefits; design your own sigil and your choices are; seemingly, at least; taken into account.
For instance, I ordered my daugther to study but she chose to go riding. She had an accident and, for punishment, I denied her medical attention. Consequently, the wound festered and I had to complete a timed mission to save her. Then, in the next mission, her wound was mentioned by a character.
I'm not certain if things would have gone differently had I chosen the option to have the Maester tend to her wounds but I assume so.

The whole thing follows the books storyline; altough quite loosely. I just sent a bard as a spy into King Robert's entourage and he found Jaime and Cersei out in the wood with Cersei arranging her dress. (Despite Jaime's POV specifically telling us the reason they did it in Winterfell was because they had no opportunity in the King's Road)

[Addai]

RainyDayLover wrote...

So... is anyone here still rooting for the Starks?

The wolves will come again.

Of course.  Don't let the preening of the Lannisters fool you.  You can accomplish a lot when you have zero human feeling, zero respect for the traditions that bind a people (it's probably not apparent to TV viewers, but the bread and salt at the beginning was supposed to be the end of any possibility of what ended up happening), no fear of gods or man, no regard even for your own offspring, nothing but blind greed for power.  The Starks fall because they continue to assume the snakes around them are actual human beings.

Though, I'm Team Daenerys ultimately.  She'll need help, though.  Beyond that, not going to say anymore, as this thread has become a spoiler bonanza.

[legion999]

TobiTobsen wrote...

legion999 wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...
As long as I get my pies I wont complain
*snip*

Seeing Wendel gave me hope we'll see White Harbour. I can't wait for the best house in the North to make an appearance.

I actually just had to google him in this episode. Didn't saw his merman pin! Nice!

I can't seem the show including that for no reason when other houses didn't appear. 

[VoiceOfPudding]

Why is everyone saying Rickon will be king? Did I miss something with Bran or what?

[billy the squid]

Addai67 wrote...

RainyDayLover wrote...

So... is anyone here still rooting for the Starks?

The wolves will come again.

Of course.  Don't let the preening of the Lannisters fool you.  You can accomplish a lot when you have zero human feeling, zero respect for the traditions that bind a people (it's probably not apparent to TV viewers, but the bread and salt at the beginning was supposed to be the end of any possibility of what ended up happening), no fear of gods or man, no regard even for your own offspring, nothing but blind greed for power.  The Starks fall because they continue to assume the snakes around them are actual human beings.

Though, I'm Team Daenerys ultimately.  She'll need help, though.  Beyond that, not going to say anymore, as this thread has become a spoiler bonanza.

Silence.

Tywin Lannister would rule the seven kingdoms by this point if Martin wasn't the author. 

Edit:

Oh yes, and take Casterly Rock!? What kind of stupid idea is that Robb? No wonder you walked straight into a trap and were outmaneuvered by Lord Tywin at every turn.

"I know, I'll take the largest and most heavily fortified fortress in Westeros, and besiege it against a numerically superior force, despite having no way of blockading it from the ocean and leave my rear exposed to Lannister and Tyrell forces a stone's throw away in Highgarden and Kingslanding"

A strategist that boy isn't.

Modifié par billy the squid, 04 juin 2013 - 07:30 .

[Mr.House]

Addai67 wrote...

RainyDayLover wrote...

So... is anyone here still rooting for the Starks?

The wolves will come again.

Of course.  Don't let the preening of the Lannisters fool you.  You can accomplish a lot when you have zero human feeling, zero respect for the traditions that bind a people (it's probably not apparent to TV viewers, but the bread and salt at the beginning was supposed to be the end of any possibility of what ended up happening), no fear of gods or man, no regard even for your own offspring, nothing but blind greed for power.  The Starks fall because they continue to assume the snakes around them are actual human beings.

Though, I'm Team Daenerys ultimately.  She'll need help, though.  Beyond that, not going to say anymore, as this thread has become a spoiler bonanza.

So Tywin has no feelings at all, eh?

[Addai]

billy the squid wrote...

Silence.

Tywin Lannister would rule the seven kingdoms by this point if Martin wasn't the author. 

There's no such thing as a sure thing.  Tywin's schemes are the kind of thing that tends to come around as it went around.

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

Am I the only one who thinks what happened to Robb was his own doing, had he kept his word, he would have went on to take Casterly Rock and eventually win the war, then he could have just divorced his wife and marry whoever he choose. We are told over and over again he is a clever strategist and yet he made a crucial mistake by not marrying the Frey.

Modifié par DinoSteve, 04 juin 2013 - 07:33 .

[LPPrince]

He was just a kid in his young teens in the book. Not like he was gonna make a smart choice.

But yes, what happened to Robb was the result of his not keeping his word. In war, you do what must be done to win. There are times when honor trumps what is more easily done, but Robb obviously couldn't tell what those times were.

He paid, dearly.

[billy the squid]

Addai67 wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

Silence.

Tywin Lannister would rule the seven kingdoms by this point if Martin wasn't the author. 

There's no such thing as a sure thing.  Tywin's schemes are the kind of thing that tends to come around as it went around.

I doubt it. He had to be stopped by Martin, or it would be a somewhat anti-climactic position in Westeros if Tywin Lannister retained control of the seven kingdoms. Between the wealth of Casterly Rock and Highgarden, bringing the Martells into an alliance aswell, he outnumbers and has outmaneuvered everyone else. 

For a man who ruled the seven kingdoms for 20 years, he's hardly one to be outmaneuvered politically or militarily for long.

Modifié par billy the squid, 04 juin 2013 - 07:41 .

[VoiceOfPudding]

DinoSteve wrote...

Am I the only one who thinks what happened to Robb was his own doing, had he kept his word, he would have went on to take Casterly Rock and eventually win the war, then he could have just divorced his wife and marry whoever he choose. We are told over and over again he is a clever strategist and yet he made a crucial mistake by not marrying the Frey.

Maybe losing the Freys was his own doing but the RW was all Lannister/Bolton/Frey. Guest right should have protected them from what happened. Also he would never have divorced his wife after he said the vows... the Starks are like that

[Mr.House]

Robb betrayed and pissed off the wrong man. Walder is a wretched man, but he's extremely powerful and he was betrayed, so he got his revenge while helping the Lannisters.

[Mr.House]

VoiceOfPudding wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

Am I the only one who thinks what happened to Robb was his own doing, had he kept his word, he would have went on to take Casterly Rock and eventually win the war, then he could have just divorced his wife and marry whoever he choose. We are told over and over again he is a clever strategist and yet he made a crucial mistake by not marrying the Frey.

Maybe losing the Freys was his own doing but the RW was all Lannister/Bolton/Frey. Guest right should have protected them from what happened. Also he would never have divorced his wife after he said the vows... the Starks are like that

And that why the Starks are in complete ruin.

[billy the squid]

DinoSteve wrote...

Am I the only one who thinks what happened to Robb was his own doing, had he kept his word, he would have went on to take Casterly Rock and eventually win the war, then he could have just divorced his wife and marry whoever he choose. We are told over and over again he is a clever strategist and yet he made a crucial mistake by not marrying the Frey.

Take Casterly Rock? Nah, it's never been taken. Robbs problem was tactically on the battle field he was a good leader. Strategically, in terms of the war he wasn't and came up against one of the worst people to be tested against. 

It's a real shame that the TV series doesn't delve into the details of the opening battles between Stark and Lannister forces. It paints Robb as able, in terms of commanding on the field. But, he's still so green compared to the likes of Tywin and Stannis he'd struggle to match them as generals. 

[billy the squid]

Mr.House wrote...

VoiceOfPudding wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

Am I the only one who thinks what happened to Robb was his own doing, had he kept his word, he would have went on to take Casterly Rock and eventually win the war, then he could have just divorced his wife and marry whoever he choose. We are told over and over again he is a clever strategist and yet he made a crucial mistake by not marrying the Frey.

Maybe losing the Freys was his own doing but the RW was all Lannister/Bolton/Frey. Guest right should have protected them from what happened. Also he would never have divorced his wife after he said the vows... the Starks are like that

And that why the Starks are in complete ruin.

I can't remember now, but was the Red Wedding Tywin's plan, it seems like it, or at least the betrayal. At least the betrayal and splitting Stark forces from the Boltons and Freys. They certainly wouldn't have made the move without Tywin Lannister's backing, and the understanding that they would be protected, at least the Freys from Riverland reprisals. While the Boltons would take control of the the North. 


Tywin himself says the blood is on Walder Frey's hands.

[CrazyRah]

DinoSteve wrote...

Am I the only one who thinks what happened to Robb was his own doing, had he kept his word, he would have went on to take Casterly Rock and eventually win the war, then he could have just divorced his wife and marry whoever he choose. We are told over and over again he is a clever strategist and yet he made a crucial mistake by not marrying the Frey.

Robb did a mistake when he followed his heart instead of his brain or the advivce from the people around him and that mistake really made things go downhill. That a man like Walder wouldn't just accept an apology and another marriage between two others and instead want revenge felt very likely. The consequences of his mistake were very severe and i can't blame him for not seeing the red wedding going the way it did. But if you play the Game of Thrones.. things don't always (ever) end well 

[Milan92]

All this talk actually made me think of the important question. Did Blackfish managed to take his ******?

[Addai]

billy the squid wrote...
I doubt it. He had to be stopped by Martin, or it would be a somewhat anti-climactic position in Westeros if Tywin Lannister retained control of the seven kingdoms. Between the wealth of Casterly Rock and Highgarden, bringing the Martells into an alliance aswell, he outnumbers and has outmaneuvered everyone else. 

For a man who ruled the seven kingdoms for 20 years, he's hardly one to be outmaneuvered politically or militarily for long.

I think Tywin himself would say you're wrong and point to the Targaryens as proof.  They had withstood greater rebellions than Robert's.

So Tywin has no feelings at all, eh?

He seems to have been fond of Joanna, but that could be narcissism as much as anything, she being his cousin.

As for Walder Frey, there seems to be too much regard for him, too.  Why do you think he has so many problems getting respect from Northerners?  Because of stunts like that.  He'll never have the position he wants because he thinks only of himself, and the lower parts of himself at that.  You can't just always take what you want, have fluid loyalties and never have it come back on you.  It can work for a while, but there's a good chance there will be a reckoning.

Modifié par Addai67, 04 juin 2013 - 08:07 .

[LPPrince]

Milan92 wrote...

All this talk actually made me think of the important question. Did Blackfish managed to take his ******?

Yeah, he's fine.