chunkyman wrote...
Hehehe, made me laugh.
Hehe made me laugh too!
That sausage actually looked yummy and I wanted to take a bite out of it.
HBO's Game of Thrones
Débuté par
horacethegrey
, avril 05 2011 04:55
#5501
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Posté 11 juin 2013 - 04:21
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Hehe made me laugh too!
That sausage actually looked yummy and I wanted to take a bite out of it.
Retour en haut
#5502
Posté 11 juin 2013 - 01:10
Nerevar-as
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PB06 wrote...
Addai67 wrote...
Yes, I know this, and the kid would be legit if Aerys the Mad King's son claimed it and Lyanna told the truth about leaving with Rhaegar.
No the kid wouldn't be legit. Unless Rhaegar divorced Elia, and Lyanna broke up with Robert and they two marry, the kid would be a Bastard. Westeros had learned their lesson in the Blackfyre uprising.
Targaryens don´t mind poligamy, incest, or both at the same time. So the kid could be legit if s/he survived childbird (it´s clear Lyanna died of childbird). Lyanna didn´t care for Robert, she knew she would be known as the biggest horns in all Westeros.
If Aerys hadn´t decided to kill her father and brother, it´s possible things wouldn´t have gone so far. And Rhaegar was planning to depose his father after the war, so even he had had enough.
#5503
Posté 11 juin 2013 - 07:10
The Hierophant
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PB06 wrote...
The Hierophant wrote...
True about LF being the catalyst for the WotFK, but i think Varys actually benefits more from the conflict as a destabilized Westeros is vunerable to conquest by Aegon or Daenerys. With Tywin, and Kevan out of the way Varys is free to concentrate all his efforts on destabilizing any house he believes is a threat to Aegon's or Dany's future rule.
With Tywin gone it's anyone's game between Varys and Baelish, but i have a suspicion about Baelish's interactions with Sansa as it opens up the potential for her to backstab him for x15 critical damage.:innocent:
If you remember in GoT, Varys and Lord Cheesemonger were arguing "The Realm is not ready for that." Cheesemonger and Varys didn't want the WotFK to happen that fast, but LF was able to make that happen anyway. :innocent:
VS
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You never know with Martin, Sansa might have interesting character development considering who she's with.I really don't care what LF did to the Starks, For me the Starks are so boring and "honorable", so cliche, doesn't matter how they turn out. Sansa is the prime example anyway.
Modifié par The Hierophant, 13 juin 2013 - 05:04 .
#5504
Posté 12 juin 2013 - 08:52
chcknwng
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I think all the Stark kids would evolve into something very interesting. Still, being a badass assassin is probably the best.
I guess it doesn't help that I liked Aidan, all the way back in The Wire.
I guess it doesn't help that I liked Aidan, all the way back in The Wire.
Modifié par wngmv, 12 juin 2013 - 08:55 .
#5505
Posté 13 juin 2013 - 05:58
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Sansa strikes me as the typical ****** in distress. She twice has the opportunity to get away from Joffrey and she refuses.
Modifié par Ravensword, 13 juin 2013 - 05:58 .
#5506
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Posté 13 juin 2013 - 08:39
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Ravensword wrote...
Sansa strikes me as the typical ****** in distress. She twice has the opportunity to get away from Joffrey and she refuses.
Because she's freaking terrified? Because every time something 'good' comes up another thing comes crashing down? Because she's a child?
Have some empathy, man! All these characters are flawed, even our good ol' pragmatic Tywin. They all can't be as brave as Ned or as cunning as Varys, or else, these people wouldn't feel like real characters; just another one of the Noldor lords from the Silmarillion.
#5507
Posté 13 juin 2013 - 02:14
chcknwng
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simfamSP wrote...
Ravensword wrote...
Sansa strikes me as the typical ****** in distress. She twice has the opportunity to get away from Joffrey and she refuses.
Because she's freaking terrified? Because every time something 'good' comes up another thing comes crashing down? Because she's a child?
Have some empathy, man! All these characters are flawed, even our good ol' pragmatic Tywin. They all can't be as brave as Ned or as cunning as Varys, or else, these people wouldn't feel like real characters; just another one of the Noldor lords from the Silmarillion.
She's no longer a child in Westeros.
Because Ned and Cat didn't do a good job educationg her. Her whole illusion of the brave knight, shining knight that is Joffery, even when he behaved so cruely.
I agree with you that they are all flawed in a good way. So I can pick which flaw I can tolerate and which I can't. Sansa's flaw is not something I can tolerate.
#5508
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Posté 13 juin 2013 - 03:00
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She's no longer a child in Westeros.
18 is what you would consider an "adult" in Europe. I think using societal standards is foolish, especially in regards to maturity. Too many of these "adults" are still children. It's not as if the years go by and people are hit with an epiphany, and understand the world around them. There are many variables surrounding maturity, and sadly, Sansa is child at heart.
Because Ned and Cat didn't do a good job educationg her.
I disagree. I feel that this goes beyond parental influence. It is in her nature to be innocent, as it is in Arya's nature to be the black sheep of the family. Of course, there is a distinct dichotomy between the education of lords and ladies, but it was Sansa's choice to embrace the tales as reality.
So I can pick which flaw I can tolerate and which I can't. Sansa's flaw is not something I can tolerate.
Fair enough. But I can see Sansa becoming one of the hardest POV's in Westeros after all she has endured. But her development can go one way or another.
#5509
Posté 13 juin 2013 - 04:00
chcknwng
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18 is what you would consider an "adult" in Europe. I think using societal standards is foolish, especially in regards to maturity. Too many of these "adults" are still children. It's not as if the years go by and people are hit with an epiphany, and understand the world around them. There are many variables surrounding maturity, and sadly, Sansa is child at heart.
I think Westeros is a much more harsh world than modern Europe, and therefore when you are legally an adult you need to shoulder your responsibility. So much so that they would be much more mature when they enter their adulthood.
But still, even for an adolescent she was extremely naive. It wasn't wrong for Sansa to fall for the fairy tales and such, but totally buying the whole thing at her age is like a 14-year-old still believing in Santa Claus. She should have more common sense than the way she had behaved in GoT (the book).
In contrast, see how Manderly's grand daughters behaved.
I disagree. I feel that this goes beyond parental influence. It is in her nature to be innocent, as it is in Arya's nature to be the black sheep of the family. Of course, there is a distinct dichotomy between the education of lords and ladies, but it was Sansa's choice to embrace the tales as reality.
I wasn't clear about this. I don't think Ned and Cat were bad parents per se. But they should have busted the bubble much early.
Education for the lords and ladies are surely very different, but both encompass the harsh reality of how to rule. Sansa was so obviously lacking in this aspect.
I remember in both Cat and Ned's chapters they both regretted that Sansa was so naive. Maybe they had felt there was still time for Sansa to grow up, but alas, that wasn't the case. Arya, on the other hand, got lucky because her personality allowed her to thrive under those situations.
Fair enough. But I can see Sansa becoming one of the hardest POV's in Westeros after all she has endured. But her development can go one way or another.
I certainly wish she retains even a portion of her sweetness. Her fondness of Lemon cakes is touching. I'd hate to see her becoming another Lysa, bitter, scheming and an utter failure.
Seeing how fast she's growing up in the Red Castle and in the East is amazing. She is smart, but still new to the game of thrones. LF is too put too much trust in her to be betrayed for sure.
We never get to see how she handled the fact that her going to Cersei directly led to the demise of Ned, and her sister being lost and she being held a hostage.I would think by this point she understood what she had done, but it's weird she had never thought about it.
Spoilers:
Speaking of Lysa, am I the only one suspecting Robert Arryn is actually Robert Baelish? It's been mentioned again and again that Jon Arryn married two times without being able to produce a viable offspring.
#5510
Posté 13 juin 2013 - 04:42
The Hierophant
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I wouldn't be surprised if Robert is Baelish's son.
#5511
Posté 13 juin 2013 - 05:58
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Was going to say something, but didn't read very thoroughly. Nevermind.
Modifié par happy_daiz, 13 juin 2013 - 06:01 .
#5512
Posté 13 juin 2013 - 09:37
Ravensword
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simfamSP wrote...
Ravensword wrote...
Sansa strikes me as the typical ****** in distress. She twice has the opportunity to get away from Joffrey and she refuses.
Because she's freaking terrified? Because every time something 'good' comes up another thing comes crashing down? Because she's a child?
Have some empathy, man! All these characters are flawed, even our good ol' pragmatic Tywin. They all can't be as brave as Ned or as cunning as Varys, or else, these people wouldn't feel like real characters; just another one of the Noldor lords from the Silmarillion.
Doesn't matter whether she is a child or not. She's failed to make decisions to ameliorate her position. Sansa is the kind of person who wouldn't fight off a rapist.
Sansa's flaw is annoying. All this crap happens to her and she does nothing to help herself. Her younger sister chose to leave King's Landing at great peril, and she chose to stay. Perhaps trekking out into the field would resul in a few broken nails?
However, you are correct in that Sansa truly is not her father's daughter. Nor is she her mother's daughter as Catelyn was shown to be assertive.
Modifié par Ravensword, 13 juin 2013 - 09:39 .
#5513
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Posté 13 juin 2013 - 10:16
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I think Westeros is a much more harsh world than modern Europe, and therefore when you are legally an adult you need to shoulder your responsibility. So much so that they would be much more mature when they enter their adulthood.
She's a Lady of Winterfell, her life was about as harsh as feathered pillow.
But still, even for an adolescent she was extremely naive. It wasn't wrong for Sansa to fall for the fairy tales and such, but totally buying the whole thing at her age is like a 14-year-old still believing in Santa Claus. She should have more common sense than the way she had behaved in GoT (the book).
I guess that by common sense, you mean her unknowing "betrayal" of her father? I'm sorry, but logic and thorough analysis of political conundrums does not apply to fourteen year olds. Hell, I'm sure around 80% of GOT's viewer base would have done the same. Would I call them idiots? Perhaps at first, yes. But it requires a little verstehen as its very easy to be the pragmatic whilst your world is in balance, and the character's is falling apart.
She was practically brainwashed the Lannisters, because (once again) her nature is passive, submissive, almost the *ideal* lady by Westeros standards. Hell, if Joffrey wasn't such a sociopath I'm sure Sansa would have grown to love his pretence again.
Is it stupid? Yes! Is it illogical? Yes! Is it everything absolutely moronic? Yes! But I cannot help but feel pity for her. Why? Because she is a child in every sense of the word. And has been manipulated, fooled, used and tormented over and over again. I'm glad she is learning her lessons of life, though.
In contrast, see how Manderly's grand daughters behaved.
If you mean in White harbour when Davos was at court? I'd say it was naive also. Calling out against the Freys within their *very* presence was foolish, it could have led to suspicion, hell, knowing what the Freys are like, they could have killed her for it. Rebellion shows she is willing to fight and has a deeper understanding of the injustices of life, but it doesn't mean squat when you're dumb about it.
Unless it's another grandaughter. I'm in no mind right now to remember the scene by heart. However, I'd like to emphasise that the above is a mimic of what you're saying about Sansa. Personally, I understand and admire her bravery.
I wasn't clear about this. I don't think Ned and Cat were bad parents per se. But they should have busted the bubble much early.
Education for the lords and ladies are surely very different, but both encompass the harsh reality of how to rule. Sansa was so obviously lacking in this aspect.
I remember in both Cat and Ned's chapters they both regretted that Sansa was so naive. Maybe they had felt there was still time for Sansa to grow up, but alas, that wasn't the case. Arya, on the other hand, got lucky because her personality allowed her to thrive under those situations.
It seems the Starks agree with me... now I'm worried xD
I would be pulling a ****-covered-stick out of my ass if I were to say the number of children was a deciding factor. It was obviously *not* due to a lack of attention. Moreover, the Starks could have prepared Sansa for court life. A mistake on their part, but I understand them as well.
Perhaps I'm too lenient on these characters and their flaws.
I certainly wish she retains even a portion of her sweetness. Her fondness of Lemon cakes is touching. I'd hate to see her becoming another Lysa, bitter, scheming and an utter failure.
Thus: "one way or another." I'm hoping she will take lessons for all around her, becoming capable and strong. She is a Stark though, and has proved it in the past with acts of defiance.
Sansa is the kind of person who wouldn't fight off a rapist.
No, but she can sing them a lullaby, make them cry and gain them some moral sense ;-)
Doesn't matter whether she is a child or not. She's failed to make decisions to ameliorate her position.
True, but that is *not* Sansa. I am pleading for empathy, an understanding that Sansa is the closest thing to a modern child there is in Westeros. All sociological factors are (or were) denied when it came to Sansa in the first books, she is literally someone who was kidnapped from our world, was told she would become queen and plopped into Westeros. This is how I see her, and this is how I pity her.
Yet. I also admire her.
As wngmv said: she could have ended up like Lysa. Bitter and vile. But she retains her innocence while continuing on. She has shown she can be defiant, brave and head-strong, yet, all in her own way. She isn't Arya, or Robb, or Cat. She is still Sansa, but now armoured with the lessons these past months have taught her.
#5514
Posté 13 juin 2013 - 11:17
Addai
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A war during which another Targaryen bastard, Brynden Rivers, distinguished himself and went on to be Hand of the King.PB06 wrote...
Addai67 wrote...
Yes, I know this, and the kid would be legit if Aerys the Mad King's son claimed it and Lyanna told the truth about leaving with Rhaegar.
No the kid wouldn't be legit. Unless Rhaegar divorced Elia, and Lyanna broke up with Robert and they two marry, the kid would be a Bastard. Westeros had learned their lesson in the Blackfyre uprising.
It's likely that Rhaegar's whole purpose, other than an infatuation with Lyanna, was to father another child because he needed three for the prophecy.
Lyanna wasn't going to marry Robert, that was her whole purpose.
#5515
Posté 14 juin 2013 - 03:28
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So, apparently its been confirmed that GRRM is writing Episode 2 of Season 4.
I think its safe to assume we know when The Purple Wedding is taking place.
I think its safe to assume we know when The Purple Wedding is taking place.
#5516
Posté 14 juin 2013 - 06:26
TobiTobsen
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Dobbysaurus wrote...
chunkyman wrote...
Hehehe, made me laugh.
Hehe made me laugh too!
Hehe... it looks like Ramsay and Stannis would make good mutilation buddies!
Modifié par TobiTobsen, 14 juin 2013 - 06:36 .
#5517
Posté 14 juin 2013 - 06:53
Inquisitor Recon
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TobiTobsen wrote...
Hehe... it looks like Ramsay and Stannis would make good mutilation buddies!
Ramsay is probably a really cool guy to hang out with unless he's torturing you. Good sense of humor.
#5518
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Posté 14 juin 2013 - 07:51
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Inquisitor Recon wrote...
TobiTobsen wrote...
Hehe... it looks like Ramsay and Stannis would make good mutilation buddies!
Ramsay is probably a really cool guy to hang out with unless he's torturing you. Good sense of humor.
Problem is, you can't ****** him off
#5519
Posté 14 juin 2013 - 07:58
Grand Admiral Cheesecake
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Oh my god Stannis and Ramsay get a sitcom involving comedic mutilation.
It's on right after Roose and Walder's Super Ethical wedding murder extravaganza.
It's on right after Roose and Walder's Super Ethical wedding murder extravaganza.
#5521
Posté 20 juin 2013 - 05:50
LTD
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Amount of wrong within this video, is highly commendable.
#5522
Posté 20 juin 2013 - 06:25
LTD
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Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...
Oh my god Stannis and Ramsay get a sitcom involving comedic mutilation.
It's on right after Roose and Walder's Super Ethical wedding murder extravaganza.
I see reality TV come alive with Ramsay tbh. Fear Factory, Cook-For-Me..much potential. Assuming he somehow survives alive through the winter.
#5524
Posté 29 juin 2013 - 12:27
TheRealJayDee
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#5525
Posté 29 juin 2013 - 12:33
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Pedro Pascal vs Conan Stevens plox
