11084 réponses à ce sujet

[LPPrince]

I didn't see her bones anywhere.

 

And she was there with him when they got locked up.

 

So how could he eat her before???????

 

*giggles*

[AlanC9]

I guess my question is... what are all these freed slaves DOING right now? I mean... who is feeding them? What are they doing for shelter? Money? Freedom is great, but if you don't have a job, then you really just have a city with an 80% unemployment rate.

 

Well, presumably most of the slaves were doing useful work before. The field slaves are no doubt still farming, etc. It's the house slaves that will have a problem, since their jobs have gone away. At least, until some sort of class structure emerges.

[Lorien19]

Pretty sure he did that before they were locked up

ROFL!

[Fast Jimmy]

Well, presumably most of the slaves were doing useful work before. The field slaves are no doubt still farming, etc. It's the house slaves that will have a problem, since their jobs have gone away. At least, until some sort of class structure emerges.

Yeah, but if the slaves are still farming, what do they do with the food? Take it to the market and sell it? What about ransportstion? How are the sales divided up? Who handles the numbers when the vast majority of your population is illiterate?


These are the kinds of things society rarely has to worry about because there is usually not a drastic change from a free labor market into one that is a sustainable meritocracy, particularly if there is no centralized program to attempt to normalize the slaves into the general population (which is especial tricky if the slaves outnumber the free men in a huge ratio, like we see in this case).

[Pateu]

He does.

 

In the books he has to drink an anesthesic very often because he gets a lot of headaches.

 

Let me fix that.

 

It isn't an anesthesic.

 

It's pretty much opium, which contains 12% morphine.

 

So yeah The Mountain has massive headaches that require he stays drugged.

[Pateu]

 

4:50

 

If you look closely, when Oberyn falls down, he goes on top of The Mountain without being pulled. HE could've rolled the other way, as Gregor was crippled.

 

Choreography error?

[Fast Jimmy]

Let me fix that.
 
It isn't an anesthesic.
 
It's pretty much opium, which contains 12% morphine.
 
So yeah The Mountain has massive headaches that require he stays drugged.

That is interesting. So he likely has some type of thyroid or other brain defect that explains his mammoth size and insane violence? That almost makes me feel sorry for the guy. He's like a rabid dog that people have been using as a weapon all these years.

[Inquisitor Recon]

I have a friend who`s the same i don`t know if the TV show has shown just how much pain theon has been through .

Surely I can't be the only one on these boards who takes some sort of sick satisfaction from seeing Theon as Ramsay's best friend forever Reek. It's poetic or something.
 

And Ramsay is the perfect troll. Can you imagine what he could do if given access to the internet?

[MisterJB]

Damn, right at the end, the show managed to make Gregor into the terrifying monster he is supposed to be.

That was brutal.

[MisterJB]

 

4:50

 

If you look closely, when Oberyn falls down, he goes on top of The Mountain without being pulled. HE could've rolled the other way, as Gregor was crippled.

 

Choreography error?

Gregor was holding him by his throat, it's just not as visible in the first seconds.

[LPPrince]

Its okay everyone, everybody's okay

 

[Pateu]

That is interesting. So he likely has some type of thyroid or other brain defect that explains his mammoth size and insane violence? That almost makes me feel sorry for the guy. He's like a rabid dog that people have been using as a weapon all these years.

 

STH defect.

 

It's what causes gigantism, though it normally doesn't affect the brain.

 

I guess it's a mix of both.

 

He's like a rabid dog that people have been using as a weapon all these years.

 

Precisely. Guy's fucked in the head.

[WildOrchid]

Poor Oberyn. Blinded by vengeance... Just one hit to the Mountain's head and he could've been done with it.

[MisterJB]

Blinded by vengeance

[Dutchess]

 

What was the beetle talk really about? It seemed pretty irrelevant.

 

 

It was a metaphor for a lot of the characters in the show, who have to crush the people beneath them (beetles) to feel powerful. Tyrion's always been a beetle. It's meant to illustrate how pointless all of the conflicts that are going on in Westeros really are; the poor beetles basically die for nothing.

 

I can appreciate the symbolism, but I felt the conversation went on for way too long. It could have made the point while being a lot shorter.

[Loup Blanc]

Wieners, wieners everywhere.

 

But don<t worry... dragons are coming.

 

And they have big fat scaly wieners.

[Milan92]

 

George sure knows when to be poetic

[Il Divo]

You know what I missed during the Viper vs Mountain fight? No mention of poison. Like, no hint or anything

 

Sure, we saw his squire "clean" his spears, but viewers that haven't read the book probably won't see that.

 

Agreed. I think they did a good job of giving Oberyn increased screen time, but they didn't quite make the same big deal of his reputation as is done in the books.

 

When Tyrion first finds out that Oberyn (instead of his older brother) is coming to King's Landing, he actually begins to freak out because of the Red Viper's legendary battle skills. I always liked that story of how he actually got the title the Red Viper.

[Fast Jimmy]

It was a metaphor for a lot of the characters in the show, who have to crush the people beneath them (beetles) to feel powerful. Tyrion's always been a beetle. It's meant to illustrate how pointless all of the conflicts that are going on in Westeros really are; the poor beetles basically die for nothing.
 
I can appreciate the symbolism, but I felt the conversation went on for way too long. It could have made the point while being a lot shorter.

I felt if the discussion had a better punch line, so to speak, it would have been a good story. As was, it was a five minute long rant that killing beetles without purpose (and, therefore, killing all life indiscriminately without purpose) was something neither Jaime nor Tyrion understood. Which is fine, but ultimately I think it was a desire to use the line "Far too much has been written about great men, and not nearly enough about morons."

[TheChris92]

See if I can come up with my own analysis for the episode I finished watching.

 

I always find discussions like the one between Tyrion & Jaime to be among the most interesting in television dramas or cinema, as they are usually meant to reflect on something deeper. Every detail, every camera panning, every sound effect, it all serves some purpose and isn't put in there unintentionally. As the brothers would regale memories of their cousin, as he'd viciously beat poor Paul, George, John & Ringo to death, I find myself suddenly thinking about the shows premise, partially sparked by Jaime's comment on Why is it important, when human beings die every day? Every war, every conflict, Tyrion would study them, but everytime he'd only hear Orson smashing little John, George, Paul & Ringo. So why is it important? They are just beetles after all. Why worry about them? They are just insects and could not possibly compare to human lives. I think the symbolism speaks for itself there and pads way for the larger perspecttive. Well, whether it be Orson; Joffrey, Tywin,The Mad King or someone else -- there'll always be someone in inexplicably lofty position of power who'd tremble and end lives by the thousands to get what he want, personal gains like simple-minded satisfaction, more power etc. 

 

It's an internal discussion on what this show is about as a whole -- It's about a bunch of twats/human beings, fighting over an extremely uncomfortable looking chair. Although, I'd go for a Wegner chair if we are talking about fancy looking chairs while still being comfortable,.. but anyway, they'll end as many human lives as possible in order to get it. In the short amount of time when they are not fighting they are spending a few minutes on a quick nobbin'.. You know, just like the rest of us.

Tyrion's tale would also reflect how his outlook on the world has been shaped from all the betrayals and discrimination he's had to put up with. It's how one can imagine it usually would look for one, who has to face his own mortality. Like most of us, Tyrion has no answer as to why Orson did what he did, why Joffrey was the way he was, or generally why the lords of the Seven Kingdoms bicker over a ridiculous looking chair, when everything around them is burning down. Regardless, it hangs with Tyrion still and what he likely cannot express in words, is the thought that human beings solely exist to kill other humans. We have the advantage of making choices, to love and to create art, but ultimately we use the gift of our intelligence to inhumanely murder other humans through various means, and eventually smother ourselves. At the core we are still animals. Take away those higher functions of brain capacity, and we are still primals. Flaunting our superiority over those beneath us -- Take away even more and we are still animals. And like animals we need to drink, to eat, we need shelter, and we need to pass on our genes to the next generation.

Death isn't just a godsend that ultimately brings us all to the same end -- or something we willingly bring to others. Death is what it is for all animals -- It's who we are.

 

In retrospect, GoT is also about diaspora -- A sort of butterfly effect, where every decision is like a gust in the wind, which eventually evolves to a hurricane. It spirals out of control, as it consumes kings, peasants alike in its wake, and the way that characters scatter to the winds in the midst of these moments. The seeds of what's happened in the show so far could just as well have been when Catelyn took Tyrion hostage, or when Jaime pushed Bran out of that window, or when men gathered to overthrow a mad king. If you go back a few pages, you can find plenty of sources for conflict, for chaos. I'd say that narratives, which involve 'cause and effect' doesn't always sit right with me, but I think George R.R. Martin’s version of this kind of story is particularly powerful. I think he understands that the hardest thing to do in life is to resist becoming an effect of a cause. Like when Arya condemns a group of people who've wronged her to death in the fire.

A seemingly harmless gesture, but nothing is as powerful when you feel like you're being tugged along by those primal, animal forces, the need to avenge a death or protect what you treasure most.

 

The Mountain and The Viper got me thinking a lot -- As is evident above, it wasn't the brutal fight between the man who was wronged against the burly white dude, as much as it was Tyrion's reflection on the world of Westeros. It's the kind of episode that reminds me why I like the books so much and sort of enjoy the show despite its flaws. The symbolism reminds me why I like The Sopranos, The Wire or Breaking Bad, shows that are willing to compromise a bit, to show humanity even amidst the supposed "scum of society". To show that any human is equally capable of good as they are evil.

Lastly, there's obviously the fight itself. I think there's one thing I'd want to mention regarding it. It's how relates to what I've been talking about earlier. I think anybody who's seen the show or read the books will get the general idea its "modus operandi" at this point.

Revenge is cool, for a short amount of time anyway. We wanted to see Robb Stark or Arya avenge the late Sean Bean, but it turned out as you'd expect -- We wanted to see Joffrey die, we want to see the Lannisters pay for lots of things. In the long run it becomes all-emcompassing.

Oberyn's thirst for justice, while seemingly commendable from our point of view, it had been growing for decades, and his desire to have it quenched would end up be his undoing. 

Had he finished him off he'd have got what he wanted and Tyrion would have been a happy camper by now. Ultimately, this is not how the animal brain works though: Once they have you in their clutches, then you're powerless to stop yourself from progressing the stoy, where you'd think you're in the center of it all.

 

I'll conclude with my satisfaction for this episode. I'm pleasantly looking forward to what else is to come next and wonder how the show will work around certain upcoming events.

[Khayness]

Gotta love all the friends whining about quitting the show because the recent outcome of a cool character. But somehow it's not that funny anymore, like after the Red Wedding.

 

Can't wait for all the edgy coolkids losing their **** when they find out where do whores go.

 

Wonder when will raging about GoT deaths stops being a thing on the internet.

[Pateu]

Gotta love all the friends whining about quitting the show because the recent outcome of a cool character. But somehow it's not that funny anymore, like after the Red Wedding.

 

Can't wait for all the edgy coolkids losing their **** when they find out where do whores go.

 

Wonder when will raging about GoT deaths stops being a thing on the internet.

 

You should spoil them all deaths that follow.

 

I hate whiners.

[Khayness]

You should spoil them all deaths that follow.

 

I hate whiners.

 

Nah, I won't do that. Atleast I got one of them to start reading the books because he hates how cryptic I am about character fates.

[WildOrchid]

It was a metaphor for a lot of the characters in the show, who have to crush the people beneath them (beetles) to feel powerful. Tyrion's always been a beetle. It's meant to illustrate how pointless all of the conflicts that are going on in Westeros really are; the poor beetles basically die for nothing.

 

I can appreciate the symbolism, but I felt the conversation went on for way too long. It could have made the point while being a lot shorter.

 

And here in this scene I was scratching my head, trying to figure out the beetle thing. Thanks for the explaining.

[Nole]

My reacction to the fight