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[xPez]

Why don't the GoT writers follow the books? I mean, i've read a post about how the show isn't like the books anymore and it gets worse, ep by ep.....

 

I'n not sure if it's accurate and how % close to books the show is but if that's the case, it's a little shame. :/

 

 

 

Poor Sansa. I really hope she kills that fucker Bolton oh my god.

 

There are some changes that have to be made in anything like this, and there is a lot that has been cut that I wish was in the show, but I understand that they can't have everything in it because it would get too long, too costly and would be hard for non-book viewers to keep track of everything and everyone.

 

That being said, there are changes they've made that they didn't have to make, like the whole Tyrion and Jamie scene at the end of season 4 is completely different from the book, and is really crappy in comparison.

 

The main thing I worry about is that D&D are changing it because they think their version is better.

[Rawgrim]

I don't mind changes at all. There were bound to be plenty given that TV is a different medium than the books.

 

What I do mind, however, are all the dead ends. They spend time in one season building up to this and that, and then just abandon the whole thing later. The Lady Stoneheart build up, for example, took about 1 hour of screentime in season 3. The Tycha bit was firmly set up in season 1, and then just abandoned. And what has happened to Balon Greyjoy? They tossed that leech into the fires ages ago, and spoke his name.

[HoonDing]

The Sand Snakes are hilariously bad.

[God]

I think some review that I read said it best about the series at this point:

 

This season just doesn't feel like its going anywhere. And it lacks a lot of the subtlety and nuance of playing things out. Things are happening now for the sake of it. It's the middle of the road slush. It's not bad, but it's not good in terms of what we'd expect. Which is understandable, considering the two books Season 5 is based off of. 

 

But it's taking time to get to where they want to go, and I think that we're at a point where we all want something to happen. And it looks like that's not coming anytime soon.

[Sir Edric]

I think some review that I read said it best about the series at this point:

 

This season just doesn't feel like its going anywhere. And it lacks a lot of the subtlety and nuance of playing things out. Things are happening now for the sake of it. It's the middle of the road slush. It's not bad, but it's not good in terms of what we'd expect. Which is understandable, considering the two books Season 5 is based off of. 

 

But it's taking time to get to where they want to go, and I think that we're at a point where we all want something to happen. And it looks like that's not coming anytime soon.

 

Pretty much how I feel. I appreciate certain aspects, and just annoyed with others. It is interesting to see how critics praise each season as getting better and better, but personally I feel they have gotten worse and worse.

 

Maybe it is bias since I have read the books, but I can't see why GoT would be getting any better.

[XMissWooX]

I'm not really getting the big issue with the Winterfell story arc.

Firstly, Sansa was raped, not killed. Her story arc is not over yet.

Secondly, this is Game of Thrones... A show where characters are raped, murdered, mutilated and tortured on an all-too-regular basis. Barely a chapter/episode goes by without someone getting flayed alive, having body parts cut off, being disembowelled by rats or ripped apart by dogs, getting burned alive, getting crucified, killing babies, and much, much more.

If people are only now getting distressed by the show, then they can't have been paying very close attention to it.

[God]

I think I may have said, but my issue with the series and its violence and gore isn't that it does these things.

 

The thing that made it work was how it used them to tell a story. Now its using them for their own sake. It just becomes a boobfest with decapitated heads, charred infant bodies, and flayed skins. 

 

Take Sansa's rape for example. I'm not saying it was a bad thing, but it was done for the wrong reasons, and at this point, it's just regressive for Sansa's character. Gone is her End of Season 4 walk down the stairs of the Eyrie in all black. Back to the Season 1 and 2 victim who is a pawn of sadistic psychos. 

[wicked cool]

What choice did she have. If anything she learned from her dads mistake. The character development was how she handled the girlfriend and most likely we see her take bigger steps soon

[Fast Jimmy]

I think I may have said, but my issue with the series and its violence and gore isn't that it does these things.

The thing that made it work was how it used them to tell a story. Now its using them for their own sake. It just becomes a boobfest with decapitated heads, charred infant bodies, and flayed skins.

Take Sansa's rape for example. I'm not saying it was a bad thing, but it was done for the wrong reasons, and at this point, it's just regressive for Sansa's character. Gone is her End of Season 4 walk down the stairs of the Eyrie in all black. Back to the Season 1 and 2 victim who is a pawn of sadistic psychos.

See, I have a different perspective on it. To me, it felt like Sansa was beginning to feel at ease, returning to her home, being welcomed back (even secretly) by fellow Northerners, gaining confidence to stand up to those who would threaten her. Heck, she may have even been under the slight impression that Ramsay wasn't a horrible monster like his father and that marrying him might not have been a nightmare.

That illusion is gone. Sansa was shown in that final instant how she is still trapped and that no one is going to save her to some paradise of safety... or even normalcy.


Which is, yes, depowering. But I think the way the writers are going to go with it is to make Sansa come back and realize that while she has started to play The Game, she needs to start calling her own plays, not just be a more effective pawn of others.

Despite Sansa's rough road where she has become more hardened and experienced, she still has been rescued at every turn of trouble. I think now that she has encountered her first true instance of harm to herself, true harm, she will use it as the catalyst to become her own protection.



But maybe not. Just my two cents.

[Bad King]

Overall, I found episode 6 to be pretty poor for a few reasons:

1). I find Arya's story extremely dull, uninteresting and in some ways inconsistent. Get on with it!

 

2). The Jaime & Bronn vs the Sand Snakes scene was crude, comical and not very believable. It was daft that they all so easily infiltrated the Royal Palace in the first place (unless it was a deliberate ploy by Doran to lure in and trap the plotters?). Also, the fight was poorly choreographed and didn't make much sense: Obara should have easily defeated Jaime and Bronn should have easily defeated Tyene. I'm just hoping that we'll get a lot more Doran in the next few episodes as he's barely been developed so far even after 6 episodes.

 

3). The Faith Militant and Cersei are really getting on my nerves, as is the incompetence of the Tyrells in responding to this threat. When you control the most powerful region of Westeros and your heir is imprisoned by a gang of poorly organised fanatics, are you really going to play along? Why don't they deal with the fanatics with their armed guards/retinues/soldiers? I also found it hard to believe that one squire's testimony was enough to get two nobles imprisoned, and I'd expect the Tyrells to have their own guard to protect them from the fanatics.

 

4). I generally had no problem with the Jorah/Tyrion scene, but it didn't seem believable to me that Tyrion would know about the circumstances of Jeor Mormont's death. The Night's Watch only found out halfway through season 4 when Grenn and Edd returned with the bad news, and seeing as Tyrion was in a cell throughout that season, it seems dubious to me that he'd learn all this.

 

Regarding Sansa's rape, I don't have a problem with it: it was a highly disturbing scene and makes sense to the plot as a means of shattering Sansa's illusion that she's in control of her situation (and thus desperately needs to escape Winterfell) and as a means of pushing Theon further and further towards turning against Ramsay. Sansa's biggest mistake this season has been in allowing herself to be manipulated by LF, and after this ordeal, I can see her character developing a greater level of independence and distrust towards others.

 

For me, the best plot line hands down has been the Jon/Stannis/Wildlings arc which has developed and fleshed out a lot of characters and touched on real and complex political issues. This was lacking from episode 6 and the episode suffered for it.

[Bison]

Ay, I agree with the Bad King, Tyrion, Sansa and the Wall are the most solid parts of the show at this point. I couldn't care less if I didn't see Kings Landing, Dorne or Bravos in the next episode. 

[lady_v23]

The Sand Snakes are hilariously bad.

 

Agreed. And since they are such dangerous warriors I expected more.

[Il Divo]

 

 

4). I generally had no problem with the Jorah/Tyrion scene, but it didn't seem believable to me that Tyrion would know about the circumstances of Jeor Mormont's death. The Night's Watch only found out halfway through season 4 when Grenn and Edd returned with the bad news, and seeing as Tyrion was in a cell throughout that season, it seems dubious to me that he'd learn all this.

 

 

To be clear, rewatching Season 3 at the moment, the news regarding the death of the Lord Commander is brought to Maester Aemon by Sam in Episode 10. If I recall correctly, it's also mentioned by Davos to Stannis in regards to going North vs. killing Gendry when Maester Aemon starts sending ravens en masse.

[AlanC9]

Take Sansa's rape for example. I'm not saying it was a bad thing, but it was done for the wrong reasons, and at this point, it's just regressive for Sansa's character. Gone is her End of Season 4 walk down the stairs of the Eyrie in all black. Back to the Season 1 and 2 victim who is a pawn of sadistic psychos.

But that's the thing -- your "character" doesn't have much to do with whether or not you're a pawn of sadistic psychos. In any event, Sansa knew what she was getting into with the marriage. Not that she had any high-percentage alternatives, of course.

[Bad King]

To be clear, rewatching Season 3 at the moment, the news regarding the death of the Lord Commander is brought to Maester Aemon by Sam in Episode 10. If I recall correctly, it's also mentioned by Davos to Stannis in regards to going North vs. killing Gendry when Maester Aemon starts sending ravens en masse.

 

Good point, I'd forgotten about Sam's testimony.

[Il Divo]

But that's the thing -- your "character" doesn't have much to do with whether or not you're a pawn of sadistic psychos. In any event, Sansa knew what she was getting into with the marriage. Not that she had any high-percentage alternatives, of course.

 

I think that's where I find myself conflicted. Once we knew Sansa was going into Winterfell, I didn't see many other ways for this whole situation to play out. Ramsay's sick, but he seems a bit more cunning than Joffrey, so I can't see the Margeary charm working. Even if Sansa had attempted the "play along" approach, Ramsay's sadism would likely cause him to take the scenario far beyond her comfort zone.

 

I see Sansa's strengths going on to likely be her playing the meek victim while sowing rebellion in the North, not so much in manipulating Ramsay directly (although who knows?).

[Bad King]

Agreed. And since they are such dangerous warriors I expected more.

 

Seeing as the Sand Snakes are barely given any space to act, it would have been better if the producers had cast actual martial artists to play the parts: this would have seriously sorted out some of the dubious choreography of their fight scene. 

[Dovahzeymahlkey]

I dont think she was lying. Arya is getting taught that the truth of who she is is a lie. That scene where arya was telling the guy who she really was and kept getting smacked and getting told she was a liar, thats straight up brainwashing.

[Jaison1986]

I don't have a problem with Sansa's rape per se. I mean, look at the messed up stuff that happens at an daily basis, why would a rape be particularly outrageous? But what truly pisses me off is how those idiots at HBO are being utterly disrespectful of the source material, wich the series was being relatively faifhtul until a while ago. Sansa never suffered that at the books, but here she did, for shock's sake alone. And personally, I find that simply unaceptable. I have zero respect for people who don't respect the source material of their productions.

[XMissWooX]

I dont think she was lying. Arya is getting taught that the truth of who she is is a lie. That scene where arya was telling the guy who she really was and kept getting smacked and getting told she was a liar, thats straight up brainwashing.

 

In the last episode?

She was telling the truth - mostly - but she would slip the odd lie into her story (like changing a person's name), which the Faceless Man kept picking up on.

When she said she hated The Hound, she honestly thought she was telling the truth, hence her confusion when the FM kept saying she was lying.

[Fast Jimmy]

I don't have a problem with Sansa's rape per se. I mean, look at the messed up stuff that happens at an daily basis, why would a rape be particularly outrageous? But what truly pisses me off is how those idiots at HBO are being utterly disrespectful of the source material, wich the series was being relatively faifhtul until a while ago. Sansa never suffered that at the books, but here she did, for shock's sake alone. And personally, I find that simply unaceptable. I have zero respect for people who don't respect the source material of their productions.

There's a reason why they did that, though. Being a TV show, every new character they introduce is time spent with them, making the viewer familiar with them, and less time with characters they do know. Each season likely only has maybe 200 pages of dialogue script, while the books have 500+ pages of derailed and nuanced prose. The books can cover much, much more.

So the options are either cut or rewrite. Some things can't be cut but require new characters, events and explanations that would dwarf the show and cause other vital parts of the story to be crunched and minimalised.

So they took the entire storyline of where Jeyne Pool, a character we've never seen or met in the show, is the decoy for Sanda and who suffered cruel treatment by the Boltons, get cut. But they needed to tell the story of Theon and what is going on in Winterfell and they want to more prominently feature one of their star characters, Sansa, so they took out the part where she was a decoy and had her suffer the same fate herself.

That's elegant editting, in my opinion. They only have so much screen time and they are attempting to consolidate. Even if each season had twenty episodes they wouldn't be able to touch on every arc as deeply as the books do, let alone the ten each year they have to cram it all in.

[Treacherous J Slither]

When I saw the shows version of the Sand Snakes I was very disappointed. They all looked so soft and weak. I was expecting cool looking assassins.

Im not a fan of all the book deviation either. Can't help but feel like they're messing everything up. Kinda makes me wish I never read the books. Maybe then i'd enjoy the show more.

[Fast Jimmy]

When I saw the shows version of the Sand Snakes I was very disappointed. They all looked so soft and weak. I was expecting cool looking assassins.

Im not a fan of all the book deviation either. Can't help but feel like they're messing everything up. Kinda makes me wish I never read the books. Maybe then i'd enjoy the show more.

I only read the books to the point where they are in the show. I find I enjoy the show a whole lot (although I agree, the Sand Snakes were FAR from menacing), then can go back with the book and feel like I get a deeper layer of understanding of the world, it's people and history.

That would be my own personal suggestion to anyone out there considering reading the books and/or watching the show.

[Jaison1986]

Well, I think I'm done. I was already on edge with the way the series was going, but the last episode really threw me off for good. I don't want to watch it anymore only to see them screwing the characters because it's more convenient. Next thing you know Snow will be randomly decaptated. 

[Upinurmomshole]

they really need to expand upon theon's severed monster dong. i feel like it could become a major player and contender for the iron throne. and they really need to bring in some necrophilia scenes cause theres nothing hotter than drilling a corpse in the pooper.