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[Hatem]

Aeowyn wrote...

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Yes it is hard to take in some of the changes. Why do they feel the need to ruin a perfectly good story that is in the books? Season 1 was very faithful to Game of Thrones, besides some differences. Here's it's like they are making freaking huge differences.

I mean seriously Stannis having sex with Melisandre?

Yeah... wtf was that?

Spoilers below I guess

I haven't finished book five yet (if it matters) but how did Melisandre give birth to the shadow that killed the guy in Storm's End. I always thought it was Stannis who knocked her up.

[Addai]

android654 wrote...
Even his sister.

After watching the second season, I'm curious what's the motivation behind incest in the story. I get the historical need to inject it into the story, but it doesn't seem that it's driven by preserving bloodlines, but either love or lust. It makes me very curious about the author.

LOL  For drama.  Theon didn't know it was his sister, and she was trolling him.  It's been a while since I read ACoK but I think he only feels up her boob, if that makes you feel any better.

Cersei + Jaime is obviously for the drama around the kids.  But it makes sense if you consider these people grew up during the Targaryen era, when it was common for the royal family to marry siblings.  Cersei was being groomed to marry Rhaegar Targaryen and got shafted then had to marry Robert (they changed that a bit in the series to make it seem she wanted to marry Robert).  Plus the Lannisters were raised to believe they were a cut above everyone else.  So with all that mentality plus a lot of dysfunction, it makes sense that Jaime and Cersei would only feel they could love one another.  There was no one else good enough for them.

There is also some fan speculation that they are Targaryen bastards.  The Mad King had a thing for their mother Joanna.  In that case it would run in the blood, I suppose.  It's possible that Tyrion could also be a Targ bastard.  This is one of those out-there theories the story inspires.

Modifié par Addai67, 12 avril 2012 - 07:06 .

[android654]

Addai67 wrote...

android654 wrote...
Even his sister.

After watching the second season, I'm curious what's the motivation behind incest in the story. I get the historical need to inject it into the story, but it doesn't seem that it's driven by preserving bloodlines, but either love or lust. It makes me very curious about the author.

LOL  For drama.  Theon didn't know it was his sister, and she was trolling him.  It's been a while since I read ACoK but I think he only feels up her boob, if that makes you feel any better.

Cersei + Jaime is obviously for the drama around the kids.  But it makes sense if you consider these people grew up during the Targaryen era, when it was common for the royal family to marry siblings.  Cersei was being groomed to marry Rhaegar Targaryen and got shafted then had to marry Robert (they changed that a bit in the series to make it seem she wanted to marry Robert).  Plus the Lannisters were raised to believe they were a cut above everyone else.  So with all that mentality plus a lot of dysfunction, it makes sense that Jaime and Cersei would only feel they could love one another.  There was no one else good enough for them.

There is also some fan speculation that they are Targaryen bastards.  The Mad King had a thing for their mother Joanna.  In that case it would run in the blood, I suppose.  It's possible that Tyrion could also be a Targ bastard.  This is one of those out-there theories the story inspires.

I would agree with you if it were only the lannister siblings, but it's a reocurring theme. Greyjoy and his sister, although that was unknown. A whole village of daughters that are repeatedly raped by the father in order to keep that same village growing with more victims. I'm under the impression the author has some fascination with the subject of incest. It's almost everywhere in the story. I just ordered the first three books, so I'll be able to find out how constant a theme it was intended to be.

[Eski.Moe]

I don't find it to be a constant theme, almost all situations are unrelated. The thing with Theon and Asha is played for laughs, pure and simple.
It's a hilarious chapter in the book and Asha comes off as ridiculous awesome (though a bit disturbing too). Theon has no idea that it's her and she plays that up. I haven't seen the episode in the show yet and have read that's underwhelming but it was just funny.

The thing with Craster is just meant to be disturbing and show that the NW has to be on cordial terms with even the most unsettling aspects of society if they are to be their job.

Jaime/Cersei is because how narcissistic they are. They almost literally love themselves. Also, like Addai said, it's to add extra tension and drama. It's also a technique for us to paint them immediately as the 'bad guys'. So to speak, of course. At least initially since the action is so taboo and so abhorrent in today's society. Heck, it's that way in Westeros too. The practice of the Targaryen royals in marrying siblings to preserve their bloodline was tolerated and accepted because they weren't from Westeros initially. It's pretty much disgusting for the rest of the normal population though.

[LPPrince]

I never thought George R. R. Martin had some underlying thing with incest when reading A Song of Ice and Fire. I can see why he used it.

Had I written a fantasy novel series, I don't think I'd of used it as much, but it could've been there.

If anything, George has a thing for food. Lots and lots of food. /foodporn

[Addai]

android654 wrote...
I would agree with you if it were only the lannister siblings, but it's a reocurring theme. Greyjoy and his sister, although that was unknown. A whole village of daughters that are repeatedly raped by the father in order to keep that same village growing with more victims. I'm under the impression the author has some fascination with the subject of incest. It's almost everywhere in the story. I just ordered the first three books, so I'll be able to find out how constant a theme it was intended to be.

I think it's that events in the TV series are compressed.  I never associated these things together or considered incest a major theme.  I don't even consider it a theme with the Greyjoys.  That was Theon being his usual lecherous, pompous self and his sister taking advantage of his obliviousness to troll him and spy on him for her father.  There's no sexual element between them at all, after that first scene.

[android654]

I think that lends credence to my suspicions. They already changed Greyjoy's sister's name, surely manipulating him could've been changed from the acts in the novel. I mean, I thought I was insatiable, but he was just having sex on a boat before he had his hands betwixt his sister's thighs. However, it can be a side effect from compressing a novel to twelve or thirteen episodes and HBO's demand for injecting sex into the story.

It just makes me want to read the books even more, because if the show is this fascinating from something that's really miniscule, then I imagine it will be even more interesting in text.

[LPPrince]

It is more interesting in text.

[GodWood]

Gr4ntus wrote...

Aeowyn wrote...

Costin_Razvan wrote...
I mean seriously Stannis having sex with Melisandre?

Yeah... wtf was that?

Spoilers below I guess

I haven't finished book five yet (if it matters) but how did Melisandre give birth to the shadow that killed the guy in Storm's End. I always thought it was Stannis who knocked her up.

The idea that Stannis had sex with Melisandre didn't bother me too much, it was more how it was depicted that pissed me off.

I always thought it was plausible that Melisandre had been sleeping with him for some purpose (e.g, the shadow) but I always imagined that there'd be some 'dark ritual' behind it that'd cost blood or whatever.

Also, I thought it'd be a given that Stannis would do it grinding his teeth and treating it like yet another unwanted kingly duty as opposed to lustfully throwing her down like in the show.

-------------

Anyways I've decided to pick up the Game of Thrones RPG on release (the collector's edition won me over). I know Cyanide Studios is making it but I'm willing to give it a chance. My biggest fear actually is that they'll try and make the 2 PC's too sympathizable and honourable ala Eddard as opposed to being magnificient bastards like Petyr.

Ideally, one would be honourable and one wouldn't be, but judging from the character bios that isn't the case.

Modifié par GodWood, 14 avril 2012 - 03:25 .

[Addai]

Axechucker (who is a mod on Wic-net, I should explain) is teasing that episode 3 is his favorite of the first four. So we'll see...

[Russalka]

Yeah, apparently having a son is a major turn-on and fetish for Stannis in the series.

[Sajji]

I want to get into this fantasy series. What's the first book I should pick up?

[chunkyman]

Sajji wrote...

I want to get into this fantasy series. What's the first book I should pick up?

Err... The first one?

[Sajji]

chunkyman wrote...

Sajji wrote...

I want to get into this fantasy series. What's the first book I should pick up?

Err... The first one?

C'Mon, Chunky...don't be mean to an old friend!

[Addai]

Sajji wrote...

I want to get into this fantasy series. What's the first book I should pick up?

The first book is called A Game of Thrones.  They should be everywhere now.

[Sajji]

Sweet. Thank you. I've wanted to get into this series for a while...I'm gonna grab it tomorrow

[LPPrince]

Yeah, my mom bought A Game of Thrones for herself and bought the DVD set of Game of Thrones for her and my stepdad. Once she's done with book one she'll grab A Clash of Kings and so on and so forth.

I knew I got them into it, but daaaamn.

[AxisEvolve]

What is dead may never die. 

An hour left to wait for me. 

[Addai]

Theon, buddy, you should've sent the letter.

Well that started slow but got pretty awesome, coincidentally around the time Tyrion showed up. How he can be so stupid about Shae...

[AxisEvolve]

Addai67 wrote...

Theon, buddy, you should've sent the letter.

Well that started slow but got pretty awesome, coincidentally around the time Tyrion showed up. How he can be so stupid about Shae...

Theon Turncloak.. I kind of understand why he chose his family, but he proves he's not weak by.... giving into his father so easily? Eh. Sending him was a pretty dumb move on Robb's part. Robb really should've just listened to his mother. 

Tyrion's scenes were.... great. I couldn't help but smirk as I watched him play all those supposed veterans (Although I feel that Varys and Littlefinger may have known what was going on). Tyrion still got what he wanted. 

About Shae, I feel like they're putting more emphasis on the whole "not just a ****" thing. It's going to be interesting to see how, or if they adapt Tyrion's thoughts on the matter. If you've read the books you'll know what I mean. 

Modifié par AxisEvolve, 16 avril 2012 - 02:32 .

[TJPags]

Addai67 wrote...

Theon, buddy, you should've sent the letter.

Well that started slow but got pretty awesome, coincidentally around the time Tyrion showed up. How he can be so stupid about Shae...

Indeed, "If Woody had gone straight to the Police...." (does anyone remember Woody Woodpecker?  No?  Okay, anyway....)

Yea, kind of dumb to send Theon, and kind of shows how much a fool Theon is... Liked Asha . . . errr, Yara . . .more in this episode.

I may have issues with the Tyrell's . . . . I may.  Not sure yet.

[Addai]

I didn't care for Asha in this one. It's okay, though. Theon needs some sympathy points while he can get them.

I wonder how Shae is working for non-book readers. She was more likeable in the books, I think. Now she's a complete b****.

I don't think Littlefinger caught on to what was happening, but I bet Varys did. Varys is so awesome.

[AxisEvolve]

I'm still waiting for Asha to turn into a badass.

<_<

[KnightofPhoenix]

I do not quite get the strategy behind Greyjoy's rationale other than some misplaced sense of arrogance. It makes much more sense to me if you want to secede, to help fellow secessionists. Why in Westeros' name does he expect the Lannisters or the Baratheons to ever accept him as independent king should any of them win and why does he think that they can't kick his ass again like they already did? It's in his interest to prolong the fighting between the Starks and the rest. Meh stupid.
Robb was also quite foolish.

Tyrion was good here, and Varys is awesome for figuring it out quickly. I think Littlefinger will too if he didn't already.

Shae's acting is annoying me to be honest. And I think it's obvious she will hold Tyrion back in one way or the other. And for some reason I don't think she is what she seems she is. But the show made me paranoid, so what do I know.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 16 avril 2012 - 04:31 .

[chunkyman]

The ending with Arya and Yoren was sad, but awesome nonetheless. I loved Yoren's line about crossbows lol.