400 réponses à ce sujet

[Mnemnosyne]

aryon69 wrote...

That would go agianst the GW motto of not getting involved in policital stuff.  They only deal with darkspawn.  I bet that would be really tough for Loghain to accept.

Do you really think there is anything in Thedas that would stop Loghain from going back to Ferelden even if the Grey Wardens told him to remain neutral?  I don't bloody well think so.

IanPolaris wrote...

Essentially it has.  I've played with
both the boon and without it, and while a couple of lines of dialog
shift slightly, what King Alistair/Queen Anora has done in Fereldan
essentially has not.  Essentially in Fereldan the crown has removed (by
force) Chantry oversight over mages and make it a royal perogative.  He
(She) doesn't (yet) have the raw military power to kick out the Templars
in the Tower, but outside the tower, the Chantry/Templar have no legal
authority anymore to hunt/regulate mages, and Fereldan is openly
accepting and protecting apostates from elsewhere.

As I see it,
Fereldan is one small step away from a Chuch of England type schism with
the main Chantry especially given the resentment against Orlais (again
my take on what is said but what I say above is what you are told).

-Polaris

This kind of makes me question a lot of things, such as why the hell does Hawke stay in Kirkwall after the Blight!?

I mean, if Hawke is a mage, you'd think learning that she doesn't have to worry much about the Templars if she goes back to Ferelden aught to send her running back.  If Bethany is the mage, same deal.  There's basically no apparent reason whatsoever for Hawke to stay in Kirkwall, if they could go back to Ferelden and live relatively openly as a mage.

I mean, yeah, we have plot armor that lets us throw fireballs in the streets, but the characters don't seem to recognize this.  Bethany is constantly nervous about being discovered, if that wasn't a problem in Ferelden, shouldn't she at least bring it up and then maybe have some reason why they can't go back?

IanPolaris wrote...

Left hand of the Divine?  She sounds
like a seeker to me.  Given her sudden hatred towards magic in DA2, I
have to wonder if she was a seeker all along and played the Hero of
Fereldan for a fool.  If so, then I wish I had killed her on top of that
mountain.....

-Polaris

Yeah, she does seem to be a Seeker.  Although I didn't really get the hatred of magic, personally.  Maybe I didn't hear the dialogue that gives that impression, but I didn't get the idea that she was concerned about the situation because she hates magic, more that the concern stemmed from the potential storm of trouble that magic being the cause of a major upheaval in Kirkwall would cause.  In this, at least, she was clearly right.

I have yet to finish DA2 with a non-mage import that didn't ask for the boon - does Leliana still say the line about what happened in Ferelden in that case?  If so, I think it's pretty clear that whatever it is will be pretty significant.

[_Somebody]

TobiTobsen wrote...

Leliana is a Seeker. Maybe she always was one. The trinket she starts with in Origins is called Seeker's Circle. So maybe she fooled the Warden all along. Who knows?

If thats the case, then my future Wardens aint gunne be romancing her anymore.

[Raiil]

TobiTobsen wrote...

Somebody wrote...

AshenEndemion wrote...

Somebody wrote...

AshenEndemion wrote...

But Leliana isn't a seeker.... so her being in the fancy armor really doesn't mean anything, does it?

She is a Seeker.

Somehow I don't think "Hand of the Divine" is a Seeker title...

It's like assuming Hawke is a templar just because he wears Templar armor...

Yes because thats the same thing...

If Leliana is not a Seeker, then why would they give her that armor?

Leliana is a Seeker. Maybe she always was one. The trinket she starts with in Origins is called Seeker's Circle. So maybe she fooled the Warden all along. Who knows?

Holy s--t. I completely forgot about that.

Mind = mildly blown. 

[Ealos]

Hand of the Divine is just a rank. You start as a Third Toenail of the Divine and work your way up. Leliana needs only three more badges and she'll get to be Right Eyebrow of the Divine (Raised)

[Raiil]

Koyasha wrote...



I have yet to finish DA2 with a non-mage import that didn't ask for the boon - does Leliana still say the line about what happened in Ferelden in that case?  If so, I think it's pretty clear that whatever it is will be pretty significant.

I'm 99.99% sure mine wasn't (it was a super old save)- I believe I chose the Chancellor boon. She still says that.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Valentia X wrote...
Leliana is a Seeker. Maybe she always was one. The trinket she starts with in Origins is called Seeker's Circle. So maybe she fooled the Warden all along. Who knows?

And since we know the new Divine is Dorothea, Leliana might have been associated with her from the time they met.

[TobiTobsen]

Valentia X wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...

Leliana is a Seeker. Maybe she always was one. The trinket she starts with in Origins is called Seeker's Circle. So maybe she fooled the Warden all along. Who knows?

Holy s--t. I completely forgot about that.

Mind = mildly blown.

And now think about some of her storys again

"People respond eagerly to others who they believe understand them. They seek approval, friendship... sometimes love. This can be exploited."

"Everyone can be seduced by the right woman. The trick is predicting who she is, and becoming her. Master the game, and no one can resist you."

Modifié par TobiTobsen, 06 avril 2011 - 10:33 .

[The Angry One]

The lesson is, every romance in DA:O is a conniver and a liar except Alistair.
That'll teach you Alistair haters!

[Ealos]

Valentia X wrote...

Koyasha wrote...



I have yet to finish DA2 with a non-mage import that didn't ask for the boon - does Leliana still say the line about what happened in Ferelden in that case?  If so, I think it's pretty clear that whatever it is will be pretty significant.

I'm 99.99% sure mine wasn't (it was a super old save)- I believe I chose the Chancellor boon. She still says that.

Same, I thought it was a reference to the demonic meltdown that occurred.

[KnightofPhoenix]

The Angry One wrote...

The lesson is, every romance in DA:O is a conniver and a liar except Alistair.
That'll teach you Alistair haters!

Except if he didn't tell you about being a Therein, which is important info, until you cure Eamon. 

[_Somebody]

TobiTobsen wrote...

And know think about some of her storys again

"People respond eagerly to others who they believe understand them. They seek approval, friendship... sometimes love. This can be exploited."

"Everyone can be seduced by the right woman. The trick is predicting who she is, and becoming her. Master the game, and no one can resist you."

Why, why do you give me these doubts?

Not I really do have to think about this though.

[EmperorSahlertz]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Since the boon can only be asked with 1/6 wardens, out of 4 or 5 choices, I doubt what's happening is that important.

Unless Ferelden opted to free its Circle regardless.

I've never asked for the mage boon ever, and even then Lelianna still talks about waht happened in Ferelden. So it is not the boon. It's more likely the fact that King Alistair is willing to harbor apostates.

[_Somebody]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The lesson is, every romance in DA:O is a conniver and a liar except Alistair.
That'll teach you Alistair haters!

Except if he didn't tell you about being a Therein, which is important info, until you cure Eamon. 

Ok, Morrigan too. Now we are all happy.

[The Angry One]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The lesson is, every romance in DA:O is a conniver and a liar except Alistair.
That'll teach you Alistair haters!

Except if he didn't tell you about being a Therein, which is important info, until you cure Eamon. 

More an omission than a lie, and he wasn't doing it to be manipulative.
And he can tell you about being Maric's son before that.

Modifié par The Angry One, 06 avril 2011 - 10:34 .

[Raiil]

AMG LELIANA


Actually I don't feel too betrayed. In my canon playthrough, I left Leliana in Lothering. Perhaps she's butthurt because I didn't think she was worthy.

[TobiTobsen]

Somebody wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...

And now think about some of her storys again

"People respond eagerly to others who they believe understand them. They seek approval, friendship... sometimes love. This can be exploited."

"Everyone can be seduced by the right woman. The trick is predicting who she is, and becoming her. Master the game, and no one can resist you."

Why, why do you give me these doubts?

Not I really do have to think about this though.

I can't resist Morrigan and get dumped for it every time. So I made it my mission to make every Leliana romancer  feel just as miserable as I felt after the Morrigan romance

[IanPolaris]

Koyasha wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Essentially it has.  I've played with
both the boon and without it, and while a couple of lines of dialog
shift slightly, what King Alistair/Queen Anora has done in Fereldan
essentially has not.  Essentially in Fereldan the crown has removed (by
force) Chantry oversight over mages and make it a royal perogative.  He
(She) doesn't (yet) have the raw military power to kick out the Templars
in the Tower, but outside the tower, the Chantry/Templar have no legal
authority anymore to hunt/regulate mages, and Fereldan is openly
accepting and protecting apostates from elsewhere.

As I see it,
Fereldan is one small step away from a Chuch of England type schism with
the main Chantry especially given the resentment against Orlais (again
my take on what is said but what I say above is what you are told).

-Polaris

This kind of makes me question a lot of things, such as why the hell does Hawke stay in Kirkwall after the Blight!?

I mean, if Hawke is a mage, you'd think learning that she doesn't have to worry much about the Templars if she goes back to Ferelden aught to send her running back.  If Bethany is the mage, same deal.  There's basically no apparent reason whatsoever for Hawke to stay in Kirkwall, if they could go back to Ferelden and live relatively openly as a mage.

I mean, yeah, we have plot armor that lets us throw fireballs in the streets, but the characters don't seem to recognize this.  Bethany is constantly nervous about being discovered, if that wasn't a problem in Ferelden, shouldn't she at least bring it up and then maybe have some reason why they can't go back?

We only learn of this (and apparetly Hawke only learns of this) seven years later (start of Act III) and by then it's too late to stop the inevitable.  Remember that Aveline only discovers that she is "dead" and is invited back to resume her Fereldan comission at the same time  I'm guessing that Meridith is putting a lockdown on trade and information flow to and from Fereldan (which would explain part of why King Alistair is there....or Queen Anora).

In fact given what Meridith has to say to King Alistair/Queen Anora, I think this is likely.

IanPolaris wrote...

Left hand of the Divine?  She sounds
like a seeker to me.  Given her sudden hatred towards magic in DA2, I
have to wonder if she was a seeker all along and played the Hero of
Fereldan for a fool.  If so, then I wish I had killed her on top of that
mountain.....

-Polaris

Yeah, she does seem to be a Seeker.  Although I didn't really get the hatred of magic, personally.  Maybe I didn't hear the dialogue that gives that impression, but I didn't get the idea that she was concerned about the situation because she hates magic, more that the concern stemmed from the potential storm of trouble that magic being the cause of a major upheaval in Kirkwall would cause.  In this, at least, she was clearly right.

I have yet to finish DA2 with a non-mage import that didn't ask for the boon - does Leliana still say the line about what happened in Ferelden in that case?  If so, I think it's pretty clear that whatever it is will be pretty significant.

If you play the Sebastian DLC, she says that Kirkwall must "not fall to magic" and takes a line I'd expect from Cullen or Meridith.  She also rather snottily says that the Chantry "tolerated" the Libertarians.

Sounds like a magic-hater to me and very unlike the Lelianna I thought I knew in DAO.  I wonder if she played the Hero of Fereldan for a sucker the whole time.

I don't think that extra line about Fereldan happens unless you freed the circle, though.

-Polaris

[The Angry One]

thurmanator692 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The lesson is, every romance in DA:O is a conniver and a liar except Alistair.
That'll teach you Alistair haters!

And shale...


what? you didn't romance shale?

I got as far as being excited that we're both female, at which point Shale says something along the lines of "Oh, so it's girl power is it? Rah-rah."

[IanPolaris]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Since the boon can only be asked with 1/6 wardens, out of 4 or 5 choices, I doubt what's happening is that important.

Unless Ferelden opted to free its Circle regardless.

I've never asked for the mage boon ever, and even then Lelianna still talks about waht happened in Ferelden. So it is not the boon. It's more likely the fact that King Alistair is willing to harbor apostates.

Good to know.  In this case I actually agree except I strongly suspect tha Alistair is not only harboring apostates but integrating them directly into Fereldan's army as part of Royal power.  That would give the Chantry an "oh snap" moment.

-Polaris

[Ealos]

Wonder how much of Leliana's song was true recollection - and why she chose to join the Warden. That "tolerates" line really made my blood boil, somewhat different from the more antiestablishment stance on faith she said she had in DAO.

[KnightofPhoenix]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Since the boon can only be asked with 1/6 wardens, out of 4 or 5 choices, I doubt what's happening is that important.

Unless Ferelden opted to free its Circle regardless.

I've never asked for the mage boon ever, and even then Lelianna still talks about waht happened in Ferelden. So it is not the boon. It's more likely the fact that King Alistair is willing to harbor apostates.

Not the most prudent thing to do. But if all hell does break loose, it might provide an interesting opportunity.

[EmperorSahlertz]

@Polaris: It is the Resolutionist, the minority actively promoting armed resistance to the Chantry, which the Chantry has tolerated, not the Libertarians. ACtually it surprised me that the Chantry would ever tolerate something actively inciting rebellion.

Modifié par EmperorSahlertz, 06 avril 2011 - 10:40 .

[The Angry One]

Well, you know how there's more than one Sten?
Maybe every branch of the Chantry has it's own Leliana.