996 réponses à ce sujet

[Aradace]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Aradace wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

Aradace wrote...
Depends on what you're betting on

I'm betting that Link is not going to get a voice in any Zelda game.

Ahh, in that case, you're probably right.  I had to re-read that because I thought it said "Link isnt going to get a voice..." as in at all.  To which I was going to argue that he technically did in the saturday morning cartoon they used to have.  Yes, Zelda used to be a saturday morning cartoon.  S.o.B I feel old now for even knowing that lol

Well excuse me, Princess!

LOL good times, good times.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Kimaka wrote...

Unless I am able to have a wide variety of voices to choose from, I won't enjoy having a set voice. And since having one voice for each gender is already costly enough, I will choose voiceless over voiced everytime. It's about personal preference.

I'll raise you one more.  I don't think I'd be happy with a voice unless we get a variety from which to choose, and we get to mix-and-match dialogue lines with intent icons, thus allowing a wider range of expression and intent. 

[Merced652]

 Oh so the desire to not have a VO'd protag is immature because you feel the VO is more "engaging?" I have some news for you, you have zero basis on which to even suggest that because engaging is subjective, and you offered nothing to back up your claim that its immature to like/want a certain thing. How about you man up and actually debate the topic instead of making even more sweeping (and ******) generalizations about things and then backing them up? 

Let me throw around some sweeping generalizations of my own now that i feel entitled. If you like a VO'd protag you're immature, afflicted with AFS, or one of the multiple forms of DS. Also, no VO'd protag is more immersive and allows a more expansive RP experience rather than some interactive moive garbage. 

SEE WHAT I DID THERE?

[Heather Cline]

No it's not bogus or inaccurate and you just pick and choose what you want. Also you are only defending yourself and that you like a voiced protagonist just fine. My original post when I started in this thread was that I disagreed with the OP because he wants the games to go back to old school style. The OP never once stated that they wanted diversity in their games. YOU stated that, you stated you wanted diversity. As such only you want diversity while the others want everything old school.

So your opinion doesn't count for much since frankly you are only defending yourself. Thus I am going to state my original statement again. I disagree with the original post of this thread removing the dialogue wheel, the voiced PC and the non-interactive cinematics. Also one other thing the cinematics in DA:O were non-interactive there too, same with ME1. ME2 did give a little bit of interactivity with the paragon/renegade interrupts.

End of discussion with you.

[DanaScu]

Heather Cline wrote...

I don't agree with this thread. I like DA2. I'm tired of the silent protagonist approach. It's old and stale.

Yeah the game had bugs because it was rushed and could have been more fleshed out. However games are going more and more to the voiced approach. Get with the times people.

I'd rather have the silent pc.

On the off chance that the devs actually find a voice actor I really like, it might not be totally abysmal to have a voiced character. When the voice actor is one I can not stand, then it ruins the whole game. I like some of the characters that Mark Meers plays. I can not abide his Shepard. Male Shepard never made it off the Normandy to Eden Prime. I have no game saves in either ME or ME2 for a male Shepard. I played one ME2 to see what the defaults were if you didn't import a save, and checked out the Tali romance. I didn't finish that runthrough and deleted it immediately. If I had disliked the femShep's voice actor to the extent I disliked maleShep, I'd have never bothered with the game.

My brother bought DA2. He lost interest and didn't finish it. I played it. I don't particularly like maleHawke that much. FemHawke is a little better but still those "why the heck" did she say *that* wheel o'hints really killed my interest in playing. I finished it; but couldn't tell you any minute points about the game, because I just don't remember. Vague hints about what might possibly be a clue about what the character you're controlling might say isn't that memorable, I guess.

::heads off to check whether Skyrim is going to have the usual silent pc::

[Tirigon]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

If the 3D models can't produce a character who looks like my character should, how is that better than a system that can?

What is the standard by which you're determining the system that fails to be superior to the system that succeeds?

Well, for me, better graphics is simply better. Because of more details, higher quality etc.

That does however NOT mean that a new art direction is better.
In fact, in many cases I much prefer the STYLE of older games over new ones.

But if the style is the same, but more detailed, then that´s an improvement.

[AlanC9]

Tirigon wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Psython wrote...
 Is it true that justin beiber or britney spears is an improvement over Vivaldi?

Is that even a meaningful question? Different music played for different people looking for different experiences....

EXACTLY!!!!!!


And that´s why RPGs should stay "old-school", as some like to call it.

For those who want voiced PC, little choices, non-interactive cutscenes etc... there is already Hack´n´Slash, Shooters, adventures, action games, RTS........

But what if I want choices and a voiced PC and some non-interactive cutscenes? Like, say, The Witcher?

Maybe you should dial that back a little. How about "traditional RPGs should still exist"? There's no reason multiple styles of RPG can't coexist. We've had Bio and Bethesda styles coexisting for years.

[Sylvius the Mad]

SilentK wrote...

I believe that the wheel worked much better in DA2 than in ME.

So do I, but that's not the appropriate standard by which to judge DA2.

DA2 offers vastly less player control over PC expression than any previous BioWare game with a silent protagonist.  The best direct comparison would probably be Jade Empire, as JE offered a similarly linear overall plot with similarly linear level design, and a similarly constrained character background.

And Jade Empire's dialogue system offered far more expressive freedom to the player than DA2's does.

[Merced652]

AlanC9 wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Psython wrote...
 Is it true that justin beiber or britney spears is an improvement over Vivaldi?

Is that even a meaningful question? Different music played for different people looking for different experiences....

EXACTLY!!!!!!


And that´s why RPGs should stay "old-school", as some like to call it.

For those who want voiced PC, little choices, non-interactive cutscenes etc... there is already Hack´n´Slash, Shooters, adventures, action games, RTS........

But what if I want choices and a voiced PC and some non-interactive cutscenes? Like, say, The Witcher?

Maybe you should dial that back a little. How about "traditional RPGs should still exist"? There's no reason multiple styles of RPG can't coexist. We've had Bio and Bethesda styles coexisting for years.

For the same exact reason it shouldn't be changed, your only advantage is your agenda aligns very roughly with theirs. Actually, i wouldn't even say it does at all, its just bad circumstance. 

Modifié par Merced652, 08 avril 2011 - 10:06 .

[the_one_54321]

AlanC9 wrote...
We've had Bio and Bethesda styles coexisting for years.

At least we did up until DAII. No choices and voiced protagonist in there. (if there's one thing DAII proved conclusively, it was that the choices you made had a strictly superficial effect on the plot, if even that)

So where are we going to get choices, and where are we going to get silent protagonists anymore? 

[Siansonea]

Tirigon wrote...

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

If the 3D models can't produce a character who looks like my character should, how is that better than a system that can?

What is the standard by which you're determining the system that fails to be superior to the system that succeeds?

Well, for me, better graphics is simply better. Because of more details, higher quality etc.

That does however NOT mean that a new art direction is better.
In fact, in many cases I much prefer the STYLE of older games over new ones.

But if the style is the same, but more detailed, then that´s an improvement.

You say that because you want your characters to look like actual people. But when your character looks like an assemblage of bathroom tile, then you have to use your imagination to determine how they would look if they were real. Having it all done for you, well, that just shows you don't want to use your imagination.

[LoveAsThouWilt]

I must say right now: DOWN with this thread.

Sure, I know its opinion but just like it is opinions so is mine that not have the very things that this thread is stating it wants to be rid of would make me NOT purchase a game. Any game. Modern day gaming - I demand that my games, especially centered in roleplaying, have a character that is voiced because that makes it feel like they actually exist, that they are THERE in that world. Hence, why I couldn't get attached to Dragon Age Origins very well. It was too meh for me, even though I completed it, my Warden just didn't exist. No voice. Emotional impact with the story goes right out the window.

Why the issue with the dialogue wheel unless you complain that it gives you fewer choices, then I could agree with that a bit, but once again if its attached to "not giving the PC a voice" then I am not for it. I want my character voiced, and I want to be able to choose within reason what they can say (roleplaying, once again).

non-interactive are a bad thing? This I never understood, perhaps because I have played Metal Gear Solid but, why are cutscenes bad? They move the narrative forward and give cool scenes that could otherwise could not be done in the game (IE camera angles and such for filming such things). So long as the graphics between cutscenes and gameplay are the same (IE I hate CGI cutscenes.... and trailers... when the game looks nothing like it. GIVE ME THE CGI GAME AT THAT RATE!... But that is another matter entirely.)

So yeah, my opinion. You are all free to yours, but mine is down with this topic lol because it isn't for me. For instance I refuse to play oblivion and probably will never tough it out to play half life 2. Why? because non-voiced characters, that and non "physical" characters in first person view but that is another matter entirely as well.


Edit: I would be for multiple voice options to choose from for the PC, but once again that is likely not going to happen because of costs. The development team would have to have the same lines said multiple times, for both genders, with the same emotional impact. Can you imagine the kind of costs that would be? And even still, there would be people that don't like ANY of those voices, so once again, not everyone will be happy or can be happy with a game. Not everything you want can be had, I am just glad DA2 WAS everything I wanted. I could have asked for me, but I got was a was hoping for (if not entirely expecting, didn't want to get hopes up), and was happily surprised to be given in a game what I wanted. I had a voiced character that could make choices, more cutscenes to move the action forward and give me more (though, quicktime event could be included in those too, but that sort of thing would seem out of place for dragon age at the very least, but I do no that that is an "option" for those that want no cutscenes to have an "interactive cinematic". ).

Modifié par LoveAsThouWilt, 08 avril 2011 - 10:21 .

[Siansonea]

the_one_54321 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
We've had Bio and Bethesda styles coexisting for years.

At least we did up until DAII. No choices and voiced protagonist in there. (if there's one thing DAII proved conclusively, it was that the choices you made had a strictly superficial effect on the plot, if even that)

So where are we going to get choices, and where are we going to get silent protagonists anymore? 

You could always use your mute button. Why not just turn on the subtitles, and imagine ALL the voices? Play your own music in the background, or better yet, IMAGINE the music too. After all, it's all about stimulating the imagination, right? You could also play blindfolded, so you can imagine the story, combat and all other aspects of the game as well.

[Sylvius the Mad]

AlanC9 wrote...

But what if I want choices and a voiced PC and some non-interactive cutscenes? Like, say, The Witcher?

Then play The Witcher and its sequels.  Clearly those games are already being made.  Your games already exist; you don't need BioWare to make them.

Where are my games?  Where are the games with pausable stat-driven combat and a silent PC?

[MercenaryRQ]

Scimal wrote...

....

well i played HL, HL2, Unreal, UT (all of them), DOW 1 and 2, Dead Space, DMoM&M, System Shock2 and various other games. i guess for me it is more that i see the voiced PC and the wheel as a limitation for the amount of responses and questions available and the extra effort and money better spend elsewhere. thought the wheel bugs me more for its Good, Derp and Evil style lol

A voiced PC and the amount of choices like in DA:O... i might like that. have to think about that another time since it is 3 am now lol

[Aradace]

This thread has become epic winning lol, seriously. It's fully of folks complaining about and wanting something that they're not going to get in the next DA game. In fact, this thread is so winning, it's CHARLIE SHEEN winning XD

[the_one_54321]

Siansonea II wrote...
You could always use your mute button. Why not just turn on the subtitles, and imagine ALL the voices? Play your own music in the background, or better yet, IMAGINE the music too. After all, it's all about stimulating the imagination, right? You could also play blindfolded, so you can imagine the story, combat and all other aspects of the game as well.

You're not being clever, you're being a [donkey], and it's not convincing anyone that you're more right than anyone else.

[Tirigon]

Aradace wrote...

Depending on your perception of the subject, that could be a sad state of affairs.  As for me, I dont know about you, but my interests dont just expand to the "classics" I like the "new age" stuff too. 

I like the good stuff.

Sadly, if ME and DA2 and CoD and whatever are any indication, the new age stuff doesn´t fulfill that criteria.

[Merced652]

hahahahah

Let me thrown out a post full of random subjective verbage to describe my position and pray it gets accepted as fact. Yea man, those scenes are "cool," "awesome," "spectaclololular."

[LiquidGrape]

the_one_54321 wrote...

At least we did up until DAII. No choices and voiced protagonist in there. (if there's one thing DAII proved conclusively, it was that the choices you made had a strictly superficial effect on the plot, if even that)

So where are we going to get choices, and where are we going to get silent protagonists anymore? 

Excuse me, but do you think the story of an RPG must invariably be steered by the player character?
Can it not serve just as impactful a purpose to make the framework of the story more defined and focused, so as to benefit the drama rather than the player's wish to influence every given aspect of its progression?

Regardless, you make plenty of choices in Dragon Age 2. Your disposition, your morals, your rapport with your companions...aren't these meaningful choices? And within the context of the greater picture at whose whims you make these choices, doesn't that add up to something very genuine? Being a victim of circumstance, but attempting to cope as best you can with what options you are able to make?
Isn't that just as legitimate an approach?

[the_one_54321]

LiquidGrape wrote...
Excuse me, but do you think the story of an RPG must invariably be steered by the player character?

No, actually. Not always. I really really really like Final Fantasy games, and you have next to zero control on choices in those games.

But I do think this kind of game should continue to be made. But who else is making them?

[Merced652]

Aradace wrote...

This thread has become epic winning lol, seriously. It's fully of folks complaining about and wanting something that they're not going to get in the next DA game. In fact, this thread is so winning, it's CHARLIE SHEEN winning XD

I'm confused about your position and motivation for existing on this planet as well as in this thread. No **** sherlock, i'm pretty sure anyone with any sense can see bioware has sailed that ship and will never ever under any circumstances return to a silent protag. I mean, do you want a ****ing medal for predicting what we were saying nearly a year ago? 

[Aradace]

Tirigon wrote...

Aradace wrote...

Depending on your perception of the subject, that could be a sad state of affairs.  As for me, I dont know about you, but my interests dont just expand to the "classics" I like the "new age" stuff too. 

I like the good stuff.

Sadly, if ME and DA2 and CoD and whatever are any indication, the new age stuff doesn´t fulfill that criteria.

That's your opinion and you're more than welcome to it.  However, I do hate CoD though.  And Halo.  Never understood the facination with either of those games lol.

[Tirigon]

Siansonea II wrote...

You say that because you want your characters to look like actual people. But when your character looks like an assemblage of bathroom tile, then you have to use your imagination to determine how they would look if they were real. Having it all done for you, well, that just shows you don't want to use your imagination.

Nice strawman.

+5 internets

[the_one_54321]

Aradace wrote...
That's your opinion and you're more than welcome to it.  However, I do hate CoD though.  And Halo.  Never understood the facination with either of those games lol.

Halo I was fun, the rest of it rather bewilders me. CoD, I don't get in the slightest. And I actually really love shooters. Multiplayer on CoD looks pretty darn cool. But multiplayer is multiplayer. All a game needs to do that well is the right balance and the right kind of server options.