63 réponses à ce sujet

[Dave666]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Dave666 wrote...

Golden Owl wrote...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I swear I recall something being said about it on the Collector ship, during one of the battles Harbringer makes a comment about human aggressiveness and the Reapers want to harness that behavior to the Reapers advantage....something along those lines anyway. The Turians are mentioned also, if you take Garrus with you and he gets hurt, Harbringer comments that the Turians are a primitive race and so the Reapers have no interest in them....asfor the other aggressive race, Krogans, I don't take Grunt with me, so wouldn't know if comments are made there.

Depends on which Human Squaddies you have with you.

masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Harbinger_%28Collector%29/Battle_Quotes#Quotes_about_Harbinger

Wish I knew how to rename links, it would be so much easier.

Wow, nice references!

And I was about to post something to this effect in response to your last post... but I'll just throw it in here. Another fantasy trope is that humans are generalists - we're a little good at magic, a little good at fighting, a little good at stealh, but not great at anything.

We're the only race that has the inquisitiveness of the salarians, the agression of the Turians, the biotic power of the Asari. I mean, we have weaker versions of all of those things, but we've got some aspects of everything. Krogans were also pretty good, but we messed them up, so they aren't useful anymore. We're their best bet...

Though it would be hilarious if, failing to make a Human reaper, they tried to make a Batarian one.

Edit: also, to make links link to words, highlight the section you want to make a link, then click on the little icon that looks like a planet with a chain. It'll give you a field to paste the URL in.

Awesome! Thanks CGG! 

I must admit that I've though about the whole Batarian Reaper thing.  We never heard Harby's thoughts on them and they're now in Batarian Space, so I'm fully expecting Indoctrinated Batarians and Batarian Husks etc in ME:3. I wonder if we'll also have Batarian Reapers to deal with also.  Have my doubts on this one though because of the timeline. Depends on how much time has passed between Arrival and the start of ME:3 really.

[Golden Owl]

Dave666 wrote...

Golden Owl wrote...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I swear I recall something being said about it on the Collector ship, during one of the battles Harbringer makes a comment about human aggressiveness and the Reapers want to harness that behavior to the Reapers advantage....something along those lines anyway. The Turians are mentioned also, if you take Garrus with you and he gets hurt, Harbringer comments that the Turians are a primitive race and so the Reapers have no interest in them....asfor the other aggressive race, Krogans, I don't take Grunt with me, so wouldn't know if comments are made there.

Depends on which Human Squaddies you have with you.

masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Harbinger_%28Collector%29/Battle_Quotes#Quotes_about_Harbinger

Wish I knew how to rename links, it would be so much easier.

Thank you Dave....yep... "Viable possibility, aggression useful factor if controlled"...thats what I was thinking of.

[StarGateGod]

Infinite Legend wrote...

Steel Hurtin wrote...

Yeah, according to some NPC's in the game, human genes are the most diverse and adaptable, or something along those lines.

I still laugh every time a hear that.

as do i

[Dave666]

Golden Owl wrote...

Dave666 wrote...

Golden Owl wrote...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I swear I recall something being said about it on the Collector ship, during one of the battles Harbringer makes a comment about human aggressiveness and the Reapers want to harness that behavior to the Reapers advantage....something along those lines anyway. The Turians are mentioned also, if you take Garrus with you and he gets hurt, Harbringer comments that the Turians are a primitive race and so the Reapers have no interest in them....asfor the other aggressive race, Krogans, I don't take Grunt with me, so wouldn't know if comments are made there.

Depends on which Human Squaddies you have with you.

masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Harbinger_%28Collector%29/Battle_Quotes#Quotes_about_Harbinger

Wish I knew how to rename links, it would be so much easier.

Thank you Dave....yep... "Viable possibility, aggression useful factor if controlled"...thats what I was thinking of.

Thought it might be (and you're welcome), did you notice the other comments about Humans?  "Impressive Technical potential", "Impressive genetic maleability" and "Great Biotic potential".

One might argue that the other races also possess these qualities, however CGG may have a point about the old trope about Humans being the Jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none.

[xzxzxz701]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Weaknesses can be a strength too.

Every weaknesses could be turned into a strength, it just depends on how you use it.

[Golden Owl]

Dave666 wrote...

Golden Owl wrote...

Dave666 wrote...

Golden Owl wrote...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I swear I recall something being said about it on the Collector ship, during one of the battles Harbringer makes a comment about human aggressiveness and the Reapers want to harness that behavior to the Reapers advantage....something along those lines anyway. The Turians are mentioned also, if you take Garrus with you and he gets hurt, Harbringer comments that the Turians are a primitive race and so the Reapers have no interest in them....asfor the other aggressive race, Krogans, I don't take Grunt with me, so wouldn't know if comments are made there.

Depends on which Human Squaddies you have with you.

masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Harbinger_%28Collector%29/Battle_Quotes#Quotes_about_Harbinger

Wish I knew how to rename links, it would be so much easier.

Thank you Dave....yep... "Viable possibility, aggression useful factor if controlled"...thats what I was thinking of.

Thought it might be (and you're welcome), did you notice the other comments about Humans?  "Impressive Technical potential", "Impressive genetic maleability" and "Great Biotic potential".

One might argue that the other races also possess these qualities, however CGG may have a point about the old trope about Humans being the Jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none.

Yes, did note all references, have now been trying to think of who I generally take with me, its always Garrus and ???. Going by the various "Impressive ...." I'm thinking "Jack of all trades, master of none" may be the clincher, as you note.

[maddenking2010]

Sovriegn was reffering to all the races in the present day galaxy, civilization asa whole. The Reapers didnt become interested in humans untill after the defeat at the citidal

[weazelwogger]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

There's a common Sci-Fi trope that may apply here - humans are curious...

Agree completely, and I think ME does a good job of articulating that idea.  It's just so revealing that the other Citadel species have spent so much time there without questioning how everything works.  Give humanity another hundred years and we'd be pulling apart bulkheads until we had every square inch of the place mapped out... given time, the insidious nature of the technology would probably out itself under such scrutiny.

As for the Salarians, I think it's just a matter of degree.  I recall a codex entry mentioned that they make natural allies for humanity as opposed to the conservative nature of Asari and Turians.

All that said, I don't think we're all that super-special.  The Reapers are coming and they will destroy everyone in time.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

weazelwogger wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

There's a common Sci-Fi trope that may apply here - humans are curious...

Agree completely, and I think ME does a good job of articulating that idea.  It's just so revealing that the other Citadel species have spent so much time there without questioning how everything works.  Give humanity another hundred years and we'd be pulling apart bulkheads until we had every square inch of the place mapped out... given time, the insidious nature of the technology would probably out itself under such scrutiny.

As for the Salarians, I think it's just a matter of degree.  I recall a codex entry mentioned that they make natural allies for humanity as opposed to the conservative nature of Asari and Turians.

All that said, I don't think we're all that super-special.  The Reapers are coming and they will destroy everyone in time.

I think that everyone is special in their own way.

I'm not being obnoxious here. In another recent thread somewhere, I outlined all of the races and how they are all exceptional in at least one area. Actually, I think it's that diversity that gives us such strength (in the Paragon version of the game, anyway). In galactic history, it's quite possible that, most of the time, one or two species dominated space travel. We just happen to have what, a dozen? That may be due to Prothean meddling, but it's important, I think.

[Aergwest]

You are overlooking another converstaion, one with Vigil on Ilos.

It was specifically said that "This time, when Sovereign sent the signal, the keepers did not respond".

No indication was given as to how long ago that signal was sent. It was also eluded to that Sovereign most likely spent a few centuries gathering allies before attempting to assault the Citadel.

You can deduce from that conversation that the Reapers actually tried to come back most likely a few centuries after the Asari found the citadel, probably before Turians even developed space flight.

They couldn't activate the citadel, so the first 'contingency plan' was to instigate the Rachni to war.

[ADLegend21]

Why humans? We killed one of them they wiped the floor with the Turians asari and Salarians but we killed one. So we're the proverbial nail that sticks up.

[Giggles_Manically]

Becuse humens are sppesshful.

[Heavensrun]

Dave666 wrote...

 I've been reading through some threads about what Sovereign tells us on Vermire and something just occured to me.

Sovereign tells us: "Your civilization is based on the technology of the mass relays; our technology. By using it, your society develops along the paths we desire."

The technology in question is The Mass Relays which is Element Zero based.

Is it illogical to assume that Element Zero is important to the Reapers?

The Reapers want us to develop along the paths they desire and also it seems want biological matter as evidenced in ME:2.

What happens to Organics that are exposed to Element Zero (and survive)?  They develop Biotics.

Can anyone name a race where every single member is a Biotic?  Hint...Asari.

So if the Reapers want us to use Element Zero and one of the byproducts of it is Biotics, why do they want Humans who have barely had any exposure to it?

Surely the Reapers would want Biotics, or why provide technology that produces them?  Surely the Reapers had alternatives avaliable to them?

To me, it would have made more sense if it had been Asari Colonies that were being abducted.

Thoughts?

Well, my main thought is that you had a hypothesis, and the facts don't fit it, so your hypothesis needs to be modified.  ;p

If the Reapers just wanted powerful biotics for some reason, yeah, the Asari would be the targets.  Soooo, obviously that's not their only objective.  Hell, it might even be a secondary objective.  Humans gots lots of genetic varieties, see, so we get to get ground up into baby reaper formula, but the Asari are 1337 |31071(Z, so they get to become super-husks or something.  Salarians are gonna be the new collectors.  (nods)

[Golden Owl]

Aergwest wrote...

You are overlooking another converstaion, one with Vigil on Ilos.

It was specifically said that "This time, when Sovereign sent the signal, the keepers did not respond".

No indication was given as to how long ago that signal was sent. It was also eluded to that Sovereign most likely spent a few centuries gathering allies before attempting to assault the Citadel.

You can deduce from that conversation that the Reapers actually tried to come back most likely a few centuries after the Asari found the citadel, probably before Turians even developed space flight.

They couldn't activate the citadel, so the first 'contingency plan' was to instigate the Rachni to war.

True...but I'm not to sure what your point is...please clarify? Yes, it does appear that the Reapers have been trying for a while, the Protheans changing the Keepers reaction threw a spanner in the works for the Reapers intially....But since that time, within a short while of the advent of humans into the Galatic community, the Reapers have made special note of the humans....the question I think being asked here is why the particular interest in humans.

[Zulu_DFA]

Saphra Deden wrote...

What have humans done to make them so important? Was it the Battle of the Citadel?

The Reapers preselected Humans during the previous round of the cycle. That's why they left the Prothean site on Mars untouched. Or should I really say "the Collector site on Mars"?

Modifié par Zulu_DFA, 08 avril 2011 - 05:22 .

[DxWill10]

Not sure of this has been said, but Harbinger says something about their tendency to mate w/ other species expresses weakness. or something

[Dave666]

DxWill10 wrote...

Not sure of this has been said, but Harbinger says something about their tendency to mate w/ other species expresses weakness. or something

I brought it up myself and its complete bolony.

Asari can reproduce with any race, so even if all but one Asari was wiped out in time the Asari race could spring back. 

Asari mates with a Turian and has three kids, those three mate with different species and each have three more kids and so on and so on.  How on earth does that make them weak?  Remember also that there's nothing stopping Asari-Asari pairings. Ardat Yakshi are extremely rare and we know that the Asari can mate with each other or the race would have been extinct long before they discovered other species.

Modifié par Dave666, 08 avril 2011 - 08:01 .

[jbblue05]

Dave666 wrote...

DxWill10 wrote...

Not sure of this has been said, but Harbinger says something about their tendency to mate w/ other species expresses weakness. or something

I brought it up myself and its complete bolony.

Asari can reproduce with any race, so even if all but one Asari was wiped out in time the Asari race could spring back. 

Asari mates with a Turian and has three kids, those three mate with different species and each have three more kids and so on and so on.  How on earth does that make them weak?  Remember also that there's nothing stopping Asari-Asari pairings. Ardat Yakshi are extremely rare and we know that the Asari can mate with each other or the race would have been extinct long before they discovered other species.

I believe its best for the Asari to mate with their own species.  Becaus the Asari only share the basic gens with other species.. Their is a higher chance for genetic diversity through asari-exclusive pairings or gene therapy. So it seems that asari-alien pairings will lead to the daughter being a clone of her mother

All the pureblood hate is just  elitism propaganda spewed by the self-hating Asari who've made an inferior mating choice.
Even Asari doctors say nothing is gained genetically from asari-alien pairings

T

[Dave666]

jbblue05 wrote...

Dave666 wrote...

DxWill10 wrote...

Not sure of this has been said, but Harbinger says something about their tendency to mate w/ other species expresses weakness. or something

I brought it up myself and its complete bolony.

Asari can reproduce with any race, so even if all but one Asari was wiped out in time the Asari race could spring back. 

Asari mates with a Turian and has three kids, those three mate with different species and each have three more kids and so on and so on.  How on earth does that make them weak?  Remember also that there's nothing stopping Asari-Asari pairings. Ardat Yakshi are extremely rare and we know that the Asari can mate with each other or the race would have been extinct long before they discovered other species.

I believe its best for the Asari to mate with their own species.  Becaus the Asari only share the basic gens with other species.. Their is a higher chance for genetic diversity through asari-exclusive pairings or gene therapy. So it seems that asari-alien pairings will lead to the daughter being a clone of her mother

All the pureblood hate is just  elitism propaganda spewed by the self-hating Asari who've made an inferior mating choice.
Even Asari doctors say nothing is gained genetically from asari-alien pairings

T

Quite the oposite actually, Asari-Asari pairings run a very small risk of producing an Ardat Yakshi, who is sterile remember.  Asari-Alien pairings run zero risk of this happening.  As for being clones of their mothers, thats just not the way its described in game.  The Asari 'mother' can rearrange the dna somehow, don't ask me how but there you go.

[BlackEssence]

*Is astounded by everyone's knowledge.* Gosh, I feel like I am surrounded with awesome eggheads! ^___^* Just wanted to throw that in! Ahem*....

Back to the conversation at hand.

[hawat333]

Because the genetic diversity makes us easier to adapt.

[TheBroodfather]

Why not humans?

[Eudaemonium]

Personally, I think that Harbinger's comment regarding Grunt (sterilized race. potential wasted) implies that at one point the Reapers were considering the Krogan. For example, Sovereign/the Reapers kick started the Rachni War, which was ended by the Krogan. This probably made the Reapers pay attention to them, coupled with their aggressive expansion and dominance of the galactic scene in the wake of the said War (a relatively short amount of time after they were 'uplifted'), they were probably high on the list of viable species. Of course, the genophage kinda screwed that plan up (potential wasted).

If we look at it this way, it seems that the Reapers might look for species that seem to adapt and evolve quickly, as opposed to having inate biotic/technical potential (though these help). Humans as well as Krogan (pre-genophage) were able to become significant forces on the galactic scene a relatively short amount of time after gaining space-flight technology. It seems to me, that this capacity for aggressive expansion and dominance might be a key factor in the Reapers' decision of which species to Harvest/elevate to Reaperdom.

That and 'humanz r speshul'.